another mob guy murdered

in Ancaster Canada

Murders only ever seem to take place in Canada now.

Good thing all the people now days will be having protests!

Back in the day you minded your own ! Never seen a problem with a guy that minded his own.....

Ancaster is a neighbourhood of Hamilton. I hear it was Al Iavarone. Anyone know him?

On internet is said that the dead was a 50 y old man from
Sunflower Crescent,why do you think he was a mobster?

A few local media outlets are reporting a Hamilton police source has said it was a known mobster.

https://www.cp24.com/news/one-man-dead-after-targeted-shooting-in-ancaster-1.4093813

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/hamilton/50-year-old-dead-in-targeted-ancaster-shooting-1.4823510


The house shown in the video is listed in the phone registry to a A.Iavarone.

A little over 15 minutes ago, Paul Manning tweeted about this murder. See https://twitter.com/mobinfiltrator/status/1040636936497582080.

The copy in the tweet is below (just in case he deletes his tweet).

Source provided intel last nights #homicide in #ancaster, #hamont was #mafia retaliation for #angmusitano #murder.

Apparently not shooter but relative gunned down.

This is not finished.

12:22 PM - 14 Sep 2018

If it's a retaliation for the Musitano hit this makes so much sense. Get this, if the murdered person is Al Iavarone, he's a real estate agent agent:

https://www.royallepage.ca/en/agent/ontario/hamilton/al-iavarone/13685/

Notice the company he works for, now notice this fella from the same exact company and location:

https://www.royallepage.ca/en/agent/ontario/hamilton/giacomo-luppino/19302/

This is a hit on the Luppino family.

Edit: looking into Giacomo Luppino's Facebook page and seeing g some of the pictures on there definitely makes me think hes some sort of boss.

rizzuto from the grave

Internal dispute is a possibility.

Police confirmed the victim is Albert Iavarone.

https://torontosun.com/news/local-news/suspected-mafia-boss-gunned-down-in-ancaster-report

Here's one link to the Hamilton Police Service's news conference earlier this afernoon:

https://www.facebook.com/CHCHTelevision/videos/742478372759898/

Skip through to the 4:43 mark, as everything before that is blank.

Ancaster man’s murder is ‘retaliation’ for 2017 mob hit: former undercover cop

https://www.thestar.com/news/gta/2018/09/14/hamilton-police-probing-ancaster-homicide.html

This Toronto Star article you posted clarifies a little bit better the situation.

I was perplexed as to why there hasn't been more shootings since the Cosimo homicide.

This is most likely is a power struggle happening in Hamilton. For the longest time the Musitano family enjoyed their power because Vito was alive. Ever since his death and the power struggle in Montreal, the Luppino family being their rivals are trying to take over the area and eliminate them.

I know a lot of people mention that there are 3 families in Hamilton with Pappalia often mentioned, but it's unclear if the Pappalias are a separate independent family, or a Buffalo crew, or simply they don't exist and are just part of the same Luppino family. Remember that the Violi brothers may very well be leading this Pappalia group, and their grandfather on their mother's side is Giacomo Luppino, so it's most likely just two families that exist and are fighting for the city control.

I agree, It makes a lot of sense.

The confusing thing to me is do the Hamilton groups follow LCN protocol or 'ndrangheta?

I was always under the impression that Ontario is primarily Calabrian territory - even though the Sicilians have tried to make inroads there.

They probably follow both based on convenience. Keep in mind that these groups are originally Calabrese and have 'Ndrangheta ties and roots, but when they were migrating to Canada, the area was under the American Mob control, which has LCN roots.

Technically speaking, the Buffalo family called the shots in Southern Ontario back in the day. All these families answered to Magaddino one way or another. Eventually the American LCN weakened while these groups strengthened their ties with their original families back home that were becoming more powerful. The independence in Montreal started a lot sooner, and eventually it happened in Southern Ontario too when Vito decided to take out Pappalia. That was pretty much the end of Buffalo's control. The Musitano decided to be connected with the Rizzutos, which were LCN.

Now you have the Luppino family, which are independent and do have 'Ndrangheta roots, but they probably have a lot of members among them (Like the Violi son's for example) that still carry the Pappalia banner to keep ties to the American LCN through Buffalo. I mean it's better to have more allies and connections than not, so Im sure something of such nature is taking place.

Thanks BZ, that makes sense. I'm sure the bosses in Calabria hear about these events through the grapevine. They are meeting these days in San Luca.

So it's established, the buffalo family is active? Nevermind, forget I asked 🤐

https://www.niagarafallsreview.ca/o...f-angelo-musitano/#.W50XrsxghmA.linkedin

Stephen G. Metelsky, M.A. did this story a while back - great read if you want a starting point for yesterday's mob hit in Hamilton.

Whacked in Waterdown: The Murder of Angelo Musitano

https://torontosun.com/news/local-news/suspected-mafia-boss-gunned-down-in-ancaster-report

Man shot dead outside home in Ancaster targeted: Cops

Older article from April of this year.Tthe home where the victim was stabbed is owned by the Luppino family.

Police probing “targeted” home invasion on Mountain

https://www.thespec.com/news-story/8560499-police-probing-targeted-home-invasion-on-mountain

_______________

I became aware of the article because a Twitter user posted a link while communicating with Stephen G. Metelsky and Paul Manning.

If was a retaliation why kill a real estate agent?

Good find.

Knowing all these past incidents that occurred, I question why these guys answer doors blindly and have no body guard protection.

Do you really think that was his only job ?

So maybe was a killer.

Cosa Nostra News article states:

That there are 3 families in Hamilton
Two of them are tied to American LCN

Obviously Bonnano and Todaro...
The third tied to the Rizzuto's the Mustiano Family

The two are taking out the Mustiano Family for two reasons:

1) Pay back
2) Take advantage of the situation

The Violios we know are Todaro family...

It looks like the picture is starting to come together up north

The Rizzuto's and their allies figured they didn't need American LCN backing....

That was a big mistake

Mustiano's rode the Rizzuto's coat tails, now that they are out of power they have no backing...

They are done

You see the Bananno's having making ceremonies in canada now and they are getting indicted with the Violio's and Gambino's....

Cosa Nostra News article states:

That there are 3 families in Hamilton
Two of them are tied to American LCN

Obviously Bonnano and Todaro...
The third tied to the Rizzuto's the Mustiano Family

The two are taking out the Mustiano Family for two reasons:

1) Pay back
2) Take advantage of the situation

The Violios we know are Todaro family...

It looks like the picture is starting to come together up north

The Rizzuto's and their allies figured they didn't need American LCN backing....

That was a big mistake

Mustiano's rode the Rizzuto's coat tails, now that they are out of power they have no backing...

They are done

You see the Bananno's having making ceremonies in canada now and they are getting indicted with the Violio's and Gambino's....

The Papalia family is active in Hamilton and Toronto; in Delianuova and Platì, Calabria and Buccinasco, Milan.

Italy
Domenico Papalia, Johnny Papalia's first cousin, was a boss in the 'Ndrangheta in Calabria. He was involved in at least five kidnappings and convicted for the 1976 murder of rival mobster Antonio D'Agostino.[4] In the 1970s, a branch of the Papalia family relocated their operations from Platì to Buccinasco near Milan. Another two first cousins of Johnny, Antonio and Rocco Papalia, used ransom money from kidnppings to buy large shipments of drugs for export. In 1993, authorities seized a house, factory, land, cars and businesses that belonged to Antonio and Rocco, worth over $40 million.[4] The Papalias also operated with the Barbaro 'ndrina in the north–south operation, also having connections stretching to Australia.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/hamilton/organized-crime-musitano-iavarone-murder-hamilton-1.4825446

Public slayings of Musitano, Iavarone meant to send a message, says expert

The American LCN no longer controls up north. Canada now has independent families that control the region and their ties and loyalty goes back to Italy.

The only family I see having some sort of involvement in Canada is the Buffalo family in southern Ontario, and even with them I think it's more of a convenience for the Hamilton mobsters rather than Buffalo having an actual control. If anything, I would say the power for the Buffalo Mob sits in Hamilton under the Pappalias, not in Buffalo, but they fly that LCN flag because it gets them access and connections in New York. Do keep in mind the Pappalia family has roots in Calabria, and in Hamilton the folks who control this group are pretty much the same family as the Luppinos. I guess what I'm trying to say is, the Luppinos, Pappalias, Violis, and Musitanos are all Calabrian mobsters, and they only dabble with LCN when they want to extend their power and influence.

The Gambinos are doing business in the Toronto area, but they are only up there by association and joint ventures with the local Calabrian families that have control. The Gambino family does not have any control up there.

The Bonnano family is a thing of the past seeing how Montreal is upside down with all the killings.

Back in the day you made it ur business to mind ur business.

And you just be left alone

I made that call about Buffalo when I first came on here.

Based on what I read I assumed that made all the sense.

No one really agreed with and actually a few posters got really upset.

These routes were carved out during the Mobs hey day no way anyone will just walk away.

Huge money to be made the Canada and MY border back then and today.

Think about it they have secret routes that are really secure as no one is getting pinched that they can get anything across the border.

What's that worth?

So the third Hamilton if they are not aligned with the Bananno's than what American LCN Family?

Detroit?

Those killings (taking into consideration the high-level ones) were started by the Bonannos (arranged by Montagna).

