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Re: JFK [Re: EastHarlemItal] #824042
01/14/15 07:41 PM
01/14/15 07:41 PM
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 3,021
far, northwest
Binnie_Coll Offline
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Binnie_Coll  Offline
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yes, most important is the house assassination committee, chaired by rep. Louis stokes, which concurred that there was a conspiracy to assassinate JFK, the big mystery is why they disbanded. you never hear the major news media say that the house committee concluded their work by saying they believe there was a conspiracy.

and yes, alpha the media never goes into the assassination. they are in constant denial.



" watch what you say around this guy, he's got a big mouth" sam giancana to an outfit soldier about frank Sinatra. [ from the book "my way"
Re: JFK [Re: DB] #835775
04/02/15 10:23 AM
04/02/15 10:23 AM
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 2,418
Secret location (WITSEC)
HairyKnuckles Offline
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Secret location (WITSEC)
This is definitely worth watching. Note the extreme short time frame between shot number 2 and 3. Impossibe to pull off for one single shooter with a Carcano rifle.

The morse code is interesting too. Also interesting is the voice saying (what I believe to be "here we go") right before the first shot.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nq-ZJ99qaCc


[Linked Image]
Re: JFK [Re: HairyKnuckles] #835839
04/02/15 05:43 PM
04/02/15 05:43 PM
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 3,021
far, northwest
Binnie_Coll Offline
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Originally Posted By: HairyKnuckles
This is definitely worth watching. Note the extreme short time frame between shot number 2 and 3. Impossibe to pull off for one single shooter with a Carcano rifle.

The morse code is interesting too. Also interesting is the voice saying (what I believe to be "here we go") right before the first shot.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nq-ZJ99qaCc


interesting HK, really an interesting take on the shots,

conspiracy...... yes. mob hit..... yes.



" watch what you say around this guy, he's got a big mouth" sam giancana to an outfit soldier about frank Sinatra. [ from the book "my way"
Re: JFK [Re: EastHarlemItal] #835840
04/02/15 06:02 PM
04/02/15 06:02 PM
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 5,822
Where ever needed.
DuesPaid Offline
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I have always thought there was a lot we do not know about the assassination and the more we get to see and learn of it really makes the case for conspiracy and cover up.


Be Loyal, Be Loving, Be Quiet.
Re: JFK [Re: DuesPaid] #835870
04/03/15 04:16 AM
04/03/15 04:16 AM
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 441
M
mickey2 Offline
Capo
mickey2  Offline
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Capo
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Posts: 441
guys.. the question is not if it was an conspiracy. thats clear without question. Even hk's video is totally irrelevant, since its clear from the rifle construction that it is impossible to shoot with that rifle that fast.

the most interesting question which remains: Who were the shooters

From the camtex-fbi files, marcello is only heard about saying: "two guys from europe".

Problem is, at this Nov23, 1963 Dallas was LOADED with assassins and hitmen.

best doc about that i've seen so far:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HpBAyWBNrAk

Re: JFK [Re: EastHarlemItal] #835871
04/03/15 04:18 AM
04/03/15 04:18 AM
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 778
Castellammare del Golfo
Malandrino Offline
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Castellammare del Golfo
I agree, how did the Warren Commission explain the shooting with a bolt action rifle that fast? I've shot bolt actions and it's almost physically impossible.


-I shot him a coupla' times.
-What's a couple?
-Hmm, more than a couple... Really I don't know the exact amount, maybe I shot him 10 times, 12 times?
-Maybe fifteen?
-Hmm, it could've been fifteen...

-Anthony "Gaspipe" Casso
Re: JFK [Re: EastHarlemItal] #835872
04/03/15 04:32 AM
04/03/15 04:32 AM
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 884
Hudson County NJ
D
DB Offline
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Yeah that was good stuff HK

I do feel the mob has some guys involved , mainly Martino and Rosselli but that was more a result of the other work these guys did with intelligence agency's and the anti castro group . CN a was powerful but had no way near the power needed for the cover up , that could only be done from inside .

The hit was done as a side rack to operation mongoose , they just reversed the plan that was meant for Castro . The landsdsle , morales , Harvey , Phillips sforza crew . The big question IMO is who gave the nod, I'm sure Dulles and Cables were involved at the top level but who else , that's the real question after the AARB files were released in the 90s, as you can trace LHO back to the anti Castro group from those documents , but after that things become unclear . I don't think LHO was a CIA agent but he was clearly being used by them whether he knew it or not . I also don't believe this was a CIA sanction hit as several agents were trying to save the president , but rather a rogue group in the anti Castro / mongoose group that wanted policy change in Cuba and Vietnam .

That Mores code tidbit is very very interesting and fits in nicely with the assumption that the hit was done by elite former military individuals and it makes sense how their is a possible erasure of some parts as that fits in as well . This hit has no markings of a mob hit , Martino did admit he was involved as a bag man for the assassination

Re: JFK [Re: EastHarlemItal] #835873
04/03/15 04:53 AM
04/03/15 04:53 AM
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 441
M
mickey2 Offline
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morse code... right. why not laser?

Re: JFK [Re: EastHarlemItal] #835874
04/03/15 05:00 AM
04/03/15 05:00 AM
Joined: Jun 2013
Posts: 2,017
SonnyBlackstein Offline
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SonnyBlackstein  Offline
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The problem with the human brain is that it has trouble accepting an extra ordinary result from an ordinary input. It's human nature. The brain prefers to reconcile a like with like. It is unsettling to have to register an ordinary input, a guy with a gun, with an extra ordinary output, the death of a president.

But this is the situation. And it's the same with the moon landing, JFK, death of Diana, Roswell, 9/11 etc etc.

All are simple explanations resulting in extraordinary outcomes. And the mind has trouble reconciling that. So we look for an extraordinary reason, to justify the outcome. For no other reason, than it sits better with us. Reason be damned.

