How did Officer Phil, who was told by McClusky to take Mike in, at the hospital, know he was a war hero? Would someone at his level, know that much detail?

The novel says that, in 1944, Michael's photo appeared in Life Magazine with a record of his deeds.

.....and I thought that the police only read the Police Gazette.

Michael initially wants nothing to do with the Corleone's "family business", and wants to live a more Americanized life, and is enrolled at Dartmouth College. After the United States' entry into World War II, he enlists in the Marines and fights in the Pacific Theatre. For his bravery, Michael is featured in Life magazine in 1944, having been awarded the Silver Star. Michael is discharged as a Captain to recover from wounds in 1945. He later re-enters Dartmouth, where he meets his future wife, Kay Adams (Diane Keaton).

I would also imagine that since the detective was on the Corleone family payroll that he would be familiar with Mike's exploits.

Also, in the novel it says that Mike suffered a disabling wound that prompted his discharge. Yet it goes on to say that Vito arranged it. Doesn't make sense.

One flaw in the GF is that Michael, given his Marine service, would somehow be nervous or afraid when confronting gangsters (i.e., when he is standing outside the hospital when Vito is being set up for assassination, lights the cigarette, and his hands don't shake; and when he kills the Turk and McCluskey in the restaurant).

True, when Mike proposes to kill Solazzo and McCluskey, Sonny says to him: "It's not like the army, where you shoot them a mile away."

But anyone who knows anything about combat in the South Pacific during WW2, with the Marines fighting the fanatical Japanese, knows it was not "a mile away." Rather, the fighting was close-in, often hand-to-hand, and very, very brutal.

Just watch "Flags of Our Fathers"!

Michael, in fact (according to his testimony before the Senate Committee in GF2), won the Navy Cross, one of the highest decorations for heroism possible, just below the Congressional Medal of Honor. For Michael to have won the Navy Cross, he must have performed valiantly in some hellish combat. Not to mention that he was a Marine captain: That alone means he was plenty tough long before he "made his bones." He was trained to kill men with his bare hands!

So taking on a bunch of Mafioso would have been a piece of cake compared to what he did in the Marines.

Or, as Vito said (in the novel): "A man has but one destiny."

Your post confuses me somewhat.

You say that one flaw in the GF is that "Michael would somehow be afraid..."

I did not see, in that scene, any indication of Michael being nervous or afraid. As a amtter of fact we've spoken here on these boards on many occassions that the scene you are talking about may have actually been the defining moment for Michael, the moment that he realized that he "can do this" because as he looks down at his hands as he is lighting the cigarette he notices that he is not shaking. He was cool, calm and collective through that whole ordeal.

So if I may ask, where is the flaw in that scene? Where does it indicate that he is afraid or nervous?

Michael has ice water in his veins in that scene. He calmly tells the nurse to stay put, sarcasticaly tells Sonny he "won't panic" hatches a great plan fr Enzo the Baker, and after the car drives by, calms the nervious Enzo by ighting his cigarette, telling him he "did good," and shooed him away before the police oculd get their hands on him. In the process healso managed to tell Vito he was "with him now," stood up to McCluskey telling him he would not move until men came to protect his father, and took a hard shot to the jaw.

Nothing nervous or afraid about any of that.

I too don't understand the poster's logic.

I also wich to opine that courage on the battlefield does not necessarily translate into courage off the battlefield. There are a considerable number of different variables associated with each situation that can mitigate courage.

I would also like to explode this myth that somehow Marines are more courageous or capable than the soldiers of other Armed Forces. As a US Army Sergeant I consider myself the equal of any other soldier. The same goes for my Dad who served in the Pacific during WWII.

I agree with the two of you. However, I think I know what the poster above meant.

As I read it, he was saying that the lack of nervousness or fear at the hospital and in subsequent scenes should not have been a surprise to Michael (or anyone else), in light of his miliary experience. The flaw, therefore, would be that the supposed "defining moment" was more of a filmic device than realistic character development.

I disagree with this, for reasons similar to Olivant's, but I think that's what he meant.

Hey guys before things get out of hand about which of our military is more courageous. I think we can all agree that EVERYONE that served and serves now in our military are EQUALLY courageous. I think the fact is that with WWII being fought in 2 different theaters, different branches performed equally in their respective battles, because of the nature of their missions. The Marines were primarily in the Pacific, taking islands, while the Army was busy taking over Europe. The soldier landing in Normandy was just as brave as the Marine landing on Iwo Jima.

I think The Duke, John Wayne, summed up bravery during time of war, in the film "In Harm's Way", when told by Burgess Meredith that he was scared. He replied with

"All battles are fought by scared men
who'd rather be someplace else."

Yeah but the marines are tougher.

I don't think that having been a soldier or having experienced dangerous situations frees you from fear. War hero or not - there were moments when Michael was scared. In the restaurant scene he was scared to death. In the bathroom he's almost panicking when he doesn't find the gun first. When he sits down we can almost hear his heart pounding.
The novel says: "he must have been scared because he was glad he was no longer standing on his legs. They had gone weak with trembling."

Don't ask, don't tell.

My point was this: Much was made in that scene of the fact that Michael's hands were NOT shaking...showing that he was NOT afraid...as if this is somehow a surprise revelation.

But of course, as a Marine hero, why should he be afraid, having been through much more life-threatening situations in the South Pacific fighting the Japanese?

The flaw is that the GF, after acknowledging Michael is a Marine war hero, then proceeds to ignore that fact.

I disagree. As a war hero and Marine, if he was faced with a similar confrontation while on duty, he'd have obviously been armed with various weapons to defend himself.

On the steps of the hospital, as a civilian, he was NOT armed with a gun to defend himself had the carload of hitmen decided to open fire on him or attempt to enter the hospital to get his father. His coolness was in that not knowing what they would do, and not having anything to defend himself with, he did not panic but instead kept calm and collective, made a snap quick decision under that kind of pressure, and called their bluff!

Two totally different scenerios under very different circumstances.

I agree, but I always thought the restaurant scene was a bit over dramatized. Mike might have been a bit apprehensive about having to kill Sollozo - b/c if caught he may have to spend the rest of his life in prison - but, I don't think he should have had ANY fears at all concerning his own life in that situation. Once he survived the car drive over there and got the gun out of the toilet, Sollozo and McCluskey were dead men. Michael was experienced with a gun and not afraid to see brains fly. He was just hoping that Tessio would be waiting to take him out of there.

The hospital scene is actually where Mike faced REAL danger to his life -- and he happened to pass that test with flying colors.

I thought the restaurant scene tension was not about danger to Michael's life or even the chance of going to prison though those things were there. I thought the tension was that he was about to make a irrevocable decision to join his father's world and perform murder. It was an action that was more than justified under Family ethics, but up until then Michael wasn't part of the "Family".

I liked the hospital scene too-that was real bravery.

Uhm, no.

"Whaddaya think, this is the ahmy, you shoot 'em from a hunnud feet away?"

I have talked to plenty of people who have been in combat and they all have told me if you are not afraid you are either an idiot or you are already dead. Courage is overcoming the fear and doing what has to be done.