The Bonannos may have lost a lot of influence, but I'll put my money on them, as an actual still considered to be viable family, being more active in Canada than whatever is left of Buffalo.

Buffalo mob playing role in deadly Ontario dispute, sources say

https://www.thestar.com/news/crime/...-deadly-ontario-dispute-sources-say.html

Why would mobsters in Buffalo let someone in Hamilton be the boss? And if the power in in Hamilton, why would they let new York guys hit ang, also why would the new York mob turn thier backs on the hitters??? This still doesn't make since

Iavarone family asks to be ‘left in peace’

https://www.thespec.com/news-story/8907237-iavarone-family-asks-to-be-left-in-peace-/

Wow! Those quoted in this article have little doubt the Buffalo Family is active. Politely, I’d lack to see Nicky from Tampa’s response and if he tries to explain this away.

I don't think Buffalo guys are doing the shooting I think their are playing a part in whatever is going on.

[quote=antimafia]Buffalo mob playing role in deadly Ontario dispute, sources say

https://www.thestar.com/news/crime/...-deadly-ontario-dispute-sources-say.html[/quote

I would say according to the law of Gangster BB if it's in the press It makes it official.

And it's recent as of last week and quoted L.E.

Rooster R.I.P.
LOL...

Sign: Change.Org
UN-ban the Rooster

1) _____________________

Notice the beginning of the article. It says:



It speaks of NY State mobsters ...I don’t think they are referring to NYC and the families there. I believe they are referring to Buffalo—as that is what is referenced in the title. Could be wrong, but that is my thought.

For what it is worth here is the wiki article on Paul Manning who this article quotes. (I know wiki is not a reliable source!) If the article is correct, it seems he infiltrated the Musitano and Paplia crime families and then his cover was blown in 2006.. Also, indicates he has a lawsuit against Hamilton Police for an intelligence breach and criminality related to his blown cover.

Paul Manning

Here is the article the wiki is based off of: Undercover Cop Manning Betrayed

Updated article by CBC News reporter who has been covering the Iavarone murder. A source, Stephen Metelsky, is quoted in the story as saying that Iavarone is connected to the Musitanos.

Iavarone family not speaking with police and want to be 'left in peace'

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/hamilton/albert-iavarone-family-death-investigation-1.4827936.

A very important piece of information. This may explain the alliance with the Wolfpack.

Hamilton cops release image of vehicle in suspected gangland hit

https://torontosun.com/news/local-n...ge-of-vehicle-in-suspected-gangland-hit/

Interesting tweet by crime reporter Jeremy Grimaldi, based north of Toronto in York Region, and an even more interesting reply by private investigator Derrick Snowdy, whose tweets and images I started posting last November (Ciment also posted a few days later the Luppino family tree that Snowdy tweeted).

https://twitter.com/Journo_Jez/status/1042102813080338432

Jeremy Grimaldi @Journo_Jez
Is murder of #Ancaster's Al Iavarone linked to #Woodbridge murder of Mila Barberi? - https://bit.ly/2QFrf2o @YRP
1:27 PM - Sep 18, 2018

Derrick Snowdy @jdsnowdy
Yes, it’s also linked to 3 other killings at least. It’s understood that the shooters are being brought in from an island country via Montreal.
1:32 PM - Sep 18, 2018

Here is where Pete Edwards stands on Buffalo being active and involved in Canada:



Here is the link: https://peteredwardsauthor.com/2018/09/buffalo-mob-involved-in-deadly-niagara-region-dispute/

I think what is happening is the two Calabrian families along with the Bananno's and Buffalo are taking out the Mustiano's/Rizzuto.

I don't think American LCN are proving the shooters here maybe it's more support.

Also, they have strong ties to the mother land as well and it looks like the
Gambino's maybe trying to pick up some territory while it is up for grabs.

Also it is possible that because of increased Border Patrol and ICE the Mexican Cartels are feeling the pinch

Just maybe the Canada border since Trump became more important.....

Don´t forget what is left of the Cotroni crime family.

I agree,interesting comments by Derrick Snowdy and Grimaldi. This means the attempted murder on Serrano, Sergi shooting and possibly other homicides are presumed linked.

The Cotroni family is still with the Bonanno's. With Lavarone murder, the plotters might be luring Joe out, as Pat Musitano will be too paranoid to come out of hiding.

How many strong are they?
Where are they located?
Montreal?

If you think about it from a logical perspective
At the time of the Violio's bust

L.E. sent out cryptic messages alluding to the fact that Buffalo is still active calling them the Todaro family.

It was just shy.

Mind you this all coming from Canada,
I am thinking C.A.didn't want to put out stories that conflicted with U.S.

So they stopped just shy of doing what they did here recently.

If you look at the announcements from Back then the one thing they did not do is refer to Buffalo as DEFUNCT

Not once

https://globalnews.ca/news/4465120/funeral-held-for-ancaster-homicide-victim/

Funeral held for Ancaster homicide victim

Southern Québec and Ontario, membership is unknown. I read a truce was signed between the Sicilians and Cotronis in 2012, after the release of Vito Rizzuto, with the blessing of Cosa Nostra and 'Ndrangheta.

https://torontosun.com/news/crime/gangland-murders-that-rocked-canadas-underworld

GANGLAND: Murders that rocked Canada's underworld

Adrian Humphreys Tweet
‏
Verified account

@AD_Humphreys
2 minutes ago

A joint police task force has made an arrest in the murders of #HamOnt high-profile mobster Angelo Musitano and York Region's Mila Barberi, as well as the attempted murder of her boyfriend, Saverio Serrano. Details to be released later this morning.

Nicole O'Reilly tweet
‏

@NicoleatTheSpec
18m18 minutes ago
More Nicole O'Reilly Retweeted Hamilton Police
Arrest made in Musitano homicide. Update happening today at 11 @HamiltonPolice

Ontario police make arrest in high-profile gangland murders

https://nationalpost.com/news/canada/ontario-police-make-arrest-in-high-profile-gangland-murders

Police make arrest in mobster Musitano murder

https://www.thespec.com/news-story/8913759-update-police-make-arrest-in-mobster-musitano-murder/

CBC News will allow you to watch this morning's 11:00 am EST press conference live. I'll try to provide one or more links, especially one that will permit those of you outside Canada to watch.

"Hamilton police to announce arrest in murders of mobster Angelo Musitano, Toronto woman"

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/hamilton/musitano-homicide-arrest-1.4831119.

Would like to see a source. There was a meeting in October 2012 in Toronto but no specification about a truce between the Cotronis and Rizzuto let alone a war between them. After this meeting Di Maulo, senior member of the old Cotroni group, was killed. Did the Cotronis sell him out in order for peace? I doubt it. Personally I don't think there was much animosity between the Cotroni and Rizzuto blood families.

Try this link for now:

https://www.cbc.ca/player/play/1325023299884

Jaw-dropping details revealed in the news conference. I'll type up my notes and then post them here. If someone else posts details, I'll make sure not to repeat them when I post.

In the interim:

https://twitter.com/HamiltonPolice/status/1042795518370430976

Hamilton Police
@HamiltonPolice

Hamilton Police Service, @YRP and @RCMPONT announce arrest of Jabril Hassan Abdalla, 27, of #HamOnt for the murders of Angelo Musitano & Mila Barberi. Canada-wide warrants issued for Michael Cudmore, 37 & Daniel Mario Tomassetti, 27. Call 905-546-4167 if you have information.

11:20 AM - 20 Sep 2018

So supposedly Danny Ranieri is dead? Wasn't there a CBC article in June or July saying he was not found amongst the dead there in Mexico? So either they changed their mind or they are jumbling up the facts. The media and investigations throw out all sorts of different and conflicting Information, who the fuck knows what to believe anymore.

Di Maulo murder could also be revenge for the murder of Sal Montagna not the Rizzutos.

My notes:

- Jabril Hassan Abdalla was arrested at home yesterday at around 3:00 pm. He lives in Hamilton and is from Hamilton.

- Michael Cudmore and Daniel Mario Tomassetti are at large. There are Canada-wide warrants for their arrest, and law enforcement here will try to get the warrants endorsed internationally -- Interpol was mentioned.

- The three individuals were involved in different ways in the murder of Angelo Musitano and attempted murder of Saverio "Sam" Serrano (one of Diego Serrano's three sons; you'll recall that the latter attempt, which was botched, resulted in the murder of Saverio's girlfriend, Mila Barberi). One of the three is believed to be the shooter in both murders. All three were likely doing the bidding of higher-ups in an Italian organized-crime group, i.e., the three were not the masterminds. The three engaged in sophisticated surveillance not only of the intended targets but of the intended targets' families. Cudmore, who is believed to be missing (as opposed to at large), is a friend of criminal Daniele "Danny" Ranieri.

- Ranieri was considered to be a person of interest in both murder plots. Were he still alive, he would still be a person of interest. You see, Ranieri, one of the people on which Project Forza was focused in December 2014, was found murdered in a ditch in Cancún, Mexico this past March. He had been bound and gagged. You'll recall that he was an associate of Spanish-born Juan Ramon Fernandez, aka Joe Bravo, who as a well-known associate of Vito Rizzuto, died in a shocking manner in Casteldaccia, just outside of Palermo, when he and friend Fernando Pimentel of Mississauga, Ontario were found burned and shot. You may also reecall that while in Sicily, Fernandez was heard saying in audio surveillance something along the lines of, They better not touch Danny. After Fernandez was murdered, there was speculation that Ranieri would take over the former's "crew" in the Greater Toronto Area, which was considered to have ties to Rizzuto and the Montreal Mafia.

