Killings of judges, cops, etc.

Besides Edwin Helfant, Joe Petrosino, and Everett Hatcher, were there any documented killings of judges, cops and prosecutors by the Mafia in the USA?

petrosino was killed in italy

Hatcher was not a Mafia killing the mob did kill the guy who did it.

Judge George Aronwald was killed by the Colombo family. He was the wrong target though as the intended target was his son, William Aronwald, the prosecutor in Carmine Persico 's trial.

I just made time ago a post about this topic.

http://www.gangsterbb.net/threads/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=799935&page=1

Didn't Scarfo kill or have that one judge killed?

Yes..Edwin Helfant , a corrrupt judge, who, @ the time Nick the blade Virgilio whacked him was on trial 4 the very reason Scarfo & Co. did, bribery in exchange 4 shorter sentences..but that didn't happen w/ Nick Virgilio...Helfant took 12 k & still gave him the max..2 bad 4 him 6 yrs later...Scarfo never forgives & never forgets.

Court Officer Albert Gelb in 76 I believe

True Everett Hatcher WAS NOT a mob hit. I think some people don't know what a mob hit really is. Farace acted alone, the mob didn't sanction it. And Farace wasn't even a made man he was an associate. Let's say a Mafioso is out gambling, words are exchanged and money is lost, with the loser getting pissed and shooting the wiseguy dead. True, a mobster was killed that night, but it wasn't a mob hit. Or a mobster is robbed and killed while making his collections by some freelance criminal, that's not a mob hit. Or when that Gambino associate recently killed that Lucchese-affiliated loanshark and robbed him, that wasn't a mob hit. Or when Zottola Jr. paid a street gang to kill his father for a bigger piece of his business/rackets, that wasn't a mob hit. Alright I'm done with my rant but I think you get the picture.

http://www.gangsterbb.net/threads/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=799935&page=1

victim: Anton Cermak,Chicago Mayor
date of death: March 20, 1933
behind the murder:The Outfit
killer/s:Giuseppe Zangara

Not clear why the outfit was ordered to kill Cermak, nor whether he was the real target and not Roosevelt

http://archive.wtsp.com/news/local/story.aspx?storyid=135110

Tampa Officers Killed: Officer Morris D. Lopez



Tampa Police - Officer Morris Lopez, age 25, conducted his daily foot patrol in historic Ybor City, this was his beat. On July 9, 1949, Officer Lopez just finished contacting headquarters on the Ybor City call box.
Officer Lopez was standing at the corner of 7th Ave. and N. 16th St. when a blue Ford stopped nearby and a gunshot rang out. As the vehicle sped away, Officer Lopez dropped to the sidewalk and died from a gunshot wound to his upper chest.

Detective Richard Cloud was a vice cop who uncovered ties between the Tampa Mafia, strip club industry, drug dealing, and politicians. When he got too close to higher ups in Tampa PD, he was fired. A few months later, in October of 1975 he answered the door to his house and was shot and killed by low level associate Benjamin Guilford who was hired by Anthony Antone (who was put to death for the murder). Guilford killed himself in jail, as did the man who was the mastermind, Victor Acosta. Another accomplice Ellis Haskew testified and was sentenced to 35 years in prison.

victim: Edwin Helfant, lawyer and part-time municipal court judge
date of death: 15 February 1978
behind the murder: Nicholas "The Blade" Virgilio and Nicky Scarfo Sr
killer/s:Nicholas "The Blade" Virgilio

victim: NY Det. Anthony J. Venditti
date of death: 8 p.m. on the evening of Jan. 21, 1986
behind the murder:fight with three mobsters
killer/s: Federico Giovanelli,Steven Maltese and Carmine Gualtiere

Giovanelli and his two accomplices— identified as Steven Maltese and Carmine Gualtiere—were arrested a short time after the fatal shooting. Following two trials which ended in hung juries, they were acquitted of second-degree murder charges during the third trial. All three men were later convicted on federal racketeering charges and incarcerated.


victim: George Aronwald (real target his son William)
date of death: March 20, 1987
behind the murder:Carmine Persico
killer/s: brothers Vincent and Eddie Carnini hired by Joel Cacace

Persico believed that Aronwald, who had helped prosecute Persico, had been disrespectful to the Cosa Nostra.

