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Re: Is there any way to defeat ELSUR? [Re: mulberry] #790617
07/20/14 06:03 PM
07/20/14 06:03 PM
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Footreads Offline
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Don't check out library books.

Don't be on face book.

Don't use search engines.

Don't talk on phones land lines or cell phones.

Don't talk in places where the Feds know it as a hang out. That can be any where restraunt, Italian deli.

Don't talk in your house or your car.

Before you make an innocent call on the phone say if anyone s listening to this call fuck your mother.

Talk in a mall or in a park where they know you don't go, and even then whisper

They can put a bug under your floor and hear everything your saying as clear as day.


only the unloved hate
Re: Is there any way to defeat ELSUR? [Re: mulberry] #790619
07/20/14 06:11 PM
07/20/14 06:11 PM
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Footreads Offline
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Have to talk do it in a country lets make one up like UzbekIstan in a town like Samarkand to make your heroin deals. Just don't brink home any pictures in those dopey cloths they want you to wear.


only the unloved hate
Re: Is there any way to defeat ELSUR? [Re: mulberry] #790622
07/20/14 06:24 PM
07/20/14 06:24 PM
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The best way to defeat it is to not do anything ilegal. It don't take much strength to pull a trigger.But try to get up every morning day after day and work for a living
Let's see 'em try that
Then we'll see who's the real tough guy
The working man is a tough guy!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y3iVumjnXvA

Re: Is there any way to defeat ELSUR? [Re: Beanshooter] #790627
07/20/14 06:32 PM
07/20/14 06:32 PM
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Posts: 23,296
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Originally Posted By: Beanshooter
The best way to defeat it is to not do anything ilegal.

There you go smile.


"I got news for you. If it wasn't for the toilet, there would be no books." --- George Costanza.
Re: Is there any way to defeat ELSUR? [Re: mulberry] #790630
07/20/14 06:49 PM
07/20/14 06:49 PM
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Illegal? The government have so much money invested in surveillance that any political party in charge will use it, and the justice department to stay in charge like Obama is doing right now.

I just bought another roll of toilet paper with Obamas picture on it. It make wiping my ass a lot of fun.


only the unloved hate
Re: Is there any way to defeat ELSUR? [Re: Beanshooter] #790643
07/20/14 09:32 PM
07/20/14 09:32 PM
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mulberry Offline OP
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Originally Posted By: Beanshooter
The best way to defeat it is to not do anything ilegal. It don't take much strength to pull a trigger.But try to get up every morning day after day and work for a living
Let's see 'em try that
Then we'll see who's the real tough guy
The working man is a tough guy!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y3iVumjnXvA


Let me know when all criminals decide to go legit

Last edited by mulberry; 07/20/14 09:33 PM.
Re: Is there any way to defeat ELSUR? [Re: mulberry] #790662
07/21/14 06:41 AM
07/21/14 06:41 AM
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Blackjack2121 Offline
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I think there were reports of certain biker clubs holding silent meetings with a chalkboard

Re: Is there any way to defeat ELSUR? [Re: pizzaboy] #790663
07/21/14 06:44 AM
07/21/14 06:44 AM
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Originally Posted By: pizzaboy
Originally Posted By: mightyhealthy
It seems weird to me that a criminal organization that extorts other criminals can do so without violence. How do they get away with it,pb? Just going on past rep?

Well, first of all, they're not what they used to be. No matter what some folks would like to believe. There are rats living wide open in cities like New York and Miami today.

That said, they're still dangerous. And even if it got to the point where they only kill, say, one guy every few years. Who wants to be that one guy? wink

The threat of violence is enough, and it always has been.


Yep,

thats what the feds kept pushing on in the Ligambi trial. The defense team kept talking about lack of violence and the prosecution kept saying about how the reputation and the threat of violence was enough, even though people werent getting beat up to collect.

Then, a philly rat gets killed right in the middle of the trial. hahahaha

Re: Is there any way to defeat ELSUR? [Re: pizzaboy] #790676
07/21/14 08:59 AM
07/21/14 08:59 AM
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IKnowNothing Offline
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Wiseguy
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Originally Posted By: pizzaboy
Originally Posted By: mulberry
They have parabolic microphones that can record you from hundreds of yards away.

And that's only what they've made public wink.

The technology that the general public is aware of is probably five or ten years behind what the Feds actually have in their arsenal.


OH Brother! Now there is a statement with no strings attached to fact or reality.

