So reading stuff on the DeMeo crew they were perhaps the most feared mob crew in the NY underworld in the late 70s early 80s. Are there any crews currently who are extremely feared? Anyone heard any rumours etc? I know it could be hard to know.

I don't know if there is a single crew that stands out. The Genovese family seems to have enough muscle to enforce discipline through murder when needed. The Brooklyn faction of the Lucchese family has been known to be rather triggy happy. Also, the Persicos in the Colombo family.

I guess today its about identifying crews with known killers in. Would there still be some crews in families who are known for being good at taking people out or are hits farmed out to hit men these days?

My guess is every family in New York still has capable killers in their ranks. It's still necessary for them, just not as much as say twenty, thirty years ago. First and foremost, they need earners.

I am sure 60% of those guys are ready to kill if they need.Murders have declined because it's much easier to catch a killer.

"there's no such thing as us bringing in outsiders to do a hit. There's no such thing as being paid for a hit "- Nicky Caramandi

are the younger people more violent or are scared amd not willing to kill these days?

I think they are more cautious not to kill.
Guys like Demeo, Tony Mirra and Jimmy Burke wouldnt have got away with half the stuff they did nowerdays

Good point, Gary. A lot of those murders were sloppy. A modern day CSI team would have had a field day with the DNA left in the bathtub at the Gemini Lounge.

Also lets not forget Tommy Pitera and John Pappa two ruthless guys and thats saying a lot in that life.

Yes on Pitera. But Pappa, to me, wasn't old enough at the time to seriously be considered to have been in the life. He was almost more of a manchild serial killer than a mob guy. But I agree that he was VERY dangerous and VERY much feared.

True, but if Pappa wasnt arrested he was already on the fast track to being made. He killed Capo Joseph Scopo the last casualty of the Colombo War, also was convicted of killing three others, and is suspected of killing six others. Thats quite the body count for somebody who is not even 30.

Not even 30?

Hell, they guy was jailed for life before he turned 25 .

hahahaha

he was a bit trigger happy even for the bloodthirsty colombos

LOL

Also the proverbial Gaspipe Casso has got to be in the mix. That guy was a psycho, I wish they would make a movie on his life. That would be very interesting.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Kuklinski

Anybody ever hear about this guy ? That's a REAL monster.He is worse than Bagarella

It's hard to pinpoint how bad Kuklinski actually was.
he takes credit for every murder from Jimmy Hoffa to JFK.

Can't trust a word he says about anything.

You'll also recall, for what it's worth, Sammy Aparo was caught on tape talking about how he felt there were 40 guys in the family who he thought would be capable of killing. Nowadays, even half of that would be more than enough.

(And, yes, Kuklinski was full of crap.)

Pappa wouldnt of gotten made he was a too much of a liability they would of made him do a few more hits and then they would oof whacked him.If he only killed scopo then it would of been alright but he was going out and killing people without getting permission the guy would of bought too much heat on any crew he was with

There's wiretaps of Colombo guys like Alley Boy talking about "making" the "Pappa kid", the guys he killed without permission were not made guys so it doesnt matter much to the administration, they are too busy rebuilding the family and trying to beat the colombo war trials

too much heat? at that point it was too late for that family to avoid the heat they just finished a war that had them all over the headlines (and continues to) so might as well reward some loyal guys who helped u win the war

I agree. It's harder to get away with stuff today.

Adding to that, I think today's mobsters aren't as tough because they never went through a phase of poverty like Ruggeiro, Mirra, Gotti and others before them. Today's wiseguy grows up in a nice home in Middle Village or somewhere on Staten Island. Hardly breeding grounds for tough mobsters.

Yep, next thing you know there will be guys like those from the show Jersey Shore getting made.

Speaking of Pappa, is it OK for a guy to be made in prison? Life sentence or 5 years, no difference.

ive never heard of a rule that says they cant, guess if they can guarantee the feds wont see/find out its alright, plus it very likely wont be a true making ceremony with the entire admin there, etc

i know casso made the guy who botched the hit on Pete Chiodo's sister (forgot his name now) at the MDC i believe

Yep, you´re right Daps.
Michael "Baldy" Spinelli was made a Lucchese member while in jail.

There's a great line from Capeci's Idiot's Guide to the Mafia about this guy:

"If Pappa lives long enough, he may set a record for the longest amount of time ever served by a prisoner. If this is the future of Cosa Nostra, then's it's all over for the mafia."

I do agree that he would have been made eventually. Remember, this is the Colombos we're talking about here.



With a little help from a toilet.

Can someone please post a little info on John Pappa? Who did he murder other than Scopo? Its amazing that this guy is apparently able to do this sort of time without flipping at such a young age! I take it he has life without parole?

Even if he did want to cooperate, he had very little to offer them. He wasn't around long enough to have gotten close to enough guys for the Feds to be interested in giving him a deal. Plus, as I posted earlier, he was a borderline serial killer. After the Gravano debacle, the Feds aren't as likely to look the other way on multiple murders.

His dad was Gerard Pappa, childhood friend of Gravano (Sammy even named his son after him) and Genovese soldier. He took after his father too, who was just as bloodthirsty.

The difference was Gerrard Pappa was a gangster who ran lucrative rackets and made alot of money.
John Pappa was basically a trigger happy thug with a gun.

If Gerrard could see his son now I think he would be annoyed that his boy had thrown his life down the toilet!