victim: retired officer Carlo Antonino
date of death: January 1987
behind the murder:The Colombos
killer/s:maybe Joel Cacace


victim:officer Ralph Dols
date of death: August 25, 1997
behind the murder: Cacace felt humiliated that Dols, a Latino, had recently married Cacace's ex-wife Kim.
killer/s:Colombo capo Dino Calabro and soldier Dino Saracino

Thanks to Villain from the Black Hand Forum

In 1926 States Attorney William McSwiggan,known as the “Hanging prosecutor”(for having sent 7 criminals to Death Row in 8 months)was shot to death by a machine gun fire infront of a gambling joint together with two prominent gangsters, James J. Doherty and Thomas Duffy.With this example the mob for the first time characterized its rule in Chicago.

In 1924 Democratic politican Michael Gavin was shot in both legs but survived.

In 1925, David Morgan Chief investigator for the Minister's and Citizens association was shot by Cicero Outfit members but he also survived the shooting.

In 1932 during the battle between John Swanson a State's attorney for Cook County and his opponent Thomas Courtney,the Democratic candidate,a Republican precinct captain was caught in a cross fire of shots between a Democratic precinct captain and five gangsters, who were attacking him. The wounded man later died.

In 1935 tate Representative Albert J. Prignano was shot to death in the doorway of his Chicago home by 3 Outfit gunmen.

In 1936 John M. Bolton while driving home was pursued by another car and during the chase one of the hitmen blew off Bolton's head with a shotgun.

In 1949, Cicero’s former assistant state's attorney Frank Christensen was shot to death outside of his home.

In the 1950's Attorney Marvin Bas, the Republican nominee for Circuit Court Clerk was also murdered by the Outfit.

In 1952 Charles Gross, the Republican Committeeman from the 31st Ward was blown away by seven shotgun blasts.

In 1953 Clem Graver, a state representative and 21st Ward Republican Committeeman was kidnapped by 3 guys and was never seen again.

In 1958 Ben Lewis,the first black alderman to represent the 24th Ward was tied to a chair in his office and shot in the head three times.

August 6, 1930 Judge Joseph Force Crater, whose disappearance was unsolved for many decades until 2005 when a handwritten letter by Stella Ferrucci-Good in an envelope marked "Do not open until I die." was discovered and opened by her granddaughter revealing a twisted tale involving Murder Incorporated, though never confirmed neither has there been evidence to debunk the bizarre story.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_Force_Crater

thanks for posting this Furio! Although the mob will try to avoid killing law enforcement there are still examples of that happening just like civilian victims

most of these are political assignations or random non-OC cop killings, why are they on this forum? JC Crusher, are you as dumb as Furio? How is the assignation attempt on President Roosevelt by a nut who was a communist, resulting in Cermak's death. Nothing to do with he mob! Yet you two are trying again to make like the mob is killing them on a regular basis. Same for the Officer Lopez death, and a few others in that post. What next, the deaths of fictional characters from movies as Mafia victims? How about Furio posts a few deaths from Star Wars, and JCrusher can say "Thanks Furio, this shows how bad the Mafia is"

. Yeah I remember seeing a documentary about him a while back. Very mysterious and like you said a twisted story indeed

Han Solo's Death was mob related, thank you Furio for pointing this out .

They tried to kill Frank Serpico but failed. He did suffer permanent damage. He was shot by the Mafia in that doorway, as Mafia members disguised as detectives let him get shot

Add Judge Rico Dredd to your list Furio, he was thrown off a building.

some more info on Albert Gelb’s murder


https://www.odmp.org/officer/5361-court-officer-albert-gelb

Stop saying bullshit,idiot.

Thats a complete falsehood. The mafia DID NOT shoot Serpico. His cop friends didn't come to his aide as backup as police protocol calls for, but it was not the MAFIA.

There is ZERO proof of that

Sorry to say but if it wasn't for the bullshit that he, she or it spews, then "it" would have nothing to say.

. Very True. Best to just ignore it

You're right as always FOH.

I didn't expect to agree with NyMafia today but here I am agreeing with them about Serpico

Jace you seem like you work for CNN

That surprises me that Jace seemed to have gone off the deep end, he usually has valuable input here.