Re: Is there any way to defeat ELSUR? [Re: pizzaboy] #790678
07/21/14 09:00 AM
07/21/14 09:00 AM
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IKnowNothing Offline
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Wiseguy
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Originally Posted By: pizzaboy
Originally Posted By: Garbageman
They've got this contraption they install on a cell tower, it out powers any signal around so every phone hunts for and will automatically lock onto this particular signal. Now they've got your LTE/4G quality audio at their disposal. So if you try and outsmart them with a burner phone and they already have known samples of your voice, they can find you talking on that burner using voice recognition in about 10 seconds. Scary shit

Exactly. If the general public can pay for 4G, that means the government is already up to 8G lol.


And another.

Re: Is there any way to defeat ELSUR? [Re: IKnowNothing] #790679
07/21/14 09:06 AM
07/21/14 09:06 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 23,296
Throggs Neck
pizzaboy Offline
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^^^^

Do you honestly believe that the government would make public the sophistication of their electronic and technological advances?


"I got news for you. If it wasn't for the toilet, there would be no books." --- George Costanza.
Re: Is there any way to defeat ELSUR? [Re: mulberry] #790683
07/21/14 09:18 AM
07/21/14 09:18 AM
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This was in 2006. Just think how much technology has changed today!
http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headlines/2006/12/can_you_hear_me/Can You Hear Me Now?

Email0Smaller FontTextLarger Text|Print
By Vic Walter And Krista Kjellman
Dec 5, 2006 3:38pm
Cell phone users, beware. The FBI can listen to everything you say, even when the cell phone is turned off. A recent court ruling in a case against the Genovese crime family revealed that the FBI has the ability from a remote location to activate a cell phone and turn its microphone into a listening device that transmits to an FBI listening post, a method known as a "roving bug." Experts say the only way to defeat it is to remove the cell phone battery. "The FBI can access cell phones and modify them remotely without ever having to physically handle them," James Atkinson, a counterintelligence security consultant, told ABC News. "Any recently manufactured cell phone has a built-in tracking device, which can allow eavesdroppers to pinpoint someone’s location to within just a few feet," he added. THE BLOTTER RECOMMENDS Federal Source to ABC News: We Know Who You’re Calling FBI Secret Probes: 3,501 Targets in the U.S. Click Here to Check Out the Latest Brian Ross Investigates Webcast on CIA Secret Prisons According to the recent court ruling by U.S. District Court Judge Lewis Kaplan, "The device functioned whether the phone was powered on or off, intercepting conversations within its range wherever it happened to be." The court ruling denied motions by 10 defendants to suppress the conversations obtained by "roving bugs" on the phones of John Ardito, a high-ranking member of the family, and Peter Peluso, an attorney and close associate of Ardito, who later cooperated with the government. The "roving bugs" were approved by a judge after the more conventional bugs planted at specified locations were discovered by members of the crime family, who then started to conduct their business dealings in several additional locations, including more restaurants, cars, a doctor’s office and public streets. "The courts have given law enforcement a blank check for surveillance," Richard Rehbock, attorney for defendant John Ardito, told ABC News. Judge Kaplan’s ruling said otherwise. "While a mobile device makes interception easier and less costly to accomplish than a stationary one, this does not mean that it implicated new or different privacy concerns." He continued, "It simply dispenses with the need for repeated installations and surreptitious entries into buildings. It does not invade zones of privacy that the government could not reach by more conventional means." But Rehbock disagrees. "Big Brother is upon us…1984 happened a long time ago," he said, referring to the George Orwell futuristic novel "1984," which described a society whose members were closely watched by those in power and was published in 1949. The FBI maintains the methods used in its investigation of the Genovese family are within the law. "The FBI does not discuss sensitive surveillance techniques other than to emphasize that any electronic surveillance is done pursuant to a court order and ongoing judicial scrutiny," Agent Jim Margolin told ABC News.

Re: Is there any way to defeat ELSUR? [Re: mulberry] #790684
07/21/14 09:22 AM
07/21/14 09:22 AM
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mightyhealthy Offline
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Well, PB, if they are ever going to use it in a trial don't they have to? That would be after the fact, though.

The Snowden revalations also signed a light on government surveillance, not sure how much is applicable to the mafia though.

Re: Is there any way to defeat ELSUR? [Re: mulberry] #790686
07/21/14 09:27 AM
07/21/14 09:27 AM
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Here is another good article:
http://onpoint.wbur.org/2011/08/08/inside-the-fbiAugust 8, 2011 at 11:00 AM

E-mail Twitter (12) facebook (22)
The Secrets Of The FBI

We’re talking about the inside life of the FBI in an era of preventive law enforcement. Trying to stop terror attacks before they happen.


Agents from the FBI and other law enforcement agencies work at a 24-hour operations center at FBI headquarters in the Chelsea section of New York. (AP)

The FBI has always had a checkered image. It’s fought gangsters. It’s worked with gangsters. It’s defended freedoms. It’s trampled freedoms.

