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May 27th, 2012
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Who was the wealthier boss genovese or Luciano? #744211
10/13/13 03:00 PM
10/13/13 03:00 PM
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Revis_Knicks Offline OP
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Who had more power, influence, and wealth? Was it lucky luciano when he was don or Vito Genovese when he was don? Why did Vito disrespect lucky by changing the name of the family from the Luciano family to the Genovesw family?

Re: Who was the wealthier boss genovese or Luciano? [Re: Revis_Knicks] #744213
10/13/13 03:12 PM
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LittleMan Offline
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I never thought Vito changed the name himself, although he probably wanted to. It was changed by the FBI and LE when Valachi revealed information about LCN. I believe whichever boss was running things at the time, had the family named after him. And Vito happened to be in charge in 1963.

Joe Profaci was a charter member of the commission, and ran his family for 34 years. But the family is named after Joe Colombo, who took over the family just months before Valachi's testimony. If Valachi flipped a year earlier, the family may have been known as the Magliocco family, after Joe Magliocco. If Valachi flipped two years earlier, it would be known as the Profaci family.

Supposedly, Joe Massino tried to change the name of the Bonanno family to the Massino family, but to no avail.


You shit-kicking, stinky, horse-manure-smelling motherfucker you! If you ever get out of line over there again, I'll smash your fucking head so hard you won't be able to get that cowboy hat on. You hear me? Fucking hick. -Nicky (Casino)
Re: Who was the wealthier boss genovese or Luciano? [Re: Revis_Knicks] #744217
10/13/13 03:42 PM
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Revis_Knicks Offline OP
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Interesting. I guess you learn something new everyday. Tommy Lucchese made $5 million a year during the depression. I assume that Luciano and genovese used to net something like that annually.

Re: Who was the wealthier boss genovese or Luciano? [Re: Revis_Knicks] #744218
10/13/13 03:43 PM
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Snakes Offline
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Not entirely true. The Valachi hearings actually named Profaci's old family the "Magliocco Family" and had it listed as such on their charts. However, the Commission never approved of Magliocco as boss and he was summarily deposed and replaced with Colombo who in turn inherited the namesake.


"Snakes... Snakes... I don't know no Snakes."
Re: Who was the wealthier boss genovese or Luciano? [Re: Revis_Knicks] #744228
10/13/13 04:27 PM
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LittleMan Offline
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Snakes, good points about Magliocco.

Maybe during the months surrounding the Valachi testimony and the McClellan hearings, there was a shift of the leadership to Colombo and the government just went with Colombo as it was current?


You shit-kicking, stinky, horse-manure-smelling motherfucker you! If you ever get out of line over there again, I'll smash your fucking head so hard you won't be able to get that cowboy hat on. You hear me? Fucking hick. -Nicky (Casino)
Re: Who was the wealthier boss genovese or Luciano? [Re: Revis_Knicks] #744238
10/13/13 05:49 PM
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I believe as the Commission never officially recognized Magliocco as boss, when they gave the family to Colombo they made it known that the family was to be renamed as punishment for the trouble that the family had caused in the recent months. As Magliocco was only the head of the family for a matter of months and the transition happened very quickly after (or during) the Valachi hearings, the Feds probably just went with "Colombo Family" for convenience purposes.


"Snakes... Snakes... I don't know no Snakes."
Re: Who was the wealthier boss genovese or Luciano? [Re: Revis_Knicks] #744255
10/13/13 07:49 PM
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Yes from what I seen on the FBI site they liked to call each family after whoever the boss was at that time. Of course now they go by our regular 4 families we are used to hearing.

The Feds went with the "Magliocco Family" for the Colombos after Colombo was killed. Then it changed to Persico Family after the Snake took over.

Re: Who was the wealthier boss genovese or Luciano? [Re: dixiemafia] #744266
10/13/13 11:03 PM
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Originally Posted By: dixiemafia
Yes from what I seen on the FBI site they liked to call each family after whoever the boss was at that time. Of course now they go by our regular 4 families we are used to hearing.

The Feds went with the "Magliocco Family" for the Colombos after Colombo was killed. Then it changed to Persico Family after the Snake took over.


The Colombo name stuck. In some reports you'd see things like the "Gambino/Gotti" family, the "Genovese/Gigante" family, the "Colombo/Persico" family, the "Lucchese/Amuso" family, and the "Bonanno/Massino" family but those same 5 names - Genovese, Gambino, Lucchese, Colombo, Bonanno - are what's set in stone. There was also a similar thing in Philadelphia for a time where you saw the "Bruno/Scarfo" family.