Oswald killed JFK. Man landed on the moon, Diana died in a car crash, it was a weather balloon, 24 Muslim barstards crashed planes.
That's it. Those are the answers.
Do yourself a favour and respect the truth.

Edit: I just did a you tube search. '9/11 documentaries' the first page was ALL full of bullshit conspiracy, anti-govt, Mossad, etc etc theories. This with the search criteria of 9/11, and documentary.
Shame. Shame on the makers for distorting history, the memory of those lost and why and on what our children will learn when they Google, on YouTube, about a documentary on what happened that day.
Not ONE real documentary. When one googles 9/11 documentary. On YouTube.
What will our children learn?
Shame.

Last edited by SonnyBlackstein; 04/03/15 05:30 AM.

MORGAN: Why didn't you fight him at the park if you wanted to? I'm not goin' now, I'm eatin' my snack.
CHUCKIE: Morgan, Let's go.
MORGAN: I'm serious Chuckie, I ain't goin'.
WILL: So don't go.
Re: JFK [Re: SonnyBlackstein] #835878
04/03/15 05:33 AM
04/03/15 05:33 AM
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 4,447
Underground
Toodoped Online off
Murder Ink
Toodoped  Online Off
Murder Ink
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Underground
Originally Posted By: SonnyBlackstein
The problem with the human brain is that it has trouble accepting an extra ordinary result from an ordinary input. It's human nature. The brain prefers to reconcile a like with like. It is unsettling to have to register an ordinary input, a guy with a gun, with an extra ordinary output, the death of a president.

But this is the situation. And it's the same with the moon landing, JFK, death of Diana, Roswell, 9/11 etc etc.

All are simple explanations resulting in extraordinary outcomes. And the mind has trouble reconciling that. So we look for an extraordinary reason, to justify the outcome. For no other reason, than it sits better with us. Reason be damned.

Oswald killed JFK. Man landed on the moon, Diana died in a car crash, it was a weather balloon, 24 Muslim barstards crashed planes.
That's it. Those are the answers.
Do yourself a favour and respect the truth.

Edit: I just did a you tube search. '9/11 documentaries' the first page was ALL full of bullshit conspiracy, anti-govt, Mossad, etc etc theories. This with the search criteria of 9/11, and documentary.
Shame. Shame on the makers for distorting history, the memory of those lost and why and on what our children will learn when they Google, on YouTube, about a documentary on what happened that day.
Not ONE real documentary. When one googles 9/11 documentary. On YouTube.
What will our children learn?
Shame.


Let me give you an example about respecting the truth. Back in the early 90's a supermarket was bombed in Saraevo,Bosnia which resulted with the deaths of many people. It was claimed that the attack was managed by the Serbian military forces and the "truth" was accepted for a long time period.Than, almost two decades later, former Bosnian government people admitted that they bombed and killed their own people just to incite international outrage and NATO intervention.So yeah...respect the truth...right?!

https://theremustbejustice.wordpress.com...ja-izetbegovic/


He who can never endure the bad will never see the good
Re: JFK [Re: Toodoped] #835881
04/03/15 05:39 AM
04/03/15 05:39 AM
Joined: Jun 2013
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SonnyBlackstein Offline
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SonnyBlackstein  Offline
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I'm not arguing that in the particular instance you speak of there was misinformation.

I'm simply asking for you to look at the preponderance of evidence in situations and accept what is, though troubling to accept, clearly the truth.

That there was misinformation in your example has frankly nothing to do with my point.


MORGAN: Why didn't you fight him at the park if you wanted to? I'm not goin' now, I'm eatin' my snack.
CHUCKIE: Morgan, Let's go.
MORGAN: I'm serious Chuckie, I ain't goin'.
WILL: So don't go.
Re: JFK [Re: SonnyBlackstein] #835882
04/03/15 05:42 AM
04/03/15 05:42 AM
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 4,447
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Murder Ink
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Originally Posted By: SonnyBlackstein
I'm not arguing that in the particular instance you speak of there was misinformation.

I'm simply asking for you to look at the preponderance of evidence in situations and accept what is, though troubling to accept, clearly the truth.

That there was misinformation in your example has frankly nothing to do with my point.


Thats not a "misinformation".Its a cover-up,its an example of conspiracy,double cross...


He who can never endure the bad will never see the good
Re: JFK [Re: SonnyBlackstein] #835883
04/03/15 05:44 AM
04/03/15 05:44 AM
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 441
M
mickey2 Offline
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mickey2  Offline
M
Capo
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 441
Originally Posted By: SonnyBlackstein
The problem with the human brain is that it has trouble accepting an extra ordinary result from an ordinary input. It's human nature. The brain prefers to reconcile a like with like. It is unsettling to have to register an ordinary input, a guy with a gun, with an extra ordinary output, the death of a president.

But this is the situation. And it's the same with the moon landing, JFK, death of Diana, Roswell, 9/11 etc etc.

All are simple explanations resulting in extraordinary outcomes. And the mind has trouble reconciling that. So we look for an extraordinary reason, to justify the outcome. For no other reason, than it sits better with us. Reason be damned.

Oswald killed JFK. Man landed on the moon, Diana died in a car crash, it was a weather balloon, 24 Muslim barstards crashed planes.
That's it. Those are the answers.
Do yourself a favour and respect the truth.

Edit: I just did a you tube search. '9/11 documentaries' the first page was ALL full of bullshit conspiracy, anti-govt, Mossad, etc etc theories. This with the search criteria of 9/11, and documentary.
Shame. Shame on the makers for distorting history, the memory of those lost and why and on what our children will learn when they Google, on YouTube, about a documentary on what happened that day.
Not ONE real documentary. When one googles 9/11 documentary. On YouTube.
What will our children learn?
Shame.


haha do yourself a favour and do some research.

edit: i dont want to come across disrespectfully and we can agree on some points (Man landed on the moon, Diana died in a car crash) - but jfk wasn't killed by that poor dumb bastard LHO. period. anybody who still denies it is just blind or stupid beyond belief.

