He served in the army but looked kind of helpless when McClusky hit him. He also looked like a total stranger to guns during Clemenza's training. What gives?

That is what made Mike so dangerous.....is that you never knew what he was thinking or if he was putting on an act......he lived with that motto "Never let anyone outside the family know what you are thinking"
When you are the head of an army, you don't need to prove your toughness.....that is what your army is for. They believed in him cause he was smart and calculating.
But Kay sure as hell knows that he can hit.....LOL.

Let's consider this. It's dark outside. You are facing a high ranking police official surrounded by cops. Your arms are pinned. He smashes your jaw and knocks you out. Wow! You mean he didn't force himself to regain consciousness and fight back. How unusual! I mean, if he was able to pull off that trick, I'm sure that the other cops standing around wouldn't have interfered and maybe shot him.

For any of us who have served in the armed forces, we know that the ratio of rifle training to handgun training is about 100 to 1. Had Clemenza offered Mike a rifle, he would have been at home with it.

Yeah the whole cop scene was in no way a testament to Mikes toughness.....I mean first off it was a cheap shot, and secondly he was being held by two cops.....give me a break. Plus......I don't know about yous guys.....but they don't make the .38 special (Saturday night special) a basic military weapon....I am sure when he fired it, it was loud and new to Mikey......the true testament to his toughness came when he popped the Turk and McClusky....that took guts.

Actually, Michael enlisted in the Marines.

If you were a Marine or Former Marine...of if you knew anyone who was...you would know the difference.

Semper Fi,
Apple

Actually there is no such thing as a "former" Marine (unless there was some kind of court martial).

Actually, yes there is.

My father served in the U.S. Marine Corps. At my parents wedding which took place on November 10th 1957 - he insisted that in addition to the wedding cake there be a special cake to honor the Marine Corps birthday which also fell on that day.

Having been a Marine was one of the few things in life of which he was always truly proud. (Aside from ME, of course!)

He always said, "You never call someone an and 'EX' Marine'...always a 'Former Marine'.

Are you a Former Marine, dontom? Or do you know any?

Apple

I don't think there was any question of Michael's courage under fire. He couldn't hit McCluskey back, and if he had, he would have been charged with assaulting an officer. He got his revenge in the way Vito advised him (in the novel): "Revenge is a dish that's best eaten cold."

My Father, brother, and cousin all were in the Marines.....and they always correct people when they say "You were a Marine?" or "You were in the Marines?" they always say "I am a Marine". From what they say, once you are a Marine, you are always a Marine.....unless you get a Dishonorable discharge or you go AWOL.
A Marine thinks, and lives his life as a Marine from the day they finish boot camp, till the day they die.
That is what I was told.....if you guys heard it a different way I don't know......but I guess it is the Marines decision not ours.

In the novel, just before getting hit by McCluskey, Michael felt the "delicious chilliness" of hatred toward his father's enemies, which he wanted to conceal at all costs to everybody. And later, when he tells Sonny & the others that he'll whack Sollozzo and McCluskey, Sonny stated that he always knew that Michael was tough on the inside and that Michael was "tougher than the old man himself."

So yes, he could have easily have held his own in a physical altercation. Sonny also stated that by not fighting back gave Michael a big advantage in the meeting with Sollozzo. They would have Michael figured as "a yellow Guinea."

BarrytheBull:

I agree with your relative's sentiment of 'Once a Marine, ALWAYS a Marine'...that was never in dispute and even my father has made that very statement on occassion (it was embedded into my brain throughout childhood).

My only point was that, once an Honorable Discharge is received, one is technically a 'Former Marine', not an 'Ex-Marine'.

And any Marine worth his salt would have corrected the initial statement of Michael having served in the 'Army'.

Apple

You are soo right about the Ex-Marine thing.....man that is like an insult to a Marine.
I think a lot of people got confused from the movie because Michael was a Marine, and earned the Navy Cross....anyone watching that, and anyone not familiar with the service probably thought he was in the Navy.....lol.

Michael was in the Navy. The Commandant of the Marine Corps. reports to the Secreatary of the Navy.

Wow Apple, I am impressed. Really (not being sarcastic here).

No, I am not a former marine, but I know a guy who is and he always says that he "IS" a marine...even though he is about 45 years old.

You may also recall that in the OJ Simpson trial F. Lee Bailey had Mark Furhman on the stand and at one point during corss examination he said "Tell me....one Marine to another...." as if that were more sacred than the oath Furhman had taken to testify.

As for the post that says the Marines are technically in the navy///ah TELL IT TO THE MARINES!!!! Also, as to anyone confusing the army and the marines, I say send them to Paris Island for a week.

Olivant you are wrong......Michael enlisted in the Marines, he won the Navy Cross as a Marine, you do not have to be in the Navy to get that honor. You used to, but during WWI they started giving it out to other branches of our armed forces. The Navy Cross is the second highest honor you can receive from Uncle Sam......the first is the Medal of Honor, which was also only for the Navy at one point. Now every branch can receive it.....which was the case for Michael. There is also the Distinguished Service Cross that is given out as a "non-combat" honor.

Correct, BarrytheBull !!

