London Police Evacuate Train Stations, Bus

LONDON - Two weeks after suicide attacks on subway stations and a bus, police reported incidents at three subway stations and an official said the windows of a double-decker bus were blown out Thursday.

Police said one person was hurt but stressed that the scale of the attack was not on the order of the July 7 bombings in which 52 people and four suicide attackers were killed.

Emergency teams were sent to all three stations after the lunch time incidents. One witness told Sky TV that another subway passenger told him a backpack exploded at the Warren Street station and there were reports of smoke.

Police in chemical protection suits were seen preparing to enter the Warren Street Underground station. Unspecified incidents also were reported at the Shepherds Bush and Oval stations.

Stagecoach, the company which operates the stricken bus, said the driver heard a bang and went upstairs, where he found the windows blown out. The company said the bus was structurally intact and there were no reports of injuries.

Closed-circuit TV cameras on Hackney Road showed the No. 26 bus immobilized at a stop with its indicator lights flashing. The area around the bus had been cordoned off.

Prime Minister Tony Blair canceled his afternoon appointments as the developments unfolded.

The incidents were hauntingly similar to the blasts two weeks ago, which involved explosions at three Underground stations simultaneously - quickly followed by a blast on a bus. Those bombings, during the morning rush hour, also occurred in the center of London, hitting the Underground railway from various directions.

Thursday's incidents, however, were more geographically spread out.

London Ambulance said it was called to the Oval station at 12:38 p.m. and Warren Street at 12:45 p.m. The July 7 attacks began at 8:51 a.m.

British Transport Police said one person was hurt at Warren Street, but they did not know how serious the injury was.

BBC TV reporter Keith Doyle near Oval station said a police officer told him there had been an incident, although it was not an explosion. He said officers had cordoned off a wide area around the station.

"People were panicking. But very fortunately the train was only 15 seconds from the station," witness Ivan McCracken told Sky news.

McCracken said another passenger at Warren Street claimed he had seen a backpack explode. The bombs which killed 56 people on board three underground trains and a bus in London on July 7 were carried in rucksacks, police said.

Police cordoned off streets near Warren Street, and officers with bomb-detecting dogs checked the area.

McCracken said he smelled smoke and that people were panicking and coming into his carriage.

McCracken said he spoke to an Italian man who was comforting a woman after the evacuation.

"He said that a man was carrying a rucksack and the rucksack suddenly exploded. It was a minor explosion but enough to blow open the rucksack," McCracken said.

"The man then made an exclamation as if something had gone wrong. At that point everyone rushed from the carriage."

Services on the Victoria and Northern lines were suspended following reports of a number of incidents, London Underground said.

"I was in the carriage and we smelt smoke - it was like something was burning," said Losiane Mohellavi, 35, who was evacuated at Warren Street.

"Everyone was panicked and people were screaming. We had to pull the alarm. I am still shaking," Mohellavi said.

This is just an outrage. saddening of course, but also an outrage.

It's high time that a larger percentage of the good Muslim people around the world, those who are sincere in their beliefs and practice the correct teaching of The Koran, rise up and take action against those who are smearing their religion with these extremist acts of terror. The good people in these communities need to start policing their communities and report anyone from within their community who they feel are radical and extreme. These are attacks not only against NON Muslims, but against NON believers of the radical, extremist and twisted ways of these fanatics. And the good people of these communities need to realize this and act on this in order to try and help stop these horrible acts of terrorism.


Don Cardi

Anybody think this might be some sick "copycat" type thing? I mean, we know Al Qaeda and other muslim terrorists don't do anything half assed, and with only 1 injury reported so far (thank God), it seems to me that it might be some sick fucks who got together to scare people again. Also, I didn't think these were necessarily suicide attacks, as has been the norm...I read one of the subways was somebody who ran on, left a backpack, and then ran off. Not characteristic of the typical Al Qaeda martyrdom.

I concur and really wonder why more people haven't come forth with information

I respectfully beg to differ with you on that comment. Al Qaeda has carried out many different kinds of bombings. They don't only resort to suicide bombings. There have been incidents of planted bombs being left and set off by these scumbags.

