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Michael Corleone's Death
#8861
05/27/04 05:20 PM
05/27/04 05:20 PM
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Posts: 146 Rhode Island
AllAboutTheFamily
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At the end of GF3, we have all sen it, Michael dies, alone in his Sicilian villa. There is something that confuses me...and that is why? Why did Michael die alone?
a)Micheal was struggling all through the third movie to go legit, Kay has to realize this! When Micheal gives up his throne as don, to pretty much a stranger I may add, Kay must see how much Micheal wants to get out of the mafia. And yet, supposedly, Kay never speaks to him again.
b)As much as Anthony hates what Micheal stand for, he still does love him very much. I compare Anthony to his father when he was young. Micheal said "I am a Corleone, I will always be a Corleone, but I will never take part in your business". I believe that Anthony would have still stuck with his dad, as a son, in love.
c) Connie,as I see it, is the only one who stays with him. There were the years of her not speaking to him in spite of Carlo, but still for the most part, she stayed with him. I would think that at least she would still stick by him until the end. But yet, Micheal dies alone.
Now some could say that they all died somehow, but then that would defeat the purpose of having an analogy in Micheal dieing alone, if the only reason he dies alone has nothing to do with him.
I personally, don't think he died alone. I think he was just alone at the the time of his death. lthough this still does not make too much sense, considering that it stronly looks like an analogy is taking place when Micheal dies, I don't see any other answer. Is this just another weakpoint in GF3, or just a setup for GF4 that Puzo eventually was writing a script for, before he died?
"I'd rather laugh with the sinners then cry with the saints, the sinners are much more fun."-Billy Joel
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Re: Michael Corleone's Death
#8862
05/27/04 05:59 PM
05/27/04 05:59 PM
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Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 277 UK
the angel of justice
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I think Kay would definately not have been with him. Howvever close thy were to reconciling, Mary's death would have been blamed on the life he lead, I doubt she would have forgiven him.
"Neri, take a train to Rome. Light a candle for the Archbishop." - Vincenzo Corleone
"But if he betrays me your prayers will not be swift enough to catch him on his way to hell." - Salvatore Guiliano
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Re: Michael Corleone's Death
#8863
05/27/04 06:03 PM
05/27/04 06:03 PM
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AllAboutTheFamily
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I really thought that Kay would have understood Micheal's position, sure none of the mafia was needed in Micheal's life but Kay, I think would understand that Micheal never ment any of this, for Kay, for Anthony, for Mary. Evcentually, while it made have been a long time, Kay would have forgiven him.
And remember, Kay married Micheal knowing exactly what Micheal did for a living.
"I'd rather laugh with the sinners then cry with the saints, the sinners are much more fun."-Billy Joel
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Re: Michael Corleone's Death
#8864
05/27/04 06:25 PM
05/27/04 06:25 PM
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Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 277 UK
the angel of justice
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I se what you're saying, and yes, she did know when she married him, but she didn't know the extent of how bad it would be.
Remember her having an abortion, because she 'couldn't bear to bring up a child in his world' (or something like that).
In my opinion, his life, or the world he lived in became too much for her, and only when it looked like he was leaving it, did she begin to reconcile. So I don't think she would have understood.
"Neri, take a train to Rome. Light a candle for the Archbishop." - Vincenzo Corleone
"But if he betrays me your prayers will not be swift enough to catch him on his way to hell." - Salvatore Guiliano
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Re: Michael Corleone's Death
#8865
05/27/04 06:29 PM
05/27/04 06:29 PM
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AllAboutTheFamily
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That is all true. She did reconsile towards the end of the movie, but after a while, she must realize that Maria died under Vincient's control, even though the attack was on Micheal. But i guess your opinion is favored by almost everyone interested in the godfather, including Coppala himself.
"I'd rather laugh with the sinners then cry with the saints, the sinners are much more fun."-Billy Joel
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Re: Michael Corleone's Death
#8867
05/28/04 12:19 PM
05/28/04 12:19 PM
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Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 310
EnzoBaker
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Like so many other scenes in the trilogy, Michael's death scene can be intrepreted many ways.
We can conclude that he dies isolated and alone because everyone close to him has been driven away or killed,
OR, it could be nothing more than coincidence. For all we know Michael could still have close family - maybe he only went out to sit in the courtyard for a few minutes. We don't know the details of what happened between 1980-1997.
"In the end, everyone dies alone."
"You did good."
