Originally Posted by The Last Woltz
Originally Posted by JCrusher
Originally Posted by olivant
How to define win?

Michael won his criminal war with Roth, but lost his personal one. One could say that his desire to win the criminal war blinded him to the implications for his soul.

As III made clear, he realized too late that he was doomed to a life of regret.

. Yeah but Roth certainly had a huge impact on that. Because of Roth Mikes two capos are gone along with his brother. Yes he still had Neri but his criminal family is not nearly as strong as it was in the beginning.


Roth was a formidable adversary but let's not overstate the impact he had on Michael.

Was the Family really not as strong as it was in the beginning? Where's the evidence of that? Rocco's death?

We see in GFIII that Michael is richer, more powerful and more "legitimate" than ever. If the Family sustained any damage, it was temporary.

Obviously, Michael suffered great personal blows, but those were mostly self-inflicted.

It was his controlling, unsentimental personality that drove away Kay and Fredo. Roth's role was incidental.

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Plus the Rosatos are still on the loose and we are never given an explanation on how that is resolved or if Mike even cares at that point


That's a good observation.

The Rosatos were involved in a public shootout with police. Hard to imagine they are still on the loose.

I always assumed that they were swept up along with Cicci and Frankie but, you're right, that was left unresolved.


. Part was self inflicted but part of it was done by Roth. Remember Mike had some luck on his side as well. If not fir Kay he would have surely been shot in the assassination attempt. Also If Fredo did really want to turn on Mike he wouldn’t have told him about Questadt. So Mike certainly had some luck on his side and took advantage of it to finally beat Roth. But I still feel Roth left a huge mark on Mike