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Why doesn't the NY mob expand? #727987
07/19/13 08:10 PM
07/19/13 08:10 PM
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mulberry Offline OP
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As Lefty Guns said to Donnie Brasco in the movie, in NY you have five thousand guys chasing the same nickel. Now that most of the other families are dead or dying, why don't the NY families send crews to other cities to take over the gambling and shylock rackets? I know they're in Connecticut, Florida and Mass, but there is open country everywhere to make money.

Re: Why doesn't the NY mob expand? [Re: mulberry] #727994
07/19/13 08:28 PM
07/19/13 08:28 PM
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SharpieOne Offline
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If they can't maintain the rackets in their own backyard, what makes you think they can do it in no-man's-land?

Re: Why doesn't the NY mob expand? [Re: mulberry] #727995
07/19/13 08:29 PM
07/19/13 08:29 PM
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In a wide open city
Tony_Pro Offline
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1. They don't know the lay of the land too well and don't have connections to establish bread-and-butter street rackets.

2. Street gangs and other ethnic OC groups have beat them to the punch. Why would those group work with out-of-towners in shy-locking and traditional mob rackets when they're already making a fortune on drugs?

3. No one to recruit once they get there, gangs thrive on personal ties, people they can trust to not rat or be too greedy. Who's going to be loyal to a bunch of guys sail in to town from New York. See point 1 also. They'd have to import soldiers, weakening already weakened families.

4. They're struggling to maintain what they already have. Who's going to stretch their resources on a big gamble in an area where cosa nostra has already been wiped-out.

5. Not too many major cities have a cohesive Italian emigrant population (or Sicilian, if the family is old school) like New York does. The ones that do still have an active cosa nostra group.

Last edited by Tony_Pro; 07/19/13 08:30 PM.

This life of ours, this is a wonderful life. If you can get through life like this, hey, thats great. But it's very, very unpredictable. There are so many ways you can screw it up.-Paul Castellano (he would know)

"I'm not talking about Italians, I'm talking about criminals."-Joe Valachi
Re: Why doesn't the NY mob expand? [Re: mulberry] #727997
07/19/13 08:34 PM
07/19/13 08:34 PM
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It would bring down to much heat, feds wouldnt allow these guys to entrench themselves in another city.


"Let me tell you something. There's no nobility in poverty. I've been a poor man, and I've been a rich man. And I choose rich every fucking time."

-Jordan Belfort
Re: Why doesn't the NY mob expand? [Re: mulberry] #728007
07/19/13 09:04 PM
07/19/13 09:04 PM
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Let's say you live in a mid-sized city that has some action. Pretend for a second that it's Rochester...or Scranton...or anything of the like.

Are you going to place your action with the small town bookie (and they're still there) that you've known for the last 20 years. The guy you can meet in the same spot, as he wears the same jacket, and has the same opening line -- or are you going to place your action with someone you've never met before? It's not like some NY wiseguy can just show up in his Cadillac and start handing out business cards. Every city has a vice. Just because LCN isn't there doesn't mean that there's not a good place to wet your whistle on a Friday and place your action for Sunday. Same with drugs, cards, numbers and about anything else you can think of. Catering to someone's weaknesses is a universal truth -- not a mafia one.

I've lived in some of those small-time areas without LCN -- Vegas, Buffalo, etc. And even without LCN, there's known people who you can drop a slip off with or use their website. Why would I change up that routine for someone who I don't know from the glory hole in the wall?

Re: Why doesn't the NY mob expand? [Re: mulberry] #728009
07/19/13 09:18 PM
07/19/13 09:18 PM
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mott street manhattan
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Kansas city is a gold mine ever since the bikers galloping goose were shut down. Why doesn't NYC send down some of their problem guys and get em outta their hair?

Re: Why doesn't the NY mob expand? [Re: red] #728026
07/19/13 10:42 PM
07/19/13 10:42 PM
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Originally Posted By: red
Kansas city is a gold mine ever since the bikers galloping goose were shut down. Why doesn't NYC send down some of their problem guys and get em outta their hair?