For decades, its job one was to catch top criminals. Now, in the era of terrorism, it’s tasked to stop crimes before they occur. Infiltrate. Listen. Tap. Trail.

That is all tricky business. Important. And fraught with pitfalls. Investigative reporter Ronald Kessler has been looking at the FBI’s secrets. He’s with us.

Plus, we’ll talk about the latest in the saga of D.B Cooper.

This hour On Point: secrets of the FBI. And the skyjacker who jumped and vanished.

-Tom Ashbrook

Guests:

Ron Kessler, author and investigative journalist, he has penned nineteen non-fiction books, including his most recent, The Secrets Of The FBI.

Casey McNerthney, crime reporter for the Seattle Post-Intelligencer.

David Boeri, senior reporter WBUR.


From Tom’s Reading List:

CBS News: “The 10th anniversary of 9/11 is next month. And one big reason there hasn’t been another major attack on the U.S. since then is a series of preventive measures taken by the FBI, according to New York Times best-selling author Ronald Kessler, who reveals some of them in his latest book, “The Secrets of the FBI.”
Excerpt: The Secrets Of The FBI
By Ron Kessler
(PDF)

1 — TACOPS

WHEN BREAKING INTO HOMES AND OFFICES TO PLANT BUGGING devices, TacOps agents try to avoid using rear doors. Since they are rarely used, rear doors could be booby- trapped. So when TacOps agents needed to plant bugs in a Philadelphia electronics supply company that was a front for an organized crime drug gang’s hangout, they decided to walk in through the front door.

Agents decided the best time for entry would be between midnight and two in the morning. After that, trash collectors began their pickups and could see agents breaking in. The only problem was that across the street was a bar with outside seating. Patrons of the bar would spot the FBI team defeating the locks and disarming the alarm system at the front door. So TacOps agents borrowed a city bus and rode to the electronics supply company. They parked the bus at the front door and pretended that the bus had broken down. As the FBI agent who was driving the bus lifted the hood, agents scrambled out to work on the locks and break in. Onlookers across the street could not see them behind the bus.

Once the agents were in the target building, the bus drove off. When the agents had finished installing electronic bugs, the bus returned to pick them up. But the bus whizzed past two inebriated customers from the bar who were waiting at a nearby bus stop. When the bus stopped in front of the business, the two angry patrons ran for the bus and jumped in. Since many of the agents were from different offices, everyone
assumed at first that the two men were part of their operation.

“We get a couple blocks away, we start peeling off our equipment,” says FBI agent Louis E. Grever, who was on the TacOps teams for twelve years. “We’ve all got weapons on and radio gear, and these two guys are kind of sitting there going, ‘What the hell?’ They start ringing the bell. Ding, ding! They want to get off. Ding, ding! Now the bus driver, who was from the local office, was not a very good bus driver. I think he practiced for like twenty minutes driving this bus. He was knocking over garbage cans when he made turns. He yells back, ‘Hey, quit playing with the bell! I’m having a hard enough time driving the bus!’ ”

Other agents on the bus began to realize that the two men ringing to get off were not with the FBI after all. Before each job, all the agents meet each other, and now it seemed clear that these two were unwitting imposters.

“One of our guys got up, and he just happened to have a shotgun hanging on the strap on his back,” Grever says. “He walks over to them and goes, ‘Do we know you?’ ”

Now, Grever says, “They’re really ringing that bell. Ding ding ding ding ding! And we realize these guys are not with us. So we yell up, ‘Hey Phil, stop the bus! We’ve got a couple of riders here!’ ”

The driver turned around, took one look at the patrons, and realized they were not agents. Swearing, he pulled over and opened the doors.

“They get out, and we never hear a word from them,” Grever says. “They had no clue what was going on. They just happened to get on the wrong bus.”

Back in 1992, Grever, who has blue eyes and a reddish buzz cut, had never heard of the Tactical Operations Section. But his supervisor in the Jackson, Mississippi, field office, Billups “Bill” Allen, asked if he would like to join it. At the time, Grever had been in the FBI four years. He was expecting to be transferred to New York or Los Angeles.

About what TacOps does, Allen was cagey. Instead, he put him in touch with Mike McDevitt, a fellow former Marine, who was already on the team.

“How’s your family life?” McDevitt asked him.

Surprised by the question, Grever answered, “Fine.”

“You have any kids?”

“Yes.”

“You mind spending time away from them on the road?” McDevitt asked.

“No,” Grever said. “Anything for the mission.”

“Good, we already got the book on you,” McDevitt said. “If you are willing, can stand up to the demands, and can beat out the competition, you might have a future here in TacOps.”

