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Poor Fredo? #396683
05/29/07 11:13 PM
05/29/07 11:13 PM
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 295
ScarFather Offline OP
Capo
ScarFather  Offline OP
Capo
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 295
I understand the sympathy and dislike for Michael for killing his own brother... but just think about a few things...

If Michael lets Fredo live... Michael may die. Tom was left as Don so what happens?

Tom as permanent Don?
Fredo comes in and challenges Tom for Donship?
Fredo is recognized as "Don" of Corleone family by Roth and others and becomes that puppet with EVERYONE else pulling his string?
Fredo is whacked and Tom is whacked and Corleone's become extinct?
It gets messy?


"What I want.... whats most important to me... is that I have a guarantee" - Train approaches.... Bang! Bang! Bang!
Re: Poor Fredo? [Re: ScarFather] #396693
05/30/07 12:26 AM
05/30/07 12:26 AM
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 168
W
wtwt5237 Offline
Made Member
wtwt5237  Offline
W
Made Member
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 168
After the Fredo's treachery was known and Roth and Frankie were whacked, there was no real threat to Micheal. Micheal could have ordered Fredo to stay somewhere where he could not present any more problem for Micheal. Perhaps a small bar manager where he could bang two cocktail waitress at a time for ever.


One has only one destiny, he cannot choose it.
Re: Poor Fredo? [Re: wtwt5237] #396796
05/30/07 10:15 AM
05/30/07 10:15 AM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 11,468
With Geary in Fredo's Brothel
dontomasso Offline
Consigliere to the Stars
dontomasso  Offline
Consigliere to the Stars

Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 11,468
With Geary in Fredo's Brothel
Actually the concept of a divided Corleone family with Fredo being recognized as Don by the family enemies is something I had not thought about before, but it is a possibility and one more reason why Michael should have whacked him. Since Fredo said that "hail mary" at the hour of his death, it is possible that he went to that big cocktail lounge in the sky where to this day he may be banging waitresses two at a time and not have to worry about Moe slapping him around.


"Io sono stanco, sono imbigliato, and I wan't everyone here to know, there ain't gonna be no trouble from me..Don Corleone..Cicc' a port!"

"I stood in the courtroom like a fool."

"I am Constanza: Lord of the idiots."

Re: Poor Fredo? [Re: dontomasso] #396800
05/30/07 10:22 AM
05/30/07 10:22 AM
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 18,238
The Ravenite Social Club
Don Cardi Offline
Caporegime
Don Cardi  Offline
Caporegime

Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 18,238
The Ravenite Social Club
I've said it before and I'll say it again.

Killing your own brother, your mother's son, your father's son, is just cold. Michael just became a cold hearted selfish bastard. It no longer was about "saving" the Corleone family. It became about Michael, his power and his ego.

Connie had foresight because he really did become a cold hearted bastard.



Don Cardi cool

Five - ten years from now, they're gonna wish there was American Cosa Nostra. Five - ten years from now, they're gonna miss John Gotti.




Re: Poor Fredo? [Re: ScarFather] #396825
05/30/07 11:47 AM
05/30/07 11:47 AM
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 19,530
AZ
Turnbull Offline
Turnbull  Offline

Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 19,530
AZ
 Originally Posted By: ScarFather
Fredo is recognized as "Don" of Corleone family by Roth and others and becomes that puppet with EVERYONE else pulling his string?

I think that's exactly what Roth had in mind:

Roth wanted Michael dead to stop him from horning in on his Nevada gaming empire, and from having designs on his Havana holdings. Roth knew that Fredo would be too weak and stupid to run the family effectively with Michael gone. Plus, Fredo had been fatally compromised by cooperating with Roth and Ola. They could have blackmailed him at any time (as in Ola telling Fredo on the phone: "Your brother's not gonna know we talked"---yeah, right, sure).
With Michael dead, a war of succession would have broken out in the Corleone family. Rocco and Neri never would have sat still for being under Fredo's thumb. Tom, notwithstanding his championship loyalty, would have to choose sides. The more they fought, the less focused they'd be on Roth. Roth would use his political influence to isolate and then take over the Corleone hotels in Nevada. Roth's allies, the Rosatos, would inherit New York. Havana would remain with Roth. Fredo would have to take out a life insurance policy.


Ntra la porta tua lu sangu � sparsu,
E nun me mporta si ce muoru accisu...
E s'iddu muoru e vaju mparadisu
Si nun ce truovo a ttia, mancu ce trasu.
Re: Poor Fredo? [Re: Don Cardi] #396829
05/30/07 11:52 AM
05/30/07 11:52 AM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 11,468
With Geary in Fredo's Brothel
dontomasso Offline
Consigliere to the Stars
dontomasso  Offline
Consigliere to the Stars

Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 11,468
With Geary in Fredo's Brothel
 Originally Posted By: Don Cardi
Connie had foresight because he really did become a cold hearted bastard.



Actually DC Connie said he was a "LOUSY" cold hearted bastard, so I guess somewhere aloung the way he lost his lice....maybe it was all that oil in his hair.


"Io sono stanco, sono imbigliato, and I wan't everyone here to know, there ain't gonna be no trouble from me..Don Corleone..Cicc' a port!"

"I stood in the courtroom like a fool."

"I am Constanza: Lord of the idiots."

