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Jun 10th, 2024
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A question for you. I'd like your opinions... #1040391
09/18/22 03:00 PM
09/18/22 03:00 PM
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 11,306
N
NYMafia Offline OP
NYMafia  Offline OP

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Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 11,306
Aside from the Genovese and Gambino families which I know is often the automatic default answer for a question of this nature. Which one particular Mafia "Family" (or families) do members of this forum feel were the most successful in terms of profitability, tenure, and had the least amount of problems such as in-fighting, wars, or arrests and imprisonment throughout their history?

Have at it guys. I'm genuinely curious as to how others perceive this.

Last edited by NYMafia; 09/18/22 03:10 PM.
Re: A question for you. I'd like your opinions... [Re: NYMafia] #1040392
09/18/22 03:30 PM
09/18/22 03:30 PM
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 1,111
A
alicecooper Offline
Underboss
alicecooper  Offline
A
Underboss
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 1,111
Not exactly an answer, but for its size, scope, and duration, could it be said that Chicago has operated relatively trouble free for a long, long time?

I mean, besides the Giancana and Spilotro era?

Re: A question for you. I'd like your opinions... [Re: NYMafia] #1040408
09/18/22 07:11 PM
09/18/22 07:11 PM
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 3,084
J
JCrusher Offline
Underboss
JCrusher  Offline
J
Underboss
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 3,084
I’d also say the Chicago Outfit

Re: A question for you. I'd like your opinions... [Re: JCrusher] #1040415
09/18/22 07:30 PM
09/18/22 07:30 PM
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 11,306
N
NYMafia Offline OP
NYMafia  Offline OP

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Joined: Sep 2019
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Originally Posted by JCrusher
I’d also say the Chicago Outfit


ok. Thats one vote for Chicago. Duly noted!

Re: A question for you. I'd like your opinions... [Re: NYMafia] #1040416
09/18/22 07:48 PM
09/18/22 07:48 PM
Joined: Mar 2016
Posts: 27,081
H
Hollander Offline
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Detroit Giacomo "Jack" Tocco headed a smoothly run syndicate from the 60s till his death in 2014.


"The king is dead, long live the king!"
Re: A question for you. I'd like your opinions... [Re: Hollander] #1040417
09/18/22 07:58 PM
09/18/22 07:58 PM
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 11,306
N
NYMafia Offline OP
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Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 11,306
Originally Posted by Hollander
Detroit Giacomo "Jack" Tocco headed a smoothly run syndicate from the 60s till his death in 2014.


So one vote for Detroit. I can see that too. Another good choice IMO

Re: A question for you. I'd like your opinions... [Re: NYMafia] #1040425
09/18/22 08:57 PM
09/18/22 08:57 PM
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 1,529
Bensonhurst, Brooklyn, NYC
B
BensonHURST Offline
Bensonhurst
BensonHURST  Offline
Bensonhurst
B
Underboss
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 1,529
Bensonhurst, Brooklyn, NYC
Detroit

Re: A question for you. I'd like your opinions... [Re: BensonHURST] #1040426
09/18/22 09:10 PM
09/18/22 09:10 PM
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 11,306
N
NYMafia Offline OP
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Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 11,306
Originally Posted by BensonHURST
Detroit


Thats two for the Zerilli crew! Duly noted!

Re: A question for you. I'd like your opinions... [Re: NYMafia] #1040430
09/18/22 09:58 PM
09/18/22 09:58 PM
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 1,498
L
Lou_Para Offline
Underboss
Lou_Para  Offline
L
Underboss
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 1,498
Throw in one for Marcello.

Re: A question for you. I'd like your opinions... [Re: Lou_Para] #1040431
09/18/22 10:10 PM
09/18/22 10:10 PM
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 11,306
N
NYMafia Offline OP
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Joined: Sep 2019
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Originally Posted by Lou_Para
Throw in one for Marcello.


Duly noted! The first vote for the New Orleans Family

---
So here's the voting count so far;

Chicago 2
Detroit 2
New Orleans 1

Last edited by NYMafia; 09/19/22 04:47 AM.
Re: A question for you. I'd like your opinions... [Re: NYMafia] #1040436
09/19/22 07:49 AM
09/19/22 07:49 AM
Joined: Oct 2016
Posts: 105
B
Ben54 Offline
Made Member
Ben54  Offline
B
Made Member
Joined: Oct 2016
Posts: 105
Detroit

Re: A question for you. I'd like your opinions... [Re: Ben54] #1040437
09/19/22 09:07 AM
09/19/22 09:07 AM
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 11,306
N
NYMafia Offline OP
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Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 11,306
Originally Posted by Ben54
Detroit


Duly noted. We're up to;

Chicago 2
Detroit 3
New Orleans 1

Re: A question for you. I'd like your opinions... [Re: NYMafia] #1040438
09/19/22 09:12 AM
09/19/22 09:12 AM
Joined: Jan 2022
Posts: 404
B
Big_Tuna93 Offline
Capo
Big_Tuna93  Offline
B
Capo
Joined: Jan 2022
Posts: 404
Has to be Chicago.