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Re: Michael Corleone's Death
#8868
05/28/04 01:31 PM
05/28/04 01:31 PM
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Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 8,224 New Jersey
AppleOnYa
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Originally posted by AllAboutTheFamily: I really thought that Kay would have understood Micheal's position, sure none of the mafia was needed in Micheal's life but Kay, I think would understand that Micheal never ment any of this, for Kay, for Anthony, for Mary... Try losing a child to a violent death the way Kay lost Mary...knowing that it happened as a direct result of the business her father was in practically his life, and all of hers (the daughter). In GFII, Kay was already willing to leave Michael and his way of life in order to save her children. That didn't work out the way she planned. She may have come to understand Michael's 'position' and that he never intended for things to work out for thieir family the way they did. Doesn't mean she could ever bring herself to forgive him for the death of their daughter (nor do I imagine he would ever have forgiven himself). I would not expect Kay to have been sitting nearby in the kitchen when Michael dropped dead in the garden. As for Connie...I agree that she would have stayed with him no matter what, until the end. Where else would she have to go...??? But perhaps we can use our ol' imaginations and assume, if we really need an explanation .... that perhaps she had died before Michael. Apple
A wise and frugal government, which shall leave men free to regulate their own pursuits of industry and improvement, and shall not take from the mouth of labor the bread it has earned - this is the sum of good government.
- THOMAS JEFFERSON
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Re: Michael Corleone's Death
#8869
05/28/04 02:02 PM
05/28/04 02:02 PM
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AllAboutTheFamily
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I know, it is extremely hard to get over something like losing a child, and I realize that Kay would never be nearly as close to him. Anthony, too. But in the end of GF3, Micheal seems a lot more alone then I think he would have been. As much as I wouldn't want a sequel, I really would like to know what happened with Micheal leading up to his death. But I guess we will never really know, but that just makes the trilogy that more likeable, great movies, still with a lot of room for your imagination.
"I'd rather laugh with the sinners then cry with the saints, the sinners are much more fun."-Billy Joel
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Re: Michael Corleone's Death
#8870
05/28/04 02:42 PM
05/28/04 02:42 PM
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Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 8,224 New Jersey
AppleOnYa
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Originally posted by AllAboutTheFamily: I know, it is extremely hard to get over something like losing a child, and I realize that Kay would never be nearly as close to him. Anthony, too. But in the end of GF3, Micheal seems a lot more alone then I think he would have been.... First of all, you DON'T get over losing a child. You go on, but you don't get over it. That aside...I think it's EXTREMELY appropriate to have had Michael die old and alone at the end of GFIII. If you just consider the suggestion given right here in this thread (thank you, goombah) of the utter tragedy of Michael's entire existence. Throughout the trilogy he loses everyone once close to him through either betrayal, death, or both. The message to be interpreted is that Mary's 'accidental' death was the final nail in the coffin for Michael, after that there was nothing else to achieve, nothing or no one else to care about. He probably wouldn't have wanted anything to do with the outside world. Even if his son and sister were still around to care for him in the physical sense...there was nothing left emotionally or spiritually. This was an empty, spent man whose life was really over long before his heart stopped. Entirely fitting that he die alone. Apple
A wise and frugal government, which shall leave men free to regulate their own pursuits of industry and improvement, and shall not take from the mouth of labor the bread it has earned - this is the sum of good government.
- THOMAS JEFFERSON
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Re: Michael Corleone's Death
#8871
05/28/04 03:01 PM
05/28/04 03:01 PM
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AllAboutTheFamily
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First off, I understand that you never really get over a child's death, move on would be a much better phrase. But anyway...
You are being way to harsh on Micheal. Yeah Micheal did a lot of REALLY bad things. Micheal could be very ruthless and evil. But Micheal was a kind man inside. He was a wonderful man who grew up in the wrong environment. Everything he did, he was doing it because he thought it was right. when he died, he was unrightfully forgotten.
The fact is, he died a long time after Mary was killed. By that time, Kay would have been with him, Anthony would have been with him, and Connie would have been with him. The one thing that keeps them coming back together is that they all loved each other. I would be just as sad as Kay to have probably ignored Micheal for another 7 years before I could speak with him. But 7 years still gave the a while to be together before he died.
You act as if he is this low scum but he isn't. He is a great man with a scummy surface. But GF3, most of the scum was being wiped off. I'm sure even Kay had to go to his funeral-he was hated by many, but he had to be missed by a few more then is thought by many.