Last edited by mickey2; 04/03/15 05:47 AM.
Re: JFK [Re: Toodoped] #835884
04/03/15 05:49 AM
04/03/15 05:49 AM
Joined: Jun 2013
Posts: 2,017
SonnyBlackstein Offline
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SonnyBlackstein  Offline
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Originally Posted By: Toodoped
Thats not a "misinformation".Its a cover-up,its an example of conspiracy,double cross...


So your argument is that cover-ups exist, basis the Bosnian supermarket bombing that 9/11, Diana, the moon landing etc etc are also cover ups? Because there is proof of one, they're all conspiracies?

Seriously?

@Micky: great argument pal. You win finals in your debating team?


MORGAN: Why didn't you fight him at the park if you wanted to? I'm not goin' now, I'm eatin' my snack.
CHUCKIE: Morgan, Let's go.
MORGAN: I'm serious Chuckie, I ain't goin'.
WILL: So don't go.
Re: JFK [Re: SonnyBlackstein] #835886
04/03/15 05:54 AM
04/03/15 05:54 AM
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 4,447
Underground
Toodoped Online off
Murder Ink
Toodoped  Online Off
Murder Ink
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Posts: 4,447
Underground
Originally Posted By: SonnyBlackstein
Originally Posted By: Toodoped
Thats not a "misinformation".Its a cover-up,its an example of conspiracy,double cross...


So your argument is that cover-ups exist, basis the Bosnian supermarket bombing that 9/11, Diana, the moon landing etc etc are also cover ups? Because there is proof of one, they're all conspiracies?

Seriously?


Time will tell...


He who can never endure the bad will never see the good
Re: JFK [Re: EastHarlemItal] #835903
04/03/15 08:03 AM
04/03/15 08:03 AM
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 884
Hudson County NJ
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DB Offline
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DB  Offline
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Hudson County NJ
I agree about the 9/11 conspiracy, that's BS IMO, I know people that were there. A conspiracy is implausible, but it does appear some within the gov't were possibly aware of an impending attack, but even if this is true, I would view this as more of an incompetence issue rather than a deliberate criminal act unless more evidence is discovered - innocent before guilty.

JFK is one of the only conspiracy theories I believe and its entirely due to facts/evidence that has emerged. If someone honestly researches the gov't documents released in the 90's, I don't see how anybody can believe the WC findings.


The smoking gun document which occurred less than 2 months before the assassination was that someone "impersonated LHO" in his tapped phone call to the Russian Mexico City embassy. This is backed up by FBI memos, including a memo from Hoover himself that stated LHO was impersonated in his phone call to the Russian embassy and the supposed head of the KGB assassination team in the Western Hemisphere- Mexico city. Voice analysis was done by FBI agents who listened to the taped but ultra secret recordings and compared it to the voice of LHO during interrogation, resulting in a finding that LHO was impersonated. Not to mention the fact that the imposter spoke broken Russian and fluent Spanish where as LHO poke fluent Russian but broken Spanish.

This finding is absolutely incredible and its shocking how it is never discussed , as it is definitive proof that a conspiracy existed to murder JFK , then you have to ask who was aware of the secret embassy phone tapping system of these embassies and who would know how this event would result in a large mole hunt. Not many intelligence agents would know this, and it would really narrow down who was involved in the JFK assassination. An investigator could trace this to the limited number of individuals that had access to this information and then might be able to trace this back to who the actual sponsors were and break the case wide open.

Who understands how and when a molehunt is conducted is the ultimate key to the blackmail / cover up operations.

There is now a boatload of documents recently released that show how large a molehunt was commenced by James Angelton's SIG team within the CIA (which in itself should show that LHO was involved in intelligence activities as the SIG sole purpose was to "spy on spies", thus completely blowing up the official CIA statement that LHO had NO connection to the CIA as they clearly felt he did after this imposters phone call, the guy had a 201 file which also basically proves the SIG unit was aware of LHO's intelligence work for someone). It is this knowledge of the molehunt that cemented the blackmailing of the CIA as if it ever got out that LHO was being investigated by the CIA right before the assassination and was supposedly trying to contact the head of the KGB assassinations team in the western hemisphere, then Wow what a bombshell that could completely destroy the CIA's credibility and destroy senior level careers. Then add in the fact that this James Angleton was assigned the job of investigating the JFK assassination ands its a double Wow. Then add in the fact of the newly released CIA documents that details James Angeltons intention was "to wait out the Warren Commission" in terms of complying with their document requests, a CLEAR obstruction of justice to the murder of JFK, and it makes this a triple wow.

It takes some research to get to the some material facts of JFK assassination, but honestly after reading only several documents, any investigator can now get a decent sense of where at least the planning traces back to. Unfortunately not many people are willing to read these documents, which is fine, however if one has a definitive opinion on the assassination, I don't know how you can skip the research part and be vocal in your opinion on who killed the president.

The information is now there, the question is whether one is open minded enough to review previously top secret documents that the authors never felt would see the light of day, and develop an opinion solely due to evidence.

What's funny is authors like Gerald Posner that will only believe the WC findings, wont dare comment on or touch these formerly classified documents as they know there is no explaining them. Instead they simply use the human brain cant accept the lone nut and magic bullet theories, ignoring the evidence. I personally never understood the lone nut theory, if you believe the WC then LHO did this to be remembered and be a part of history, then how does one explain he strongly denied these charges even thru his last statements before death, makes no sense to me but then again the WC was not developed to make sense, but rather to make sure this case never reached a trial or jury.

As LBJ stated in a phone call with Hoover after the assassination that someone appears to have tried to erase, "Did THEY shoot at me", clearly he knew what was up.