FOX News has just confirmed that several bombs actually did detonate, but so far one found on a bus did not. They are also in pursuit of someone who they think was responsible for planting the bomb and may have possibly injured himself in doing so. They also have one in custody who they believe is involved and has strong ties to Al Qaeda.

There has been an anouncement that the U.S. Embassy may be closed.

ONE death caused by these bastards is still ONE too many!


Don Cardi

Mmm, true, I mean, the original WTC bombing in '93 wasn't a suicide attack. It just usually seems to me in high profile attacks that they use suicide bombers to exaggerate the committal of their "soldiers" to their twisted cause.

Though what you say is correct, muslims as a whole have been subjected to a lot of suspicion and hatred after the terror attacks. One can expect them to come forward 'proactively' in helping with the fight against terrorism once they can be convinced that an average muslim who has got nothing to do with terrorism can receive the same amount of respect as others get. IF I were a muslim and some people were to constantly suspect me, I would hardly care about the welfare of those people. Ofcourse I don't know what muslims think, I am guessing.

And that is EXACTLY why the Muslim people who are good people should come out and denounce these acts and turn in those they see who are giving them a bad name. If the Muslim community stepped up to the plate and turned in the ones who they suspect are extremists and are preaching fantasim in their mosques and communities, then maybe they would not be subject to suspicion and abuse by outsiders. I don't condone abusing the Muslim people because they are Muslim, for that is pure ignorance. But I feel that the good people of the Muslim community will never be taken seriously unless they take a firm stand against those within their communities who are preaching hate and fanatasicm.

There have been several mosques both in London and the USA where extremist teachers, with ties to Al Qaeda, have been arrested and charged. That does not mean that all of the members of those Mosques are extremists or terrorists, but it does mean that these people are hearing what is being preached and if they know that what is being preached is NOT what The Koran teaches, then they should step up and start blowing the whistle on those who are distorting real Muslim teachings and inciting hate.

Unfortunately until that starts to happen on a much broader scale, the innocent and good Muslim people of the world will be looked upon with suspicion.

It is very important that they do what is neccesary to help rid their religion of those who are tarnishing it.

Don't kid yourself for one minute. Part of the plan of the extremisit is to plant seeds of hate in Non Muslims against innocent Muslims so that the extremists can then say to the Muslim " See, you are hated because you are a Muslim and therfore you must join in Jihad against the non believers." It'a all part of the plan.


Don Cardi

You are right. This ploy is used by many groups to convince people that they are victims and must defend themselves to survive. Though Osama and similar top leaders have some grandiose wicked plans, I am sure the ordinary soldier who joins the group is convinced that he is fighting for his religion. It is surely not reward of 72 virgins in heaven or some such crap that many believe to be their motive. That is a simplistic analysis and not true IMO.

I think it's important to remember that the "people" (savage animals is more like it) carrying out these attacks are not true Muslims. They pervert the Muslim faith by claiming their attacks are to serve Allah, which is a bunch of crap. All they are doing is holding the religion hostage and casting a bad name upon what is a peaceful religion. These terrorists are NOT Muslims - they are radical fundamentalist extremists.

True Muslims, like Muhammed Ali for example, denounce these cowardly terrorists who cite their so-called religious beliefs as reasons for carrying out attacks. Like that idiot Atta's father said to CNN - the extremists want a holy war that will last decades. Their goal is to purport a war so it's viewed as the Westerners/Christians/Jews vs. the Muslims.

I was arguing with a co-worker today about pulling out of Iraq in an effort to appease the Muslim world and the extremists. My point was that even if we did pull out, that there is no pleasing the fundamentalists. They would be mad for us leaving Iraq in dissarray. Or they would simply find some other convenient reason to hate us. We're in a no-win situation trying to change their minds. They have been taught since birth to hate the West in general and America in particular. And nothing we do will ever change that mentality.