. Yup FOH is a very respected poster. Good Guy for sure

I was being sarcastic, I had said you JCrusher and yourself, would next start naming movie characters as being mob victims. So I threw in Serpico, who was set up by New York City cops, and you idiots thought it was a real reference. Furio, you gave political killings and a cop killed in Florida many years ago as "Mafia killings" with no validity to it. JCrusher, who is always in a hurry to say the Mafia: Kills kids, innocents, cats, dogs, and little old ladies jumped in as soon as you put up your crap.

Furio the dope said:

"victim: Anton Cermak,Chicago Mayor
date of death: March 20, 1933
behind the murder:The Outfit
killer/s:Giuseppe Zangara

Not clear why the outfit was ordered to kill Cermak, nor whether he was the real target and not Roosevelt"




You are not sure, but you included it. If you looked into it you would see it was not a mob shooting at all.

AS ire you are so great. I also mentioned Hans Sole and a character from Judge Dredd. I guess you added them to your list? A-Hole!

Most of your claims have zero proof, it has never stopped you.

. Truer words have never been spoken

https://web.archive.org/web/20130725055310/http://www.americanmafia.com/Feature_Articles_197.html

The Guns Of Zangara


Part One

By John William Tuohy

     Almost 70 years ago, an enigmatic Italian immigrant bricklayer named Giuseppe Zangara momentarily leaped onto history's stage and took a misguided shot at President-elect Franklin Roosevelt and, accidentally, killed Chicago's reform mayor, Anton Cermak. Or so the story goes. But over the next six-and-a-half decades, the shooting only created more questions than it answered. Who was Zangara, and who was his intended victim Anton Cermak, and did the Chicago mob order the killing?

     The recent discovery of lost government records can now answer those questions and forever seal the case of the Guns of Zangara.

     Like most mob murders, it started over money, greed and the lust for power. In 1931, the labor rackets business in Chicago was worth $145,000,000.00 or about a half billion dollars in today's value. In fact, unions were such easy prey for gangsters, that before prohibition, the mob saw control of labor unions, not bootleg beer, as the quickest route to riches.

     Now, in 1931, with repeal closing in, and the national depression curbing the outfit's gambling business, Al Capone pulled out all stops in his drive to control the labor unions in Chicago. Capone's goons invaded so many union locals that Frank Loesch, President of the Chicago Crime Commission, estimated that two out of every three unions in Chicago was run by Capone.

     As Capone terrorized his way into more teamster locals, the union bosses fled out to suburban Des Plains to live under mobster Roger Touhy's protection.

     The Touhy brothers, Roger, Tommy and Eddie were the last serious threat to Capone's might. The brothers, safely tucked away in the still mostly undeveloped portion of northern Cook County, had grown rich from Prohibition and gambling and the ability to avoid big political payoffs and long-drawn-out beer wars. By 1932, they had the money, the manpower and the firepower to take over the entire Chicago Teamsters' organization without having to split any of the proceeds with Capone.

     Patty Burrell, the Teamsters Vice President, called a meeting of all the locals threatened by Capone and gave them a choice. They could stand alone against Capone, and lose their unions and probably their lives, or they could move their operations under the Touhys' protection. They would still lose a large portion of their treasury to the Touhys, but at least they'd be alive.

     Most of the union bosses knew Roger Touhy from their childhood. He had a solid reputation as a union organizer in his youth and compared to Capone at least, he was still evil, but at the least, he was the lesser of the two evils. The bosses would go with Touhy.

     After the meeting, Burrell sent union boss Jerry Horan to Roger's house with $75,000 in cash for a defense fund. Touhy used that money, plus an additional $75,000 from his own pocket, to hire an army of thugs, killers and goons to fend off Capone's pending assault.

     Touhy's defiance didn't come without a price. The Capones killed one of the brothers, and attempted to kidnap his children. Then, on October 25, 1931, the unbelievable happened. Al Capone was convicted of income tax evasion and sentenced to ten years in prison. That same day, Matt Kolb, Touhy's business partner and financier, as well as the source of Touhy's enormous political clout, was gunned down by Capone gunmen inside his speakeasy, the Club Morton. With Kolb dead, the price for political protection went through the roof. Touhy would have to find a Kolb replacement soon and Anton Cermak was just off on the horizon.