- At some point, Cudmore's family has (had?) been told about Ranieri's murder, and the family, as well as law enforcement, now fears that Cudmore has also been killed in Mexico.

- The recently murdered Al Iavarone knew two of the accused in the Musitano murder. Iavarone also knew a person of interest in the plot to murder Musitano. Iavarone knew Musitano.

- Law enforcement does not yet know whether there is a common motive for the murder of Musitano and the attempted murder of Serrano.

- Apart from the investigations being multi-jurisdictional here in Canada, there was also co-operation with the FBI, DEA, and Department of Homeland Security (which I think had to do with Ranieri's and Cudmore's presence in Mexico). The Mexican authorities have also been assisting.

Don't think this has been posted yet:
Hamilton Spectator Summary of News Conference

cancun mexico is turning into maybe the worst hell hole and mexico. fighting for the turf near the ocean to send us americans the blow. i wouldnt ever go there again. went around 2005 it was safe. the wall is stoping alot of coke from easyly crossing over the boarders. theres miles long patches of 30 foot walls here and there. coke is becoming hard to find in the northeast.

From the Hamilton Police Service's site:

Suspect Arrested in Musitano and Barberi Homicides

http://hamiltonpolice.on.ca/news/suspect-arrested-in-musitano-and-barberi-homicides/

You are correct. Toronto Star reported that Danny Ranieri was not among the dead in July of this year.

Now they are reporting he was killed in March 2018 in Cancun Mexico.

https://toronto.ctvnews.ca/arrest-m...rganized-crime-related-murders-1.4101764

Arrest made, international manhunt underway in organized crime-related murders

"In March of this year, Ranieri’s body was found bound in a ditch in Cancun."

Police say Ranieri was handed the reins to run Rizzuto’s GTA operations after the April 2013 murder of Juan Ramon Fernandez, who lived in Mississauga under the name “Joey Bravo.”

If Ranieri was a person of interest in the murder of Musitano, does this mean the Musitano crime group was no longer allied with Vito Rizzuto and the Montreal Mafia? When did the alliance break?

Former Hamilton Police Service undercover officer Paul Manning seems to have known who was involved in Musitano's murder, as well as what happened to some of the the suspects in Mexico earlier this year. Go to https://twitter.com/markalanwhittle/status/982649393269522432 -- a tweet from April 7, 2018 -- and follow the thread, including replies.

^^^^
Paul Manning made a post on a news website today -- you can see his tweet there. Last April, he essentially knew that Ranieri was killed the month before, as was Cudmore.

https://www.exaronews.com/arrest-made-in-2017-shootings-of-angelo-musitano-and-mila-barberi

Here's a link to video of this morning's news conference:

https://www.facebook.com/CHCHTelevision/videos/468701450297029/

If you don't want to view the video on Facebook, go to https://www.chch.com/arrest-made-2017-homicides-angelo-musitano-mila-barberi/ and tap/click on the video below the sixth paragraph.

I saw that... It seems Paul Manning knows what he's talking about. Some have questioned his knowledge on some other boards. Definitely lends credibility to what he told Pete Edwards about Buffalo in the article earlier this week.

Arrests made in Mila Barberi, Angelo Musitano mob-hit murders

https://www.yorkregion.com/news-sto...-barberi-angelo-musitano-mob-hit-murders

A Twitter user -- he and I follow each other -- speculated about the two crime groups that are at odds with each other. See https://twitter.com/donhanzel/status/1042814455715905536.

I think he's arguing that Domenico and Giuseppe Violi lost their backing from individuals in Buffalo because the Violis attended the Bonanno induction ceremony.

Holy Crap this is getting good!

I asked myself the same question about Musitano's no longer being allied with the Rizzuto's and another question also came to mind about the Cuntrera's they were also being targeted in the GTA. Is the Ruzzuto clan targeting them also for doing business with the Calabrians?

https://canoe.com/news/crime/mobs-g...wcm/04e98f8c-04ea-4035-918a-1ea53b505345

MOB'S GREATEST HITS: Timeline of GTA gangland rubouts

Not sure what that has to do with the murder of Angelo Musitano. Who is saying the Violis lost the backing of Buffalo? If anything, the Luppino-Violis as possible remaining Buffalo family members are enacting revenge for the murder of Papalia. That would make a lot more sense to me. Crazy to think the Musitanos are now allied with Buffalo members against the Violis.

I think Giacomo Vicari indicated Buffalo ordered the Pops hit in 97... thought it was strange... but who knows nowadays. Maybe he was right.

This quote is also interesting.

It seems the truth is coming out to an extent about a bunch of stuff. Goes to show you how skewed alot of information is.

I agree, but the hit on the son of Diego Serrano and the girlfriend?

He's full of shit. Outed as a liar long time ago.

May be unrelated. These guys are hired hoodlums who probably do hits for anyone who pays the right amount of money.

The Twitter user knew of Peter Edwards' article about Iavarone's murder in which Edwards wrote about two organized-crime groups in conflict with each other. At this morning's press conference about the Musitano and Barberi murders, Sgt. Peter Thom spoke of two such groups without identifying them (was he talking about the same groups that Edwards wrote about?). The Twitter user doesn't advertise himself as any type of expert--neither do you nor I--so he has an opinion that is just as valid as mine or yours, which is that Violi's sons--regardless of whatever made status or associate status or family affiliation they have--were present at a Bonanno induction ceremony. What the fuck were they doing there? Are they Bonannos? Was the ceremony a joint Buffalo–Bonanno ceremony? If Violi's sons are 'ndrangheta members, did they once belong to a clan headed by their paternal grandfather in Parma, Ohio?

We don't have any evidence that the Luppino-Violi group consists of made members of the Buffalo Family--if they are, would that pad the total number of Buffalo Family members by two? by 15? Why do most posters on this organized-crime forum assume that the Luppinos and Violi's sons have historically been 'ndrangheta members? We don't have any evidence of their making ceremonies in an American LCN family, so we assume that the Luppino-Violi group is an 'ndrangheta group--I'm kind of okay with that because that's what I've believed forever but I would feel even better knowing that this could be confirmed or disconfirmed. And the presence of Violi's sons at the Bonanno ceremony possibly casts doubt on what crime group they have been made into.

Why should the Luppino-Violi group take it upon itself to avenge Papalia's murder 20 years later? Wouldn't Papalia's relatives have taken care of that? Papalia got along with Giacomo Luppino, but the history of the Hamilton underworld is littered with conflict between the three main groups (Luppino, Musitano, and Papalia). Hell, Papalia and the Musitanos both have ancestry from Delianuova in Calabria, and Pat and Angelo were behind the plot to murder Papalia, who incidentally was Pat's baptismal godfather.

Edwards's article about Iavarone's murder is interesting because the story mentioned that people behind Angelo Musitano's murder weren't made, thus making them vulnerable to attack by the opposing group that consists of made members. If the article is correct, then we can rule out the Musitano group and Luppino-Violi group being on the outs. If it's not correct, I would stick to what I believe, which is that the Musitano group and the Luppino-Violi group are still on good terms after many years (this was definitely not the case in the 1990s).

Peter Edwards's latest article:

Hamilton man arrested in 2 mob-related slayings

https://www.thestar.com/news/gta/20...o-murder-police-hunt-for-two-others.html

Thanks anti.

Diego Serrano the father was also close to the killed Carmine Verducci.

Maybe Buffalo is just a Crime Syndicate like Sergi’s article suggested....

Another article by Nicole O'Reilly of the Hamilton Spectator. A good timeline accompanies her story.

Hamilton man arrested in mobster Musitano murder, police hunt for two others

https://www.thespec.com/news-story/...sitano-murder-police-hunt-for-two-others

Siderno group?

Adrian Humphreys has updated his article from earlier today:

Ontario police make arrest in high-profile gangland murders linked to Mafia 'power struggle'

http://nationalpost.com/wcm/e812bfb6-1470-47c3-8251-10480de2ae44

The Canadian gangsters stll love Mexico, Moreno Gallo was killed in Acapulco.

Another way of looking at what is going on in the Greater Toronto and Hamilton Area (GTHA) is that the murders, attempted murders, firebombings, arson, etc. have nothing to do with Quebec OC or Buffalo OC.

Two of James Dubro's Facebook posts from today are reproduced below. Knowing you, you may end up crying in your stamppot by the time you're done.

https://www.facebook.com/jamesabookguy/posts/10156537356735330

Same hit man team for Angelo Musitano killing and second but botched mob hit in Woodbridge last year. Possibly also part of hit team for last week’s Ancaster related prof hit of Albert Iavarone who knew two of the hit team. This is a big story of a major very deadly Calabrian mob Cell fight for coke territory and power in GTA/southern Ontario. Many ndrangheta cells in GTA and Italy involved in violent fight Now from Musitanos to Verducci to Ursino to other Calabrian Mafia cells here close to Italy including Vaughan/Mexico/ Italy Coke king Diego Serrano’s associate’s here and in the USA Italy and Mexico. And if course there was the recent double murder of Calabrian mob boss Cosimo Commisso’s cousin with his girlfriend in Toronto . Much more to come of this story which is far from finished

https://www.facebook.com/jamesabookguy/posts/10156537990985330

Major deadly GTA Calabrian Mafia war is now on as further indicated by cop arrest today of 1 of 3 of from one GTA mob hit team involved . Cops link last wks Iavrone murder in Hamilton with mafioso Musitano’s murder on Waterdown & Barberi(well connected Vaughan mobster Diego Serrano’s son was real target hit) killing in Vaughan last year there was also the recent double murder of longtime Calabrian mob Cosimo Commisso’s cousin with his girlfriend. This is a very big development involving at least 3/4 Ndrangheta cells in GTA (ties to Italy USA Mexico) vying for coke routes & more GTA Calabrian mob power. Old time Calabrian Cell leaders against newer Ndrangheta cells bosses with even better connections in their native Italy.

