Were the Jews the brains behind Cosa Nostra?

always seemed like the Jews were the financial geniuses behind the mob's various rackets and success while the Italians were the face and the muscle

Lansky, "Lefty" Rosenthal, Rothstein etc.

Arnold Rothstein was def a key figure in modern organized crime and he died at the age of 46.

i often hear him be described as the father of organized crime in america, the laundry list of people he mentored is crazy bosses Lucky Luciano, Meyer Lansky, Frank Costello, Bugsy Siegel and numerous others.

2 questions i have for you Hollander if you can answer them. Do you accept the premise that jewish gangsters were the brains behind Cosa Nostra? and 2nd. What happened to the Jewish Mob, why did it not survive alongside Cosa Nostra?

I believe the decline came in the 70s later you still had some powerful Russian and Israeli groups in the US.

Several notable Jewish-American mobsters provided financial support for Israel through donations to Jewish organizations since the country's creation in 1948. Jewish-American gangsters used Israel's Law of Return to flee criminal charges or face deportation. Notables include Joseph "Doc" Stacher, who built up Las Vegas by pairing the Jewish and Italian Mafia into a national organized crime syndicate. Prime Minister Golda Meir set out to reverse this trend in 1970, when she denied entrance to Meyer Lansky

I don't think it was they were the brains behind Cosa Nostra but the Italians profited from the knowledge and connections of the Jewish gangsters.

Jewish gangs were very big during Prohibition--generally much bigger than Italian gangs--and dominated the booze trade in most big cities. But, many Prohibition-era Jewish gangsters went legit after Repeal, and focused on gambling. They often worked with Mafia families but were never part of them,

Individual Jewish gangsters sometimes advised Mafia families. Lansky was very close to Luciano, Costello and Adonis, often partnering with them. Jack Guzik was Capone's close friend, advisor and mentor when he was new in Chicago. Rothstein gathered a cadre of up-and-coming Italian gangsters around him in the early '20's--including Luciano and Costello (also Lansky and Siegel), advised them and gave them political protection. But, he was killed in '28. Longy Zwillman was the OC leader of northern NJ and often was a senior partner to Boiardo and Catena. Moe Dalitz was "Mr. Las Vegas" and probably helped Mafia guys.

Overall: They often cooperated with Mafia families, and some Jewish individuals advised powerful Mafiosi, but they weren't always, or even often, the financial guiding lights of the Mafia.

I definitely agree with you on certain things Turnbull. But def disagree on a few others.

I do agree that Jewish gangs were extremely prominent during the Prohibition era, as were Irish gangs and Italians also. And depending upon which particular city you're speaking of, some Jewish mobs where even more dominant for awhile. Playing a role as significant leaders, or firsts among equals, in alcohol-bootlegging and several other rackets. In the garment district, Lepke Buchalter and his mob dominated that industry. He was also very prominent in other forms of "industrial racketeering." He was a powerhouse.

But the Jewish gangs were never, "generally much bigger than Italian gangs," as you mentioned, nor did they dominate cities like NYC and Chicago (to name just two).

If taken in their totality; the Napolitani (Camorra), Calabrese (Societa' Onorata), and Siciiani (Mafia), collectively, dwarfed any one particular ethnicity in underworld power. Even back then. But during the 1910s-1920s, even into the 1930s, these Italian "Mafias" were separate entities. And for the most part, operated in the shadows. Away from the limelight. It was only after their amalgamation, after the Commission was formed in 1931, and these three "Mafias" became one group, that America (and even the underworld) later started to realize the totality of their collective power.

And dating back to the 1920s-1930s, yes, in general, the various "ethnic" gangs were mostly independent, but sometimes worked with one another too. And once again, depending upon the city discussed, Italians and Jewish gangs interacted to a greater or lesser degree. Fellas like Longy Zwillman as you mentioned, Dutch Schultz, Lepke Buchalter, etc., all headed their own gangs. And yes, each of these organizations were very large and powerful in their own right. And "independent" of Cosa Nostra (for the time being)...

But by the mid-late 1940s, and certainly into the early 1950s, most Jewish gangs had either faded away, or been absorbed and amalgamated into Cosa Nostra as formal "associates" of the various "Families" across the United States. On the East Coast for sure. Meyer Lansky (and by extension), his large cadre of Jewish associates, for sure. They were considered "on record" associates of the Luciano/Genovese Family.

I suspect the same held true for most top Jewish mobsters in various major cities throughout the U.S.
-
As far as certain Jewish mob figures "advising" Cosa Nostra? In some situations that was the case. Again, Meyer Lansky is a perfect example that. For decades, he was a pivotal figure within Lucky Luciano's Family. Considered a "top" associate. Lansky was a sharp guy. Very sharp! So naturally, Luciano, who was no fool himself, entertained many of Lansky's financial ideas. History shows he trusted Lansky immensely.

As you pointed out, that doesn't mean guys like Meyer Lansky was the Mafia's "guiding light," but they did, in fact, sometimes advise them on good business investments and in illicit rackets, and partner with mafiosi.

But Lansky, was not, as some others over the years have falsely claimed, the Luciano Family's "consigliere," or the Mafia's "financial accountant." IMO, those types of titles do not present Lansky in a proper light.
-
As far as Jewish mob figures later abandoning illegal rackets for "legalized gambling" in Las Vegas and elsewhere, that was sometimes the case. Cleveland's Jewish Mob is a perfect example of that. After the made a fortune in bootlegging, they dovetailed their success by reinvesting their profits into Nevada's gaming industry. A brilliant move (as it turned out). Others did the same.