Last edited by DB; 04/03/15 08:17 AM.
Re: JFK [Re: DB] #835906
04/03/15 08:20 AM
04/03/15 08:20 AM
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 441
M
mickey2 Offline
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mickey2  Offline
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Capo
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 441
Originally Posted By: DB
I agree about the 9/11 conspiracy, that's BS IMO, I know people that were there. A conspiracy is implausible, but it does appear some within the gov't were possibly aware of an impending attack, but even if this is true, I would view this as more of an incompetence issue rather than a deliberate criminal act unless more evidence is discovered - innocent before guilty.

JFK is one of the only conspiracy theories I believe and its entirely due to facts/evidence that has emerged. If someone honestly researches the gov't documents released in the 90's, I don't see how anybody can believe the WC findings.


The smoking gun document which occurred less than 2 months before the assassination was that someone "impersonated LHO" in his tapped phone call to the Russian Mexico City embassy. This is backed up by FBI memos, including a memo from Hoover himself that stated LHO was impersonated in his phone call to the Russian embassy and the supposed head of the KGB assassination team in the Western Hemisphere- Mexico city. Voice analysis was done by FBI agents who listened to the taped but ultra secret recordings and compared it to the voice of LHO during interrogation, resulting in a finding that LHO was impersonated. Not to mention the fact that the imposter spoke broken Russian and fluent Spanish where as LHO poke fluent Russian but broken Spanish.

This finding is absolutely incredible and its shocking how it is never discussed , as it is definitive proof that a conspiracy existed to murder JFK , then you have to ask who was aware of the secret embassy phone tapping system of these embassies and who would know how this event would result in a large mole hunt. Not many intelligence agents would know this, and it would really narrow down who was involved in the JFK assassination. An investigator could trace this to the limited number of individuals that had access to this information and then might be able to trace this back to who the actual sponsors were and break the case wide open.

Who understands how and when a molehunt is conducted is the ultimate key to the blackmail / cover up operations.

There is now a boatload of documents recently released that show how large a molehunt was commenced by James Angelton's SIG team within the CIA (which in itself should show that LHO was involved in intelligence activities as the SIG sole purpose was to "spy on spies", thus completely blowing up the official CIA statement that LHO had NO connection to the CIA as they clearly felt he did after this imposters phone call, the guy had a 201 file which also basically proves the SIG unit was aware of LHO's intelligence work for someone). It is this knowledge of the molehunt that cemented the blackmailing of the CIA as if it ever got out that LHO was being investigated by the CIA right before the assassination and was supposedly trying to contact the head of the KGB assassinations team in the western hemisphere, then Wow what a bombshell that could completely destroy the CIA's credibility and destroy senior level careers. Then add in the fact that this James Angleton was assigned the job of investigating the JFK assassination ands its a double Wow. Then add in the fact of the newly released CIA documents that details James Angeltons intention was "to wait out the Warren Commission" in terms of complying with their document requests, a CLEAR obstruction of justice to the murder of JFK, and it makes this a triple wow.

It takes some research to get to the some material facts of JFK assassination, but honestly after reading only several documents, any investigator can now get a decent sense of where at least the planning traces back to. Unfortunately not many people are willing to read these documents, which is fine, however if one has a definitive opinion on the assassination, I don't know how you can skip the research part and be vocal in your opinion on who killed the president.

The information is now there, the question is whether one is open minded enough to review previously top secret documents that the authors never felt would see the light of day, and develop an opinion solely due to evidence.

What's funny is authors like Gerald Posner that will only believe the WC findings, wont dare comment on or touch these formerly classified documents as they know there is no explaining them. Instead they simply use the human brain cant accept the lone nut and magic bullet theories, ignoring the evidence. I personally never understood the lone nut theory, if you believe the WC then LHO did this to be remembered and be a part of history, then how does one explain he strongly denied these charges even thru his last statements before death, makes no sense to me but then again the WC was not developed to make sense, but rather to make sure this case never reached a trial or jury.

As LBJ stated in a phone call with Hoover after the assassination that someone appears to have tried to erase, "Did THEY shoot at me", clearly he knew what was up.




great post. gerald posner is a bad joke. i think the 100% complete release for all files that are exist is scheduled for 2017. we will see.

Re: JFK [Re: mickey2] #835907
04/03/15 08:23 AM
04/03/15 08:23 AM
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 441
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mickey2 Offline
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Originally Posted By: DB
I agree about the 9/11 conspiracy, that's BS IMO, I know people that were there. A conspiracy is implausible, but it does appear some within the gov't were possibly aware of an impending attack, but even if this is true, I would view this as more of an incompetence issue rather than a deliberate criminal act unless more evidence is discovered - innocent before guilty.


the gov was well aware of the terrorist threat. scarpa jr. provided them with lots on intel on that, but i dont think they blew up the twins thats ridiculous

Re: JFK [Re: DB] #835921
04/03/15 09:59 AM
04/03/15 09:59 AM
Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,146
A
abc123 Offline
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abc123  Offline
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Originally Posted By: DB
I agree about the 9/11 conspiracy, that's BS IMO, I know people that were there. A conspiracy is implausible, but it does appear some within the gov't were possibly aware of an impending attack, but even if this is true, I would view this as more of an incompetence issue rather than a deliberate criminal act unless more evidence is discovered - innocent before guilty.

JFK is one of the only conspiracy theories I believe and its entirely due to facts/evidence that has emerged. If someone honestly researches the gov't documents released in the 90's, I don't see how anybody can believe the WC findings.


The smoking gun document which occurred less than 2 months before the assassination was that someone "impersonated LHO" in his tapped phone call to the Russian Mexico City embassy. This is backed up by FBI memos, including a memo from Hoover himself that stated LHO was impersonated in his phone call to the Russian embassy and the supposed head of the KGB assassination team in the Western Hemisphere- Mexico city. Voice analysis was done by FBI agents who listened to the taped but ultra secret recordings and compared it to the voice of LHO during interrogation, resulting in a finding that LHO was impersonated. Not to mention the fact that the imposter spoke broken Russian and fluent Spanish where as LHO poke fluent Russian but broken Spanish.