Stampot lol. There is also the link between the Ursinos and the Gambinos.

Dark Danny was already dead around Feb. 3.

https://www.caledonenterprise.com/n...ter-daniele-ranieri-confirmed-dead-rcmp/

People were saying he was dead since December, so who knows what's even true.
https://www.thestar.com/news/gta/20...nd-in-mexico-canadian-official-says.html

I just read through all the posts

I.am confused seems like more questions than answers

??? So the latest is:

1) Arrested and 2) At Large

The person or people are Rizzuto members?

So thats weird that the violis went to the bonanno guys induction but it wasnt not burning saint card prick your finger gun on table shit. I think it was a lunch at a restaurant probaly over discussion of drug deals. Think joe bonanno said in his book bosses from other familys were at his sons induction ceromony in 1955 or whenever. I never heard any other won. Ray patriarca made all the scibelli brothers and a handfull of other guys in 1956 in worcester and imediatly transderd them to the genovese family . Its in a fbi report that was weird but he was doing it as a favor to genovese. Basically he was the sit in boss

The other italian guy Tomassetti is probably also dead.

The fugitves joined Ranieri in Mexico and he took over Rizzuto’s GTA operations in 2013.

Daniel Ranieri is a Rizzuto henchmen that looked after his interests in the GTA killed in Mexico.

His two predecessors Juan Ramon Fernandez & associate Fernando Pimentel were both killed in Sicily and Gaetano Panepinto killed by Calabrians in Toronto.

It is not a job I would like to have......LOL

https://torontosun.com/news/crime/mcmafia-gta-gangland-murders-linked-to-mob-world-war

McMAFIA: GTA gangland murders linked to mob world war

"Cops believe Ranieri’s demise can be traced to a bloody gang war unfolding in southern Ontario between Calabrese crime clans."

“It’s definitely a Calabrian/’Ndrangheta Mafia War,” well-known mob observer James Dubro told The Toronto Sun. “It’s three or four cells competing for cocaine routes and power in the GTA.

I think looking at Hamilton/Buffalo, etc. through the lens of American LCN groups is incorrect. It's clear what's going on is involving groups that are structured differently than traditional, LCN groups who have a hierarchy structured like a pyramid. These may not be groups operating in a specific territory like the American LCN. I believe these are groups are more like drug trafficking networks and cut across both territories and mafia allegiances.

So, if there is mafia activity in Buffalo in 2018, to look at Buffalo as structured like a traditional LCN family may be wrong. We don't know if mobsters there include a mix of Todaro, Ndrangheta from Calabria, and Calabrians from Hamilton's families like Violis. Or the made guys flying the Todaro flag may be Canadians aligned with the Violis who were made in Buffalo. When they say "Hamilton answers to Buffalo", we don't really know the full extent of what that means yet: Who in Buffalo? Hamilton gangsters under the Todaro/Buffalo flag or Italian-American made guys in Buffalo?

Same thing with Hamilton: Hamilton seems to have 2 or 3 groups fighting for power right now, but there could also be Bonannos and Gambinos in the area (associates or members) working with some of the groups there.

With busts in New York lately we've seen connections of the Ndrangheta working with the Gambinos, so it's likely there's a decent amount of collaboration for drug trafficking. Which is why we've had reports of Bonannos doing making ceremonies in Canada. When drugs are involved, it's not really about controlling a territory so much as about making connections in several different places and groups in order to facilitate the drug shipments. Cabrini has discussed this several times before, especially when discussing the Partinico faction in Detroit from back in the day (also known as the lower Sicilian group). Similar to how the Cherry Hill Gambinos crew had made guys in both the US Gambino Family and in the families in Sicily.

What were seeing is a continuation of the huge power shift away from the Sicilian Mafia and toward the Ndrangheta. Now with the Rizzuto's weakened (but not completely defeated) in Montreal, their allies in Hamilton.. the Musitanos... are under attack. Even though the Musitanos are Calabrian with connections back to the old country, there's obviously other Ndrangheta groups trying to take control of Toronto and Hamilton seems to be a proxy for the war in Toronto.

From that article that was just posted:

This would definitely make sense of what Anna Sergi wrote when she suggested The Todaro "Syndicate" used to be aligned with LCN.

it seems that who ordered the musitano hit are people connected to the rizzuto's, ndrangheta doens't seem to be involved

WOW
This is tangled

Very confusing

Honestly the American LCN seems way more functional here

This is why Luciano did what he did

Everybody is just killing everybody here

You can't even keep track

that isnt organized crime. crazy cartel cocaine cowboy shit. atleast all the fake rules in the american lcn (no drug dealing) is what has kinda kept them afloat over the last 50yrs. rizzuto should have stayed away from drugs it killed his whole family son dad cousins ect.

It's not so simple. You may be right but you are just going with your first instincts.

If you look at the cases of some of the well-known murders of Canadian mafiosi over many decades--regardless of whether they were made into the American La Cosa Nostra, 'ndrangheta, or Sicilian Cosa Nostra--you would be surprised at who were people of interest but never charged. You would be surprised at who were not people of interest but who were communicating with other mafiosi before and after the murders.

Ranieri was only a person of interest in the plots to murder Musitano and Saverio Serrano. Law enforcement knows that the hit-team members used in the Musitano murder were ordered by a higher-up in a criminal organization that is part of traditional organized crime (i.e., Italian mafia). For your theory to be correct, the person who ordered Angelo Musitano's murder was a made member in the Montreal Mafia or part of a group tied to the Montreal Mafia--don't forget that Angelo was very likely made (although we don't have any concrete evidence). Peter Edwards's article about Iavarone's murder indicates that of two groups in conflict with each other--a reason given for Iavarone's murder--one group consisted of people who were not made.

Ranieri, who supposedly took over Juan Ramon Fernandez's job in Ontario at some point after Fernandez was killed in 2012, was not made. Fernandez claimed in Sicily that he was made by Vito Rizzuto, but this has never been substantiated and likely never will be. (In Joe Di Maulo's daughter's book that was published in January of this year, she writes of Fernandez's claim and confidently dismisses it--she knows you have to be Italian to be inducted into the mafia.) Fernandez's predecessor in Ontario, Gaetano Panepinto, was not made (there was just a rumour he was, but it was never substantiated).

One theory about the murder of Albert Iavarone was that the killing was revenge for the murder of Angelo Musitano. I think Iavarone belonged to a group that consisted of criminal associates who were not made--but even if this opinion is right, who knows whether this group in turn is tied to an actual mafia group whose leader ordered Musitano's murder?

There have been many theories as to why Musitano was killed, not just the few that are reported in newspaper articles. Here's the list I've been compiling since his murder (in no order of which theory I favour):

1. Revenge for plotting the murders of John Papalia and Carm Barillaro (mobwatchers neglect to mention the latter's death).

2. A newer 'ndrangheta cell from Italy that, at some point before Angelo Musitano's murder last year, seems to have established itself in Hamilton in order to possibly wrest drug territory from the Musitano crime group. (James Dubro's theory)

3. Mostly Calabrian organized-crime groups, including the Siderno Group, violently fighting over profits and territory in the medical-marijuana industry in the Greater Toronto Area (GTA) or the Greater Toronto and Hamilton Area (GTHA). The 'ndrine in the Siderno Group could be fighting with one another--Carmine Verduci's murder might be an example of this.

4. The same type of jockeying for control of cocaine trafficking--in particular as a result of the aforementioned 'ndrangheta cell from Italy that could be encroaching on the Musitanos' territory.

5. A pre-emptive strike by hitman Ken Murdock, hired by the Musitanos to kill both Papalia and Barillaro and successful in his attempts, who might have been worried after his release about retribution by the Musitano brothers.

6. A joint effort by the Wolf Pack and Rizzuto loyalists in Montreal to push their way into the Niagara Region, having already possibly made an incursion into the GTA.

7. An all-out war, over a number of rackets in southwestern Ontario, involving 'mostly ndrangheta groups and/or Calabrian-Canadian crime groups, with the 'ndrangheta internal war in the GTA somehow spilling over into the Hamilton area.

8. Rivalry between the Musitano crime group and the Luppino-Violi group, which might have intensified after Domenico and Giuseppe Violi were sentenced and imprisoned.

9. A kill-or-be-killed scenario in which the Iavarone group decided it had to kill Angelo Musitano because a member of the group owed Angelo a large gambling debt and was being squeezed by Angelo for a stake in the group's gambling activities. (A still very credible theory as to why Pat and Angelo Musitano arranged to have Papalia killed is the large gambling debt Pat owed Johnny.)

Great summary...

Edwards article said: "Prior to his death, Musitano was owed money from a man involved in gambling who worked for New York State mobsters, a source said." Assuming NYS mobsters is another term for Buffalo Mob in this article---like it seems to me---Did Iavarone's group work for Buffalo mob which was running this gambling ring?

