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May 27th, 2012
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Re: What made Gotti so likeable? [Re: TheKillingJoke] #955017
10/07/18 11:10 AM
10/07/18 11:10 AM
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Originally Posted by TheKillingJoke
Originally Posted by JCrusher
Originally Posted by TheKillingJoke
That was John Favara. Of course nobody knows how his demise truly went like, but it's rumored he was pummeled with a baseball bat, dismembered with a chainsaw before he was dissolved in acid. It crosses into sadism territory.

Gangsters can be nice enough on a superficial level, but once you cross a certain line of relation and they got you in their pocket, they often won't be so nice anymore. It's their line of work.

Except he didnt cross a line it was just an accident. If you are driving when the sun is going down it can be very tough to see. Add to the fact that a dumpster was put in to the street, and add to that fact that a kid darts out from it out of nowhere there was nothing the poor guy can do. Thats how ive heard it and my father has heard from officers involved in that situation. The whole "favara was drunk and evil" nonsense was just something the gotti women made up. The Favara family was also harrassed during that time and even after john favara was already killed. Janet Favara was harassed by victoria gotti and they were also sent a box of excrement. The only gotti who has been somewhat honest about that situation. He says he was friends with Scott Favara and liked the family. Did he really mean that? Who knows but I take his word for it because he was indeed friends with Scott


The Favara situation definitely was an accident. There wasn't anything he could've done.
The second part of my comment was more meant as a general statement. You cross a certain line of involvement with a gangster - like getting into debt with them or making them feel like you owe them something (and both things can happen faster than you think - there's basically no turning back

.
Well I agree to a certain extent. Yes I agree dont get involved with gangsters but that doesnt justify getting murdered for it. So thats why I keep saying 4th of july psrties or even loaning out money may seem like such a nice thing for them to do is only a front in which they are the ones who gain the most

Re: What made Gotti so likeable? [Re: JCrusher] #955018
10/07/18 11:17 AM
10/07/18 11:17 AM
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Originally Posted by JCrusher

Well I agree to a certain extent. Yes I agree dont get involved with gangsters but that doesnt justify getting murdered for it. So thats why I keep saying 4th of july psrties or even loaning out money may seem like such a nice thing for them to do is only a front in which they are the ones who gain the most


Where did I justify people getting murdered for being involved with gangsters? Matter of fact, I actually mean that it's quite easy to being tricked into thinking that this gangster you just met "isn't such a bad bloke like he's got a reputation for being", he does you a few small favors (where he's still benefiting from) and before you know it they got you in their pockets. Suddenly when it dawns up on you that there's no way out of his pockets, the situation can turn ugly.
My apologies if I wasn't clear enough.

Re: What made Gotti so likeable? [Re: TheKillingJoke] #955019
10/07/18 11:28 AM
10/07/18 11:28 AM
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Originally Posted by TheKillingJoke
Originally Posted by JCrusher

Well I agree to a certain extent. Yes I agree dont get involved with gangsters but that doesnt justify getting murdered for it. So thats why I keep saying 4th of july psrties or even loaning out money may seem like such a nice thing for them to do is only a front in which they are the ones who gain the most


Where did I justify people getting murdered for being involved with gangsters? Matter of fact, I actually mean that it's quite easy to being tricked into thinking that this gangster you just met "isn't such a bad bloke like he's got a reputation for being", he does you a few small favors (where he's still benefiting from) and before you know it they got you in their pockets. Suddenly when it dawns up on you that there's no way out of his pockets, the situation can turn ugly.
My apologies if I wasn't clear enough.

I NEVER stated you meant it was justified. I was talking in general man.

Re: What made Gotti so likeable? [Re: JCrusher] #955020
10/07/18 11:31 AM
10/07/18 11:31 AM
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Originally Posted by JCrusher
Originally Posted by TheKillingJoke
Originally Posted by JCrusher

Well I agree to a certain extent. Yes I agree dont get involved with gangsters but that doesnt justify getting murdered for it. So thats why I keep saying 4th of july psrties or even loaning out money may seem like such a nice thing for them to do is only a front in which they are the ones who gain the most


Where did I justify people getting murdered for being involved with gangsters? Matter of fact, I actually mean that it's quite easy to being tricked into thinking that this gangster you just met "isn't such a bad bloke like he's got a reputation for being", he does you a few small favors (where he's still benefiting from) and before you know it they got you in their pockets. Suddenly when it dawns up on you that there's no way out of his pockets, the situation can turn ugly.
My apologies if I wasn't clear enough.