When Grever met with the TacOps team on the FBI Academy grounds in Quantico, Virginia, he learned that it conducts supersecret, court- authorized burglaries to implant hidden microphones and video cameras and to snoop into computers and desks in homes, offices, cars, yachts, airplanes, and embassies. In any given year, TacOps conducts as many as four hundred of what the FBI calls covert entries. Eighty percent are conducted
in national security cases relating to terrorism or counterintelligence. The rest are carried out in criminal cases involving organized crime, white-collar fraud, and political corruption.

As it turned out, Grever had been recruited in part because during college he worked for an engineering company on access control and electronic security. A member of the field office’s SWAT team, he had once been a police officer. Before recruiting him through Allen, TacOps had checked him out thoroughly.

“Above all, they wanted to find out if I would be able to work as part of a team,” Grever says. “When you spend most of your life with a very close- knit crew like TacOps, they want to make sure you can stand up to the challenges. You may be confined with them for extended periods, locked inside storage containers
or on the top of an elevator. You lead a double life and are required to not talk work with family and friends. You do what might best be described as crazy.”

Working as what he calls a “government- sanctioned burglar,” Grever was on one of seven teams of about ten agents each that travel around the country conducting court- authorized break- ins. He conducted or supervised about a thousand covert entries.

Because of his background, Grever initially became a supervisory agent focusing on defeating alarm systems. He rose to head Tactical Operations, an FBI section with a purposely vague name. In his bio on the FBI website, the section is described only as “a deployment team chartered to provide technical support to national priority programs.” In October 2008, FBI director Robert S. Mueller III named Grever the FBI’s executive assistant director for the Science and Technology Branch. That put him in charge of the FBI Laboratory, fingerprints and biometrics, and the Operational Technology Division. Consisting of a thousand people, including contract employees, the Operational Technology Division includes both TacOps and the Engineering Research Facility at Quantico. There, the FBI makes custom- designed bugging devices, tracking
devices, sensors, and surveillance cameras to watch and record the bad guys. It also develops ways to penetrate computers and defeat locks, surveillance cameras, and alarm and access control systems.

On a daily basis, Art Cummings consulted with the fiftyyear- old Grever to discuss innovative ways to intercept the conversations of tough targets and to lay out his priorities in national security cases.

“Before he is going to spend a hundred thousand dollars on a solution, I let him know we have a court order, and I help him prioritize based on our needs,” Cummings says.

Cummings considered TacOps critical to preventing terrorism. “TacOps collects against terrorists while they are in the planning stages, while they have their guard down, allowing us to see what’s really going on,” Cummings says. “Combined with other collection techniques like the development of sources, scrutiny of other records, and physical surveillance, TacOps is a critical piece of an integrated collection plan that allows for a deep, multidimensional understanding of the threat.”

If the FBI needs a simple wiretap of a landline phone or cell phone, or an intercept of an email account, Grever’s technicians in the Operational Technology Division deal directly with the provider. Usually, the phone company can install a court- ordered wiretap within minutes by entering the target number in its computers and transmitting the conversation over an encrypted broadband link to any FBI field office. But if a physical entry is required, TacOps takes over.

In interviews with Grever and other agents currently and formerly assigned to TacOps, the FBI revealed for the first time in its history how it conducts covert entries, the bureau’s most secret, most closely guarded technique. Even to members of Congress and administration officials with top- secret clearances, the operation is off- limits.

In some cases, the FBI can eavesdrop on conversations without breaking in, using parabolic microphones or laser beams to pick up sound vibrations off windows. To guard against similar intrusions, Grever’s office on the seventh floor of FBI headquarters faces an inner courtyard so that no one outside can pick up his conversations. Such a remote effort to eavesdrop is referred to as a “standoff” collection. Both that technique and covert entries to plant bugs and snoop into computers and records are called “close- access attacks.” The FBI may also recruit a surrogate, who is a party to a conversation or who works in an office or home, to introduce a Trojan— an almost invisible listening device implanted in a lamp, for example, which is switched for the original. Using photos taken through a window or by an agent posing as an exterminator, a health inspector, or a telephone repairman, TacOps will have fashioned an exact replica of the lamp in the
targeted office or home.

However, in most cases, a covert entry is required, offering the greatest gain but also posing the greatest risk of being caught and possibly shot by a homeowner, security guard, police officer, or foreign intelligence officer who thinks the agent is a burglar.

In selecting agents for TacOps teams, the FBI looks for men and women who have relevant experience and have worked undercover, since those agents are good at maintaining a façade. The teams include agents from all ethnic backgrounds to blend into particular neighborhoods. Of the FBI’s 13,807 agents, about 20 percent are female. They participate in the full panoply of TacOps activities, including conducting covert entries, serving on perimeter surveillance teams, and participating in “quick- react contingency teams” that will rush in to bring a dangerous situation under control.

