Would Gotti still have taken out Castellano if....

In either of these two scenarios:

1. If DiMeo was still alive/his crew was still active in 1985?

2. If Castellano had picked Gotti (say alongside Tommy Gambino) to be Underboss or Co-Underboss after Neil died and attended Neil's funeral? Or if say he ruled that Gotti and Gambino would be his Acting Bosses when/if he went to prison.

1. That is a good question. Likely a highly debatable one, in fact. Thought I think Gotti would have done it anyway for reasons I'll give in reply to number 2. If he'd had to deal with Roy in the aftermath then I think he would have found a way to try to do that.

2. There is no chance Gotti would have been picked to be Underboss. At that time there would have been two dozen guys more qualified than Gotti, based on loyalty alone (which is the only justification for Bilotti.) Gotti actually may have made a great number two, but there's no way he would have been picked by Castellano for good reason.

I wouldn't read too much into Castellano's not attending the funeral, that was just some icing on the cake that Castellano gave Gotti to sell the hit to the rank and file. At that point, Castellano was going down anyway because Gotti didn't want to turn over the Ruggiero tapes, didn't want his crew broken up and had legitimate reason to fear that his own life was in danger. Once Dellacroce was cold, the wheels were in motion and I'm sure that was the plan all along.

Prior to the Castellano hit the assumption was that Dellacroce was keeping Gotti alive. As it turns out, he was actually keeping Castellano alive.

Is it known if Gotti voiced any thoughts of mutiny to Neil, any suggestions to take Paul out?

And would Neil have had Gotti killed if he knew a plot was underway while he was alive?

More good questions but the more we play the speculation game the further we get away from reality.

I'm not, by far, the best Gotti historian here so my opinion probably wouldn't be as valued as some others, and rightfully so. But I wouldn't be surprised if Gotti voiced ideas to Neil - they were close. But I would think they would have been shot down immediately. The fact that Gotti would not carry this plan out until Dellacroce was in the ground should tell you, I think, that Dellacroce would never have approved of any such plan.

If Gotti had done it anyway and Dellacroce was still around hard to say would have happened. Lots of other old timers fell into line and perhaps Dellacroce would have too, so long as what was done was done. Of course, if Dellacroce was still around perhaps he would have ended up being a caretaker Boss - which I'm sure would have been just fine with Gotti. The question then would be, what would Dellacroce do to address the obvious infraction of LCN rules? This was an old school guy...I wouldn't be totally surprised if he turned around and took Gotti out. Surely the commission would have demanded it and I don't think Dellacroce was going to argue with Gigante.

It's hard to say what Neil would have done for sure, although I am sure that if Castellano had ordered Neil to whack John, it likely would have happened. Probably the same could and should rightly be said of most members; what Gotti did in terms of LCN rules was absolutely outrageous.

There’s bugged recording where Neil is talking to Gotti and Angelo about the consequences of NOT handing over the tapes and says something along the lines of “...and if you don’t you gotta roll it up and go to war”

Maybe someone can post that full taped convo. Not sure that it’s a green light from Neil but he certainly didn’t say No you can’t go to war just that war would be the outcome.

Roy would've been no problem. He also wanted Paul whacked. Freddie DiNome said he and Roy used to do practice hit runs on a motorcycle.

Lord knows there been alot threads on the Gotti brazen take out
Of Big Paul and it seems like it brings out really knowledgeable
Input.
I would politely ask the following

1.What if Big Paul wanted to eliminate Gotti. Would he have approached
Sammy Gravano about it?

2. How come their wasnt another attempt on Gottis life
After the DeCicco bombing?

Pretty sure Gotti was on trial or starting trials and had a lot of heat on him as well as media. I think they were still interested in killing him but just couldn’t find an opportune time were Gotti wasn’t surrounded by media or law enforcement surveillance, crew members, etc.

It wasn't Gotti's brains that pushed him to him take out his boss, it was his ego. I think it was coming no matter what

This has been covered ad nauseum

but I believe Roy Demeo would have been part of the plot....had Castellano not been killed he was planning on murdering Nino Gaggi...

The original plan was to have 3 capos as a panel run the family which was Gotti,Tommy Gambino and Bilotti.....
Had Gotti been made Underboss and told dont worry about the drugs then I think Castellano would be alive, because Gotti would have been made Boss as soon as Castellano was Jailed in late 1986 on the Commission Case and if he beat that then in late 87 when he would have been jailed on the Gambino Heirarchy case.......

It was all about one thing, the tapes Castellano wanted handed over. There were side issues, and others like Locascio and Gravano were along own the killing, so it was not all Gotti. If not for the tapes, or if Gotti had not stayed loyal to Ruggerio, Paul lives, and the Commission case might send him away fo life, or if he beats it he would have likely stepped aside anyway (Not for Gotti) DeMeo was never a factor.

I think the real question is would Gotti have been able to if Decicco and Sammy didn’t agree to come together. My answer is obviously no. However to answer your question no Roy had no love for Paul. In fact he was pissed that would wouldn’t induct him for awhile until he brokered a deal with the Westies. As for naming him underboss or a ruling panel I doubt he wanted that anyway

Why did Roy want Paul gone? It's always been portrayed like Roy was Paul's loyal fuckin' Rottweiler that he could sic on whoever

You see Gaspipe's book saying he never would have made a move if Demeo was still around....

That's probably true if Demeo liked Castelanno, but he hated him...He would have joined the hit team faster then Gravano

Okay so outside of Bilotti who was a joke, who was the most personally loyal guy to Castellano that actually was respected overall? Or that was a killer? Either or. Like someone who would've been in "The Castellano faction" and honestly been taken aback by the murder. Just curious because was he popular with anyone?