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HOW DID VITO KNOW ABOUT SONNY? #555113
09/15/09 02:50 PM
09/15/09 02:50 PM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 11,468
With Geary in Fredo's Brothel
dontomasso Offline OP
Consigliere to the Stars
dontomasso  Offline OP
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Joined: Feb 2005
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With Geary in Fredo's Brothel
In the scene in Vito's office where Vito is talking to Johnie Fontaine, but indiretly also to Santino, he makes the comment that a "man who doesn't spend time with his family can never be a real man." Sonny had just completed a quasi clandestine assignation upstairs, Vito seemed to know about it. Later in the office, after Sonny's ill timed comment to Sollozzo, Vito again upbraids him for "getting soft in the head from all that comedy you're playing with that young girl." Obviously Sonny probably had a reputation for womaniz about which Vito was aware, but he seemed to know exactly what Sonny was up to in real time. Did he have a tail on Sonny or was he just extremely aware of what was going on?

I also am wondering if there is not a parallel that was deliberately created in GF III. In that film, Michael's first choice to carry on his "legitimate" business was his son, who refused him, so he was forced to turn to Vincent. In The Godfather, Vito had a similar problem. The son he wanted to take the family "legitimate" was Michael, who, at first said he would never work for him. I think in his heart of hearts Vito had to know that if things had gone along as planned, Sonny would one day take over the family business, and probably run it into the ground. I would like to be a fly on the wall of converations Vito and Tom Hagen must ahve had about all this.


"Io sono stanco, sono imbigliato, and I wan't everyone here to know, there ain't gonna be no trouble from me..Don Corleone..Cicc' a port!"

"I stood in the courtroom like a fool."

"I am Constanza: Lord of the idiots."

Re: HOW DID VITO KNOW ABOUT SONNY? [Re: dontomasso] #555115
09/15/09 03:27 PM
09/15/09 03:27 PM
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olivant Offline
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DT, in the novel it staes that many people at the wedding knew what was going on with Lucy. As you point out, Vito thought Sonny was going soft in the head for fooling around with Lucy. If it was obvious to the guests, it would be obvious to Vito. As far as parallels go though, Sonny would have taken over the business if his death hadn't intervened. It was primogeniture until there was reason for it to be otherwise. Michael's offer to Anthony was primogeniture also. However, Anthony made a choice to not take over. That's a big distinction.


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Re: HOW DID VITO KNOW ABOUT SONNY? [Re: olivant] #555121
09/15/09 05:06 PM
09/15/09 05:06 PM
Joined: Aug 2002
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New York
Sicilian Babe Offline
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Didn't Vito look out the window and see Sonny and Lucy sneaking off together?


President Emeritus of the Neal Pulcawer Fan Club
Re: HOW DID VITO KNOW ABOUT SONNY? [Re: dontomasso] #555123
09/15/09 05:14 PM
09/15/09 05:14 PM
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SC Offline
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Originally Posted By: dontomasso
Did he have a tail on Sonny or was he just extremely aware of what was going on?


C'mon.... when Sonny came into Vito's den to join the meeting, he must have been reeking of Lucy juice! Vito sniffed it and knew immediately what Sonny had been up to.


.
Re: HOW DID VITO KNOW ABOUT SONNY? [Re: SC] #555124
09/15/09 05:19 PM
09/15/09 05:19 PM
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Desertwolf Offline
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Re: HOW DID VITO KNOW ABOUT SONNY? [Re: Desertwolf] #555125
09/15/09 05:21 PM
09/15/09 05:21 PM
Joined: Jul 2001
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New York
SC Offline
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Thanks, DW.

dt, sorry to make light of a serious question.... I'm just in one of those moods today. ohwell


.
Re: HOW DID VITO KNOW ABOUT SONNY? [Re: SC] #555142
09/15/09 09:52 PM
09/15/09 09:52 PM
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 19,539
AZ
Turnbull Offline
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Since Sonny lived at the mall, Vito had many chances to observe his behavior close up. There were probably plenty of rehearsals for the wedding, and Sonny made no secret of his eyes for Lucy. We see him pinch her cheek during the celebration. His wife, Sanddra, openly talked about Sonny's infidelities (in the novel) and said she was relieved because his, uh, endowment was making mush of her insides.

The parallel between Michael and Anthony rejecting their father is one I hadn't considered before, dt. Very good observation! But I wonder what Michael really had in mind for Anthony if he'd become a lawyer. Michael seemed to have made good headway at becoming "legitimate" without Anthony.


Ntra la porta tua lu sangu � sparsu,
E nun me mporta si ce muoru accisu...
E s'iddu muoru e vaju mparadisu
Si nun ce truovo a ttia, mancu ce trasu.
Re: HOW DID VITO KNOW ABOUT SONNY? [Re: Turnbull] #555147
09/15/09 10:12 PM
09/15/09 10:12 PM
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New Jersey
AppleOnYa Offline
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I think it's safe to assume that everyone in the family knew of Sonny's infidelities. Even Sandra seemed more frustrated than surprised when she turned and saw him walking off w/ Lucy at the wedding.

Anthony's rejection of the Business would've also been the end result of years of influence from Kay. While as a child he seemed to have little use for his mother once she left the house...one can see that they became closer as the years went on.

Also...coming to the realization that your own father was responsible for the death of your uncle & fishing buddy would probably help alot toward turning a young man sour on the Family Business.


A wise and frugal government, which shall leave men free to regulate their own pursuits of industry and improvement, and shall not take from the mouth of labor the bread it has earned - this is the sum of good government.

- THOMAS JEFFERSON

Re: HOW DID VITO KNOW ABOUT SONNY? [Re: AppleOnYa] #555536
09/20/09 08:54 PM
09/20/09 08:54 PM
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 599
Toronto, Ontario
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dontommasino Offline
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Toronto, Ontario
We can gather from both the novel and the film that Sonny spent a lot of time around the Don. Even if this was not the case, the Don has a large intelligence network I am sure and someone would have reported it to him.

Re: HOW DID VITO KNOW ABOUT SONNY? [Re: dontommasino] #557397
10/14/09 12:05 PM
10/14/09 12:05 PM
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 5,325
MI
Lilo Offline
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MI
What everyone else said...
also it's been my experience that even when a particular man and woman think they are being discreet, people generally know the deal.


"When the snows fall and the white winds blow, the lone wolf dies but the pack survives."
Winter is Coming

Now this is the Law of the Jungle—as old and as true as the sky; And the wolf that shall keep it may prosper, but the wolf that shall break it must die.
As the creeper that girdles the tree-trunk, the Law runneth forward and back; For the strength of the Pack is the Wolf, and the strength of the Wolf is the Pack.
Re: HOW DID VITO KNOW ABOUT SONNY? [Re: Turnbull] #557398
10/14/09 12:14 PM
10/14/09 12:14 PM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 11,468
With Geary in Fredo's Brothel
dontomasso Offline OP
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dontomasso  Offline OP
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Originally Posted By: Turnbull
But I wonder what Michael really had in mind for Anthony if he'd become a lawyer. Michael seemed to have made good headway at becoming "legitimate" without Anthony.


I suspect he would have had Anthony as general counsel for all the foundations, and also get involved with Immobiliare, slowly manipulating him into helping all that money laundering.


"Io sono stanco, sono imbigliato, and I wan't everyone here to know, there ain't gonna be no trouble from me..Don Corleone..Cicc' a port!"

"I stood in the courtroom like a fool."

"I am Constanza: Lord of the idiots."


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