This finding is absolutely incredible and its shocking how it is never discussed , as it is definitive proof that a conspiracy existed to murder JFK , then you have to ask who was aware of the secret embassy phone tapping system of these embassies and who would know how this event would result in a large mole hunt. Not many intelligence agents would know this, and it would really narrow down who was involved in the JFK assassination. An investigator could trace this to the limited number of individuals that had access to this information and then might be able to trace this back to who the actual sponsors were and break the case wide open.

Who understands how and when a molehunt is conducted is the ultimate key to the blackmail / cover up operations.

There is now a boatload of documents recently released that show how large a molehunt was commenced by James Angelton's SIG team within the CIA (which in itself should show that LHO was involved in intelligence activities as the SIG sole purpose was to "spy on spies", thus completely blowing up the official CIA statement that LHO had NO connection to the CIA as they clearly felt he did after this imposters phone call, the guy had a 201 file which also basically proves the SIG unit was aware of LHO's intelligence work for someone). It is this knowledge of the molehunt that cemented the blackmailing of the CIA as if it ever got out that LHO was being investigated by the CIA right before the assassination and was supposedly trying to contact the head of the KGB assassinations team in the western hemisphere, then Wow what a bombshell that could completely destroy the CIA's credibility and destroy senior level careers. Then add in the fact that this James Angleton was assigned the job of investigating the JFK assassination ands its a double Wow. Then add in the fact of the newly released CIA documents that details James Angeltons intention was "to wait out the Warren Commission" in terms of complying with their document requests, a CLEAR obstruction of justice to the murder of JFK, and it makes this a triple wow.

It takes some research to get to the some material facts of JFK assassination, but honestly after reading only several documents, any investigator can now get a decent sense of where at least the planning traces back to. Unfortunately not many people are willing to read these documents, which is fine, however if one has a definitive opinion on the assassination, I don't know how you can skip the research part and be vocal in your opinion on who killed the president.

The information is now there, the question is whether one is open minded enough to review previously top secret documents that the authors never felt would see the light of day, and develop an opinion solely due to evidence.

What's funny is authors like Gerald Posner that will only believe the WC findings, wont dare comment on or touch these formerly classified documents as they know there is no explaining them. Instead they simply use the human brain cant accept the lone nut and magic bullet theories, ignoring the evidence. I personally never understood the lone nut theory, if you believe the WC then LHO did this to be remembered and be a part of history, then how does one explain he strongly denied these charges even thru his last statements before death, makes no sense to me but then again the WC was not developed to make sense, but rather to make sure this case never reached a trial or jury.

As LBJ stated in a phone call with Hoover after the assassination that someone appears to have tried to erase, "Did THEY shoot at me", clearly he knew what was up.




What the Warren Commission Didn’t Know
A member of the panel that investigated JFK’s death now worries he was a victim of a “massive cover-up.”


Read more:

http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2...ml#.VR8oPdKUduA

Half a century after the Warren Commission concluded there was no conspiracy in John F. Kennedy’s assassination, the commission’s chief conspiracy hunter believes the investigation was the victim of a “massive cover-up” to hide evidence that might have shown that Lee Harvey Oswald was in fact part of a conspiracy. In new, exclusive material published today in the paperback edition of a bestselling history of the investigation, retired law professor David Slawson tells how he came to the conclusion, on the basis of long-secret documents and witness statements, that the commission might have gotten it wrong.
***
Fifty-one years ago this winter, working from a cramped, paper-strewn temporary office on Capitol Hill, a fresh-faced 33-year-old Denver lawyer named David Slawson was earning his place in modern American history.
It was President John F. Kennedy’s assassination that brought Slawson to Washington. In January 1964, two months after JFK’s murder in Dallas, Slawson was part of a small group of hotshot young lawyers recruited to the capital to join the hastily organized staff of the Warren Commission, the panel convened by President Lyndon B. Johnson to investigate his predecessor’s death.
The lawyers, most only a few years out of law school, would do the bulk of the commission’s detective work in determining how and why the president had been killed. And the Harvard-educated Slawson, in particular, had an extraordinary assignment on the staff. Although he had no background in foreign affairs or law enforcement, he was responsible—at times, single-handedly—for the search for evidence of a foreign conspiracy in the assassination. When the commission issued a final report, in September 1964, that identified Lee Harvey Oswald as the sole assassin and effectively ruled out any conspiracy, foreign or domestic, Slawson was satisfied. “I was convinced—then—that we had it right,” he told me last year.
For most of the next five decades, Slawson, who went on to a distinguished teaching career at the law school at the University of Southern California, tried to put his work on the commission behind him, even as the national debate about the Kennedy assassination and the legacy of the Warren Commission continued to rage. He was content mostly to keep his silence, continuing to believe that nothing had undermined the commission’s essential finding that Oswald was, in Slawson’s words, a “true lone wolf” who had acted without the knowledge or encouragement of others—that there was no conspiracy.
Today, however, Slawson’s silence has ended once and for all. Half a century after the commission issued an 888-page final report that was supposed to convince the American people that the investigation had uncovered the truth about the president’s murder, Slawson has come to believe that the full truth is still not known. Now 83, he says he has been shocked by the recent, belated discovery of how much evidence was withheld from the commission—from him, specifically—by the CIA and other government agencies, and how that rewrites the history of the Kennedy assassination.
Slawson is now wrestling with questions he hoped he would never have to confront: Was the commission’s final report, in fundamental ways, wrong? And might the assassination threat have been thwarted? The commission, he believes, was the victim of a “massive cover-up” by government officials who wanted to hide the fact that, had they simply acted on the evidence in front of them in November 1963, the assassination might have been prevented. “It’s amazing—it’s terrible—to discover all of this 50 years late,” says Slawson, whose health is still good and whose memories of his work on the commission remain sharp.
Slawson’s most startling conclusion: He now believes that other people probably knew about Oswald’s plans to kill the president and encouraged him, raising the possibility that there was a conspiracy in Kennedy’s death—at least according to the common legal definition of the word conspiracy, which requires simply that at least two people plot to do wrongdoing. “I now know that Oswald was almost certainly not a lone wolf,” Slawson says.
Slawson is not describing the sort of elaborate, far-fetched assassination plot that most conspiracy theorists like to claim occurred, with a roster of suspects including the Mafia, Texas oilmen, anti-Castro Cuban exiles, southern segregationists, elements of the CIA and FBI, and even President Johnson. Slawson did not believe in 1964, and does not believe now, that Fidel Castro or the leaders of the Soviet Union or of any other foreign government were involved in the president’s murder. And he is certain that Oswald was the only gunman in Dealey Plaza.
What Slawson does suspect is that Oswald, during a long-mysterious trip to Mexico City only weeks before the assassination, encountered Cuban diplomats and Mexican civilians who were supporters of Castro’s revolution and who urged Oswald to kill the American president if he had the chance. “I think it’s very likely that people in Mexico encouraged him to do this,” Slawson told me. “And if they later came to the United States, they could have been prosecuted under American law as accessories” in the conspiracy.
He has also come to believe—again, only recently—that the CIA knew about these meetings but hid the evidence of them from the Warren Commission.
What has changed Slawson’s mind so dramatically on questions that he thought were settled half a century ago? I interviewed him repeatedly, over several years, for my 2013 book on the Kennedy assassination, and Slawson says that our conversations, as well as material that I had gathered from declassified government archives and from other researchers, shook his confidence. “It never occurred to me until you interviewed me and I read your book that the commission’s investigation had been blocked like this.” It never occurred to him, he said, that the CIA and other agencies “tried to sabotage us like this.”
It was clear to me from the earliest days of my research on the book just how much I would want Slawson’s cooperation. It is hard to overstate his significance in the work on the commission—and in the investigation’s finding that Oswald acted alone. Although he had been the junior member of the two-lawyer team that focused on a possible foreign conspiracy, the work fell almost entirely to Slawson. His senior partner appeared in the commission’s offices only one day a week, according to the commission’s records, and Slawson finished up doing “90 percent of the work,” he told me.
In 2010, after two years of gathering up tens of thousands of once-classified documents from the National Archives and elsewhere, I made the first of several transcontinental reporting trips to meet with Slawson at his home in Washington State, where he moved after his retirement from USC. Each time, I brought with me the latest batch of documents that I had retrieved. And after each trip, Slawson grew more and more alarmed to discover how much evidence about the assassination—and specifically, about Oswald and the possibility of a conspiracy—had not been shared with him in 1964.

Re: JFK [Re: EastHarlemItal] #835924
04/03/15 10:25 AM
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While the subject of main conspiracy theories (whether they are right or wrong) is usually the John Fitzgerald Kennedy murder, what about Robert Kennedy? Is it considered definitely a lone gunman job or a contract killing? If the Kennedy's murderers carried out somebody's contracts, do you think it was the same people who had both John and Robert whacked?

But, since you mentioned 9/11 also, could you please explain one thing to me: why do people say that implying that it was an inside job offends the memory of the victims? It may offend the government or the CIA, but surely not the victims. I personally DON'T BELIEVE it was a government job or a thing approved by the CIA direction, but if some rogue CIA cells were corrupted by terrorists or tried to use them, that wouldn't surprise me.
I mean, where did the alleged "disrespect towards the victims" thing come from? EVERYONE tied to the attack should be executed or go to jail, even if it is a government official or a CIA agent along with Muslim terrorists. If I was an American and would have lost somebody in that attack, I would have wanted ALL theories to be verified so NO ONE escaped justice.

Last edited by Dwalin2011; 04/03/15 10:30 AM.

Willie Marfeo to Henry Tameleo:

1) "You people want a loaf of bread and you throw the crumbs back. Well, fuck you. I ain't closing down."

2) "Get out of here, old man. Go tell Raymond to go shit in his hat. We're not giving you anything."
Re: JFK [Re: EastHarlemItal] #835925
04/03/15 10:32 AM
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I agree with DB. Most of these conspiracy theories are nothing but bullshit. But there is definitely more to the JFK assassination.

Re: JFK [Re: HairyKnuckles] #835926
04/03/15 10:36 AM
04/03/15 10:36 AM
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Originally Posted By: HairyKnuckles
This is definitely worth watching. Note the extreme short time frame between shot number 2 and 3. Impossibe to pull off for one single shooter with a Carcano rifle.

The morse code is interesting too. Also interesting is the voice saying (what I believe to be "here we go") right before the first shot.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nq-ZJ99qaCc


I thought the dictabelt recording was largely debunked. There's plenty of other evidence of a conspiracy.

Re: JFK [Re: Dwalin2011] #835928
04/03/15 10:40 AM
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Originally Posted By: Dwalin2011
But, since you mentioned 9/11 also, could you please explain one thing to me: why do people say that implying that it was an inside job offends the memory of the victims? It may offend the government or the CIA, but surely not the victims. I personally DON'T BELIEVE it was a government job or a thing approved by the CIA direction, but if some rogue CIA cells were corrupted by terrorists or tried to use them, that wouldn't surprise me.
I mean, where did the alleged "disrespect towards the victims" thing come from? EVERYONE tied to the attack should be executed or go to jail, even if it is a government official or a CIA agent along with Muslim terrorists. If I was an American and would have lost somebody in that attack, I would have wanted ALL theories to be verified so NO ONE escaped justice.