First of all their is already a Italian element handing gambling in KC. Second the Goose/el forresto's are still operating just fine out of their new headquarters. They weren't shut down, they had some administration arrested and sent to prison but they never shut down.

Re: Why doesn't the NY mob expand? [Re: Tony_Pro] #728035
07/20/13 12:45 AM
07/20/13 12:45 AM
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mulberry Offline OP
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Originally Posted By: Tony_Pro
1. They don't know the lay of the land too well and don't have connections to establish bread-and-butter street rackets.

2. Street gangs and other ethnic OC groups have beat them to the punch. Why would those group work with out-of-towners in shy-locking and traditional mob rackets when they're already making a fortune on drugs?

3. No one to recruit once they get there, gangs thrive on personal ties, people they can trust to not rat or be too greedy. Who's going to be loyal to a bunch of guys sail in to town from New York. See point 1 also. They'd have to import soldiers, weakening already weakened families.

4. They're struggling to maintain what they already have. Who's going to stretch their resources on a big gamble in an area where cosa nostra has already been wiped-out.

5. Not too many major cities have a cohesive Italian emigrant population (or Sicilian, if the family is old school) like New York does. The ones that do still have an active cosa nostra group.


1. You have to start somewhere

2. Most ethnic street gangs don't deal in gambling and juice. They deal in drugs. Besides, I'm not talking about going into Gary Indiana. I'm talking about the suburbs of major cities. Those people gamble too.

3. You send a made man and a few associates. The families have a bunch of brokesters and troublemakers who aren't earning. Send them to another city to start up gambling operations. You have to start somewhere. How did those bookies get started?

4. I don't think they're struggling to maintain a hold in NY/NJ. The gambling and juice rackets there are saturated.

5. If the mob can only operate in cohesive Italian neighborhoods, then they are doomed. The Little Italy in KC is about 4 square blocks. There is no little Italy in Detroit and barely anything left in Chicago. The fact is, everyone gambles and gamblers lose and borrow money. There was no Italian community in Las Vegas and the mob had a lock on that city.

Re: Why doesn't the NY mob expand? [Re: mulberry] #728077
07/20/13 12:03 PM
07/20/13 12:03 PM
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azguy Offline
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Who says they haven't reach into some of these others areas, quietly or through front people...?


"In onore della Famiglia la Famiglia e' aperta"
Re: Why doesn't the NY mob expand? [Re: mulberry] #728120
07/20/13 02:09 PM
07/20/13 02:09 PM
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Tommy2Times Offline
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Originally Posted By: mulberry
Originally Posted By: Tony_Pro
1. They don't know the lay of the land too well and don't have connections to establish bread-and-butter street rackets.

2. Street gangs and other ethnic OC groups have beat them to the punch. Why would those group work with out-of-towners in shy-locking and traditional mob rackets when they're already making a fortune on drugs?

3. No one to recruit once they get there, gangs thrive on personal ties, people they can trust to not rat or be too greedy. Who's going to be loyal to a bunch of guys sail in to town from New York. See point 1 also. They'd have to import soldiers, weakening already weakened families.

4. They're struggling to maintain what they already have. Who's going to stretch their resources on a big gamble in an area where cosa nostra has already been wiped-out.

5. Not too many major cities have a cohesive Italian emigrant population (or Sicilian, if the family is old school) like New York does. The ones that do still have an active cosa nostra group.


1. You have to start somewhere

2. Most ethnic street gangs don't deal in gambling and juice. They deal in drugs. Besides, I'm not talking about going into Gary Indiana. I'm talking about the suburbs of major cities. Those people gamble too.

3. You send a made man and a few associates. The families have a bunch of brokesters and troublemakers who aren't earning. Send them to another city to start up gambling operations. You have to start somewhere. How did those bookies get started?

4. I don't think they're struggling to maintain a hold in NY/NJ. The gambling and juice rackets there are saturated.

5. If the mob can only operate in cohesive Italian neighborhoods, then they are doomed. The Little Italy in KC is about 4 square blocks. There is no little Italy in Detroit and barely anything left in Chicago. The fact is, everyone gambles and gamblers lose and borrow money. There was no Italian community in Las Vegas and the mob had a lock on that city.