"I'd rather laugh with the sinners then cry with the saints, the sinners are much more fun."-Billy Joel
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Re: Michael Corleone's Death
#8872
05/28/04 03:20 PM
05/28/04 03:20 PM
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Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 8,224 New Jersey
AppleOnYa
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Originally posted by AllAboutTheFamily: You are being way to harsh on Micheal... Wrong, you're interpreting my statement incorrectly. I do not mean to say he DESERVED to die alone, but that it is ENTIRELY fitting in the context of his life and the trilogy, that his life ended the way it did. Originally posted by AllAboutTheFamily: ...he died a long time after Mary was killed. By that time, Kay would have been with him, Anthony would have been with him, and Connie would have been with him... Maybe Anthony, definitely Connie (assuming they were both still alive at the time of Michael's death). But not Kay. Originally posted by AllAboutTheFamily: You act as if he is this low scum but he isn't. He is a great man with a scummy surface. But GF3, most of the scum was being wiped off... I do not act as if he were scum or even a 'great man with a scummy surface'. You're taking the discussion personally on Michael's behalf, instead of considering the entire trilogy. It and Michael were far more complex than that. Again, pay attention to theme of THE TRAGEDY of the man's life. What more fitting conclusion would you have preferred to GFIII? That Michael die peacefully in his bed, surrounded by those he loved who still remained in his life? Or those who outlived him sadly attending his funeral as with Don Vito in The Godfather? What would have been the point of such an ending, what do you suppose we would have gotten out of it? What dialogue do you imagine should have taken place among the characters? "Poor Don Corleone...he was a great man who had a scummy surface. None of what happened was his intention." "Rest in peace, Don Corleone...we know he did bad things, but he was kind on the inside." "It was his destiny to be hated and feared and despised; his father didn't want this for him." And so on and so on...instead, in his genius, FFC left us with that abrupt ending, leaving us the audience to consider all those things. Again...entirely fitting end. Apple
A wise and frugal government, which shall leave men free to regulate their own pursuits of industry and improvement, and shall not take from the mouth of labor the bread it has earned - this is the sum of good government.
- THOMAS JEFFERSON
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Re: Michael Corleone's Death
#8874
05/28/04 03:25 PM
05/28/04 03:25 PM
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Posts: 146 Rhode Island
AllAboutTheFamily
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Oh don't get me wrong, I believe that the ending was a perfect way to end the trilogy, however, as far as Michael Corleone goes, I don't thionk it would have been the case in real life.
"I'd rather laugh with the sinners then cry with the saints, the sinners are much more fun."-Billy Joel
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Re: Michael Corleone's Death
#8875
05/28/04 03:37 PM
05/28/04 03:37 PM
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Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 8,224 New Jersey
AppleOnYa
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AllAboutTheFamily: As far as Michael Corleone goes, virtually NOTHING that happened from 1946 to the day he died would have been the case in real life. Because in real life, control of mob families is not passed from father, to oldest son, skipping over next oldest son due to sheer incompetency, down to youngest son who wanted no part of that kind of life in the first place, but got there by default. But then...'real life' is usually not quite as entertaining as what happens in novels and movies !! Apple
A wise and frugal government, which shall leave men free to regulate their own pursuits of industry and improvement, and shall not take from the mouth of labor the bread it has earned - this is the sum of good government.
- THOMAS JEFFERSON
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Re: Michael Corleone's Death
#8876
05/28/04 03:39 PM
05/28/04 03:39 PM
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AllAboutTheFamily
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So true, AppleOnYa, so true
"I'd rather laugh with the sinners then cry with the saints, the sinners are much more fun."-Billy Joel
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Re: Michael Corleone's Death
#8879
06/18/04 12:54 AM
06/18/04 12:54 AM
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Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 19
TheKillerGFan
Wiseguy
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Wiseguy
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Originally posted by EnzoBaker: Like so many other scenes in the trilogy,
OR, it could be nothing more than coincidence. For all we know Michael could still have close family - maybe he only went out to sit in the courtyard for a few minutes. We don't know the details of what happened between 1980-1997.
"In the end, everyone dies alone." In coppollas eyes i dont see how this would make sense. The director used that last shot of Michael by himself to send a powerful message to the audience. Michael though he had fought all his life to protect his family he eventually drove them all away or killed them himself. Copolla always saw Mike as a tragic figure, I think he had a specific intent to show us that Michael died alone.
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