To give agents plausible cover, male and female agents may walk together, holding hands. However, “Contrary to the James Bond movies, our female agents aren’t allowed nor asked to use sex to manipulate or control a subject,” Grever says. “Flirting and a smile at the right time are perfectly fine, but nothing physical.”
In conducting surveillance, agents may use any type of vehicle— a bucket truck, a Rolls- Royce, or a U.S. Postal Service truck.

Agents are assigned to jobs randomly. “You could be on the Robert Hanssen case, you could be on the Aldrich Ames case, you could be on the John Gotti case, you could be on the Umar Abdulmutallab case or the Zacarias Moussaoui case,” Grever says.

Over the years, the FBI has conducted successful covert entries at the Russian and Chinese embassies or their other offi – cial diplomatic establishments, as well as at the homes of their diplomats and intelligence officers. Because of the obvious sensitivity, Grever and other current FBI officials would not discuss these operations. In breaking into an embassy, the FBI may try to develop an insider to help with the entry. Once an entry has taken place, code books or electronic encryption keys used by foreign embassies are the greatest prize. Agents on the TacOps teams have what are called deep aliases, meaning that if someone runs a check on their driver’s license or social security number, the appropriate agencies would confirm their fictional identity.

“When our operators are home with family, they are simply Special Agent John or Jane Doe, but as soon as they leave the house and particularly when on a job, they become Jim Brown, Hector Garcia, or Andrea Simmons, complete with all the right documents, including alias driver’s license, passport, and credit cards, and all the right stories, including fake family, fake job, and fake history— all fully backstopped,” Grever says.
When returning home, undercover agents make sure they are not being followed. If pulled over for a speeding violation, they would not reveal that they are agents.

Arrangements for undercover operations are made by an FBI program code- named Stagehand. If $2 million in cash is needed as front money, Stagehand provides it. If a yacht or airplane is needed as a prop, Stagehand can provide one that was confiscated in a criminal case.

Stagehand sets up front companies so agents can hand out business cards showing they work there. The companies have real offices staffed by personnel who actually work for the FBI. Stagehand also creates front companies so agents can gain access to a target.

“One day we will be Joe’s Plumbing, complete with a white work truck, company label, uniforms, and telephone number,” Grever says. “If called, FBI personnel will say, ‘Joe’s Plumbing, can I help you?’ Another day it will be Joe’s Survey and Excavation Services, with the same level of backstopping.”

A full wardrobe of about fifty assorted uniforms hangs on racks at the TacOps Support Center. A graphics expert designs custom- made uniforms, fake ID and badges, and wraps with fake signs for trucks. Agents will pose as elevator inspectors, firefighters, or utility workers. Alternatively, they could pose as tourists, wearing shorts and taking snapshots. They could be homeless people wearing tattered clothes. Agents select oversize
clothes where they can secrete their tools for breaking in. And they go in with guns drawn.

“Usually we practice cover stories beforehand,” Grever says. “If they confront you, and you give them one cover story, and then they confront me, I may give them something different.” To avoid ethical issues, TacOps agents won’t impersonate a member of the clergy or a journalist. They may pose as telephone repairpeople or FedEx or UPS delivery people. But they try to avoid posing as an employee of a real company because if they are challenged, “our cover story can quickly break down if someone calls his local FedEx or UPS outlet and asks if we really work there,” Grever says.

If a TacOps agent’s identity is exposed because he or she is called to testify in court about an entry, that agent can no longer serve on the covert entry teams. The strategy and contingency plans for each break- in are laid out in operations orders. Agents are required to read the court order authorizing the intrusion so they know exactly what they may and may not do.

A successful “job,” as TacOps agents call it, takes weeks of planning— to determine the schedule and habits of occupants, to study the alarms and surveillance systems that need to be defeated, and to plot escape strategies. Agents from TacOps and from the local field office fall into four groups: a survey group, which scopes out and controls the site; a mechanical group, which picks locks and opens safes and mail; an electronics group, which focuses on computers and BlackBerrys; and a “flaps and seals” group, which concentrates on special techniques the occupants may use to detect intruders. That group is also responsible for “target recovery,” making sure the team leaves behind no sign that agents were there. For one job, more than a hundred agents may be involved.

“We will send agents in, and they will spend days looking at the target, the patterns of life around it, day and night, weekends and weekdays,” Grever says. “We are interested in people’s sleep habits, and when they will be in a deep sleep cycle when a loud noise will not necessarily wake them up. We will track everything because— I’m not being melodramatic— our lives depend on it.”