I NEVER stated you meant it was justified. I was talking in general man.


Yeah I get it. Seems we just misinterpreted each other. I agree with your take.

Last edited by TheKillingJoke; 10/07/18 11:32 AM.
Re: What made Gotti so likeable? [Re: Moe_Tilden] #955054
10/07/18 10:32 PM
10/07/18 10:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Moe_Tilden
Jace

I like Conor McGregor but I can admit that he got his ass beat tonight. You like John Gotti. Why can't you admit that he is what he is, a scumbag and criminal?

What are your opinions on Gotti having his neighbor murdered when he wasn't in the life, Jace? What are your opinions on Gotti and his crew flooding the neighborhood he "protected" with drugs? What are your opinions on Gotti and his crew hijacking and extorting his fellow Italian Americans? What are your opinions that this man never worked an honest day in his life, getting up at noon every day. A man who was such a terrible provider for his family, which his wife often complained about by the way, that he smuggled his family out of the hospital when his child was born because he was too broke from being a deadbeat gambler to pay his hospital bills.

And I reiterate, you cannot slander people online and call them criminals when you have absolutely no evidence and are unwilling to provide any, as usual. I don't agree with the public figure thing either. George Anastasia talks about mobsters for a living. I can't go online and say he runs a bookmaking and extortion operation a) because it's nonsense and b) because if he got wind of it he could have the site taken down/pursue legal action. "Public figure" isn't a blanket term that protects you from saying whatever you want about people, believe it or not.

If you think you are beyond reproach for doing it that's one thing, but you could get the owners of the website in trouble.




You are making it personal again and putting words in my mouth. Liar. I never said I liked Gotti, lie one. Next you bring up ethnicity and race, and drudge up everything you can. You end off saying I thing I am beyond reproach. Things were fine till you logged back on and immediately resumed attacking me personally. Please state your opinions without mentioning me or insulting me. I've asked you repeatedly to stop, you keep ignoring that request. AS soon as I log on you are right back to talking about me in an insulting way.

Re: What made Gotti so likeable? [Re: Moe_Tilden] #955221
10/09/18 12:01 PM
10/09/18 12:01 PM
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jace Offline
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Originally Posted by Moe_Tilden
Originally Posted by JCrusher
Originally Posted by jace
Of course, no problem JC.

Cool. I mean i was just trying to be honest from what ive heard. I wasnt a Howard Beach resident but my father did work as a cop in the city where a lot of mob figures were including the bergin crew. Even people who he talked to or his fellow cops talked seemed to"like" gotti but it was more fear. He described it to me as "battered wife syndrome"


Wasn't a black man the victim of a modern day lynching by Gotti supporters back in 1986? Plus he had his neighbor dissolved in acid. And he wasn't in the life. If I was a resident of that part of New York I would have Stockholm syndrome too when it comes to these people.




No a Black man was not lynched by Gotti supporters, a Black man was killed in fight with White teenagers in Howard Beach, but none were Gotti supporters, friends, or even knew him. There was no lynching. There was. fight between a few adults who were Back and a larger group of White teens who came after them following an initial confrontation where the teens were outnumbered. The leader of the White teens was the son of a New York Police captain, he turned states evidence. His name was Reilly I think. He was the only one with a previous bias case arrest for attacking a Jewish man with a fire extinguisher. I wish you would not bring up race to make a point, especially when it has no truth to it.

Last edited by jace; 10/09/18 12:05 PM.
Re: What made Gotti so likeable? [Re: Joe_Bonanno] #955223
10/09/18 12:06 PM
10/09/18 12:06 PM
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There is literally a Wikipedia page about the incident entitled: "Howard Beach racial incident"

Quote
On December 20, 1986, a black man was killed and another was beaten in Howard Beach, Queens, New York, in a racially charged incident that heightened racial tensions in New York City.