Or it is possible that these things have nothing to do with religion and may be economicaly driven. The large money needed for these organizations should be coming from illegal sources. Could be viscious cycle of arms supply, drugs trade, politics, corruption. Religion might just be an excuse...

Please forgive my ignorance in the matter, but why do these people teach their children to hate the West so much? What did we ever do to them? Why is it just the West that they are targeting? Didn't we help these people rid themselves of "the enemy" (the Russians) during the 1980s??

NEW YORK - Police will begin conducting random searches of packages and backpacks carried by people entering city subways, Mayor Michael Bloomberg announced Thursday after a new series of bomb attacks in London.

Authorities said the system is still being developed, but the plan is for passengers carrying bags to be selected at random before they have passed through turnstiles.

Police Commissioner Raymond Kelly promised that officers would not engage in racial profiling, and that passengers will be free to "turn around and leave" rather than consent to a search.

Officials would not immediately say how frequently the checks would occur. The checks are scheduled to begin at some stations by Thursday evening and will be occurring throughout the system by rush hour on Friday.

"We just live in a world where, sadly, these kinds of security measures are necessary," Bloomberg said. "Are they intrusive? Yes, a little bit. But we are trying to find that right balance."

Searching the bags of more than a token number of straphangers may be impossible.

New York's subways carry about 4.5 million passengers on the average weekday, according to the Metropolitan Transportation Authority.

There are 468 subway stations in the system, most of which have multiple entrances, and during rush hours, the flood of commuters hurrying in and out of key stations can be overwhelming.

Asked whether the searches might create bottlenecks at subway entrances, Kelly suggested the searches would be of a small enough sampling of passengers that only individuals, rather than whole crowds, would be delayed.

"We are going to do it in a reasonable commonsense way," he said.

Similar types of random searches of subway passengers have prompted complaints from civil liberties groups in other cities, and in some cases have been challenged in court.

Christopher Dunn, associate legal director of the New York Civil Liberties Union, said the searches in New York could be problematic, if not conducted properly.

"The department can and should be actively and aggressively investigating anyone they suspect of bringing explosives into the subway, but police searches of people without any individualized suspicion is contrary to our most basic constitutional values," he said.

Authorities said there is also a possibility that checks will be conducted on some bus and train passengers.

Europe is looking at a problem of enormous proportions. All the major countries there have large muslim populations nearing about 15%-20%. Most of them came in to do menial work. Many have been there for generations and still are not citizens of the various countries. theyu live in segregated ghettoes outside the "post card cities" that we Americans visit when we go over there. The extreme religious leaders, bred in Europe tell these people that the Europeans are decadent and evil, and they insist that the muslims follow all the dress codes, the treatment of women etc., which is abhorrent to Western style democracy.
This is a recipe for complete disaster, and what we are seeing in England, I fear is sort of a copy-cat version of Al Quaeda which may well be home grown.

Until the Muslim religion embraces a reformation much like the Christian religion did 550 years ago there is going to be trouble.

Add to that the fact that the middle east is the repository of most of the world's oil, and thus the natural setting for ongoing wars (who is kiddin whom here) to control it, the fire is further fueled.

It's not ignorance, Irishman. It's a complicated issue. I think it falls into 3 main issues: 1) Part of the problem is our nation's wealth. We're the wealthiest country on earth and, proportionally, we don't share that wealth with other countries. 2) Another factor is that we are an educated people and we are free to pursue whatever we want to in this country. 3) The last is our freedom. Despite the complaining we all do about our country from time to time, we enjoy a great many freedoms in this country. I know that I certainly am guilty at times of taking those freedoms for granted. We don't have to live day-to-day with tanks, fighter planes, and machine gun fire going on in our neighborhoods. We don't have 10 year old boys being forcefully taken to go fight in a war.

Many of these people are poorer than we can ever imagine, impoverished into an existence where there is no freedom, no opportunity and no hope. That's why I think the fundamentalists are so easily influenced because ANYTHING (including becoming a suicide bomber so their family can get money) is better than the existence they endure. Not that I can sympathize for 1 second the notion of anyone becoming a suicide bomber who targets innocent people.

