Many of these men still held on to their faith throughout their lives of crime, how did they square that life life with the teachings of the Lord?

I'm an an Irish Catholic from Co. Tipperary, IRA volunteers in our country were given absolution by certain Priests for Murder in this country during the War of Independence in the early 20s. It's only a pity the filthy fcuks didn't stop with it after the war had ended.

What type of relationship in general was there with the mob and RCC in the US over the years? I presume many mobsters still practiced the faith.

I remember reading that Dean O'Banion in Chicago was given a great send off at his graveside by Fr Daniel Molloy a good friend of his even though his local RCC diocese had denied him a Funeral Mass because he was a gangster.

"One Good Turn Deserves another" Molloy speaking in reference to all the genuine good O'Banion had did in his life for the poor and destitute of his local area.

Speaking as a Protestant from Ulster stock, I would say it would be very hypocritical for any church no matter the faith to condone murder. But only God can judge and no priest or minister has the right to pass judgment!

A funeral service should be allowed as long as its not got any form of 'celebration' of that persons crimes whatever they are.

British what happened and happen today between UK and Irland is a religion war;the english until 1500 oppressed the cattolic irish and Cromwell destroyed a city named drogheda to tame the irish men. In italy is different and the religione for the mobster is only external:so for respect the Our Lady statue bows in front of the mobsters home,John dickie made a documentary Called Chiesa Nostra, a word joke 'tween chiesa and cosa nostra.
Cutolo said that will be repent only in front of God.
For me who kill innocent people is out of God Grace and must be excommunicate. But it's just my opinion.

John Dickie's Chiesa Nostra Intro.

Furio, we all have our views on that, it's not as black and white and you think but that's not got anything to do with this.

I have RC friends and they know my views on their church and I would ask that those without sin cast the first stone, there is much sin within that church so if an individual has a faith then who is a priest to say whether they get a funeral, only God can judge...

Amen

There is no need to sugarcoat anything Furio.

The Irish "famine" was more like a deliberate genocide than a famine.

It was population control pure and simple. Irish people were perceived as a threat to the British, so my ancestors were deliberately starved and forced to emigrate in their millions, which left the British free to reinforce their policies in the country.

The British Prime Minister, Tony Blair, apologized for it.

British is an absolute imbecile. If you are looking for an intelligent British perspective on interrelations with Ireland then you are not going to get it from him.

Thanks for the explanation Moe. I went to Irland 3 time and absoluty don't understand that the irish famine was a genocide I read on history books that was a bactery of the potato plants. This give to the English empire the third place as the most evil empire from the modern age.

Of course here we go with Moe the bigot with his one sided republican nonsense

The famine affected Protestants as well!

What this has to do with the original post question, answer the original point!!

Only God can judge....

The RC church in the US can and does deny funeral masses to certain people. Gotti, Frank DeCicco and Castellano were all denied this rite.

This doesn't mean the church denies they will be forgiven by God for their sins. That's between them and God. They are granted a funeral service, but not the full rite of Mass.

Canon 1184 of the Code of Canon Law, is ''The following are to be deprived of ecclesiastic funeral rites: notorious apostates, heretics and schismatics; persons who have chosen the cremation of their own bodies for reasons opposed to the Christian faith; other manifest sinners for whom ecclesiastic funeral rites cannot be granted without public scandal to the faithful.''

In the cases of Gotti and Castellano it was to avoid the appearance that the church condoned their criminal activity, which falls under the last reason of the Canon.

Castellano wasn't even allowed to be buried in Catholic cemetery. That was just crazy stuff, God Almighty will judge the dead, not Man.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bloody_Sunday_(1972)

Nobody condoning terrorism here but the IRA wouldn't exist if the British Army wasn't slaughtering defenseless, unarmed, innocent women and children in the street.

Not to mention British Army soldiers going off the reservation and personally committing murders i.e. Robert Nairac.

Context is important.

The IRA were bombing and murdering way before the British army arrived to try and keep the peace.

British forces killed many loyalists as well, Brian Robinson, the set up of Billy Wright and many more

Stop with the incessant victimhood card, anyhow why can't you reply to the original posters question?

I think its an interesting point, what is the stance from the RC church in Italy and Sicily to Cosa Nostra members?

Complete and utter horsehit and you know fully well that it is.

And because you keep commenting/trolling on sensitive topics that you should stay out of.

Piss off to a UDA, UVF, UFF or Orange Order forum. You'll fit in better.

I think it's absolutely revolting that you are comparing the British Army killing British terrorists to the British Army killing women and children civilians.

You are sick in the head.

The only troll is you Moe, 3 posts on this thread and not one that's related to the point made by the original poster


What a vile little man you are...

I know a Church in Brooklyn that the Monsignor issued a letter so a made guy would be let out of jail sooner..This recently happened. To me it's don't ask, don't tell law of the Church.

Religious paintings donated by infamous Camorra Mafia boss ordered removed by Naples archbishop http://gangstersinc.ning.com/profil...ed-by-infamous-camorra-mafia-boss-ordere

If you are going to comment on the origins of the conflict and how the British army came to be in Ireland at that time at least be honest about. Ulster Loyalists were whipping things up into a frenzy long before the Provos had to emerge to defend their people.

As for the discussion at hand, there is simply no similarity or comparison between the (frankly difficult) relationship between Irish Republicans and the Church and Italian gangsters and the Church. In fact it is bizarre that the opening comment on this is from someone from Tipperary, with that area’s own proud record in the fight for freedom, talking about “murders”. The War of Independence saw ordinary Irish men and boys do the hard yards for their country and thank God that they did. Thank God also that there were good priests there to minister to them in that crisis. For an understanding of the value these men placed on their faith I would recommend anyone to read Guerilla Days In Ireland by Tom Barry and they would see quite clearly that they are dealing with a different beast to criminals and murderers who associate themselves with the Church to assuage their guilt or for reasons of cultural attachment. They were humble young men who fought and died for their country, usually single and upstanding individuals, not philandering gangsters prepared to make others pay for their own personal gain.