That's a shame there is allot of us Italians living here in Las Vegas and your right no little Italy, no Italian community, just an Italian/American club. I know of some retired made guys living here that are from NY families, Trafficante, and LA but are like I said retired.

Re: Why doesn't the NY mob expand? [Re: joey_dice] #728123
07/20/13 02:14 PM
07/20/13 02:14 PM
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mott street manhattan
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Originally Posted By: joey_dice
Originally Posted By: red
Kansas city is a gold mine ever since the bikers galloping goose were shut down. Why doesn't NYC send down some of their problem guys and get em outta their hair?


First of all their is already a Italian element handing gambling in KC. Second the Goose/el forresto's are still operating just fine out of their new headquarters. They weren't shut down, they had some administration arrested and sent to prison but they never shut down.

well from my studies kc is the best because its you got the interstate 35 coming out of Dallas (which is a growing market)I 35 goes to kc then you got the I 70 going west so you are dead center. can you imagine how many truckers pass through there. oh theres room for Italian restaurants, bakeries fuddgettaboit along them interstates. Don't forget many interstates have splits or spurs indicated with suffixed letters after passing through D/FW, I-35's two forks merge in Denton entering the Kansas City Metropolitan Area where it serves Johnson County, and Kansas City, Kansas a ramp, for cattle trucks may be found in either direction along the highway. some truck stops have 80 truckers stopping per day. your dead center the place is undeveloped it new territory. if my math tells me that there would be thousands a dollars per day to be made, you could some
machines and tables in them restaurants offering credit. youse tell me how much money could be made plus kc, may not have man power to pull off this operation.

Last edited by red; 07/20/13 02:20 PM.
Re: Why doesn't the NY mob expand? [Re: mulberry] #728141
07/20/13 03:10 PM
07/20/13 03:10 PM
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In exile watching star wars an...
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Skinny Offline
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Why would you give credit to guys at a truck stop????? Will you take my action red???

Re: Why doesn't the NY mob expand? [Re: Skinny] #728149
07/20/13 03:41 PM
07/20/13 03:41 PM
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mulberry Offline OP
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Originally Posted By: Skinny
Why would you give credit to guys at a truck stop????? Will you take my action red???


What you could do is take sports bets and run brothels.

Re: Why doesn't the NY mob expand? [Re: mulberry] #728151
07/20/13 03:45 PM
07/20/13 03:45 PM
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In exile watching star wars an...
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obviously you missed the fucking point

Re: Why doesn't the NY mob expand? [Re: mulberry] #728153
07/20/13 03:53 PM
07/20/13 03:53 PM
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Not to mention the dangers of expanding a family's membership- it only takes one moron, one overtly greedy guy, one dipshit to really bring masive heat down on the entire organization. Taking over a racket in distant cities would require such man power to overturn the already existing OC and building a network of relationships that you would be almost certain to get the kind of guys that bring down families.


Should probably ask Mr. Kierney. I guess if you're Italian, you should be in prison.
I've read the RICO Act, and I can tell you it's more appropriate...
for some of those guys over in Washington than it is for me or any of my fellas here
Re: Why doesn't the NY mob expand? [Re: mulberry] #728154
07/20/13 03:54 PM
07/20/13 03:54 PM
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Saint Louis has an extremely large Italian American population and no OC in the area. One of the strongest Little Italys in the nation (yeah… it's bigger than the ever shrinking Little Italy in Manhattan).


F. Mazola, Esq.
Re: Why doesn't the NY mob expand? [Re: mulberry] #728173
07/20/13 05:12 PM
07/20/13 05:12 PM
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The mob is done in most cities and is never coming back . Alot of Italians have career options these days and many are going to college.

Philly is probably always going to have a mob, it could just be very small with business limited to gambling and shy . I know philly does do some garbage stuff in south jersey and that doesn't appear to be changing anytime soon.