Michael even says so himself - in the final flashback scene of GFII. Which, as we know triggers Sonny's 'famous' temper on their father's birthday!!!

Apple

Yeah but that scene has a huge error in it. They are sitting around the table late in the day and they claim it is the same day that Pearl Harbor was attacked. Mike says that he signed up "this morning." Morning in New York would be well before dawn in Pear; Harbor, so Mike would have enlisted before the attack....very prescient of him.
Actually the attacks would have taken place about two hours before the conversation at the table.

dontom, whatever timeline errors you can point out, that's swell.

Fact remains that in that scene, Michael clearly states that he's enlisted in the Marines.

Apple

Not only that, but he is wearing a Marine uniform when he arrives at Connie's wedding.

Yep that marine uniform is a surefire tip off.

Let me try this again. The Commandant of the Marine Corps. reports to the Secretary of the Navy. The Marine Corps. is a unit of the United States Navy, plain and simple.

True as that may be....

Michael Corleone did not enlist in the Army, nor did he enlist in the Navy.

He enlisted in the Marines.
Plain and simple.

Apple

MICHAEL CORLEONE, dressed in the uniform of a Marine Captain, leads KAY ADAMS through the wedding crowd.

*********************

MICHAEL :In the hopes of clearing my family name -----
That I served my country faithfully and honorably in World War two and -- was awarded the Navy Cross for action in defense of my country.

*********************

SONNY : Well if you don't feal that way why don't you just quit collage and go to -- go to join the Army.

MICHAEL :I did -- I enlisted in the Marines.

________________________________________________________

My father in-law served in the U.S. Navy. He said that there were certain times that the Marines would board his ship for certain missions and that when they boarded his ship they were under the command of the U.S. Navy. So it is possible that Michael was awarded the Navy Cross.


Don Cardi

Okay, you go to a Marine Corps. recruiter and you say I want to join the Marines. If everything goes okay, you do enlist in the Marines, you train as a Marine, and you fight as a Marine. Pride and allegience aside, however, you are, in effect, in the Navy. That's why Mike could have been awarded the Navy Cross. Aircraft carriers carry a compliment of Marines. The captain of a large Navy vessel such as a carrier is guarded by one or more Marines. Seals are Navy too. A Marine pilot of a Harrier jet could launch from a carrier, but under Naval command. The movie A few Good Men demonstrated this. Prosecution was handled by a Marine, but defense was handled by a naval officer. The jury was made up of both Marines and Naval personnel. That's Naval CMJ. So, Mike's getting the Navy Cross was entirely possible.

Those of you who have relatives who served in the military, do the member of the different branches of the armed forces have serious animosity toward their fellow countrymen who happen to serve in a different branch than them? Or is it more of a rivalry thing, like the Army-Navy football game? I thought we were on the same side. From some of the things I've heard it sounds like there is some intense hatred between fellow soldiers.

Everybody listen up.......I just Googled "Navy Cross" on the web.....it says that the Navy cross is the second best honor you can get in the Military (all branches) the first being the Medal of honor....which I am sure we have all heard of right???? Did you know that is was called the Navy Medal Of Honor??? Back in WW1 they decided to give out both medals to other branches....army, airforce.....Marines. Basically it is completly normal for a Marine to get the Navy Cross.......I mean, why just keep it in the Navy....after all.....we are not communist. LOL....sorry.
People get awarded the Purple Heart......but nobody has a "purple heart" (insert your joke here...lol) it is just the name of the honor.

I'll answer this with a story...

Once, many years ago when there was no war going on & they were running those 'JOIN THE ARMY' commercials on tv (and I was having trouble deciding upon a career which is still the case) ...I half kiddingly said to my father, 'That's what I'll do I'll go into the army and learn a trade!

He looked at me and without blinking an eye said...'You are FORBIDDEN to join the Army.' Then he looked back at the television and it was clear the subject was closed.

Besides the normal disciplining that goes on while one is growing up...it was one of the few times in my life I remember my father being dead serious. I knew by his tone that he wasn't kidding, even if he knew I was. Had I joined the Army anyway (which I had no intention of doing)...it probably would've been one of the worst things I could do in his eyes.

The rivalry is MOST DEFINITELY there...but I think it's more of a rivalry between the branches than a real hatred of a fellow serviceman, a fellow human being.

Apple

You are soo right Apple......My father was an Army grunt in Vietnam.....he didn't like certain branches, because certain branches or divisions got special treatment and his grunts did a lot of the "Grunt work" hence the name. It is kind of like watching the Olympics when they started putting professional players on the teams......There were Lakers fans who hated Larry Bird, and Celtics fans who hated Magic, and both Laker and Celtics fans that hated Jordan.....but they all stood together and cheered them on and loved them when they won the gold against the world. That is how it is in the Military.....I wanted to go into the Air Force....my father said no to that......or the Army....lol.
Every branch thinks they have the best in the world, it is good competition.....ask a Navy Seal if he is better trained than a Ranger, or a Delta soldier......but you watch how fast they have got each others backs in combat. Look at Sonny and Michael.....Sonny wanted to bash Mike's head in when he heard Mike joined the Marines.......but the minute someone messed with Mikey.......Sonny wanted them dead.