     "Tony Cermak was not a very nice man," wrote Judge Lyle of Chicago's mayor. "He appeared to take pride in his lack of polish. He was uncouth, gruff, insolent and inarticulate . . . he could engage in no more intelligent discussion of the larger political issues of the day then he could have the Einstein theory of relativity."

     In personal confrontations, Cermak was known as a bully and an intimidator with a violent temper, who'd never walk away from a dispute.

     He liked very few people, and he trusted virtually no one. As his power grew so did his paranoia. He wasn't a back slapper. He was elected because he was a political survivor, who simply outlasted his opponents. Those he couldn't outlast, he blackballed.

     In the Illinois State House, as President of Cook County and later as mayor, Cermak used wire taps, stole mail, used secret surveillance and informants to get intelligence on the weaknesses of his enemies and he took great care to know who his enemies were. He admitted to authorizing beatings of anyone that got in his way.

     Anthony "Ten Percent Tony" Cermak, was born on May 7, 1873, in a Bohemian village about fifty miles outside of Prague. The family immigrated to America in 1884, settling in a Chicago slum on 15th and Canal, the infamous Valley that had also produced the Touhy brothers, and later, in 1900, moved to Braidwood in southern Illinois, where the elder Cermak worked as a coal miner.

     In 1889, Tony Cermak returned to Chicago at age 16. Cermak was a hustler who saw his opportunity in the rough and tumble world of Chicago's ethnic politics. He organized the huge Bohemian community into a powerful voting machine and before he was old enough to vote himself, Tony Cermak was a political power.

     Cermak was also a greedy man who wanted to be rich and the roads he used to riches was to form an organization called the United Societies, a high-sounding name for nothing more then a shakedown operation. Every brewer and booze seller, dance hall operator and saloon keeper was a member, as were most of the area's gunmen, pimps, prostitutes and gamblers that worked along 22nd street, later renamed, oddly enough, Cermak Road. They paid to belong to Cermak's organization because Cermak had the police and the politicians in pocket.

     In 1928 Cermak, who was still the "spokesman" for organized liqueur interest, decided to become mayor of Chicago.

     On election day, April 7, 1931, word went out from higher ups in the Capone organization down to the goons and speakeasy owners to support Cermak. If Cermak won, the Bosses said, the reformers would loosen up.

     Cermak did win. He trounced Thompson 667,529 votes to 475,613, the largest margin ever recorded in a Chicago mayoral election to that date.

     But he double crossed the people too. On his first day in office, Cermak promised the people of Chicago that he would rid their city of its gangsters before the Century of Progress Exhibition opened in the summer of 1933.

     But Tony didn't want to get rid of organized crime in Chicago, he wanted to coral it. To dominate it. To run it. To own it. To grow rich from it, and, he figured, all he had to do was to give it another face.

     So Tony Cermak threw his net around the city's multimillion dollar gambling rackets. The first thing he did to corner the gambling market was to close down the competition.

     Seemingly overnight, Cermak's police force, which he dominatedwith his hand-picked loyalists, raided hundreds of syndicate gambling dens and casinos and shut them down. Independent gamblers, there were still a few in those days, who refused to throw in with Cermak, were run out of business.

     Once Cermak had smashed the gamblers into submission he would need someone dependable to act as his collector and street boss, the mayor's personal bagman. Enter Teddy Newberry, a lifelong gangster, who had been with Bugs Moran and then the Aillos, and finally with Capone until his career ended.

     After several months of acting as Cermak's street supervisor, Teddy Newberry sat down with Anton Cermak in the summer of 1931 and worked out a deal. As Newberry and Cermak saw it, with Capone and most of his top men behind bars, or on the run from the law, what was left of the syndicate would easily fall apart.

     The fact that Roger Touhy was winning his shooting war against the mob was another plus for them. All that was left, according to Newberry, to topple the Chicago syndicate, was to kill the head and then watch the body die.

     The head of the syndicate in 1933 was Frank Nitti. Once Nitti was dead, all the other hoods would fall into line . . . or so they thought.