Nicely said Dwalin2011. Hey you are russian right? What do you think about this?Was this just another bluff made by Putin?Or is there any truth in this?

http://www.veteranstoday.com/2015/02/10/pravda-putin-threatens-to-release-satellite-evidence-of-911/


He who can never endure the bad will never see the good
Re: JFK [Re: Toodoped] #835929
04/03/15 10:45 AM
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Originally Posted By: Toodoped

Nicely said Dwalin2011. Hey you are russian right? What do you think about this?Was this just another bluff made by Putin?

http://www.veteranstoday.com/2015/02/10/pravda-putin-threatens-to-release-satellite-evidence-of-911/

I think it's more likely a bluff because THE WHOLE USA GOVERNMENT planning such an insane thing is too much even for politicians in my opinion. I still would like to believe that, corrupt as they may be, the majority of theirs wouldn't treat THEIR OWN country like a chess piece.
Everything is possible in politics, but I think this one won't be true.


Willie Marfeo to Henry Tameleo:

1) "You people want a loaf of bread and you throw the crumbs back. Well, fuck you. I ain't closing down."

2) "Get out of here, old man. Go tell Raymond to go shit in his hat. We're not giving you anything."
Re: JFK [Re: Dwalin2011] #835931
04/03/15 10:51 AM
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Originally Posted By: Dwalin2011
Originally Posted By: Toodoped

Nicely said Dwalin2011. Hey you are russian right? What do you think about this?Was this just another bluff made by Putin?

http://www.veteranstoday.com/2015/02/10/pravda-putin-threatens-to-release-satellite-evidence-of-911/

I think it's more likely a bluff because THE WHOLE USA GOVERNMENT planning such an insane thing is too much even for politicians in my opinion. I still would like to believe that, corrupt as they may be, the majority of theirs wouldn't treat THEIR OWN country like a chess piece.
Everything is possible in politics, but I think this one won't be true.


Yeah,i agree also. All of these so called threats started with that passanger plane that was shot down over Ukraine.


He who can never endure the bad will never see the good
Re: JFK [Re: EastHarlemItal] #835934
04/03/15 11:51 AM
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Yes I do believe RFK was killed by the same people but purely from a cover up of his brother assassination . David Sanchez Moralez I think had a strong hand in both and he admitted such to his best friend in front of his attorney and several others. He was basically head of the CIA foreign leader assassination squad , he killed Che Guevara and headed that lethal Phoenix unit in Vietnam , both him and Bill Harvey , another top CIA assassination figure both died right before the HSCA along with Rosselli who Harvey was very very close with .

A week before RFKs murder he told several aides that when he is president he will finally find out who ordered his brother death . If RFK stayed in the background I doubt he would of been touched . There were 10 bullets fired in LA but the suspects gun only had 8 bullets . RFK knew the people that killed his brother came from the mongoose group , unfortunately RFK personally was the head of this group and for years was guilted by this ( I wouldn't doubt if this was the intent ), he was shocked to his core , his son finally came out about the CIA behind his uncles death in 2013. It's not even a secret who was involved in the jfk murder , the big secret is who gave the nod , the sponsors.

I feel very strongly that Dulles was involved as George DeM tracks back to him ( he was LHO CIA babysitter in Dallas - note he was strongly anti communist- the exact opposite of LHO and he was instructed by Tracey Barnes to befriend LHO . Barnes was deep in Mongoose , anti Castro and very close with Moralez , Harvey , Sforza etc and George committed suicide right before his HSCA testimony , he said for years how horrible he felt about possibly helping with the LHO set up.

Also in terms of the assassination you have to remember how vital Ruth Paine was to the assassination plan . I don't think she had pre knowledge but she definitely knew what was going on after the hit as she was picked up on the phone talking to her separated husband that they both knew who pulled off this hit and this is before LHO was fingered . Anyway whoever put her there , she moved suddenly from Pa to Dallas for no reason then went out to get Marina to move in with her , knew this person had to be as hard as a rock as she could provide the character support behind the lone nut and more importantly all the evidence to pin LHO came from her house, not too mention she lied to the WC and got LHO in the book depository right before the assassination . Her family was deep in the CIA with her sister working for the CIA psychological group and her father working at AID , a CIA foreign front and she tied directly back to Dulles as her mother and Dulles were longtime friends and lovers- Mary Bancroft . Also note exactly 1 month after the JFK hit President Truman wrote a large op - ed stating how misguided the CIA had become, he started the CIA purely to gather intelligence and not to hijack foreign policy , he blasted them and I highly doubt the timing was a coincidence but Dulles flew out to try and convince Truman not to release this article . Not to mention Dulles was appointed to the WC and was the only member regularily there , this after JFK fired him for trying to lie him into an all out war with Cuba during bay of pigs . Even worse is while on the WC , 3 of the 7 members didn't believe the magic bullet theory and wouldn't sign the official WC conclusion unless they added their difference of opinion disclosure about this issue into the report . Dulles realizing this was a disaster came up with a brilliant plan , on the last day the 3 senators voiced their opinion which they thought would be officially recorded into the document as a stenographer was present , however what they didn't know was Dulles already let go the stenographer and replaced her with his secretary , therefore the 3 senators dissent never made it into the official WC documents , classic lol . Eisenhowers last public address in 1960 was to warn the American people about the dangerous influence of the "military industrial complex ".


With 9/11 , I wouldn't be surprised if some in our intelligence had strong suspicions of an attack or reported an imminent attack upwards but which was never acted upon . I wouldn't be surprised though if foreign agencies had more pieces to the puzzle and deliberately kept this info from us for political or military purposes

Re: JFK [Re: Dwalin2011] #836035
04/04/15 04:44 AM
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Originally Posted By: Dwalin2011
But, since you mentioned 9/11 also, could you please explain one thing to me: why do people say that implying that it was an inside job offends the memory of the victims?

I mean, where did the alleged "disrespect towards the victims" thing come from?