Sometimes the FBI offers bogus prizes to get occupants to leave the targeted home.

“We give people opportunities to travel and do exotic things,” Grever says. “ ‘You’ve won the lottery! You’ve won a trip, a free dinner! Congratulations, we picked your business card out of a bucket.’ That wasn’t luck. That was us, trying to present an opportunity.”

To cover up noises or divert attention, the FBI may drive garbage trucks through the streets and bang the garbage cans around. They may start up a wood chipper or use a jackhammer to attack a piece of concrete that has been delivered to the location and dumped on the street. They may use high- pressure water jets to clean the sidewalks, sending passersby scurrying. Agents may enlist local police to park their cruisers with lights flashing nearby. Seeing a police car, passersby will assume that the person climbing a ladder to enter an apartment or office can’t be a burglar.

Agents may remotely freeze the view on closed- circuit television so security guards watching for intruders will not see them enter. During the operation, at least one of the agents does nothing but watch out windows or doors to make sure no one is approaching. TacOps agents refer to the period when they are inside an installation or defeating lock systems as the “exposure time.” While security guards are a problem, “our biggest fear, quite frankly, is innocent third parties such as a neighbor with a key to the premises and a gun,” Grever says. Perhaps a suspect is away for the weekend and leaves his key with a neighbor. “The neighbor may be nosy and sit around the home,” Grever says. “If he hears something unusual, instead of calling the police, he tries to defend the neighbor’s property with a gun. That’s when your tennis shoes for running away fast can come in very handy.”

If the neighbor calls the police, that is not necessarily considered a bad thing: The FBI scans police dispatches and usually enlists the aid of local police assigned to joint task forces. Instead of a dispatched police car showing up, an officer in league with the FBI will arrive on the scene and pretend to take a police report. By that time, the agents are long gone. As a safety precaution, agents bring with them devices that
peer under doors. They check for explosives and radiological or biological hazards. In some cases, the purpose of the entry is to determine if suspects are making bombs or developing weapons of mass destruction, as happened during the investigation of anthrax mailings.

Drug dealers will booby- trap their buildings to guard against competitors and thieves. They may rig a lightbulb so that if it’s turned on, it will explode and ignite gasoline or dynamite. Instead of breaking into an office building or government facility at night, agents may stage what they call a “lock- in.”

They hide inside the office building until occupants have left for the evening, then break into the targeted office. They may hide in a telephone utility closet or on top of an elevator. In one such case involving terrorism, TacOps agents rode up and down on top of an elevator for hours.

“The building finally closed up for the night,” Grever recalls. “Surveillance teams outside and in neighboring high- rises where we had rented space could watch and report movements of the night security staff. When the time was right, we called our elevator to the floor just below our target, using controls we can operate remotely by plugging into the elevator command- and- control circuits. Using elevator control keys we have, we opened the doors from the inside and went to work on our targeted suite of offices undetected.”

After the work was done, the agents positioned themselves on top of the elevator again and waited for the building to open in the morning. “After changing back into our business attire, we walked out with the rest of the people who were visiting that building that morning,” Grever says.

In some cases, agents are delivered to a compound inside a sealed shipping carton. In the middle of the night, like soldiers in a Trojan horse, they emerge and break into the target facility. To break into a home, an agent sealed in a refrigerator carton may be delivered to the front door, where the carton shields him from passersby as he works on the locks.

“We typically construct containers that even the most suspicious freight workers or longshoremen couldn’t open without a lot of effort and time,” Grever says. “Even if they did try to open our container, our emergency action team— FBI agents rushing in with raid jackets on— would be there in time to avoid a
confrontation.”

To make sure they are not caught, TacOps assigns field office agents or special surveillance teams to follow occupants of homes or offices— called “keyholders”— to watch them to see if they start to return. If they do, agents tailing them radio that they are heading back and estimate the time it will take them to return. Agents working the premises know their own “breakdown time,” how long it will take them to gather their equipment and leave without a trace.

“If the breakdown time is fifteen minutes and the target is five minutes away, we’ll have a plan in place to slow them down,” Grever says.” Since we’re in our own backyard, we can involve the police, fire department, public health and public safety officials, the sanitation department, the U.S. Postal Service.”

Perhaps there is a “sudden traffic jam,” Grever says. Or there could be an “accident in front of them, or police could pull them over. There could be a little local natural disaster— a fire hydrant is turned on and is flooding the street, and they have to go around the back way.” Letting the air out of tires is another
stratagem.

During an entry, one agent is in charge of making sure everything is returned to normal. At the beginning of the operation, he photographs the rooms so everything can be put back in place. If a chair or sofa is to be moved, agents first place tape on the floor to mark where the legs are.