     Francisco Nitto, or, Frank Nitti, as he preferred, was a small built, pensive little man with ulcers and a nervous twitch. He was born outside of Palermo, in Italy, but he avoided discussing his Sicilian background, always calling himself an Italian instead. Nitti had gotten a full formal education in Italy before coming to the United States which gave him a working knowledge of advanced chemistry and he was also said to be a talented watchmaker.

     Although the newspaper referred to Nitti as "The Enforcer," for those who knew the real story, the nickname was almost comical. In fact, as far as anyone knows, Nitti never killed anyone. He made his way up through the ranks of the syndicate because he was smart, cunning and obnoxious.

     At mid morning, on December 20, 1933, Tony Cermak summoned two members of his special squad to his office, Harry Miller and Henry Lang. Miller and Lang were crooks, gangsters with badges. Always had been. Harry Miller, who had once been dismissed from the force for trafficking in narcotics, was one of the notorious Miller Brothers who headed up the Valley gang.

     Henry Lang was a bag man for former Mayor Big Bill Thompson and taught Miller the little bit he needed to know about being a crook when he came on the force by "special political appointment" back in 1927.

     Now, through political pull they were both detective sergeants on his Cermak's "Special Squad," a group of tough cops of questionable background, tossed together to carry out Cermak's every whim.

     As Lang would later testify under oath, Cermak called them to his office and handed them a slip of paper with Frank Nitti's name and office address on it. Teddy Newberry was there, sitting on the mayoral desk, smoking one of his small cigars. Newberry told the pair that he and the mayor had decided that it was time for Frank Nitti to die, and they had to do the killing. The slip of paper, he explained, was where they would find Nitti most of the morning.

     Newberry said that once Nitti was dead, he would pay Miller and Lang $15,000.00 each. Good money for a pair of cops who were supposed to be making less then one hundred dollars a week.

     The detectives left city hall and drove to Nitti's office at the La Salle-Wacker building at 221 North LaSalle, took the elevator to the fifth floor and walked to room 554, where Nitti kept a cramped a three room office.

     Inside the office was Nitti and several underlings. Lang and Miller lined the hoods up against the wall, and, very quickly, Lang fired five shots into Nitti's leg, groin, back and neck. Then Lang walked to an anteroom, and fired a single shot through his own hand. The story would be that Nitti resisted arrest and lunged for Lang's service revolver, and had to be shot.

     The mistake in shooting Nitti was that they didn't kill him. While it was true that the shooting had spooked what was left of the mob's leadership, Cermak and Newberry knew that once Nitti had recuperated, that the outfit would strike back. What they needed now was a street fighter to fend off those pending attacks.

Enter Roger Touhy.

     Anton Cermak, who had known Touhy for Roger Touhy for decades, wanted Touhy to join forces with him and Teddy Newberry to help them jointly run the underworld in Chicago and the Midwest.

     In 1959, Touhy told the Illinois parole board that in early 1933, Newberry and Cermak called him down to city hall for a discussion.

     In a meeting in the mayor's office, Cermak and Newberry urged Touhy to wage a larger war with the mob, but Touhy laughed it off saying he didn't have the strength to fight the Nitti organization which could muster at least 500 gunmen within a week's time. Cermak said, "you can have the entire police department."

     Touhy eventually agreed, and Cermak lived up to his end of the bargain. He sent word down to his police commanders that Roger Touhy was to be cooperated with in his war against the syndicate for control of the Chicago teamsters.

     The number of Capone men killed after Cermak took office tripled in two years. Some one hundred gangsters were killed in ambushes and street fights. For a while, the hoods fell at a rate of one gangland murder a day with most of the dead coming from the syndicate's ranks.

     James Doherty, a crime reporter for the Chicago Tribune recalled: "It was a war, chiefly, between the Irish and the Italians. I'm Irish and I'd come into my office in the morning after another shoot-out and I would say to my co-worker, who was Italian, "Well that's one to my side" and the next day he would come and say "Well, it's leveled Jim," we chalked one up on our side last night."

     For a while, it was going well for the upstarts. Almost too well. The Touhys gunned down the syndicate's lead labor plunderer, Red Barker, the government jailed the equally deadly Murray Humpreys, and Cermak's boys shot down Frank Nitti.

     They were so close. They had chased the syndicate out of the Teamsters and had ready access to the pension funds. They owned city hall and the cops.

Then the tide started to turn.