I'm sure Chicago mob isn't going anywhere so either . I know several Chicago posters don't believe the 30 made guy estimates but I am on the side that the Feds # is probably pretty close to the right # . With roughly 30-50 active made guys , how much power can they really have today , that just isn't enough man power IMO to do alot , an as importantl put fear in people , which was the backbone of its power. They just don't whack people in Chi anymore.

NY and NJ is going to have a mafia presence for a long time . It still has the manpower to do damage and just so many different businesses to earn from ( just a by product of the area ) . They are smaller but still wield alot of power outside the gambling and shy core biz. They are still crushing it in the marajuana biz and are still common place in the garbage (more NJ from what i hear ) and union / construction businesses . Talking to my friends in those industries , their presence is still accepted and commonplace ( and in some cases valued ). I know a few low level guys in the luchesse NJ that basically only do gambling and shy and they are still making a couple hundred K a year . Nothing crazy but still a good amount of $, higher end middle class .

Re: Why doesn't the NY mob expand? [Re: mulberry] #728191
07/20/13 07:24 PM
07/20/13 07:24 PM
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In a wide open city
Tony_Pro Offline
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Quote:
1. You have to start somewhere


Yeah you do. But is it worth the risk of uprooting your man-power to "foreign" when you can make that money at home. Conneticut and NJ is close enough to be "home turf" to NY families. But moving out to Louisville or Northern Virginia is something that is going to take more than "sending a couple of guys" to get a lock on.

Quote:
2. Most ethnic street gangs don't deal in gambling and juice. They deal in drugs. Besides, I'm not talking about going into Gary Indiana. I'm talking about the suburbs of major cities. Those people gamble too.


At legit places were they may be robbed blind, but at least they'll come out with their kneecaps intact. With legal gambling spreading to more and more places, taking down a marker "Big Sal" isn't that appealing to people who are in traveling distance to an Indian casinos and don't want to deal with street characters. The legit casino business here in Reno has been slaughtered by the opening of Indian casinos in Nor Cal and I'm sure that the effect has been the same for the mob on the east coast and midwest. Why go to "Big Sal" if you're not a desperate degenerate gambler?

And there are only so many of those to go around. New York, NJ and it's burbs are huge enough to provide demand but I doubt Pittsburgh or Denver could. New York's bread and butter is gambling and shylock, but they still make money off of drugs. Could they resist infringing on street gang or ethnic OC turf? I don't think they could, it only takes one or two greedy meatheads to touch off a war.

Quote:
3. You send a made man and a few associates. The families have a bunch of brokesters and troublemakers who aren't earning. Send them to another city to start up gambling operations. You have to start somewhere. How did those bookies get started?



And drain off your crews in NY to do an uncertain venture on unfamiliar turf, see my point above, it isn't impossible but I doubt it's worth the trouble and potential conflict with people who are established there.


Quote:
4. I don't think they're struggling to maintain a hold in NY/NJ. The gambling and juice rackets there are saturated.


Yet people keep getting popped and will continue to get popped. They're already scraping the bottom of the barrel in terms of guys smart enough to run complicated rackets. Why drain off the pipeline of replacements to bet on uncertain risks?

Quote:
5. If the mob can only operate in cohesive Italian neighborhoods, then they are doomed. The Little Italy in KC is about 4 square blocks. There is no little Italy in Detroit and barely anything left in Chicago. The fact is, everyone gambles and gamblers lose and borrow money. There was no Italian community in Las Vegas and the mob had a lock on that city.


Las Vegas isn't a real typical example of a "mob town", the only racket cosa nostra there to exploit was the casino skim and shylocking that went along with it. As soon as the skim was gone the mob went away with it.

Say how is cosa nostra in KC today? Not too good is it? Same with L.A., New Orleans, SF and other places where the "little italy" have died off. Chicago is one of the examples where cosa nostra has been able to expand in to the suburbs, but they aren't your typical family in that they've always been comfortable in treating non-italians as family members.

Last edited by Tony_Pro; 07/20/13 07:30 PM.