Re: Poor Fredo? [Re: dontomasso] #396876
05/30/07 02:15 PM
05/30/07 02:15 PM
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 607
Peter_Clemenza Offline
Underboss
Peter_Clemenza  Offline
Underboss
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 607
I don't condemn Michael for ordering Al Neri to murder Fredo; Fredo was a traitor, so he deserved the punishment that a traitor should recieve.

Last edited by Peter_Clemenza; 05/30/07 04:58 PM.
Re: Poor Fredo? [Re: dontomasso] #396884
05/30/07 03:16 PM
05/30/07 03:16 PM
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 19,530
AZ
Turnbull Offline
Turnbull  Offline

Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 19,530
AZ
 Originally Posted By: dontomasso

Actually DC Connie said he was a "LOUSY" cold hearted bastard, so I guess somewhere aloung the way he lost his lice....maybe it was all that oil in his hair.


...but they could have made a meal out of the silk in his suit...


Ntra la porta tua lu sangu � sparsu,
E nun me mporta si ce muoru accisu...
E s'iddu muoru e vaju mparadisu
Si nun ce truovo a ttia, mancu ce trasu.
Re: Poor Fredo? [Re: Turnbull] #396889
05/30/07 03:25 PM
05/30/07 03:25 PM
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 18,238
The Ravenite Social Club
Don Cardi Offline
Caporegime
Don Cardi  Offline
Caporegime

Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 18,238
The Ravenite Social Club
"I don't like to see you come out to this clean country in your oily hair -- dressed up in those silk suits - and try to pass yourselves off as decent Americans."



Don Cardi cool

Five - ten years from now, they're gonna wish there was American Cosa Nostra. Five - ten years from now, they're gonna miss John Gotti.




Re: Poor Fredo? [Re: Don Cardi] #396891
05/30/07 03:33 PM
05/30/07 03:33 PM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 11,468
With Geary in Fredo's Brothel
dontomasso Offline
Consigliere to the Stars
dontomasso  Offline
Consigliere to the Stars

Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 11,468
With Geary in Fredo's Brothel
 Originally Posted By: Don Cardi
"I don't like to see you come out to this clean country in your oily hair -- dressed up in those silk suits - and try to pass yourselves off as decent Americans."



I guess "decent Americans" had permed hair and polyesther suits, like the Dad in the Brady Bunch.


"Io sono stanco, sono imbigliato, and I wan't everyone here to know, there ain't gonna be no trouble from me..Don Corleone..Cicc' a port!"

"I stood in the courtroom like a fool."

"I am Constanza: Lord of the idiots."

Re: Poor Fredo? [Re: Peter_Clemenza] #396928
05/30/07 10:33 PM
05/30/07 10:33 PM
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 295
ScarFather Offline OP
Capo
ScarFather  Offline OP
Capo
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 295
 Originally Posted By: Peter_Clemenza
I don't condemn Michael for ordering Al Neri to murder Fredo; Fredo was a traitor, so he deserved the punishment that a traitor should recieve.


Its really THIS SIMPLE = You kill your brother or your brother kills you.


"What I want.... whats most important to me... is that I have a guarantee" - Train approaches.... Bang! Bang! Bang!
Re: Poor Fredo? [Re: ScarFather] #396973
05/31/07 08:10 AM
05/31/07 08:10 AM
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 18,238
The Ravenite Social Club
Don Cardi Offline
Caporegime
Don Cardi  Offline
Caporegime

Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 18,238
The Ravenite Social Club
 Originally Posted By: ScarFather


Its really THIS SIMPLE = You kill your brother or your brother kills you.



Which brother are you? Caine or Abel?



Don Cardi cool

Five - ten years from now, they're gonna wish there was American Cosa Nostra. Five - ten years from now, they're gonna miss John Gotti.




Re: Poor Fredo? [Re: Don Cardi] #398086
06/05/07 01:01 AM
06/05/07 01:01 AM
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 4,539
My own world.
whisper Offline
Underboss
whisper  Offline
Underboss
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 4,539
My own world.
Fredo deserved what he got.Thats the rules of the game.Fredo knew the risks and thought that just because Michael was his brother,it excluded him from the rules.


The hero and the coward both feel the same thing, but the hero uses his fear, projects it onto his opponent, while the coward runs. It's the same thing, fear, but it's what you do with it that matters. Cus D'Amato
Re: Poor Fredo? [Re: whisper] #398120
06/05/07 06:37 AM
06/05/07 06:37 AM
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 295
ScarFather Offline OP
Capo
ScarFather  Offline OP
Capo
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 295
If Michael lets Fredo live then Fredo could be used against him ALWAYS.... (something in it for me on my own)

Another family could take Fredo and give him his own Corleone family and pit him against Michael. Then Michael has to deal with that situation. Michael Corleone family vs. Fredo Corleone family and ultimately Michael would be taken out.


"What I want.... whats most important to me... is that I have a guarantee" - Train approaches.... Bang! Bang! Bang!
Re: Poor Fredo? [Re: ScarFather] #398122
06/05/07 07:11 AM
06/05/07 07:11 AM
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 39
Alexander Kokotas Offline
Wiseguy
Alexander Kokotas  Offline
Wiseguy
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 39
I don't think so.

See, I don't think Fredo was that dim. He didn't want Michael dead, thats for sure. He MIGHT'VE been more caucious and all. Still, he WOULD be an easy target for Michael's enemies, which is what worried Michael.

Michael also might've looked it from ScarFather's POV, because he was at that time, to phrase Coppola, "as mad as Nixon".


The higher up you go, the crookeder it becomes..

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