The man attacked was 23-year-old Michael Griffith (March 2, 1963 – December 20, 1986), who was from Trinidad and had immigrated to the United States in 1973,[1] and lived in Crown Heights, Brooklyn. He was killed after being hit by a car as he was chased onto a highway by a mob of white youths who had beaten him and his friends. Griffith's death was the second of three infamous racially motivated killings of black men by white mobs in New York City in the 1980s. The other victims were Willie Turks in 1982 and Yusuf Hawkins in 1989.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Howard_Beach_racial_incident

And the same people who did it would have been sympathisers of John Gotti. Indeed I remember them being described as such when I read news reports describing the killings and their aftermath while doing research.


In my thoughts, I use the technique of positive visualization.
Re: What made Gotti so likeable? [Re: Moe_Tilden] #955231
10/09/18 12:19 PM
10/09/18 12:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Moe_Tilden
There is literally a Wikipedia page about the incident entitled: "Howard Beach racial incident"

Quote
On December 20, 1986, a black man was killed and another was beaten in Howard Beach, Queens, New York, in a racially charged incident that heightened racial tensions in New York City.

The man attacked was 23-year-old Michael Griffith (March 2, 1963 – December 20, 1986), who was from Trinidad and had immigrated to the United States in 1973,[1] and lived in Crown Heights, Brooklyn. He was killed after being hit by a car as he was chased onto a highway by a mob of white youths who had beaten him and his friends. Griffith's death was the second of three infamous racially motivated killings of black men by white mobs in New York City in the 1980s. The other victims were Willie Turks in 1982 and Yusuf Hawkins in 1989.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Howard_Beach_racial_incident

And the same people who did it would have been sympathisers of John Gotti. Indeed I remember them being described as such when I read news reports describing the killings and their aftermath while doing research

Good Find Moe.

Last edited by JCrusher; 10/09/18 12:20 PM.
Re: What made Gotti so likeable? [Re: Joe_Bonanno] #955234
10/09/18 12:25 PM
10/09/18 12:25 PM
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News of the suicide of the ringleader of the attack, Jon Lester, was leaked to the media after Victoria Gotti posted a condolence letter.

Quote
And perhaps a response condolence posting by Victoria Gotti, daughter of deceased mobster John Gotti who was also Lester’s neighbor might have been the magnet that alerted the popular daily newspaper of the suicide.


That tells you all you need to know really.

Also, in same article.

Quote
Lester allegedly stated that he aspired to being “a capo” in the Mafia.


I'm not going to post the racial epithets Lester and his friends were reported to have said in the build up to the murder. They're in the articles linked below.

https://www.caribbeanlifenews.com/stories/2017/11/2017-11-03-vkp-inside-life-cl.html

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/10/23/...howard-beach-race-attack-dies-at-48.html

Also, the mayor of New York, Howard Koch, compared it to a lynching:
Quote
This incident can only be described as rivaling the kind of lynching party that existed in the Deep South.



In my thoughts, I use the technique of positive visualization.
Re: What made Gotti so likeable? [Re: Moe_Tilden] #955236
10/09/18 12:28 PM
10/09/18 12:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Moe_Tilden
News of the suicide of the ringleader of the attack, Jon Lester, was leaked to the media after Victoria Gotti posted a condolence letter.

Quote
And perhaps a response condolence posting by Victoria Gotti, daughter of deceased mobster John Gotti who was also Lester’s neighbor might have been the magnet that alerted the popular daily newspaper of the suicide.


That tells you all you need to know really.

Also, in same article.

Quote
Lester allegedly stated that he aspired to being “a capo” in the Mafia.