Last edited by IvyLeague; 10/13/13 11:04 PM.

Mods should mind their own business and leave poster's profile signatures alone.
Re: Who was the wealthier boss genovese or Luciano? [Re: Revis_Knicks] #744533
10/15/13 12:57 PM
10/15/13 12:57 PM
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Revis_Knicks Offline OP
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Who do you guys believe was the more affective boss?

Re: Who was the wealthier boss genovese or Luciano? [Re: Revis_Knicks] #744541
10/15/13 01:54 PM
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Originally Posted By: Revis_Island
Who do you guys believe was the more affective boss?


Lucky.....if we're counting the time when both he and Vito were active bosses on the street, and not when they were behind bars/deported.

Lucky had close contacts with other families.....Anastasia and Lucchese were underbosses, but were closely aligned with Lucky. And Lucky had the ear of the Jewish mob through Lansky, Siegel, and Lepke. Through Costello, he had political contacts and he had Joe Adonis in his corner.

Meanwhile, Vito was supposedly anti semitic and didn't get along with Lansky and Siegel. Vito and Anastasia hated each other, and he tried to whack Costello. According to the book, Joey the Hitman, Genovese also tried to whack Lansky.

Charlie had more power and influence. Wealth? I'd give the nod to Genovese due to the margins with narcotics, but that's just a guess.


You shit-kicking, stinky, horse-manure-smelling motherfucker you! If you ever get out of line over there again, I'll smash your fucking head so hard you won't be able to get that cowboy hat on. You hear me? Fucking hick. -Nicky (Casino)
Re: Who was the wealthier boss genovese or Luciano? [Re: Revis_Knicks] #744566
10/15/13 04:00 PM
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Revis_Knicks Offline OP
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Both were extremely wealthy I imagine though. I think Lucchese was probably just as wealthy as them. Making $5 million during the depression is absolutely astonishing. I could be wrong though genovese and Luciano could've made 10 times more than lucchese for all I know

Re: Who was the wealthier boss genovese or Luciano? [Re: Revis_Knicks] #744569
10/15/13 04:03 PM
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Look at what old man Kennedy made during the depression, jeesh


"In onore della Famiglia la Famiglia e' aperta"
Re: Who was the wealthier boss genovese or Luciano? [Re: Revis_Knicks] #744591
10/15/13 06:51 PM
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Hypothetically, if Charlie was a free man in the US (not deported to Italy), he would have had multiple revenue streams, which appeared more profitable than what Genovese had going on. Again, this is strictly hypothetical, as we all know he was deported and took a hands off approach to most of the family's rackets.

He would have been partners with Meyer Lansky in Havana. And he would have worked closely with Bugsy in Las Vegas....might have kept him in line better than Meyer did. He also would have been involved with the racing wire that Bugsy was involved with. In addition, he would have worked together with Costello with the Louisiana slots with Huey Long. Plus, as the don, he likely would have gotten a piece of whatever Genovese had going on. Based on my knowledge, Vito didn't profit from the above, but Charlie would have.

I read a bio which discussed when Charlie originally expanded his rackets to Los Angeles/Hollywood. He battled with Frank Nitti on the drug territory in LA....he even ordered a hit on Nitti, after which, Nitti gave in to Charlie's demands. While in LA during that general period, Lucky also found time to have girlfriend and actress Thelma Todd whacked. He used the second floor of her diner to set up a posh gambling room. Again, this was from a bio that I read. I'm not taking this all as fact.


You shit-kicking, stinky, horse-manure-smelling motherfucker you! If you ever get out of line over there again, I'll smash your fucking head so hard you won't be able to get that cowboy hat on. You hear me? Fucking hick. -Nicky (Casino)
Re: Who was the wealthier boss genovese or Luciano? [Re: Revis_Knicks] #744604
10/15/13 10:38 PM
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Lucky was always willing to work with the Jews and Genovese wasn't. This made Lucky wealthier than Vito even at his richest.


"Snakes... Snakes... I don't know no Snakes."
Re: Who was the wealthier boss genovese or Luciano? [Re: Revis_Knicks] #744606
10/15/13 11:04 PM
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http://www.bls.gov/data/inflation_calculator.htm maroneee 5 million in 1920 is equivelent to 58.5 million today! unbelievable!