Re: A question for you. I'd like your opinions... [Re: Big_Tuna93] #1040439
09/19/22 09:20 AM
09/19/22 09:20 AM
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 11,306
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NYMafia Offline OP
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Joined: Sep 2019
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Originally Posted by Big_Tuna93
Has to be Chicago.


Thank you BT93. Were' now at a tie between Chitown and Motor City at;

Chicago 3
Detroit 3
New Orleans 1

Re: A question for you. I'd like your opinions... [Re: NYMafia] #1040442
09/19/22 12:15 PM
09/19/22 12:15 PM
Joined: Mar 2020
Posts: 615
Dob_Peppino Offline
Underboss
Dob_Peppino  Offline
Underboss
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Posts: 615
I would say Detroit and the old Gagliano/Lucchese Family.
New Orleans, much like The Bonannos are a "top down" Family. Meaning the power and wealth of the Family comes the boss in place. The perfect example of a "bottom up" Family is the Genovese, Chicago and Gambinos. The strength of the soldiers and crews allow a boss to sit atop a strong emipre, no matter what his credials are.

Last edited by Dob_Peppino; 09/19/22 12:16 PM.

"Joe Bananas went after Carlo Gambino, the war went on for seven years..... When guys go to the mattresses, they're not out earning" -Tony Soprano
Re: A question for you. I'd like your opinions... [Re: Dob_Peppino] #1040443
09/19/22 12:33 PM
09/19/22 12:33 PM
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 11,306
N
NYMafia Offline OP
NYMafia  Offline OP

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Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 11,306
Originally Posted by Dob_Peppino
I would say Detroit and the old Gagliano/Lucchese Family.
New Orleans, much like The Bonannos are a "top down" Family. Meaning the power and wealth of the Family comes the boss in place. The perfect example of a "bottom up" Family is the Genovese, Chicago and Gambinos. The strength of the soldiers and crews allow a boss to sit atop a strong emipre, no matter what his credials are.


Hi Don Pep. Thats a reasonable outlook.

So now the count is;
Chicago 3
Detroit 4
New Orleans 1
Gagliano/Lucchese 1

Re: A question for you. I'd like your opinions... [Re: NYMafia] #1040444
09/19/22 01:46 PM
09/19/22 01:46 PM
Joined: Nov 2018
Posts: 217
NEPA and now Fla
J
Jshov31 Offline
Retired Capo
Jshov31  Offline
Retired Capo
J
Made Member
Joined: Nov 2018
Posts: 217
NEPA and now Fla
Bufalino

Re: A question for you. I'd like your opinions... [Re: Jshov31] #1040445
09/19/22 02:06 PM
09/19/22 02:06 PM
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 11,306
N
NYMafia Offline OP
NYMafia  Offline OP

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Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 11,306
Originally Posted by Jshov31
Bufalino


Another excellent choice. So now we have;

Chicago 3
Detroit 4
New Orleans 1
Gagliano/Lucchese 1
Bufalino 1

Re: A question for you. I'd like your opinions... [Re: NYMafia] #1040446
09/19/22 02:21 PM
09/19/22 02:21 PM
Joined: May 2017
Posts: 260
Millspgh Offline
Capo
Millspgh  Offline
Capo
Joined: May 2017
Posts: 260
Due to the Casino skims and unions, among the other everyday money making schemes, I think Chicago was making money hand over fist.

Remember they had Murray Humphreys out there bribing all the politicians, that had to be expensive. They were making as much money if not more than the NY Families at their peak in my opinion, mainly due to the Vegas skimming.

As much as I would like to say Pittsburgh, I would say Chicago made the most money outside NY, by far.

But I do think Pittsburgh had much more money, influence and power than many other outside of NY families, just not the most. From the casino they owned in Cuba, to California, to Detroit, to NY.
During the 1960 World Series, John LaRocca hosted a group of Outfit big shots in Pittsburgh and got them tickets, the FBI has photos of them together at the game(s).

*Honorable Mention*
I think Trafficante may have had more money and power than given credit for because he had legit relationships with every single family in the country. I think he was getting a piece from many families who operated in Florida.