This life of ours, this is a wonderful life. If you can get through life like this, hey, thats great. But it's very, very unpredictable. There are so many ways you can screw it up.-Paul Castellano (he would know)

"I'm not talking about Italians, I'm talking about criminals."-Joe Valachi
Re: Why doesn't the NY mob expand? [Re: Tony_Pro] #728197
07/20/13 07:44 PM
07/20/13 07:44 PM
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Originally Posted By: Tony_Pro
Quote:
1. You have to start somewhere


Yeah you do. But is it worth the risk of uprooting your man-power to "foreign" when you can make that money at home. Conneticut and NJ is close enough to be "home turf" to NY families. But moving out to Louisville or Northern Virginia is something that is going to take more than "sending a couple of guys" to get a lock on.

Quote:
2. Most ethnic street gangs don't deal in gambling and juice. They deal in drugs. Besides, I'm not talking about going into Gary Indiana. I'm talking about the suburbs of major cities. Those people gamble too.


At legit places were they may be robbed blind, but at least they'll come out with their kneecaps intact. With legal gambling spreading to more and more places, taking down a marker "Big Sal" isn't that appealing to people who are in traveling distance to an Indian casinos and don't want to deal with street characters. The legit casino business here in Reno has been slaughtered by the opening of Indian casinos in Nor Cal and I'm sure that the effect has been the same for the mob on the east coast and midwest. Why go to "Big Sal" if you're not a desperate degenerate gambler?

And there are only so many of those to go around. New York, NJ and it's burbs are huge enough to provide demand but I doubt Pittsburgh or Denver could. New York's bread and butter is gambling and shylock, but they still make money off of drugs. Could they resist infringing on street gang or ethnic OC turf? I don't think they could, it only takes one or two greedy meatheads to touch off a war.

Quote:
3. You send a made man and a few associates. The families have a bunch of brokesters and troublemakers who aren't earning. Send them to another city to start up gambling operations. You have to start somewhere. How did those bookies get started?



And drain off your crews in NY to do an uncertain venture on unfamiliar turf, see my point above, it isn't impossible but I doubt it's worth the trouble and potential conflict with people who are established there.


Quote:
4. I don't think they're struggling to maintain a hold in NY/NJ. The gambling and juice rackets there are saturated.


Yet people keep getting popped and will continue to get popped. They're already scraping the bottom of the barrel in terms of guys smart enough to run complicated rackets. Why drain off the pipeline of replacements to bet on uncertain risks?

Quote:
5. If the mob can only operate in cohesive Italian neighborhoods, then they are doomed. The Little Italy in KC is about 4 square blocks. There is no little Italy in Detroit and barely anything left in Chicago. The fact is, everyone gambles and gamblers lose and borrow money. There was no Italian community in Las Vegas and the mob had a lock on that city.


Las Vegas isn't a real typical example of a "mob town", the only racket cosa nostra there to exploit was the casino skim and shylocking that went along with it. As soon as the skim was gone the mob went away with it.

Say how is cosa nostra in KC today? Not too good is it? Same with L.A., New Orleans, SF and other places where the "little italy" have died off. Chicago is one of the examples where cosa nostra has been able to expand in to the suburbs, but they aren't your typical family in that they've always been comfortable in treating non-italians as family members.


The old little Italy (colombus park in KC) is pretty much done, however the Italian community has moved north of the river into Gladstone and North Kansas City.

Re: Why doesn't the NY mob expand? [Re: Tony_Pro] #728213
07/20/13 08:14 PM
07/20/13 08:14 PM
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Scorsese Offline
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i dont see any older guys or even guys in their 40s moving anywhere, leaving their families or even moving them unless their dead certain its going to be worth it. Also does anyone think any of the bosses are gonna send them help or backup if they run into trouble in their new homes?

Having said that drugs would be the easiest thing to expand with into other areas. New York is one of the biggest drug markets and hubs in the USA, they do have access to the best quality coke,heroin. They can go and sell drugs from new york and the money would be good but it also comes down to the muscle and protection of their operation, if they are not able to provide this then its just not worth the risk.
The only groups i have seen do this are ny street gangs.
Miller time bloods,NY-virginia
old bronx gang pops up in vermont

I also think it would depend on the quantity of drugs they would be selling, any major weight would attract competition.

