Gang leader Ducarme Joseph was shot dead in St. Michel on Friday night.His death was likely retaliation for slaying Vito's son, press reports revealed.That is power From the grave plus what he accomplished with cancer after getting out of prison.. Last of his breed.Best RIP VITO AND FAMILY

What a mong..glorifying killers.

I am going to have to agree with TommyGambino.....Even though I find the topic of La Cosa Nostra interesting, I would never be amazed by their power to whack someone out.....The guy who got whacked out maybe, had a son or daughter of their own. I can't support that but am intrigued by it.The guy was probably following orders out of fear he would be killed if he didn't.

I think it is the word BEST that we have a problem with.....Omit that and the post isn't too over the edge

Who says he's glorifying a killer?

The term 'best' could easily be referring to Rizzuto as the 'best' modern gangster.

Of certainly a case could be made.

Let's not jump on the guys back too early here.

Welcome to the board PaulieSenter.

Yeah the guy may have kids and stuff like that , but these people know wot they get into , they should think about that stuff before they get involved with mobsters and killers . It's that simple

to be fair Vito was boss in Canada which makes a world of difference compared to the legal pressure a boss in the U.S faces. Hell I mean Vito came down to one murder in New York and got pinched for that and did time in Florence which is probably the worst prison in the states. He was afraid of getting for something in that states and all the murders he has supposedly had done have been out of there. So all I mean is while he was a good boss in terms of cosa nostra he also had a lot less risks than his American counterparts.

Imagine if the Genovese family was based in Montreal. I am sure they could drop bodies left and right too if they wanted. And besides for being such a great boss his son and dad where both killed and his brother and law kidnapped so that really isn't that impressive.

Only reason he got pinched was because Massino had a big fucking mouth.

Yea and Massino has a big fucking mouth cause he didn't want to spend the rest of his life in Florence alongside his buddy Vince. Which Massino would be facing after the legal ass kicking he got courtesy of the American government and the fbi and his own choices in life.

Vito was not at as much risk of the FBI while operatin in Canada and outside of U.S borders. He was free from the FBI monitering him as greatly and being able to use RICO against him. He was faced instead with Interpol and more importantly the Canadian government which is a lot less risky and punishing than the U.S. He had it much easier than someone like Massino trying to lead a mob family in New York

Why do people always give credit to Vito rather than to Nick? Was the old man ever really retired from the position of command (I mean, for real, not just "officially")?

yea he retired when the bullet entered his head as he stood in a totally open position in view of his window with minimal security surronding his easily trespassed property, while his mob family / blood were embroiled in a violent power stuggle with other vicious and violent capable mafia members. If I was a man who had been a don for that long and had lived through violent periods I would of invested in much more intense and tight security measures, but that is just me. He was a real criminal mastermind

Thank you good to be back again thank you

They were all "masterminds" there Look at Di Maulo who didn't even bother to protect himself even though everybody knew he would be target n.1 after Vito's return.

Exactly. Then again you know security costs money and these guys are pretty greedy might not want to spend dollars and invest in some real stuff.

Though I know they do get armored cars and weapons and vests. Only work so well though ;p

Vito was the man in mafia terms. His family would have NEVER been touched had he never went away to prison in America and that is GUARANTEED! That tells you enough about his power, that the power grab was put into motion when he was away. That was the only way they could get anyone to go along with the plot to begin with.

because, you know, the FBI totally never surveilled his movements, never cooperated with Canadian law enforcement and certainly didn't play a role in his extradition to the Untied States to stand trial for his role in the three captains hit, NO sir!



Yeah, instead of the FBI he had Canadian law enforcement to contend with, but, obviously they MUST be completely incompetent and inferior compared to the FBI, right? Who totally have a long illustrious career of NEVER, EVER fucking up. I mean, that could be the only POSSIBLE explanation for the "success" experienced by the Rizzuto family, right?

Do you even think about what you post? DO you just assume you know what you're talking about before making these asinine assumptions? That's a serious question. Enquiring minds want to know. Fucking baffling.

I'm going to admit right here that, yeah, it's annoying WHENEVER this subject comes up you get some half cocked american getting his undies all in a bunge because someone suggested something might have been done "better" elsewhere. Mostly because guys who do that are completely ignorant. Like, the fuck do you know about Canada other than: Hockey, cold, moose, and maple syrup? Probably dick all.

And I apologize to the majority of Americans on this board (and in general) who aren't dipshits. One bad apple doesn't spoil the bunch. <3

+1000 Slumpy.

Slumpy is on fire.

Well considering I have lived the last 10 years in Canada and half my famly is from here, I would assume I know a little more than maple syrup, hockey etc. But that is just me.

And yea if you think the RCMP or the Canadian legal system comes down nearly as hard on criminals or has the resources that the Americans use to fight LCN then you are seriously mistaken.

Of course the U.S and Canada share info and work together on projects. I never said they didn't. Hence why the U.S was able to extradite Vito to the U.S to face trial in the 3 capo murders?

I would agree that the punishments are certainly less stringent (some might argue more humane, but that's just me) it's not even open to debate that Canada is 'easier' on crime... But I disagree that they are any less effective at combating OC. You're wildly conflating. Just because they didn't take vito "down" (he's done time more than once in canada for crimes committed) sooner doesn't mean that they are inferior to the FBI by several orders of magnitude. More money doesn't necessarily equate to more effective. The truth is canada is a tiny nation of 32 million people. Our law enforcement is much smaller and thus requires much less funding.

it also doesn't mean that the Rizzuto family in general just wasn't good at what they did. Look at the history, no undercover infiltration, no rats/informants, etc... Now I'm not saying the "less than tough on crime" attitude of Canadian law doesn't make Canada an attractive location for organized crime but to simply toss the carefully cultivated secrecy of the Rizzuto family out the window because "its not america" is just stupid. Bottom line.