Re: Who was the wealthier boss genovese or Luciano? [Re: Revis_Knicks] #744607
10/15/13 11:08 PM
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thats interesting too about thelma todd.. i thought she looked familiar and there is actually a picture of them two together https://www.google.com/search?q=charles+lucky+luciano&newwindow=1&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=CANeUsqRCc_F4APcvYH4Bw&ved=0CAkQ_AUoAQ#facrc=_&imgdii=_&imgrc=0gISDtLcbwJ80M%3A%3B5_xehf0pBydCdM%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww.histeria.blog.br%252Fwp-content%252Fuploads%252F2013%252F07%252Fcharles-lucky-luciano-antes-de-fazer-uma-suruba.jpg%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww.histeria.blog.br%252Fa-murder-inc-judeus-a-servico-da-mafia%252F%3B900%3B639 theres other pictures too i just am too lazy right now



Re: Who was the wealthier boss genovese or Luciano? [Re: Revis_Knicks] #751230
12/03/13 03:47 AM
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Power? Luciano. Influence? Luciano. Wealth? Genovese.

In Luciano's early life right before the Castellammarese war and up to about the 1950's, Luciano had more wealth then Genovese.
When Lucky went to prison and was deported he had to rely on those that were loyal to him in the states to get his money. Genovese fled to Italy to avoid a murder rap, but was still able to setup networks, most notable the narcotics, not to mention he made sure he got his share of the cash. When Lucky went to Italy, he was low on funds from the states, and decided to reopen the narcotic networks that Genovese had setup before Genovese was sent back to the states. Genovese used Luciano's name to set these networks up, so Lucky figured he would make sure they were his, until bosses back in the states were growing angry with Lucky as his involvement was bringing in a lot of heat from law enforcement to which Luciano complied and stopped. When Costello was removed as boss the money really stopped reaching Luciano. Once Genovese reached the top spot, the money was rolling in as the family had ventured into other rackets that became a cash cow for the mob during the late 1950's to the early 70's. The Capo's made sure Genovese got his cut as he was only sentence to 15 years in 1959. But Genovese could never shake the shadow that Lucky put over the family, which is what Genovese tried to do at Appalachin, and the rest is history.


"I have this Nightmare. I'm on 5th avenue watching the St. Patrick's Day parade and I have a coronary and nine thousand cops march happily over my body." Chief Sidney Green
Re: Who was the wealthier boss genovese or Luciano? [Re: Revis_Knicks] #751248
12/03/13 10:07 AM
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Truth of the matter is this: We'll never know the truth

Re: Who was the wealthier boss genovese or Luciano? [Re: Revis_Knicks] #751276
12/03/13 12:28 PM
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To speak on the subject of naming the families. I Think it was a generational thing, reading little al's book, guys like schiavo traced the roots of the families way back to mineo and morello and called the families after them.

Once you got to the senate reports of the 60's that named the families after whatever boss was in charge, that seemed to be the shift where the young guys (at that time) called them by that name and that's what stuck. But again this is a public thing, I imagine the actual wiseguys don't refer to the names the way outsiders do, they, i think, refer to things geographically based (the west side, referring to the traditional power base of the genovese's) or whoever is running the show. If bellomo is meeting with crea I doubt he'll ever utter the name lucchese in reference to it, even in a passing mention to someone in his own family.

Re: Who was the wealthier boss genovese or Luciano? [Re: Revis_Knicks] #751282
12/03/13 12:34 PM
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We will never know.


From now on, nothing goes down unless I'm involved. No blackjack no dope deals, no nothing. A nickel bag gets sold in the park, I want in. You guys got fat while everybody starved on the street. Now it's my turn.

Re: Who was the wealthier boss genovese or Luciano? [Re: Revis_Knicks] #751357
12/03/13 06:34 PM
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If you measure wealth in houses,cars and stuff like that,than it was Genovese.Lucky was in jail for a long time and after it he was deported in Italy.You cannot compare Italy and the U.S. in thouse days.Mobsters in the U.S. were making a lot more money than the fellas in Italy.Plus Genovese lived longer.


Whoever appeals to the law against his fellow man is either a fool or a coward. Whoever cannot take care of himself without that law is both. For a wounded man shall say to his assailant: "If I live, I will kill you. If I die, you are forgiven." Such is the Rule of Honor

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Re: Who was the wealthier boss genovese or Luciano? [Re: Revis_Knicks] #751361
12/03/13 06:56 PM
12/03/13 06:56 PM
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How is there anyway to really know?


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