Then throw in the fact that they have very filtered and heavily censored media and they're fed constant misinformation about us. They hear al Jezeera (or however it's spelled) saying the "US are occupiers - just look at what the US is doing to Iraq." They don't have the choice to get alternative viewpoints than what their government rams down the citizen's throats. Couple that with many, many illiterate people and you get what we have today in the Mid East and in other parts of the world.

And that is what I was trying to say in my other posts. I refer to the scumbags as extremists, and to the true Muslim as GOOD Muslims.

As for that arguement that people give about " maybe if we pulled out of Iraq" or " They are pissed at us because we went into Iraq" is weak and is just plain bullshit!


Rabbi Meir Kahane murdered, WTC Bombed, USS Cole bombed. Bali nightclub bombed, Mogadeshu incident, US Embassy Bombing in Nairobi, Planes flown into WTC.

Didn't these incidents occur way before we ever went into Iraq?

They'll attack us no matter what. Their mission is to destroy all those who do NOT see their so called religious EXTREMIST beliefs. Bottom line.

That Iraq arguement is so weak. :rolleyes:

These bastards MUST be incinerated.


Don Cardi

:p sorry Goombah, couldn't help it lol

:p sorry Goombah, couldn't help it lol [/quote]

How do you find out which ones should be incinerated and which ones should not be? Who should decide this?

How do you find out which ones should be incinerated and which ones should not be? Who should decide this? [/b][/quote]I know that I would love to have 5 minutes alone with one of them. Wouldn't you?


When one is caught red handed, dead to rights, plotting to kill people, making bombs to commit acts of terrorism, funneling money to known terrorist groups or trying to kill people in the manner that they do, then what do you think we should do to them, counselor?


Don Cardi

I think it would be interesting to ponder what would happen if we pulled out of the Middle East entirely. I would suspect that Israel would become enemy number 1 (if it isn't already), and there would be a muslim war against the Jewish state, condemning them for their "oppression" of Palestine.

Though I could see us sending them arms, perhaps even WMD's, to aid their cause? Just a theory, mind you. But it would keep the US hands clean. Clearly, Israel knows how to take care of business, as they obliterated the PLO from Lebanon in the 80's (despite the western media's outright rejection of the actions as illegitimate).

Amen to that. Isreal doesn't take any shit from terrorists.

Don Cardi

LONDON (July 22) - Police shot and killed a man wearing a thick coat at a London subway station Friday, a day after the city was hit by its second wave of terrorist attacks in two weeks.

The man died after being shot by officers at the Stockwell subway station in south London, police said.

Passengers said a man, described as South Asian, ran onto a train at Stockwell station in south London. Witnesses said police chased him, he tripped, and police then shot him.

''They pushed him onto the floor and unloaded five shots into him. He's dead,'' witness Mark Whitby told the British Broadcasting Corp. ''He looked like a cornered fox. He looked petrified.''

Britain is home to many immigrants from the South Asian countries of Pakistan, India, Sri Lanka and Bangladesh, among others.

Whitby said the man did not appear to have been carrying anything but said he was wearing a thick coat that looked padded. Temperatures in London on Friday were in the 70s.

Alistair Drummond, of the London Ambulance Service, said paramedics had been called to the station at 10:10 a.m.

Service on the Northern and Victoria Tube lines, which pass through Stockwell, was suspended because of the shooting, British Transport Police said. Stockwell is one station away from the Oval station, which was affected by Thursday's attacks.

____________________________________________________________


Don Cardi

How do you find out which ones should be incinerated and which ones should not be? Who should decide this? [/b][/quote]You decide this exactly the way that they took care of the bastard this morning in London. One less murderer in the world now.


DS

Under those circumstances...a few bullets to the head.

Under those circumstances...a few bullets to the head. [/b][/quote]That's too humane for these monsters. I still like my idea.

It's good to see the people of London staying steadfast and not letting fear dictate the way that they go about their daily lives. It's a very hard thing to do and I feel for them.