     First, Teddy Newberry's dead body showed up on the bitter cold evening of January 7, 1933. He was found lying face down in a ditch in Porter county, Indiana.

     After Newberry was killed, Tony Cermak lost his nerve. Tony was absolutely certain that the outfit had pegged Louis "Short Pants" Campagna; Al Capone's former bodyguard was going to kill him.

     He may have been right. According to newsman Jack Lait, in late 1933, the syndicate's hit men tried to blow up Cermak's car early one morning in the middle of Chicago's loop.

     After that, Cermak beefed up his security forces and moved from the Congress hotel to the Morrison hotel where he paid for a private elevator that went non-stop to his penthouse suite. He increased his city police guard from two to five officers and had detectives sent to protect his daughters and hired on private bodyguards to augment his city police detail and then took a midnight train to Miami where he owned a home.

     The job to end the union war with the Touhys and take out Anton Cermak fell to Paul Ricca, acting boss since Nitti had been shot. Ricca determined that the only way to deal with Cermak was to kill him. But, knocking off the mayor of the nation's second largest city would bring down more heat on the mob then Cermak ever could have gathered. Unless, of course, the murder could be thumbed off on a "nut case."

     The "Nutcase" they found was Giuseppe Zangara, a hapless Italian immigrant with a gambling problem, who was into the outfit for his eye teeth.

Interesting tale with a nice twist involving organized crime, I live in Miami and have been to where Zangara shot Cermak and at Roosevelt near Bayfront Park, I believe there's a plaque to mark the incident. Here's a link to video of Mr. Zangara speaking about President Roosevelt.
https://www.britishpathe.com/video/attempted-assassination-of-mr-roosevelt

Giuseppe Zangara was nutcase, and Touhy was just trying as hard as he could to make it a mob case. He wrote about the mob and looked to shape that now debunked and dismissed story that Furio posted. Yeah, right, the mob tried to kill a guy with the President of the United States present, put the killer in a situation where he was guaranteed to be caught, and used a mentally ill communist. Keep believing that Furio.

We're forgetting the big one, JFK. Some would argue that Carlos Marcello and company organized that.

I don't believe the Mafia was behind the JFK assassination, call me a conspiracy theorist but I strongly believe it was some Illuminati shit, or whatever they're actually called.

I don't believe "It" was referring to me as I never added a name to this "hit" latest, but who knows what she's likely to say. She is what she is, an idiot!

-

Your idiotic response to my post begs the question, do the insults ever stop with you Jace? For a person who knows absolutely shit about the true history of organized crime in America, you sure have a lot to say. Not to mention the fact that 99% of what you do say is way off base and completely wrong no less.

Like the old adage goes, "people who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones"... in case you're truly that dense Jace, I'm referring to you! What you know about the mafia, and life in general, we could fit inside of a thimble, and we've still have more than enough room inside to fit a finger. Girl or no girl, I strongly advise you to shut the fuck up once in awhile. Because at this stage of the game, nearly everybody on this forum feels you're an imbecile.

. Good for you NYMafia. We dont always agree on the subject of the mob BUT you’ve always been a class act. You respect other opinions even if you don’t agree with them which is the way it should be

New York Mafia, you make claims of knowing all sorts of mafia members, and seemingly form every state they existed in. You offer no proof, you just look up news archives and read books, then act like it first had knowledge. As for JCrusher, he just likes you at the moment because you threw a sissy fit over my telling the truth about you.

I don't know how or why you got involved in this, and call me "It" all you like. You are another clown who claims to have knowledge of the Mafia in Ohio and Western Pa, with no proof. If I was not referring to you, did you respond because you very strongly believe the mafia killed a man right in front of the United States President, and got away with it? Maybe all the ghosts of Mafia members past that you communicate with told you so. Please share.

Your Friend,

It

Proof, that's easy for me. Somewhere in this forum when I first joined over 9 years ago JCB published quite a few of my Dad's pictures taken at Charlie's Roost during deer season, not internet photos. Pictures of the upper end of the LaRocca Family of Pittsburgh. Michael Genovese, Boss...Jo Jo Pecora, Under Boss and Charlie Murgie, Consigliere. I'm shown in a couple and my relationship with the Youngstown/Pittsburgh LCN is very well known. As far as these senseless killings, I have no skin in the game. I only know that you think you know it all and the truth of the matter is you know shit. I'm simply tired of you spewing your shit on everybody's threads. Simple enough? Now crawl back under your rock and quit trolling. We're done!