Let's quote more extensively from Edwards's article:

Some of Iavarone’s underworld ties were south of the border, sources said.

“The recently deceased had ties to New York,” a former police investigator said.

“Buffalo factions of Traditional Organized Crime are not ‘in’ Canada per se, but historically have controlled aspects of Canadian ‘family business’ and do get kickbacks from profits from illicit activity,” Manning said.

Prior to his death, Musitano was owed money from a man involved in gambling who worked for New York State mobsters, a source said.

When he demanded payment or a piece of the gambling operation, he was murdered by a crew of Niagara Region men connected to the gambler, the sources said.

None of the men involved in the Angelo Musitano murder were actual mob members, leaving them vulnerable to retaliation, the source said.

They have already been cut astray by the New York mob, a police source said.

“They have no backing,” the source said.
_______________

Did Iavarone have ties to numerous criminals in the US? only to the Italian underworld in the US? only to the Buffalo underworld? only to a New York City mafia family?

Was the former police investigator being precise when he said Iavarone "had ties to New York"? Or was the source being careful not to mention Buffalo by generally saying "New York" so as to refer to the whole state?

Is Albert Iavarone the gambler who worked for New York State mobsters? Was he related to the gambler? Were the two of them part of the same crime group?

We now know the names of three individuals charged in the murder of Angelo Musitano. Were these three the ones who were cut astray by the New York mob? by mobsters in Buffalo? Were these three individuals in the same crime group as Iavarone? Did Iavarone lose backing by the New York mob? by mobsters in Buffalo?

Something else to think about. Daniel Ranieri went to Mexico believing his Mexican connections would keep him safe. Was he betrayed or did some powerful crime organization persuade the Mexicans to have him killed.
Things have become complicated in Ontario and if the theory of 3 to 4 Ndrangheta clans warring is true. Then maybe one way to analyse this is to look at who has been victimized, shot at, or killed and try to find out what clan did they belong to. This will give you the names of some of the clans involved. Some of them are obvious.

The cells answer to the locale .

Yeah, so complicated. I definitely have bias in the Buffalo direction, so I'm going to read that into the article. That is why I love these sites to keep me thinking about things form multiple angles. When I'm not in "Buffalo Mode" I keep coming back to the "Todaro Syndicate" idea but forth by Sergi,... Is this something like the East Coast LCN Enterprise that Merlino got caught up in? Is this going to become the norm? Is this why Sergi said Buffalo is no long LCN?

This is pretty spot on, when you think of Canadian organized crime, it's very diverse in comparison to the US. People need to understand that Mafia business in Canada is dangerous because you have actual families who have ties back to Italy that are fighting to control the drug market. Laws in Canada are a joke so these guys operate with little pressure and killing is a whole lot easier north of the border, so it's often used to eliminate competition. The US families on the other hand cannot operate with such freedom, that's why mob wars are not as common in the US these days. The thing to keep in mind is the US is a huge drug market, and the Canadians are fighting to control the trade and also keeping connections with the families down the US to distribute. That's why you hear about the Gambinos doing business with Calabrian mobsters in Toronto, and it's also the reason why Canadian mobsters in general keep contact with US mobsters, the two sides need one another.

Seeing all this chaos, one must respect how smart and powerful Vito Rizzuto was, when he was around and in power, he kept the region quiet for most part and everyone operated for a very long time. I wonder if we will ever see a powerful figure rise up again to take control.

I even think the US mafia's structure has changed in the last decades.

I gotta say, this is the best thread I've read in a LOOONG ass time, great job everyone!

Great discussion, no bullshit, all facts and educated opinions, everything sourced, this is how it should be.

I'll say something else, I've been on black hand forum, and you guys over here have a MUCH BETTER HANDLE of the topic than the guys over there. Despite having really great researchers, and all the shit talking they do, they are just kinda clueless here. It's like a tyranny of a minority...

Big respect to anti mafia, Hollander, and ciment. Consistently on the money with all things Canada, and international OC....

@ BronaZora @ Stubbs

I saw you guys post and my brain immediately stopped hurting, lol!! Y'all voiced everything I've felt and think about the situation, that I've been unsuccessfully babbling about for about three years, carry on fellas, this fuckin thread made my day!!!

@ Bensonhurst

VERY SAVVY on noticing how the cops were handling the press conferences, and their careful references. I took it like that too, that they didn't want to embarrass the FBI.

And all this talk of how the fed would know more, well the fed are WORKING WITH THESE GUYS, and they didn't refute shit. That should speak volumes....

Nickel can attest, you can't even really talk about this over there.....

drakes behind it all.......

https://www.chch.com/new-details-ma...ium=twitter&utm_source=socialnetwork

New details about the man arrested in connection with the murder of mobster Angelo Musitano.

"Dubro’s mob contacts say Iavarone’s brother is thought to have played a role in Musitano’s murder."

Wow, it just keeps getting more interesting.

A brother for a brother then. To be continued...

T

That is a good way to describe it.

https://torontosun.com/news/crime/crime-hunter-dont-give-mafia-last-rites-just-yet

CRIME HUNTER: Don't give Mafia last rites just yet

Police have repeatedly alluded to a power struggle among the established Calabrese clans in the GTA and newer ‘Ndràngheta upstarts.

“Many ‘Ndrangheta cells in GTA and Italy are involved in a violent fight,” Dubro said.

“This is a big story of a major and very deadly Calabrian mob fight for coke territory and power in GTA/southern Ontario.”

Dubro adds that it’s all connected. He suggested an Iavarone relative may have pulled the trigger on Ang Musitano and it’s payback on drugs and a personal beef.

“There’s lots of moving parts in this mob war — a complex cast of characters from the GTA, Italy, USA, Mexico and Canada.”

Author and former RCMP analyst Pierre de Champlain said a possibility is that international Italian Mafia organizations such as Sicilian Cosa Nostra and 'Ndrangheta are fighting from abroad to get control over Canada's mafia in order to gain control over drug trafficking.

I'd like to learn more about this. Can yo point me the right direction?

It was just a comment on his twitter account.

https://twitter.com/PdeChamplain/status/1042900011024101378

The piece says: "We were a little too quick on the trigger to give traditional organized crime its last rites." "Are we returning to the bad, bloody days of the Mafia"--with a picture of mob hit in upstate NY from 1970. ...“There’s lots of moving parts in this mob war — a complex cast of characters from the GTA, Italy, USA, Mexico and Canada.”...Dead? ...Not by a long shot."

Is the author of this article suggesting the Mob may be behind the Farm Massacre in 2016?

Are we being told the Mob across all its organizations and regions of operations is much more powerful than LE and Journalists had given credit? Or just a little hyperbole to sell copy?

What do you all think? ... Have we not given enough attention to OC? Has it come back with a vengeance not just in Canada, but the US and Southern Italy and Sicily? Anyone hearing rumblings? Anyone else?

I believe the massacre to be a separate article.

It is very hard to get in the mind of the person that wrote the article because frequently journalists are not specific enough.
I think he got a little overzealous because of the warring going on in Canada. Back in the 70's there wasn't a heavy presence of the Ndrangheta that it now commands. By this mere fact it is changing the dynamics among OC groups and interrelations between countries such as Italy, Canada and the USA. I do not think the warring will spill over to the US. The Ndrangheta prefer working with existing OC rather than warring with them. A good example is the Gambino family and other NY families already doing business with the Ndrangheta.

The problem you have in Ontario is two fold. Firstly, the war between the Sicilians and Calabrians in Montreal has spilled over to Ontario. Please note that there are some Calabrians also fighting along side with the Sicilians as well. I chose to use Sicilians vs Calabrians to ease my depiction of the situation but there are other Italians who are neither and non Italians that are also part of the feud.

and Secondly, according to the news media, there is warring between some of the Ndrangheta clans in Ontario.

Many journalist give us little hints here and there but for the most part we have to figure things out on our own; it is for this reason that I do not profess to know it all and what I have just explained is my opinion and there may be others that may see things differently. I am open minded to learning new theories or opinions.

Wait a second, haven't the actual people directly involved in the Musitano murder been named now, with Cudmore believed to have pulled the trigger? How is he related to Lavarone? I believe they only suggested that his brother was somehow involved but not part of the actual hit squad?

Contrary to the past I'm not that informed about all these details, and there's lots of them this time (which is quite unusual). I guess too much leaked out and they reacted like this in order to keep control over the situation.

Thank you

No, Iavarone was not part of the hit squad, unlike American mobsters, Canadian mobsters rarely do the hits themselves, they always go through layers so it does not trace back to them. In fact theres a good chance that Iavarone was nothing more than an associate and not an actual made guy himself, he or his sibling may have been the one that hired this hit squad for the actual mobsters (Possibly the Luppinos/Violis/Pappalias).

Al Iavarone worked in the same real estate firm as a person by the name of Giacomo Luppino. Not sure if this specific Luppino is involved in OC or just related, but it's most likely an indication that Iavarone was connected with the Luppinos.

they are more than my first instincts, we have the names of people involved, and are all close to daniele ranieri who is a rizzuto's man in ontario

Yes, there are elements to these articles that are being fed to the public that does not seem to make sense.