[quote
I would agree that the punishments are certainly less stringent (some might argue more humane, but that's just me) it's not even open to debate that Canada is 'easier' on crime... But I disagree that they are any less effective at combating OC. You're wildly conflating. Just because they didn't take vito "down" (he's done time more than once in canada for crimes committed) sooner doesn't mean that they are inferior to the FBI by several orders of magnitude. More money doesn't necessarily equate to more effective. The truth is canada is a tiny nation of 32 million people. Our law enforcement is much smaller and thus requires much less funding.

it also doesn't mean that the Rizzuto family in general just wasn't good at what they did. Look at the history, no undercover infiltration, no rats/informants, etc... Now I'm not saying the "less than tough on crime" attitude of Canadian law doesn't make Canada an attractive location for organized crime but to simply toss the carefully cultivated secrecy of the Rizzuto family out the window because "its not america" is just stupid. Bottom line.[/quote]








I never said the Rizzuto Family was not effective in terms of power and wealth it amassed in Canada and around the world. I mean funding that bridge in Sicily? That was huge and it showed the scope of influence they exerted around the globe. And yes I agree Canada has 32 million people and requires less law enforcement.

That being said without having a similar RICO law in place, Canada cannot even come close to inflicting the same sort of damage on OC groups that the FBI did with cases like the Commission one. Like I said earlier you don't think a OC family like the Genovese could not have had just as productive and little punishment if it had been them operating out of Montreal?

So yes to disagree with you. I do believe the Rizzuto family being based in CANADA has allowed them to get away with a lot more crimes and murders than they would ever get away with than say if they were based in New York.

That is just me. And I respect your opinion.

"In Canada the Royal Canadian Mounted Police and the Office of the Superintendent of Financial Institutions enforce rules and regulations that cumulatively are equivalent to RICO."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racketeer_I...valents_to_RICO

The difference between Canada and America is that America accumulated the necessary legislation into one bill for sake of ease (which is what Canada SHOULD do, but won't). That aside, Canada does have methods of prosecuting criminals whom are attached to a "criminal organization".

1. I agree that less stringent criminal justice make it easier for OC to establish itself and due to the comparatively "minimal punishments" (mandatory 10 years for murder 1 is still a lot of years of your life to lose as far as I'm concerned) does lend itself to preventing internal strife within the Organized Crime groups for non-violent offences... However...

2. They do still have to contend with law enforcement who can and do utilize laws that are virtually the same as those contained within the RICO act.

Montreal is such a throwback tot he old school

i acknowledge part of this post is not a response to the discussed topic of rizzuto power.

i think we have been taken in by the rizzuto myth. powerful yes, but not the almighty god the media and journalists have made him out to be. i would also point that much if not all media reports we read or hear about oc in canada (specially about toronto clans)is probably bullshit. good copy, sells papers etc. if that group who initially decided to work together, did not eventually turn on each other, rizzuto would have never regained his hold on Montreal.

born and raised in toronto (woodbridge) u tend to hears stories growing up of who is in control etc., from what i heard (could be bullshit) there are four powerful families in toronto
1. demaria clan
2. filiomengni clan
3. cammalleri family
4. campoli family

Honestly I think Rizzuto would have come back strong no matter if they turned on each other or not just because of his power. Yes they did make a power grab when he was away (they wouldn't dare do it with him there and alive) but to see people still getting clipped proves how much influence he had/has in the GTA. While I do think it would have taken him longer to gain control that it did when he came back, I still think it would have ended up with Desjardins/Montagna/Di Maulo all dead.

There is a certain amount of pageantry around Vito, especially now that he's dead. A powerful guy, yeah, but I agree that his reach may have been somewhat overestimated. Still, he's probably the most powerful mob figure in the last 15 years in North America.

I'd say the Sixth Family is a pretty accurate book, though, and a fantastic read for anyone wanting to know more.

Ive said this time and time again, the mafia is a business and money is power.

The FACT is that the Rizzuto family controlled a cocaine pipeline through the port of Montreal, a billion dollar enterprise over a decade.

Now like it or not this family earned more than the NY 5 combined. Purely through this pipeline. Not withstanding its monopoly on construction etc

So as much as people may not like it, when it comes to money, and hence power, the Rizzuto family (through drugs) dwarfs the NY 5.

Simple math guys. Like it or not.

Not so simple. The five families have tons more money than Dominicans and black street gangs, but exert no power in those parts of town. Paul Castellano made tons more money than John Gotti, but he ended up lying on the sidewalk in a pool of blood and Gotti became the boss.

VIOLENCE and FEAR control the underworld. The Rizzutos gained power through murder and held on to power through murder and fear. Don't try to deny the facts.

Massino didn't want the death penalty. Canada doesn't have the death penalty or RICO or the hellish prisons like the US. Does anyone in Canada ever get 25 years in prison with no parole for a non-violent charge like bookmaking? There are more rats in the US because of the legal system.

The Facts are this.

The Rizzuto family is PRIMARILY a drug (cocaine) business. They have a monopoly of the 2nd largest pipeline in Nth America.

The NY 5 have only small drug interests.

This IS the difference.

There is more money in drugs than all other illicit enterprises combined.

As stated money IS power, and the FACTS are the Rizzuto organization through its monopoly on the 2nd largest drug pipeline into the US DWARFS the NY 5 in terms of revenue.

Argue the point. Because those are the undisputed facts.

Like it or not.