If it was you in any pictures, and it may not be, so what? It does not mean you know the secrets of anyone in the photos. Plus as I said, who knows if you are the4 person in the photo? You may have found a photo of the people you mention posing with a guy on a site, and claimed it was you with them. As if the mafia would tel you secrets!!!

Jace, or whatever the fuck your name it. YOU are literally the last person in the world that either me, FOH, or anybody else on this forum needs to prove anything to.

Who the fuck are you anyway, the Pope or the President? You're a straight up jerk-off, plain and simple. As FOH and I have said here and now (and many other posters have said in the recent past), you know zero about anything. Especially organized crime. Your theories are patently ridiculous. Your statements are generally without merit. You constantly throw out insults to others here on the forum. And then you try and act all high and mighty and indignant when someone pulls your bullshit card out from under you.

You're a bad joke. And that's all you are. (or yeah, your also a troll)....a poor one at that also. Lol. You just can't seem to get anything right can you Jace?

I get things right, and I know a conspiracy theory from fact. If you believe the Mafia had a politician killed while he stood next to the President of the United States, as Furio claims, then you are exactly everything you claimed I am. Plus, you have been made into what they call a "Punk" by the people who were blasting you a few weeks ago. You went from standing up to calls of being a pedophile to praising the person calling you that, and totally backed down on questioning accusations of all mafia members being rats to backing that cause. i wait for facts, not conspiracy theories. I stick by what I say, you are a coward, and a fraud. Now Mr. Mafia, say I know nothing again. I know enough, and don't try to fake it like you and a few others. Go write another fake story about a mobster and claim you knew him.

One more thing I wanna say while I'm at it. After having been a forum member now for several years already, I've realized who counts and who doesn't count around here. Who is a gentleman, and who is a nasty fuck. Who is knowledgable about OC. And who may not be unknowledgeable but is willing to keep an open mind and learn. Who is a troublemaker. And who is a nice person.

You Jace. I'm sorry to say are one of the troublemakers and loud mouths who constantly makes nasty and uncalled for comments toward others. Trolls posts. And generally only looks to start trouble around here.

You add very little in the way of positive contributions with either articles, photos, interesting stories, questions, etc. Yet, you constantly look to criticize others and get sarcastic. You are a zero!

Thank you JC

From the book publishers of the book on Giuseppe Zangara and the killing of Cermak:


[i]In Miami, Florida, on February 15, 1933, Giuseppe Zangara, an unemployed bricklayer from Italy, fired five pistol shots at the back of President-elect FDR's head from only 25 feet away. While all five rounds missed their target, one of them found Mayor Anton Cermak of Chicago, who died of his wound three weeks later. A scant two weeks after that, Zangara was executed in the electric chair. It was the swiftest legal execution in twentieth-century American history. With his death, Zangara took to the grave the answer to one of the most baffling unsolved mysteries in the annals of Presidential assassinations. Was FDR Zangara's real target? Or was he a mob hitman who actually intended to kill Cermak, as Walter Winchell believed? Was he a terrorist, as the LA police contended? Could he have been a member of La Camorra, as the prison warden insisted? Was he simply insane, as many at the time thought? Or was he really a martyr for the cause of the Common Man, as he himself proclaimed?[/i]
Source: Publisher


Conspiracy theories. Executed in 2 weeks by the government. Yet people want to make it a mob hit.

Well that was a complete mixed up gibberish of a whacky rant if ever I heard one. Wow!... you really are an idiot aren't you Jace.

. Nobody can argue with anything you said. Well Put! . I actually feel a tiny bit bad for that other person making shit posts because she/he/it had literally alienated everyone tired of her shit

Says the guy who spent most of his/her/ it's time here fighting with everyone till giving in and going along. Now let's wait for JCrusher to defend you, after making you his/her/it's punk

Ha!!!! I knew it, as I was posting that last one jCrusher was there defending you! I knew it!