Re: Why doesn't the NY mob expand? [Re: Scorsese] #728224
07/20/13 08:44 PM
07/20/13 08:44 PM
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This what i don't understand the Buffalo crime family should have been so much bigger if they would have ventured into Canada so much money to make there and work with the Rizzuto family control drugs from overseas into Canada then smuggled into the US. You have the docks as well as other opportunities . I have been outta of touch is the Buffalo family even around? Also L.A. is prime real estate for everything that too me is an avenue NY should really try to reconnect with and put effort into rebuilding that family before its extinct.

Last edited by Tommy2Times; 07/20/13 08:46 PM. Reason: spelling
Re: Why doesn't the NY mob expand? [Re: mulberry] #728226
07/20/13 08:52 PM
07/20/13 08:52 PM
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Posts: 2,111
New Jersey
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New Jersey
Buffalo has had a crew in hamiliton, canadafor quite some time now but seem to be very small time as of lately and the majority of mob experts have the bufalo family in the non viable category even though there are about 20 made guys still alive in the area. Some of the guys may still be active in gambling but the family as a whole seems to be defunct.

Last edited by Dellacroce; 07/20/13 08:52 PM.

"Let me tell you something. There's no nobility in poverty. I've been a poor man, and I've been a rich man. And I choose rich every fucking time."

-Jordan Belfort
Re: Why doesn't the NY mob expand? [Re: mulberry] #728227
07/20/13 08:53 PM
07/20/13 08:53 PM
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Buffalo and LA are extinct.


MORGAN: Why didn't you fight him at the park if you wanted to? I'm not goin' now, I'm eatin' my snack.
CHUCKIE: Morgan, Let's go.
MORGAN: I'm serious Chuckie, I ain't goin'.
WILL: So don't go.
Re: Why doesn't the NY mob expand? [Re: Dellacroce] #728230
07/20/13 09:08 PM
07/20/13 09:08 PM
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Originally Posted By: Dellacroce
Buffalo has had a crew in hamiliton, canadafor quite some time now but seem to be very small time as of lately and the majority of mob experts have the bufalo family in the non viable category even though there are about 20 made guys still alive in the area. Some of the guys may still be active in gambling but the family as a whole seems to be defunct.


I now just realized that, I'm retarded lol. Thanks

Last edited by Tommy2Times; 07/20/13 09:08 PM.
Re: Why doesn't the NY mob expand? [Re: Skinny] #728231
07/20/13 09:11 PM
07/20/13 09:11 PM
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mott street manhattan
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Originally Posted By: Skinny
Why would you give credit to guys at a truck stop????? Will you take my action red???

skinny I am too old I had my time, however my concern is for the young guys that wanna dame and the money to have some fun with. your in jersey so nobody is gonna bother you.

Re: Why doesn't the NY mob expand? [Re: Tony_Pro] #728245
07/20/13 10:51 PM
07/20/13 10:51 PM
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mulberry Offline OP
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Originally Posted By: Tony_Pro


Yeah you do. But is it worth the risk of uprooting your man-power to "foreign" when you can make that money at home. Conneticut and NJ is close enough to be "home turf" to NY families. But moving out to Louisville or Northern Virginia is something that is going to take more than "sending a couple of guys" to get a lock on.



At legit places were they may be robbed blind, but at least they'll come out with their kneecaps intact. With legal gambling spreading to more and more places, taking down a marker "Big Sal" isn't that appealing to people who are in traveling distance to an Indian casinos and don't want to deal with street characters. The legit casino business here in Reno has been slaughtered by the opening of Indian casinos in Nor Cal and I'm sure that the effect has been the same for the mob on the east coast and midwest. Why go to "Big Sal" if you're not a desperate degenerate gambler?

And there are only so many of those to go around. New York, NJ and it's burbs are huge enough to provide demand but I doubt Pittsburgh or Denver could. New York's bread and butter is gambling and shylock, but they still make money off of drugs. Could they resist infringing on street gang or ethnic OC turf? I don't think they could, it only takes one or two greedy meatheads to touch off a war.