“Trained foreign intelligence officers set traps to warn them of an intrusion by leaving a door ajar a certain degree or arranging magazines a certain way,” Grever notes.

The owner of a desk may never open one drawer but sets up an item inside to fall over, tipping him off if an intruder opens the drawer. Working with the CIA, the FBI interviews defectors to learn tradecraft used by adversaries to detect FBI intrusions. Every other week, Grever meets with his counterparts at the CIA to
compare notes on the latest bugging and surveillance devices. So that nothing is left behind, each tool used during an operation is numbered and marked to identify it with the agent using it. Before leaving, agents take an inventory to make sure they have all their tools. To smooth out marks their shoes may have left on carpets, agents carry a small rake.

“We have a light that we’ll use to see whether or not dust marks have been disturbed,” Grever says.”We carry a supply of dust. We can throw a little bit of additional dust on if needed to make everything look as it was.”

Excerpted from The Secrets of the FBI by Ron Kessler. Copyright 2011 by Ron Ksssler. Excerpted by permission of The Crown Publishing Group, an imprint of the Random House Publishing Group. All rights reserved.

Re: Is there any way to defeat ELSUR? [Re: pizzaboy] #790688
07/21/14 09:28 AM
07/21/14 09:28 AM
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Lou_Para Offline
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Originally Posted By: pizzaboy
^^^^

Do you honestly believe that the government would make public the sophistication of their electronic and technological advances?
Right on,Pizzaboy.In his book,Pistone recounts an incident in which his recorder malfunctioned,and failed to capture a crucial conversation. In his frustration,he fired it against the wall,destroying it.
He summed it up nicely when he said that the Government will not give it's latest technology to agents for making cases that could go to court. They would rather see guys walk than have to reveal the gadgets or methods involved to the public.

Re: Is there any way to defeat ELSUR? [Re: mightyhealthy] #790690
07/21/14 09:30 AM
07/21/14 09:30 AM
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pizzaboy Offline
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Originally Posted By: mightyhealthy
Well, PB, if they are ever going to use it in a trial don't they have to? That would be after the fact, though.

The Snowden revalations also signed a light on government surveillance, not sure how much is applicable to the mafia though.

I don't know what they're WILLING to use against the mob, and frankly, I don't give a fuck. I'm just stating what they CAN do if they WANT to. Big brother and all that crap.

And I don't trust the Government as far as I can throw them. But fuck Snowden. He's a traitor who should be drawn and quartered. But let's not derail the thread with another political discussion.


"I got news for you. If it wasn't for the toilet, there would be no books." --- George Costanza.
Re: Is there any way to defeat ELSUR? [Re: Lou_Para] #790692
07/21/14 09:32 AM
07/21/14 09:32 AM
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pizzaboy Offline
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Originally Posted By: Lou_Para
Originally Posted By: pizzaboy
^^^^

Do you honestly believe that the government would make public the sophistication of their electronic and technological advances?
Right on,Pizzaboy.In his book,Pistone recounts an incident in which his recorder malfunctioned,and failed to capture a crucial conversation. In his frustration,he fired it against the wall,destroying it.
He summed it up nicely when he said that the Government will not give it's latest technology to agents for making cases that could go to court. They would rather see guys walk than have to reveal the gadgets or methods involved to the public.

Thanks, Lou. I appreciate that. But that guy is just trolling. Ten or eleven posts so far, and all of them are antagonistic. He's obviously been here before and he has an ax to grind. And I doubt he'll be here for very long.


"I got news for you. If it wasn't for the toilet, there would be no books." --- George Costanza.
Re: Is there any way to defeat ELSUR? [Re: pizzaboy] #790694
07/21/14 09:34 AM
07/21/14 09:34 AM
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Blackjack2121 Offline
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Originally Posted By: pizzaboy
^^^^

Do you honestly believe that the government would make public the sophistication of their electronic and technological advances?


I think it is obvious this guy is simply a troll.

His first 2 posts on this board and I already knew that.

Re: Is there any way to defeat ELSUR? [Re: mulberry] #790698
07/21/14 09:48 AM
07/21/14 09:48 AM
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mightyhealthy Offline
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Haha, that story about the bus is hilarious. Those two people were probably scared as hell.

Re: Is there any way to defeat ELSUR? [Re: mightyhealthy] #790699
07/21/14 09:52 AM
07/21/14 09:52 AM
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Originally Posted By: mightyhealthy
Haha, that story about the bus is hilarious. Those two people were probably scared as hell.





I know! I wonder if any of the Philly guys know what case that was.

