How come Italians are called Mobsters and the Irish Mob are usually called Hoodlums ? and how come for Italian Stereotypes they say they are some way linked to the Mafia and for Irish stereotypes they say there are some way linked to Street Gangs ?

Never heard anybody call the Westies an Irish gang, I am sure everybody knows that they are a mob organization.

Irish can be mobsters, but never mafiosi, because that's for Italians.

Contrary to popular belief the Irish invented organized crime in America. Alot of underworld slang comes from Irish influence. They contributed to the first gangs. And alot of staples of the subculture. They're are the single most influential group besides the Italians that made the criminal underbelly what it is today.

Street Gangs to me implies modernity. Signs, graffiti, identifiable clothing. While they were responsible for the first gangs, they were less like modern street gangs and more like mob crews in my opinion. Independent chieftains. And the Italian had street gangs too. Still do. 10th and Oregon for example. It wasn't until they were consolidated into the mafia by the Sicilians that it began to take shape. But even then the early mafia was more like street gangs. It wasn't until Prohibition that they all evolved into what is now considered a mobster.

And that was the problem with the Irish. They had a desire and a talent for organized crime, but no structure. It's why the Mafia has outlasted them and most ethnic criminal waves for that extent

By the end of prohibition, the Irish were tasked with exerting ethnic influence in the upper worlds of business and politics. They became acceptable to the mainstream, still to a point, but accepted. The upper world Irish politicians, cops and businessmen were the necessary conduits into providing the underworld's influence and basic ability to operate. The Mafia is Italian in name but the Mob structures it adheres to is based more on the traditional corruption patterns established by Irish-Americans based on cooperation between lawful and unlawful elements.

The Irish had the political connections here in the U.S. before the Italians did but that's because they arrived earlier. Political corruption, in relation to organized crime, wasn't exactly something new back in Italy. And the Irish and Jewish groups faded away precisely because they didn't have the structure the Italians did.

The Italians lasted because they had better food.

The Irish were the first to have the political corruption. The Jews were the first to have the labor racketeering. But, because they had the ongoing, self-perpetuating organization, the Italians ended up with both.

Amen to that!

The Italians are proud, loyal but they're not on the same level as they were in the 50s (referring to the Americans). They been involved long time ago, and still going strong... I don't know about the Irish but they're probably not gonna beat the Sicilians when it comes to organized crime. Am I right or am I right?

Is this a trick question?

My husband says this to me all the time. Believe me, it IS a trick question.

Well most Irish crooks have achieved a level of legitimacy over the century. As the most populous immigrant population at the infancy of America, they became slowly entrenched in the political machine, in the police departments, fire departments, other official position as well as on the streets and in the business world.

As far as the things that made the Mafia so properous in decades past was it's insulate nature. Sicilians (whom birthed the American Mafia) have what I term an "invader culture" which opted them to be more secretive, clanninsh, and distrusting. WHich is why certain crime families were formed the way they were. The Irish didn't have that degree of inter-ethnic segregation, altho they did have that mentaility from being lorded over by the English for centuries*

In the end, Irish OC became more locale based. Bosses arising spontaneously in Irish ghettos. The Hells Kitchens, Southies, Northeast Phillys. And to the contrary, LCN families were more compact and almost fuedal. How bosses would arrange intermarriage to other gangsters. Something very unique amongst Italians.

And for this reason is why Italian never really entrenched American society the way the Irish did. Using organized crime as a tool to get ahead in the world. So to answer your question. As long as there's IRish neighborhoods, there will be Irish organized crime. Without them it falls onto white collar and political corruption. However the Italians, have a structure which has outlasted that. But it quickly dying due to Americanization and degradation. Rich gangster having spoiled kids for example. And ass too do the Italian neighborhoods die, this also hurts the families as recruitment suffers. But there's also the fresh blood coming in through intermarriage and sons following in their father's footsteps. It's really a question of organization which the Irish have been lacking, but made up for in ambition.