I'm not going to post the racial epithets Lester and his friends were reported to have said in the build up to the murder. They're in the article linked below.

https://www.caribbeanlifenews.com/stories/2017/11/2017-11-03-vkp-inside-life-cl.html

Yeah that does make sense especially the victoria gotti condolence letter lol

Re: What made Gotti so likeable? [Re: Joe_Bonanno] #955250
10/09/18 04:42 PM
10/09/18 04:42 PM
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jace Offline
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You are reaching for articles that were proven untrue. Lester not only never said any of that, they also wrote that he was racist because of his South African heritage. You can find old articles stating he support his nations Apartheid rule. Only problem is he never lived there, he was born and raised in England, to which he was deported after his prison time.
Al Sharpton tied a court officer to the killing, because his car hit one of the men running away. He was vindicated, although not by Sharpton and certain news outlets, like the Caribbean news which Moe went far ou too his way to Dig up.
You 2 are pathetic, trying to fight the Gotti likeablility thing by tying him and people who support him to a racial incident. You 2 disgust me. I would never support anyone saying that the police were behind it ( as was also printed back then) to make. point, I would not as I mentioned say the police were behind a lynching because a police captains son was the leader and got off. And for the last time, they were not Gotti supporters, I am sick of you 2 alternating with lies and BS, using race to make points, and teaming up in arguments. I will stop posting, you 2 and your lies and crap and false peace offering are tiresome.

You 2 win, I will stop posting fuck the 2 of you. . You bring up race to make a point, in a sick way, screw you both. BYE!

Last edited by jace; 10/09/18 04:45 PM.
Re: What made Gotti so likeable? [Re: jace] #955251
10/09/18 04:56 PM
10/09/18 04:56 PM
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JCrusher Offline
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Originally Posted by jace
You are reaching for articles that were proven untrue. Lester not only never said any of that, they also wrote that he was racist because of his South African heritage. You can find old articles stating he support his nations Apartheid rule. Only problem is he never lived there, he was born and raised in England, to which he was deported after his prison time.
Al Sharpton tied a court officer to the killing, because his car hit one of the men running away. He was vindicated, although not by Sharpton and certain news outlets, like the Caribbean news which Moe went far ou too his way to Dig up.
You 2 are pathetic, trying to fight the Gotti likeablility thing by tying him and people who support him to a racial incident. You 2 disgust me. I would never support anyone saying that the police were behind it ( as was also printed back then) to make. point, I would not as I mentioned say the police were behind a lynching because a police captains son was the leader and got off. And for the last time, they were not Gotti supporters, I am sick of you 2 alternating with lies and BS, using race to make points, and teaming up in arguments. I will stop posting, you 2 and your lies and crap and false peace offering are tiresome.

You 2 win, I will stop posting fuck the 2 of you. . You bring up race to make a point, in a sick way, screw you both. BYE!

WOW. I havent lied AT ALL. Like I said i live in NY and my family was in law enforcement in the city. So i guess they are liars too? By the way your true colors showed up. Disgusting post.

Last edited by JCrusher; 10/09/18 05:07 PM.
Re: What made Gotti so likeable? [Re: JCrusher] #955256
10/09/18 05:52 PM
10/09/18 05:52 PM
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Jace and Crusher: Take this offline. Don't pollute this thread (or any others) with personal beefs.


Ntra la porta tua lu sangu sparsu,
E nun me mporta si ce muoru accisu...
E s'iddu muoru e vaju mparadisu
Si nun ce truovo a ttia, mancu ce trasu.
Re: What made Gotti so likeable? [Re: Turnbull] #955257
10/09/18 05:54 PM
10/09/18 05:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Turnbull
Jace and Crusher: Take this offline. Don't pollute this thread (or any others) with personal beefs.

Yeah I never wanted that. Tried so hard to be nice and never cursed or insulted. Anyway thats over with now

Re: What made Gotti so likeable? [Re: Joe_Bonanno] #955544
10/13/18 02:52 AM
10/13/18 02:52 AM
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I enter this topic late, but I'd say there are several reasons Gotti was liked and popular.

He was a career gangster who truly lived the life, which garners respect.
He was a flash dresser as he got older, not a dirty street scumbag thief.
He had family power and a long, strong association with Neil Dellacroce.
He was successful as a gangster. Drugs, sure, but who moralizes in LCN?
He was a high flyer who didn't fly beneath the radar - he WANTED attention.
He was unforgettable: he had fans & wasn't interested in staying in the shadows.


"It was all crap, right up to the moment he died" - an investigator's opinion - and epitaph - of John Holmes (Johnny Wadd)

"Drunk words are sober thoughts" - Anon.
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