Re: Is there any way to defeat ELSUR? [Re: mulberry] #790700
07/21/14 09:53 AM
07/21/14 09:53 AM
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mightyhealthy Offline
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Pb, I'm not trying to get into a political discussion. You can probably guess how I feel about Snowden. I was just bringing up some electronic surveillance techniques that the government doesn't want people to know about, but we do now anyway. That's all.

Re: Is there any way to defeat ELSUR? [Re: mulberry] #790701
07/21/14 09:54 AM
07/21/14 09:54 AM
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mightyhealthy Offline
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Imagine being wasted and getting on a bus with a driver that has no idea what they are doing and everyone has weapons on them? Especially after a night out? That is fucking hysterical.

Re: Is there any way to defeat ELSUR? [Re: mulberry] #790702
07/21/14 10:00 AM
07/21/14 10:00 AM
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ne philly
merlino Offline
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The feds can get into listening on any wiseguys just with associating with other underworld figures who may have connections either intentionally or not with terrorist organizations through gun trade drug trade stolen overseas goods whatever... then that becomes threats to national security and then the "enemy of the state" nsa, surveillance starts on some ppl and your outta business

Re: Is there any way to defeat ELSUR? [Re: merlino] #790704
07/21/14 10:08 AM
07/21/14 10:08 AM
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Originally Posted By: merlino
The feds can get into listening on any wiseguys just with associating with other underworld figures who may have connections either intentionally or not with terrorist organizations through gun trade drug trade stolen overseas goods whatever... then that becomes threats to national security and then the "enemy of the state" nsa, surveillance starts on some ppl and your outta business

That's all I was trying to convey. Whether it's admissible or not, that's another story. But if they want you, they're going to make your life a living Hell.

And I've said it before. But Vinny Basciano has already been housed with terrorists. It's just a matter of time before the Feds link a local drug deal to a foreign national to a radical group like Al-Qaeda. And even though there are many degrees of separation, when that happens, they'll start using the anti-terrorism statutes against run of the mill criminals like Italian American wiseguys.

I think it's pretty clear that I don't trust the government. But neither do I hate them. They have an impossible job to do in the age of terrorism.


"I got news for you. If it wasn't for the toilet, there would be no books." --- George Costanza.
Re: Is there any way to defeat ELSUR? [Re: pizzaboy] #790729
07/21/14 12:32 PM
07/21/14 12:32 PM
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ne philly
merlino Offline
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Originally Posted By: pizzaboy
Originally Posted By: merlino
The feds can get into listening on any wiseguys just with associating with other underworld figures who may have connections either intentionally or not with terrorist organizations through gun trade drug trade stolen overseas goods whatever... then that becomes threats to national security and then the "enemy of the state" nsa, surveillance starts on some ppl and your outta business

That's all I was trying to convey. Whether it's admissible or not, that's another story. But if they want you, they're going to make your life a living Hell.

And I've said it before. But Vinny Basciano has already been housed with terrorists. It's just a matter of time before the Feds link a local drug deal to a foreign national to a radical group like Al-Qaeda. And even though there are many degrees of separation, when that happens, they'll start using the anti-terrorism statutes against run of the mill criminals like Italian American wiseguys.

I think it's pretty clear that I don't trust the government. But neither do I hate them. They have an impossible job to do in the age of terrorism.


100% right on the feds nowadays, you have drug dealers in Afghanistan sending heroin all over, and eastern europeans and cartels in mexico and s america all making money at any menas necessary and that money that is transferred at some point will end up in the hands of people living in terrorits states in russia, middle east, africa, and once that connection is made as was stated above by someone then the 8G or 10G surveillance kicks in. I know here they have some mobile cell phone listening devices that they go after the drug dealers with and were given these through the federal government. There is probably someone with the government linked in on this site...crazy stuff

Re: Is there any way to defeat ELSUR? [Re: mulberry] #790936
07/22/14 12:06 PM
07/22/14 12:06 PM
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Carosophia Offline
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There are ways to encrypt email and cellular communication
http://www.tccsecure.com/products/wirele..._somRoC3wnw_wcB

PgP also comes to mind..but like Lupara said as above..idk why talk about it if you don't an absoulty have to..I think a lot if guys got nailed cause they needed to satisfy their egos.


Do the right thing
Re: Is there any way to defeat ELSUR? [Re: mulberry] #791009
07/22/14 04:22 PM
07/22/14 04:22 PM
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>>>OVA THERE
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>>>OVA THERE
I'll bet 50 to 1 that a lot of those guys don't even have cell phones for that exact reason of being tracked and bugged....After that story about what Ralph Guarino did to the DeCavalcante's, those guys are probably scared to even touch a cell phone anymore.


"Jersey...It's where my story begins."
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