Cudmore supposedly is working for Ranieri who in turn works for the Rizzuto's. The Musitano's were said to be allied with the Rizzuto's. Then why are they fighting each other ?
Furthermore, the Iavarone's seem to have ties to the Luppino/Violi clan then how is it possible that Lavarone and Cudmore, who are supposedly enemies, both be involved in Angelo Musitano's murder ? Did some of them switch sides ? There are many unanswered questions.

maybe ranieri crew wanted to expand and take over musitano's racket, it seems that rizzuto men seem to want to expand in ontario, like francesco del balso did

The hit on Musitano had nothing to do with the Rizzuto family, with all the trouble they're dealing with in Montreal, the last thing they want to do is take out their allies.

The hit squad that took out Ang Musitano are just hired guns, that's it, even if they have ties to Ranieri, they did it for the money and possibly one of them was connected to the person giving them the contract.

Do you guys remember that Sopranos episode where Tony tells Chrisy that they needed to take out Carmine Lupertazzi Sr and Tony asked him to arrange it? Who did Chris go to? A bunch of black thugs. Something similar in nature happened here.

With Ranieri dead since March and no one to replace him then I can see your theory plausible.

They should hire you to plan hits.........LOL

ranieri was a major rizzuto man in ontario and the men wanted for musitano hit are very close to him, yes they are hired guns but somebody ordered the hit and he was probably a man who belongs to rizzuto clan

If Ranieri was Fernadez' right-hand man and friend then I'm not so sure how close and loyal he would still be to the Rizzuto group since Fernandez became persona non grata to Vito for refusing to join his side. I wouldn't be suprised if the Ranieri murder would be connected to Fernandez. Based on the facts at hand I don't see the Rizzuto group having much to do with the Angelo Musitano murder. If they had a beef with the Musitanos they probably would've gone for Pat Musitano instead. Rival mafiosi usually want to cut of the head of the snake right away to end things right there. The owed money/gambling situation seems a more logical theory. Not to mention the statement that New York mobsters connected to the killers washed their hands of them, meaning that it was unsanctioned.

If you look at Montreal, you could see that there were a lot of political manoeuvres before a high-level killing. First Sal Montagna's lobbying before the Rizzuto guys were killed, then the meeting in Toronto followed by Joe Di Maulo's murder and a subsequent killing spree of Rizzuto enemies.

WOW first mafia "WORLD WAR"
Has not really dragged in American LCN however, looks like that might change...

what american family have stuff going on in canada ?
the gambino's ? and the bonanno's right ?
you guys think that there is any chance that they might join in ??

According to Edwards these guys have stuff in Canada and have already joined in:Buffalo Playing a Role

Also Detroit In Windsor, apparently run by Tony Palozzolo.

so if that's true then we really have a big war !
why would the american lcn will want anything to do with that crazy beef over there ?

I think it is mostly about control of drug trafficking routes, and maybe a couple of beefs between clans in Hamilton that may have ties to Buffalo.

I have a hard time believing that the hit came from the Rizzuto family for the following reasons:

- It makes no sense for the Rizzutos to be hitting their own allies when they need all the help they can get.
- We don't know what kind of relationship the hit squad had with Ranieri, furthermore, Ranieri has been out of the GTA for years and we don't know what his standing was with the Rizzuto family at the time of his death.
- It makes more sense that the hit came from Musitano rivals such as the Luppinos or Pappalias because there's historical beef and competition for the city of Hamilton.
- The murder of Al Iavarone and the way it was done (In his own home) seems to be a message sent, this is a payback for Angelo Musitano, and Al Iavarone is definitely connected in some way to the Luppino family, which possibly indicates that the murder of Ang came from this camp.



I doubt this kind of war will ever spill over the US. American LE would rain a storm on these guys like they've never seen before.

While US mobsters don't have the freedom to operate like they used to, they are lucky that they don't have to worry about the kind of hits Canadian mobsters have to deal with.

Ciment posted this Crime Hunter article: Don’t read mafia last rights just yet

That article said:



Now compare that story to the previous one about Buffalo in May 2018 called: Buffalo Blues: Last rites for mob in queen city

Very similar titles: Seems like the author may be recanting his original story about Buffalo (even though it refers to mob worldwide as well) after Edwards recent piece. Is this article being referred to when Edwards wrote: “The mob in Buffalo isn’t dead, despite some media reports.”?

Luccheses apparantly too.

Even though I agree with you on this matter (the Musitano murder) I think this reasoning can be disputed. With the release of Mirarchi, Scoppa and Arcadi a resurgence of violence was a realistic expectation but it didn't happen. Instead it has been quiet in Montreal for quite enough time now to think that there is a truce between the factions, and so it remains to be seen whether the Rizzutos still need all the help they can get. And other then assumptions we don't know the actual status of the old Rizzuto group. Oldtimers have been killed on both sides and younger members simply step in to fill the void. Also, so much has changed over the years with new alliances, double, triple or even quadruple crossings, that the once thought alliance between the Musitanos and Rizzutos may very well be outdated let alone a remaining business relationship.

@Hollander

couple things,



1. Where'd you here about Windsor and Palazzolo? I've honestly been wondering about the Widsor crew/ territory for the longest time......

2. The Cotroni -Rizzuto truce.... any chance it's something I could look up or read? Any links? Sounds like a fascinating gbc read..

3. Any info on the Luchesses in Canada?

@Sonny

you make some good points...

This thing is a lot like the Godfather.." See, all our people are businessmen, their loyalty is based on that..".


(Not to the Bonnano " Family", or anything like that... now if an association with the Bonnanos gets them paid... they will placate the situation. This is what Montagna apparently couldn't figure out... They backed him because they thought letting him take out the Rizzutos would increase THEIR OWN SHARE of the Montreal rackets. Then he tried to play the big boss, got greedy, and quickly got wacked... )

I think Vito had the kind of magnetic charisma, combined with his pedigree and contacts to impose a kind of benevolent hegemony, these other guys dont have that level of respect yet. So any alliance is going to be a temporary matter of convienence.

Unless a long term business arrangement is made.

Look at the Calabrians fucking members of the Wolfpack out of their payment. That was colossally stupid. As long as they had a supply source, they could have stolen them from the Rizzutos. They pushed them into Montreals orbit, with the same type of arrogant stupidity Montagna showed...

Cabrini I get back on your second question. According to Scott Burnstein the American mafia in neighboring Detroit has always controlled the racket territory in Windsor dating back to the Prohibition Era. Law enforcement in Michigan has long viewed reputed Detroit mafia consigliere Anthony (Tony Pal) Palazzolo as the man tasks with looking after its affairs in Canada. It´s a valuable region with relatively a lot of crime.

In getting back to CabriniGreen about a so-called Cotroni-Rizzuto truce, please don't bother trying to spread more misinformation on this board about Canadian organized-crime groups than you already do. You don't have any sources to support your claim in another page on this thread that there are Cotronis operating in Ontario. By also claiming that the membership of the Cotronis is unknown, you're trying to get posters on the board to believe that Cotronis were lurking in the shadows during the turbulent and quiet times in the Montreal mob war, that Cotronis were biding their time to take over the Montreal Mafia, that Cotronis were the main opposition to Rizzuto loyalists, that Cotronis were calling the shots, etc.

Frank Cotroni Jr. is likely the only Cotroni alive in all of Canada who is a made member of the Montreal Mafia or any other Italian crime group for that matter. If someone were to ask me for evidence of his made status, even I would have to cite circumstantial evidence that may not even be considered that strong. Read Maria Mourani's book about Milena Di Maulo from earlier this year, Milena Di Maulo : fille et femme de mafiosi, to discover how Frank Cotroni Sr.'s family, as well as Di Maulo's, actually had and have a very strong French-Canadian flavour because of who Cotroni Sr. and Di Maulo married. Read that book as well to find out how inactive Cotroni Sr.'s son Michel has been over the decades, despite being seen meeting with Domenico Violi at the Linguini restaurant in Baie-D’Urfé in October 2016 (that's the restaurant that got burned down two months after the meeting of Violis and Cotronis).

In his 2016 book, Cellule 8002 vs mafia, Daniel Renaud has simplified charts of the "Sicilian" and "Calabrian" factions of the Montreal Mafia as they stood in 2004. Giuseppe "Joe" Di Maulo is at the head of the Calabrian faction. (His daughter's book confirms that he was born in Montorio dei Frentani, in Campobasso, Molise--to be clear, Di Maulo was not Calabrian). In the Calabrian chart, under Di Maulo, are Moreno Gallo, Antonio Vanelli, and Raynald Desjarding--Renaud considers the first two to be made. Under Gallo is Antonio Mucci, also considered made. Under Desjardins is Giovanni Bertolo, and under Bertolo is Vittorio Mirarchi--none of these three is considered made. Not a single Cotroni to be seen anywhere in this chart.

If a whole bunch of Cotroni sons and other Cotroni male relatives were made after Frank Sr.'s death in 2004, into which family were they made exactly? Why don't any of these Cotronis figure in books about the Montreal Mafia by Lamothe and Humphreys, Cédilot and Noël, and Edwards and Nicaso, the earliest being published in 2006? You've previously speculated that the Cotronis were 'ndrangheta members but without providing any proof whatsoever. Frank Sr. didn't speak any Italian at all, and you expect his sons and male relatives to have picked it up along the way?