I loved the story that I heard this morning about several civilians who jumped on one of these guys and beat the heck out of him. Too bad he got away.


Don Cardi

I am listening to the ongoing BBC coverage. They are saying the guy they shot was connected to yesterday's incident, but they havent said how. They are also raiding two houses at this very moment, and they have released pictures of what appear to be all four bombers at the various subway and bus stops.

I believe he's the guy who they started to track down yesterday and thought that he went to the hospital.

There is also news that someone attempted to torch one of the suicide bombers homes. These are the things that are going to happen unless the islamic community speaks out against these bombings.


DS

Along this same line:

LONDON (AFP) - British Muslims said they feared police were operating under a "shoot to kill" policy after a man was gunned down at an Underground train station following a new wave of bomb attacks.

Muslims said the shooting deepened their anxiety about a violent backlash against their community in the wake of two sets of bomb attacks blamed on Islamist militants, including one that killed 56 people on July 7.

The Muslim Council of Britain demanded police explain why an Asian-looking man, reported as a "suspected suicide bomber" by Sky News, was shot dead at Stockwell station in south London on Friday.

Police have confirmed that officers pursued and shot a man who was pronounced dead at the scene, but have offered no explanation for the shooting.

The incident came a day after another apparent wave of would-be suicide bombers hit London's mass transport system, two weeks after four suspected Islamist suicide bombers on trains and a bus killed 56 people.

No one was injured in Thursday's attacks after the bombs apparently failed to go off. A website statement purportedly from the Al-Qaeda terror network claimed responsibility for the attacks Friday but this has not been confirmed.

A Muslim Council spokesman said Muslims were "jumpy and nervous" and feared reprisal attacks.

"I have just had one phone call saying 'What if I was carrying a rucksack?'," said Inayat Bunglawala, referring to the rucksack bombs used in the London attacks.

"It's vital the police give a statement about what occurred (at Stockwell) and explain why the man was shot dead," Bunglawala said.

"We are getting phone calls from quite a lot of Muslims who are distressed about what may be a shoot-to-kill policy."

Witnesses told Sky News that police shot the man five times at close range after shouting at him to stop. Others described seeing many heavily armed plainclothes officers in unmarked cars at the scene.

"There may well be reasons why the police felt it necessary to unload five shots into the man and shoot him dead, but they need to make those reasons clear," Bunglawala said.

The shooting is the latest in a series of incidents which have threatened to create a rift between Britain's large Muslim community and the rest of the population in the wake of the terrorist attacks here this month.

Some radical British Muslim preachers have blamed the government's Middle East policy and the British-backed invasion of Iraq for the outrages, although the vast majority of British Muslims have condemned the bombings.

"Unless British foreign policy is changed and they withdraw forces from Iraq, I'm afraid there's going to be a lot of attacks, just the way it happened in Madrid and the way it happened in London," radical British Muslim preacher Sheikh Omar Bakri Mohammed told the New York Times this week.

The government is drafting a range of tough new laws to crack down on Islamic extremism and those who advocate terrorism, including setting up special intelligence units to monitor Muslims nationwide.

Prime Minister Tony Blair called Tuesday on Britain's Muslim community to confront the "evil ideology" behind terrorism following a meeting with leaders from Islamic groups.

In another incident Friday, armed police briefly threw a cordon around a mosque in east London, while the home of a Muslim convert identified as one of the suspected July 7 suicide bombers was sealed off after a suspected arson attack.

Analysts said the officers involved in the Stockwell shooting did not appear to be operating according to normal procedures.

"These guys may have been some sort of plainclothes special forces," said terrorism expert Professor Michael Clarke.

"To have bullets pumped into him like this suggests quite a lot about him and what the authorities, whoever they are, assumed about him."

Professor Paul Rogers of Bradford University said the shooting had parallels with the "very strong" methods used by Israeli security forces and US troops in Iraq.

"The kind of tactics the Met (Metropolitan police) appear to have used this morning are very similar to the very tough tactics that the Israelis use against suspected suicide bombers," he said.