But even in this instance, guys like Moe Dalitz and his partners brought in certain Mafia bosses, giving them a "piece of the pie," so as to have their blessing, and to have their protection.

One thing is for certain Turnbull. And that is (with few exceptions), Jewish and Italian mobsters have always gotten along well together. In fact, more than any other ethnicity, I feel those two underworld groups were simpatico. They made a great team, complimenting each other.

More than with the Irish mobs, or any other ethnic criminal group for that matter, history has proven that Italian and Jewish mob guys, in general, blended together like "peanut butter and jelly."

What do you think about my thoughts on this, Turnbull? Do you agree?

Moe Dalitz ended his life with the "key to the city" of Las Vegas. That says a lot. Then again people say Rockman was a pivotal figure in the way things ended up in Cleveland.

There were so many influential players Chicago's Hyman Larner for example.

Someone who doesn’t get some credit for Cosa Nostra is Salvatore Maranzano.

Sure he tried to be the boss of all bosses and got killed by the new generation of gangsters.
But he still the one who create the 5 families of NY. And those families are still there.
Also, ***I don’t know if I’m wrong on this *** but was he also the one who decide what would be the ranks in Cosa Nostra and the difference between the American Cosa Nostra and the Sicilian Mafia ?

But I think, because Salvatore Maranzano was killed because he was so old school and was the bad guy in the history of Lucky Luciano, he get put out of his impact on Cosa Nostra.

He wasn't Jewish. but Murray Humphries was also wildly impactful figure on LCN.

Yeah we all know Maranzano wasn’t jewish.
But its still a name that don’t get recognize.

For the jewish question, I think Cosa Nostra took everything that work of every crime organization that were successful and made it there own.

They took the organization and buisness asset from the jewish mob.
The contacts in the political world from the irish mob and probably the syndicate world.
The gambling operations from the african-american mob.
And I guess many other things from all type of criminal world.

The thing is that the italians succeed to make all of this an organization that work like an entreprise, and still being a criminal thing.

-
Maranzano was unquestionably one of the most pivotal figures in the early American underworld. But alas, he didn't last long. Still, he helped shape the American structure of a "Family" as we have come to know it. (but remember, that even his structuring was based off the ancient Sicilian structure from back in Sicily.) Maranzano just expanded it to American standards because the U.S. borgatas were generally much larger and more diversified than the early Sicilian model.

Yes The Hump was an important fixer.

Sidney Roy Korshak also read Supermob interesting stuff about Chicago's Jews in the upper echelons of power as well as the Chicago Outfit.

Korshak was the model for the " Tom Hagen " character, played by Robert Duvall in "The Godfather".

I always thought The Hump was the inspiration behind Tom Hagen.

Maybe a bit of both. Tom Hagen was a legal advisor and defends Michael Corleone during the Senate hearings on the mob.
That part is def based on Sidney Korshak.

Marazano was important, but you know could be argued to be more important

Paul Kelly

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Kelly_(criminal)

reading about the alumni of the 5 points gang is crazy

Also a good story.

The Mafia controlled the port of New York. Albert Anastasia and Joe Adonis, who controlled the longshoremen’s union and the docks, helped Israeli agents conceal arms purchased for Israel. Illegal consignments of military hardware, some of it brand new and still packed in oil and straw, were then secreted onto ships that happened to be bound for Israel.

I don't have any disagreements with your response to my post, NYM. We're both on the same page. Certainly Jewish mobs weren't anywhere near as big as the totality of Mafia, Comorra, etc. And, as I said and you agreed: Most Jewish mobs that were so big durig Prohibition faded away after Repeal, or went legit, or moved into gambling. This was natural: Gambling was legalized in '31 in Nevada; the 18th Amendment was repealed in '33; and Mormons (who dominated Nevada politics) always looked favorably on Jews. Of the more than 200 applications for gaming licenses that the Nevada Tax Commission received in the first month of legalized gambling, more than half came from individuals with Jewish-sounding surnames.

Incidentally: It was also natural for Jewish mobs to move into booze during Prohibition because they were very big into urban racketeering before Prohibition. NYPD recorded that 15% of all felony arrests in Manhattan in 1900 were of people with Jewish sounding surnames, rising to 24.5% in 1915.

Jewish gangs were cooperative with each other and with some Italian mobs even before Prohibition. This was mainy to protect the neighborhoods they operated in. You must not think of them as circumcised Robin Hoods--they were "protecting" their rackets from the depredations of other mobs.

You're 1000% correct Turnbull.

And I will add this. During their time in the rackets, "The Jewish Mob" held their own with the best of them. They were as tough and rugged as any, sharp and ingenious in their endeavors and racket expansion, generally worked very well amongst themselves, and had a huge network in their own right. And as we both agreed, after Prohibition, they seamlessly morphed into the gambling rackets in a big way (both legal and illegal), ran both domestic and international narcotics operations, were visionaries in the strong-arm infiltration and domination of the American labor movement, business infiltration, control of politicians, etc., etc., etc....They were a force to be reckoned with.

And as we both agreed, Jewish and Italian mob guys generally got along well together, and worked hand-n-glove over the decades very closely.