I could see Domenico and Giuseppe Violi inducting guys like the Cotronis into their crime group, but would this group be a Luppino-Violi 'ndrina or an American La Cosa Nostra crew, i.e., a Bonanno crew? Same with Mirarchi being possibly recruited by the Commisso crime group in the GTA, as we don't yet have evidence of Mirarchi being made, despite the claims he is a candidate for godfather of the Montreal Mafia. Incidentally, I have the same doubts about Stefano Sollecito and Leonardo Rizzuto's made status--what evidence is there of that? If Vito Rizzuto reportedly respected Andrew Scoppa--see yesterday's news article posted in this thread--I have a much easier time believing Scoppa is made, although I don't quite understand what it means to be an independent man of honour, as Renaud has previously put it (in French of course) in older articles about Scoppa.

And if posters are going to argue that surviving members of the old Cotroni-Violi group like Vanelli, Mucci, and Volpato are still planning to make a move to take over the Montreal Mafia, please explain to me what exactly they have been waiting for during the past nine years of the mob war. Or why they went to the funeral services for Vito Rizzuto's mother in February of this year.

The death of Frank Cotroni was the end of the Cotroni family as such. They have since become part of the Rizzuto family, but remaining the Calabrian faction of the organization. With Cotronis I mean those guys Cotroni is just the name we use like Bonanno.

I'd be interested in your reasoning (circumstantial evidence) of Frank Jr's possible made member status. You don't believe that the elder brother, Nicodemo, is a made member? It seems like Frank Jr., not necessarily because of the name, was Frank Sr.'s favorite. Marrying Joe Di Maulo' s daughter would've helped too. I agree that he is a possible made member due to his activity in the mob going back to the early 80s and the facts of being the son and son-in-law of two of the Montreal Mafia's most prominent members. I think it's pretty cool that Di Maulo's daughter wrote that book but so far I haven't found time to learn French...



Are these the exact specifics of this particular chart? Could you also provide the specifics of the Sicilian faction or is it just a repeat of a chart already made public (the six leaders)? Is Scoppa also included on the Calabrian chart? Poster eurodave mentioned that Renaud states in his book that the Scoppas were connected to Gallo. In any case, the chart is pretty similar to the one I made years ago.



Mostly logical and circumstantial evidence such as being named as the leaders of the Montreal Mafia. I suspect that at this point they had become their own group (my hypothesis is that the 2012 Toronto meeting may have established Vito as leader of his own group so he could restore order after the Montagna fiasco). Also, there was an article in 2014 about Stefano Sollecito's birthday party, attended by higher-ups, which apparantly also served to celebrate his recent made member status. This again leads me to believe that they were capable of inducting their own members, probably with approval from New York, because being made doesn't mean anything if there's no recognition.

Have they been brought into this as of yet?

I guess they have their own separate pipeline?
From Italy to Canada to Detroit

Otherwise they would gotten dragged in somehow the Canada crew anyhow.

Nickle, regarding the part I put in bold:

With all due respect, I would say that you are reaching with that one. I did not see the word 'Buffalo' in that article once. Nor anything relating to Western New York, unless you count the unspecified ties that Iavarone allegedly had with Buffalo. I can see how you came to that conclusion that the author may be backtracking on his story, so I completely get your point of view, but it's dubious whether the author was recanting his original story or not.
As far as I can tell, that article (the Cochrane Times one) was one of many written about the Mafia in 2018 reacting to Gene Gotti's release, and it smartly tied in the developments north of the border too. That's my personal opinion, based on comparing the two articles.
Let me know if you disagree.

Here are some interesting articles I have found on the recent Iavarone hit. There is, of course, Peter Edwards' Buffalo one:
https://www.thestar.com/news/crime/...-deadly-ontario-dispute-sources-say.html

And here are some other ones:
https://torontosun.com/news/local-news/suspected-mafia-boss-gunned-down-in-ancaster-report
https://www.thestar.com/news/gta/2018/09/14/hamilton-police-probing-ancaster-homicide.html
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/hamilton/organized-crime-musitano-iavarone-murder-hamilton-1.4825446



If you skim through these articles, I think it becomes pretty evident that the Canadian law enforcement is very far behind the Mafia. They have very little information on the power struggles going on. Here are some quotes from the following articles:
“It is possibly linked to the Angelo Musitano murder,” (Det. Sgt. Peter) Thom said. “Something is going on in the underworld, perhaps a power struggle, and it is something we are wise to.” “I’m not sure that this particular case factors into that, but that’s certainly something that we’re alive to,” Thom said.

Antonio Nicaso, a Mafia expert who teaches courses on organized crime at Queen's University, told CBC News it does appear different groups are vying for power in Ontario and Quebec right now — but it's unclear whether or not this incident is related.
"There is a power struggle. There is violence related to the power vacuum left by the Rizzutos," he said.

In my opinion, the statements made by police and the general vague nature of all of these articles make it hard for me to make a definitive conclusion. And it makes it especially hard for me to accept the Buffalo conclusion by Peter Edwards, which reads - in my opinion - like a fortune teller as opposed to an organized crime report since it seems to me to be intentionally vague and open to interpretation. Most of the quotes in that article by Edwards' sources are very broad one-liners which I don't think can - at this stage - be used to make a conclusion on the subject, especially when you look into other organized crime articles where actual, named police officers and sergeants - not "sources" - say themselves that they're not really sure what's going on.

There is a lot of interpretation when it comes to what's going on in this area, especially with the Iavarone murders. It will be interesting to see what happens with the murder suspects. I can completely understand why one would take Edwards' article as the assurance they need to consider Buffalo an active family.

In a nutshell:
1. Edwards' Buffalo piece does not line up with other police statements and article, which generally concede that the power struggle is largely a mystery.
2. Edwards' Buffalo piece reads like a "fortune teller" report in that no specifics are mentioned and the article is seemingly intentionally vague.
3. Edwards' sources seem to know way, way, way more than the actual cops and investigators on the ground, which I view as a red flag that perhaps the article is not entirely accurate.
4. Edwards' sources conflict with the FBI down in the States, which is - by all accounts - light years ahead of investigative police in Canada.

Let me know if you disagree with the above statements, and why. This is simply my take on the recent articles and information in comparison with one another.

You are definitely right. It is a reach... I just find it very interesting the wording of these these titles are so similar...i.e. “last rites” to Buffalo... “to quick to read last rites” although admittedly the second piece is speaking of the mafia in general. Very well could just be the author's vocabulary and writing style...

Nickey a couple questions...

Why would the FBI know about OC in Hamilton? Or know better than the cops there?

Now I ask bacause I feel their info is, how do I put it, maybe outdated?


I only ask, cause people keep saying it. I'm like , ALL confused, like arnt the FBI and DEA working with these people? And why dont they refute or correct anything then?

I actually took it as maybe they disagree on Buffalo. Maybe that's why in the Violi indictments they said Todaro syndicate, but in this one they are MUCH more conservative and careful with their wording. I took it as them trying not to antagonize or embarrass the FEDs.


There has to be extensive cooperation between the agencies to really make these type of cases right?

Like there CANT be an Old bridge type case unless there is coordination, no?

If the Buffalo- Ontario territory is dominated by Calabrians, why exactly would an American raised Fed be THE authority?

Also, have you read that report-theory by Anna Sergi?

@ antimafia

Just great post, my man....Great stuff
.

@Sonny @Nickel @Nickey

Just really good stuff guys,

@Hollander

Thanks for taking the time to answer, I know I can be a little intense...

@Cabrini I've actually wondered if the FBI/Justice Dept. in the Unites States is conflicted on the Buffalo family, and I know BensonHURST has too. Is that what you are saying. If it is, that question arises for me because of the following:

Cohen at Buffalo Field office in March 2017 told the Buffalo News:




US Attorney Eastern District (and I would guess the FBI in that area) wrote the following after the Otremens arrests in November 2017:




I would say that is a significant contradiction being both statements were made in the same year.

However, Nicky responded with a very good point:



Here is my issue with that response: I have a hard time making a separation between the "Mafia in WNY" and the "Todaro Crime Family" and its operations in other countries. To me they are one in the same as the Todaro's where the heads of the Buffalo Crime family for two decades--even if they diminished in size and viability over that time. Of course it could be that another LCN family (like the Bonanno's) or even one of the Ndrangheta clans could be running things. Is that what you suggest Nicky?

My big question: What is the likelihood that traditional mafia structures have been reinvented and and their is much more collaboration between mafia families and mafia groups like the Sergi article has suggested.

The other thing that's interesting, the FBI mentioned that the case with the Bonannos included members of the Todaro Family:



What's interesting is in the same FBI press release that contains the above quote, all of the defendants listed are all in the NYC area. So, who are the members and associates of the Todaro family that were arrested? Wouldn't there be a list of their names somewhere if they were arrested and formally charged with a crime?

Sorry if I missed it earlier, but I can't seem to find who the Todaro family members are who were arrested anywhere.

That is the frustrating thing, they were never listed.

There is much conjecture and very little in the way of real answers as to who the Todaro people are.

• Some say those who were arrested are currently Buffalo members--i.e. one theory is that they are the Violi Brothers as their Grandfather had strong ties to Buffalo.
• Others say the Violi's and their clan are Bonanno--because they were at a Bonanno making ceremony and Buffalo may have been absorbed by a NYC family like the Bonannos.
• Some say what is left of Buffalo/Todaro were absorbed by a Ndrangheta family--i.e. Luppino whom some reports several years ago indicated Dominic Violi was the heir apparent leader.
• Others believe the "Todaro" family members are left over Buffalo Crime Family that are just working with one of the Ndrangheta clans in Canada because Buffalo is defunct with no administration.
• Another theory is that the current families and mob organizations are much less structured and work much more across organizational and family lines--See the Anna Sergi article:New York Crime Families Survive & Colaborate .