And drain off your crews in NY to do an uncertain venture on unfamiliar turf, see my point above, it isn't impossible but I doubt it's worth the trouble and potential conflict with people who are established there.


Yet people keep getting popped and will continue to get popped. They're already scraping the bottom of the barrel in terms of guys smart enough to run complicated rackets. Why drain off the pipeline of replacements to bet on uncertain risks?

Las Vegas isn't a real typical example of a "mob town", the only racket cosa nostra there to exploit was the casino skim and shylocking that went along with it. As soon as the skim was gone the mob went away with it.

Say how is cosa nostra in KC today? Not too good is it? Same with L.A., New Orleans, SF and other places where the "little italy" have died off. Chicago is one of the examples where cosa nostra has been able to expand in to the suburbs, but they aren't your typical family in that they've always been comfortable in treating non-italians as family members.


1. Don't the families have crews in Florida? How is Upstate NY or NE PA any different?

2. I'm not talking about bashing people. Chicago is running their gambling rackets without making too much noise. The Indian casinos don't take sports bets.

3. There's more guys in NY than needed to run gambling operations there.

4. I'm not talking about sending top earners.

5. Non-Italians gamble too. The NY families has always used Non-Italian associates too. KC still has gambling. Dallas has gambling. New Orleans has gambling.

The families expanded to Florida, where there is no established Italian community. The Gambinos even opened a club in Atlanta and made money.

Re: Why doesn't the NY mob expand? [Re: mulberry] #728254
07/21/13 01:52 AM
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I didn't read through so I apologize, but why have like, a family send a small crew of trusted guys down to say, Texas or some of the other old territories and have them set up there? Then slowly recruit from the local pool of thugs and whatnot--as associates? You don't have to send half a family there, send like 10 guys. Not a Capo, take a good, well earning soldier, give some guys to him as a "crew" and send him out to a new territory, and have him recruit other ethnic thugs as associates, and find rackets out there, prey on the local, very local level of politics maybe, too.

Re: Why doesn't the NY mob expand? [Re: mulberry] #728425
07/21/13 06:47 PM
07/21/13 06:47 PM
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Originally Posted By: mulberry
1. Don't the families have crews in Florida? How is Upstate NY or NE PA any different?

2. I'm not talking about bashing people. Chicago is running their gambling rackets without making too much noise. The Indian casinos don't take sports bets.

3. There's more guys in NY than needed to run gambling operations there.

4. I'm not talking about sending top earners.

5. Non-Italians gamble too. The NY families has always used Non-Italian associates too. KC still has gambling. Dallas has gambling. New Orleans has gambling.

The families expanded to Florida, where there is no established Italian community. The Gambinos even opened a club in Atlanta and made money.


For the most part, for all the reasons listed above, you just don't see the remaining mob families venturing beyond their traditional territories. The only significant exceptions are the New York families operating in South Florida and the mob's bookmaking networks reaching across various states and offshore. There's some ad-hoc stuff here and there, like the Gold Club case in Atlanta you mentioned, but that's the exception to the rule.


Mods should mind their own business and leave poster's profile signatures alone.
Re: Why doesn't the NY mob expand? [Re: mulberry] #728698
07/22/13 07:48 PM
07/22/13 07:48 PM
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@DB

Chicago's mob has nobody to compete with

they can have a decent amount of influence if the 30 guys are sharp enough


@mulberry


"streetgangs" as you call them don't only deal in drugs

this ain't the 80s or 90s

believe it or not, ethnic mobs are smart enough to do white collar scams

Re: Why doesn't the NY mob expand? [Re: mulberry] #728702
07/22/13 07:57 PM
07/22/13 07:57 PM
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Originally Posted By: mulberry
[quote=Tony_Pro]1.

5. If the mob can only operate in cohesive Italian neighborhoods, then they are doomed. The Little Italy in KC is about 4 square blocks. There is no little Italy in Detroit and barely anything left in Chicago.

You obviously have never been to Chicago

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