Because the victims, their children, their relatives, the American people and future generations are owed the truth.

The victims memory deserves the truth. They deserve history to write the wrongs perpetrated against them accurately.

That the rightful blame and responsibility is levied at those responsible.

To not do so with baseless accusations, to ignore the evidence, to muddy the annals of history with bullshit, while those factually responsible are held unaccountable? Well, to not honor those fallen in such a manner, is at the least, imo, more than a little fucking disrespectful.

To put it mildly.


MORGAN: Why didn't you fight him at the park if you wanted to? I'm not goin' now, I'm eatin' my snack.
CHUCKIE: Morgan, Let's go.
MORGAN: I'm serious Chuckie, I ain't goin'.
WILL: So don't go.
Re: JFK [Re: SonnyBlackstein] #836036
04/04/15 04:59 AM
04/04/15 04:59 AM
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Originally Posted By: SonnyBlackstein
Originally Posted By: Dwalin2011
But, since you mentioned 9/11 also, could you please explain one thing to me: why do people say that implying that it was an inside job offends the memory of the victims?

I mean, where did the alleged "disrespect towards the victims" thing come from?


Because the victims, their children, their relatives, the American people and future generations are owed the truth.

The victims memory deserves the truth. They deserve history to write the wrongs perpetrated against them accurately.

That the rightful blame and responsibility is levied at those responsible.

To not do so with baseless accusations, to ignore the evidence, to muddy the annals of history with bullshit, while those factually responsible are held unaccountable? Well, to not honor those fallen in such a manner, is at the least, imo, more than a little fucking disrespectful.

To put it mildly.

The problem is though that, as usually happens with big crimes, nobody will ever know the complete truth. Thinking that Muslim terrorists may have had "moles" is not sacrilege because nor I nor you know whether that was the case. Writing every single member of the CIA off as suspects just because they are Americans and that's the only reasonable argument to say that they "couldn't have had anything to do with this", THIS "logic" offends the victims with its warped parody of "patriotism". The "inside" traitors, if there were any, should be hunted down as persistently as the terrorists, otherwise that wouldn't be an impartial position. I respect the victims very much and that's the reason I wouldn't want the investigation to be blinded by anything, not even "patriotism".

And nobody avoids holding the Islamic terrorists accountable. They did it, and everybody knows it. But what's wrong in supposing they may have had help? Just dismissing it as "bullshit" is like denying police corruption before the Eppolito/Caracappa case. I bet their superiors said before they were discovered that the NY police was the "cleanest in the world". So why so sure that there are no traitors in the CIA?

It's not just an American matter anymore, international terrorism has become a global menace.

Last edited by Dwalin2011; 04/04/15 05:14 AM.

Willie Marfeo to Henry Tameleo:

1) "You people want a loaf of bread and you throw the crumbs back. Well, fuck you. I ain't closing down."

2) "Get out of here, old man. Go tell Raymond to go shit in his hat. We're not giving you anything."
Re: JFK [Re: Dwalin2011] #836038
04/04/15 05:13 AM
04/04/15 05:13 AM
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Originally Posted By: Dwalin2011
The problem is though that, as usually happens with big crimes, nobody will ever know the complete truth. Thinking that Muslim terrorists may have had "moles" is not sacrilege because nor I nor you know whether that was the case. Writing every single member of the CIA off as suspects just because they are Americans and that's the only reasonable argument to say that they "couldn't have had anything to do with this", THIS "logic" offends the victims with its warped parody of "patriotism". The "inside" traitors, if there were any, should be hunted down as persistently as the terrorists, otherwise that wouldn't be an impartial position. I respect the victims very much and that's the reason I wouldn't want the investigation to be blinded by anything, not even "patriotism".


And THATS the thing.

We DO know the truth. The 9/11 report was three THOUSAND pages of evidence.
There is NO debate.
There is no controversy.
There is no EVIDENCE justifying ANY conspiracy.

So, stop chasing shadows, look at the EVIDENCE, and let it go.

And if your worried about 'patriotism' blinding? Mate, Im not even American.

Understand now?


MORGAN: Why didn't you fight him at the park if you wanted to? I'm not goin' now, I'm eatin' my snack.
CHUCKIE: Morgan, Let's go.
MORGAN: I'm serious Chuckie, I ain't goin'.
WILL: So don't go.
Re: JFK [Re: SonnyBlackstein] #836040
04/04/15 06:57 AM
04/04/15 06:57 AM
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Originally Posted By: SonnyBlackstein
Originally Posted By: Dwalin2011
The problem is though that, as usually happens with big crimes, nobody will ever know the complete truth. Thinking that Muslim terrorists may have had "moles" is not sacrilege because nor I nor you know whether that was the case. Writing every single member of the CIA off as suspects just because they are Americans and that's the only reasonable argument to say that they "couldn't have had anything to do with this", THIS "logic" offends the victims with its warped parody of "patriotism". The "inside" traitors, if there were any, should be hunted down as persistently as the terrorists, otherwise that wouldn't be an impartial position. I respect the victims very much and that's the reason I wouldn't want the investigation to be blinded by anything, not even "patriotism".


And THATS the thing.

We DO know the truth. The 9/11 report was three THOUSAND pages of evidence.
There is NO debate.
There is no controversy.
There is no EVIDENCE justifying ANY conspiracy.

So, stop chasing shadows, look at the EVIDENCE, and let it go.

And if your worried about 'patriotism' blinding? Mate, Im not even American.

Understand now?

Ok then. I admit I haven't read the report, and if it says what you say I am ok with that. I think we better stop the discussion here and return to JFK, because I realize 9/11 is a very delicate topic, I don't want to cause flame.


Willie Marfeo to Henry Tameleo:

1) "You people want a loaf of bread and you throw the crumbs back. Well, fuck you. I ain't closing down."

2) "Get out of here, old man. Go tell Raymond to go shit in his hat. We're not giving you anything."
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