Last edited by Millspgh; 09/19/22 02:22 PM.
Re: A question for you. I'd like your opinions... [Re: Millspgh] #1040449
09/19/22 02:37 PM
09/19/22 02:37 PM
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 11,306
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NYMafia Offline OP
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Originally Posted by Millspgh
Due to the Casino skims and unions, among the other everyday money making schemes, I think Chicago was making money hand over fist.

Remember they had Murray Humphreys out there bribing all the politicians, that had to be expensive. They were making as much money if not more than the NY Families at their peak in my opinion, mainly due to the Vegas skimming.

As much as I would like to say Pittsburgh, I would say Chicago made the most money outside NY, by far.

But I do think Pittsburgh had much more money, influence and power than many other outside of NY families, just not the most. From the casino they owned in Cuba, to California, to Detroit, to NY.
During the 1960 World Series, John LaRocca hosted a group of Outfit big shots in Pittsburgh and got them tickets, the FBI has photos of them together at the game(s).

*Honorable Mention*
I think Trafficante may have had more money and power than given credit for because he had legit relationships with every single family in the country. I think he was getting a piece from many families who operated in Florida.



A logical answer Millspgh. So here's the count;
Chicago 4
Detroit 4
New Orleans 1
Lucchese 1
Pittsburgh 1
Trafficante 1

Re: A question for you. I'd like your opinions... [Re: NYMafia] #1040455
09/19/22 04:27 PM
09/19/22 04:27 PM
Joined: Jan 2022
Posts: 404
B
Big_Tuna93 Offline
Capo
Big_Tuna93  Offline
B
Capo
Joined: Jan 2022
Posts: 404
Honest question, and please tell me if this off: Couldn't you make a pretty strong argument that at least throughout the 50's and 60's the outfit was on par with the most powerful families in NY? Even for all the flack Giancana gets for attracting too much attention, the dude was an absolute powerhouse that grew their influence throughout the entire world. Not to mention, Paul Ricca is, in my opinion, the most powerful boss that no one ever talks about. When Aiuppa became the front guy for the outfit is when I think they started slipping a little, as he wasn't nearly as saavy as his predecessors.

Last edited by Big_Tuna93; 09/19/22 04:30 PM.
Re: A question for you. I'd like your opinions... [Re: Millspgh] #1040456
09/19/22 04:28 PM
09/19/22 04:28 PM
Joined: Jan 2022
Posts: 404
B
Big_Tuna93 Offline
Capo
Big_Tuna93  Offline
B
Capo
Joined: Jan 2022
Posts: 404
Originally Posted by Millspgh
Due to the Casino skims and unions, among the other everyday money making schemes, I think Chicago was making money hand over fist.

Remember they had Murray Humphreys out there bribing all the politicians, that had to be expensive. They were making as much money if not more than the NY Families at their peak in my opinion, mainly due to the Vegas skimming.

As much as I would like to say Pittsburgh, I would say Chicago made the most money outside NY, by far.

But I do think Pittsburgh had much more money, influence and power than many other outside of NY families, just not the most. From the casino they owned in Cuba, to California, to Detroit, to NY.
During the 1960 World Series, John LaRocca hosted a group of Outfit big shots in Pittsburgh and got them tickets, the FBI has photos of them together at the game(s).

*Honorable Mention*
I think Trafficante may have had more money and power than given credit for because he had legit relationships with every single family in the country. I think he was getting a piece from many families who operated in Florida.


That part about the World series is really cool. I did not know that. Are those photos available online?

Re: A question for you. I'd like your opinions... [Re: Big_Tuna93] #1040457
09/19/22 04:40 PM
09/19/22 04:40 PM
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 11,306
N
NYMafia Offline OP
NYMafia  Offline OP

N

Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 11,306
Originally Posted by Big_Tuna93
Honest question, and please tell me if this off: Couldn't you make a pretty strong argument that at least throughout the 50's and 60's the outfit was on par with the most powerful families in NY? Even for all the flack Giancana gets for attracting too much attention, the dude was an absolute powerhouse that grew their influence throughout the entire world. Not to mention, Paul Ricca is, in my opinion, the most powerful boss that no one ever talks about. When Aiuppa became the front guy for the outfit is when I think they started slipping a little, as he wasn't nearly as saavy as his predecessors.


Absolutely. During their heyday "The Chicago Outfit" was a powerhouse! On par in rackets and influence with any crew in the USA.