This thread is truly NOT about Zangara, a murder conspiracy, or anything else at this stage of the game except what a troublemaking loudmouth idiot you really are Jace. Learn some manners. Learn how to be a gentleman, or a lady for that matter (who the heck knows what you really are). Learn how to interact with others without stooping to sarcasm and insults. Learn a bit about organized crime. And then maybe, MAYBE, people will want to start chatting with you.

Because right now most of us have put you on "the pay no mind list".... (I know me, FOH, Furio, and JCrusher have). I'm certain many others have also.

. Exactly. I dont even respond to he/she/it anymore because quite frankly they aren’t worth it. I tried a few years back but it became clear that it was a lost cause. Part of me feels a tiny bit bad because obviously something is wrong upstairs lol. However now he/she isn’t fooling anymore anymore and everyone is tired of it

JCrusher, be honest, you don't agree with New York Mafia, you disagree with me. As for your BS about trying to respond to me years back, you did nothing but respond with insults, along with your then partner, Moe. Stop lying, I will call you out on it.

1000% correct JC

I tried being nice to "IT" at first. Then I tried tolerating her insults. Then I just ignored her completely. But after this last passive/agressive post of hers I lost patience. Hence, I decided to straighten her out once and for all. And tell her what's REALLY what! Lol

Now, as FOH, likes to say. we're done here! Am I'm done interacting and wasting my time with a nitwit like Jace. Grow up, or shut up!

So now you're gonna put words in JC's mouth for him now too? LOL.... why don't you believe him when he told you the first two times. He does "not" like you!

Straighten me out? Now you think you're The Godfather. You can't get yourself straight.

. Just the usual crap from this clown. That’s why I don’t even respond to he/she/it haha

People were waiting for the files released a year or 2 ago on the assassination to see if it showed mob involvement, there was no mob involvement in the unredacted files. It has not stopped people from saying the mafia killed him.

Lol, you are the delusional one here, not me. And as anybody can see, it didn't take much for me to straighten you out that's for sure. Or to out think you. As I tried to "enlighten" you earlier, unsuccessfully I see, you are but an "imbecile"

You're right JC. I just said what I said. But now its high time we both ignore this yo-yo. Talk to you again my friend. Good night

You "Straightened me out" then "Tried to enlighten" me---you really have way too high an opinion of yourself. You are overrated in your own twisted mind. You and your "I was friends with mobsters" fantasies.

. You too NY!! Some of us actually have to work tomorrow. Take Care!

bumping up

Let me stir some pepper into this pot by dropping this theory on you guys.
JFK was accidentally shot by a secret service agent armed with an AR15 in the car directly behind the presidential convertible .
Check out this interview the evidence is overwhelming and pointed out by the only marksman to have replicated Oswald's feat on November 22nd 1963

I don't know CNote, it sounds a bit far fetched. Do you think it might be true, or are you just adding it for info on conspiracies? I think it was Oswald alone, but I think I'm in the minority on that. JFK's brothers were still very powerful politically and financially,, I can't see them not cracking down on whoever was responsible. They had the power to do so. It is an interesting video

Bonar Menninger also wrote another book on the topic, I tried to put up the Amazon link but it won't show, the book is called JFK Motorcade, published in 2013

No sir, not trolling. This is the real deal, it completely changed my perspective on what happened. The interviewee, Howard Donahue is unbelievably factually accurate. You don't have to take my word for it and I won't take personally but I wouldn't waste anyone's time if didn't think it was a valid theory.

I did not think you were trolling at all, CNote I thought you might be adding it to include all of the popular conspiracy theory's out there. It is a respectable interview, I just am not a believer in the JFK theories Anyway, thanks for adding it

. Awesome Furio. Thanks!

It is still a fake BS, conspiracy theory that was long ago dismissed by anyone with a brain. But don't worry Furio, JCrusher will bump it up again in a few days and say it's great, even though he does not believe it himself.

http://images.app.goo.gl/ty4dHsVu6vJhR7Xs9

@Furio I think all members share the same sentiment regarding that individual lol

"IT" is what "IT" is: Can't Understand Normal Things ;-)

. Very True Henry. IT needs some serious help lol

I understand, you are clueless.

Youngstown, Ohio: Murder City, USA (2000)

Maybe you would share your vast knowledge of Youngstown, Ohio: Murder City, USA (2000)