Re: A question for you. I'd like your opinions... [Re: NYMafia] #1040461
09/19/22 08:42 PM
09/19/22 08:42 PM
Joined: May 2017
Posts: 260
Millspgh Offline
Capo
Millspgh  Offline
Capo
Joined: May 2017
Posts: 260

Originally Posted by Big_Tuna93
Originally Posted by Millspgh
Due to the Casino skims and unions, among the other everyday money making schemes, I think Chicago was making money hand over fist.

Remember they had Murray Humphreys out there bribing all the politicians, that had to be expensive. They were making as much money if not more than the NY Families at their peak in my opinion, mainly due to the Vegas skimming.

As much as I would like to say Pittsburgh, I would say Chicago made the most money outside NY, by far.

But I do think Pittsburgh had much more money, influence and power than many other outside of NY families, just not the most. From the casino they owned in Cuba, to California, to Detroit, to NY.
During the 1960 World Series, John LaRocca hosted a group of Outfit big shots in Pittsburgh and got them tickets, the FBI has photos of them together at the game(s).

*Honorable Mention*
I think Trafficante may have had more money and power than given credit for because he had legit relationships with every single family in the country. I think he was getting a piece from many families who operated in Florida.


That part about the World series is really cool. I did not know that. Are those photos available online?

I have not been able to find the photos but I have multiple files that reference this taking place.

Re: A question for you. I'd like your opinions... [Re: Big_Tuna93] #1040463
09/19/22 08:46 PM
09/19/22 08:46 PM
Joined: May 2017
Posts: 260
Millspgh Offline
Capo
Millspgh  Offline
Capo
Joined: May 2017
Posts: 260
Originally Posted by Big_Tuna93
Honest question, and please tell me if this off: Couldn't you make a pretty strong argument that at least throughout the 50's and 60's the outfit was on par with the most powerful families in NY? Even for all the flack Giancana gets for attracting too much attention, the dude was an absolute powerhouse that grew their influence throughout the entire world. Not to mention, Paul Ricca is, in my opinion, the most powerful boss that no one ever talks about. When Aiuppa became the front guy for the outfit is when I think they started slipping a little, as he wasn't nearly as saavy as his predecessors.

I agree with this 100%

Re: A question for you. I'd like your opinions... [Re: NYMafia] #1040475
09/20/22 06:20 AM
09/20/22 06:20 AM
Joined: Mar 2016
Posts: 27,081
H
Hollander Offline
Hollander  Offline
H

Joined: Mar 2016
Posts: 27,081
Originally Posted by NYMafia
Originally Posted by Big_Tuna93
Honest question, and please tell me if this off: Couldn't you make a pretty strong argument that at least throughout the 50's and 60's the outfit was on par with the most powerful families in NY? Even for all the flack Giancana gets for attracting too much attention, the dude was an absolute powerhouse that grew their influence throughout the entire world. Not to mention, Paul Ricca is, in my opinion, the most powerful boss that no one ever talks about. When Aiuppa became the front guy for the outfit is when I think they started slipping a little, as he wasn't nearly as saavy as his predecessors.


Absolutely. During their heyday "The Chicago Outfit" was a powerhouse! On par in rackets and influence with any crew in the USA.


The Second City also became bigger after their rivalry with NYC.


"The king is dead, long live the king!"
Re: A question for you. I'd like your opinions... [Re: NYMafia] #1040511
09/20/22 08:21 PM
09/20/22 08:21 PM
Joined: Mar 2016
Posts: 27,081
H
Hollander Offline
Hollander  Offline
H

Joined: Mar 2016
Posts: 27,081
I voted for Detroit but the Genovese Family never had an internal war like the other NY families.


"The king is dead, long live the king!"
Re: A question for you. I'd like your opinions... [Re: Hollander] #1040512
09/20/22 08:49 PM
09/20/22 08:49 PM
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 11,306
N
NYMafia Offline OP
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Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 11,306
Originally Posted by Hollander
I voted for Detroit but the Genovese Family never had an internal war like the other NY families.


The Genovese definitely had their internal conflicts and killings over the years. Plenty in fact. But no they never had a full-blown internal gangland war.

Re: A question for you. I'd like your opinions... [Re: NYMafia] #1040521
09/21/22 04:44 AM
09/21/22 04:44 AM
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 11,306
N
NYMafia Offline OP
NYMafia  Offline OP

N

Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 11,306
Anybody else care to give their thoughts and opinion on this topic?

Re: A question for you. I'd like your opinions... [Re: NYMafia] #1040522
09/21/22 05:01 AM
09/21/22 05:01 AM
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 7,390
naples,italy
furio_from_naples Offline
furio_from_naples  Offline

Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 7,390
naples,italy
Philly. Of course they had their internal wars but today had 40 active made men and a large territory while Chicago and Detroit are small family in big cities.

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