Did I miss any theories?

Stubbs and Nickle.

I don't mean any disrespect, but the "members and associates" of the Todaro crime family were not in the NYC area. They were in Canada. That's okay, we all make mistakes. Here is the official quote from the Justice Department.

"In a coordinated operation, Canadian law enforcement authorities today arrested nine organized crime members and associates in Canada, including members of the Todaro organized crime family, who are charged with, among other crimes, narcotics trafficking."

Never meant to insinuate they were from NYC. Not sure Stubbs did either. Can’t speak for him, but I didn’t take his comment that way. I assumed he was just asking if any of those arrested in Canada were identified as Todaro family members. The US Attorney did list those Bonanno and Gambino members/associates who were from the NYC area and were arrested in that operation. Here they are:

I was on Peter Edwards website and he has to have it looks 4 books on Canada LCN there has to he at least 6-7 books out there.

Anyone read any of them?

Some of the answers as to historic structure could be answered.

I think that's the only way we are going to get answers?

Nikel, just a though what about a FOIA request on he Violi bros?

Bensonhurst, I could be wrong here, but I am 99% sure that you cannot do a FOIA request on people that are still living. Deceased individuals only.

Nickle, I accept that and I know you wouldn't have looked at it that way. Just clarifying for Stubbs. I know that you know this Nickle, but the following individuals and their allegiances are, as follows:
1. Damiano Zummo, Bonanno family acting capo - behind the induction ceremony in Canada.
2. Salvatore Russo, Bonanno associate and cousin of Zummo.
3. Paul Semplice, Gambino soldier and noted member of family's Sicilian faction.
4. Paul Ragusa, Gambino associate. Former member of Giannini crew which was what Bonanno soldier/turncoat Vincenzo Morena was in before being deported.

Paula Manning (Pete Edwards Source about Musitano Hit, arrests, and Buffalo) tweeted this a while back: Pat Musitano talking with Johnny Catz from Buffalo after Pops hit

Manning indicated Buffalo gave permission for Pops to be hit. Does this change some understandings about what went on then, and Buffalo’s ability to have a say in Canada today?

Now this IS interesting. Thanks for bringing this up Nickle. It would make a whole lot of sense that Buffalo gave permission since by 1997 Buffalo was still a functioning family and there should have been retaliation otherwise. I think the Musitanos were in Buffalo's orbit too and they were capable of taking over Papalia's businesses with Buffalo likely still receiving their cut as has been stated in previous recent articles.

My take on Buffalo is that even though the remaining members seem to have gone legit, particulary the Todaros, they still hold positions of influence and respect in the underworld in the Niagara region and Southern Ontario. It can't be ruled out that they still have a say in the ongoings and perhaps still receiving a cut of the profits from associates that are still active. Just no longer a functioning family with an actual hierarchy on the American side. At the very least they are probably still consulted for advice in business and conflict.

In the book or Blood authored by Peter Edward & Antonio Nicasso. pages 104-105.

"Papalia was named as a key Canadian under the wing of the Buffalo mob."

"Less than two months after Pop's (Paplia) murder on May 31,1997. his lieutenant Carmen Barillaro was shot dead at his Niagara Falls, Ontario. Ken Murdock was again the shooter. Neither killing was directly traced to Vito,although his shadow fell over both crimes."

"In the late 90's, Vito was seeking to cut links to the American La Cosa Nostra and create a Canadian based Mafia that was no longer an appendix of the US organization. On October 22,1997, four months after the Papalia murder, Vito met with fifteen men he considered loyalist in a Woodbridge Ontario restaurant, Musitano including Murdock's one time boss , Pasquale Musitano of Hamilton. Also there was Gaetano Panepinto of Toronto.
Musitano and his brother Angelo were originally charged with two counts each of murder for arranging the Papalia and Barillaro hits.Eventually they pled guilty to one count each of murder conspiracy for Barillaro's death. Vito Rizzuto's name was left out of the court proceedings."

"The removal from the scene of Papalia,Barillaro and Mora certainly helped Vito create more space for his own independent crime family in Canada
free from the stumbling Bonnano family of New York. While politicians in Quebec were talking about separation , Vito was making his own version,except he wanted to take Ontario with him. "

"Murdock later told the Toronto Star that he was instructed by senior members of the Musitano crime family to pull the trigger on half dozen others, almost all of whom were key members of the Ontario Ndrangheta. Most were blood relatives and in laws of Paolo Violi: Jimmy Luppino and Paolo Violi two sons, four other family members and in laws of the late Giacomo Luppino."

Sorry if I didn't explain myself well. What I meant was: The FBI claimed in that bust they arrested "members and associates of the Todaro" family, but in their press release they only mention members from the Gambinos and Bonannos from NYC. So if they really arrested people under the Todaros, who were they and why weren't their names released in their official FBI press release? I find that curious.

Giacomo Luppino's wife is named Domenica Todaro.
Does anyone here know which part of Italy the old man Todaro of Buffalo came from ?
I just would like to know if there is any relationship between the two.

Other posters stated Sicily.

At La Nova they rotate pictures of family and their is a set where they are visiting where they are from in Sicily.

If anyone knows the name of Joe Todaro Sr.'s parents, his ancestry may be easier to determine. I've never had any luck when trying to find out where his parents were from.

Josephine D. Todaro, who is Todaro Sr.'s wife, had the maiden name Santamauro. Some time ago I found what I believe is her father's World War I Registration Card -- go to https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:33S7-916P-97JH. Rosario Santamauro was born in Ventimiglia di Sicilia, in the province of Palermo.

Giacomo Luppino was born in Castellace di Oppido Mamertina, in the province of Reggio Calabria. I suspect his wife, Domenica (née Todaro), was born in Castellace too.

I'm going to add one more theory as to why Angelo Musitano was killed, although with all the information we now have, I doubt this additional theory could be true.

10. Remo Commisso wanted both Angelo and Pat killed.

Go to private investigator Derrick Snowdy's tweet at https://twitter.com/jdsnowdy/status/989681899705720833. In case you can't see the tweet and the photo, see below.

Derrick Snowdy
@jdsnowdy

With respect to the #Ruthowsky conviction I’m reminded that Hamilton Police source debriefing reports show they knew people were targeted for murder. Did corruption keep it hushed up? Thousands of pages of these debriefing reports.

9:45 PM - 26 Apr 2018

Thanks !

So apparantly the Musitanos had a reason for revenge against Papalia, who ordered the beating of his own godson. When did this happen?

Thanks

Joe Todaro Sr father was Antonio, and his uncle was Salvatore Todaro. Salvatore "Black Sam" Todaro of Cleveland was a cousin of theirs. They are from Sicily. No relation to Domenica Todaro.

Papalia stepped on a lot of people's toes.

^^^^
Is the first Salvatore Todaro the uncle of Joe Todaro Sr. or of Antonio Todaro (Joe Todaro Sr.'s father)?

Thanks Giacomo !

They didn't list any of the defendants arrested in Canada, let alone the Todaro family members and associates.

Antonio and Salvatore Todaro were brothers. Salvatore "Black Sam" Todaro was a cousin of theirs.

^^^^
I was able to find the 1940 United States Census record for Anthony Todaro. It also lists Joe Todaro Sr.'s mother, Sarah, as well as his siblings. See https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:K7SQ-F96. Unfortunately, I couldn't find immigration/travel records for either Anthony or Sarah, who according to the census were both born in Italy. I'm curious why Sarah's name was anglicized from, I presume, Sara--all of her and Anthony's children listed in the census do not have Italian first names except for the youngest, Salvatore.

FamilySearch isn't going to cut it, unless I can find an immigration/travel record for either of the two Salvatore Todaros.

It appears Salvatore Todaro from Cleveland had another cousin in Buffalo named “busy” Joe Patitucci — don’t know if this will help track down more information on Antonio Todaro.

From DiCarlo: Buffalo’s First Family of Crime vol. 1

The Todaro family members would have to be someone on this list from the RCMP: RCMP GTA CFSEU and its policing partners land a tremendous blow to organized crime in Canada
The following subjects have been charged with the following offences:

DOMENICO PAOLO VIOLI, of Hamilton
DIMITAR DIMITROV of Stoney Creek
ADRIANO VALENTINO SCOLIERI of Richmond Hill
BERNARDO LUKE ROTOLO of Woodbridge
TRAN GIANG TANG of Markham
KAM TIM TONG of Markham
Nicholas VALENTINE of Vaughan
ANTHONY JAMES ARROYO of Waterloo
JAMES LINCOLN JABLONSKI of Mississauga
A CANADA WIDE WARRANT HAS BEEN ISSUED FOR THE ARREST OF GIUSEPPE VIOLI of HAMILTON
A CANADA WIDE WARRANT HAS BEEN ISSUED FOR THE ARREST OF MASSIMIGLIANO CARFAGNA of BURLINGTON
YIN YUN LEONG OF MARKHAM
A CANADA WIDE WARRANT HAS BEEN ISSUED FOR THE ARREST OF WITTON LUU OF TORONTO, ON
A Canada wide warrant is being sought for the arrest of WOJCIECH GRZESIOWKI of Innisfil

The Violio's never had aby ties d's zto the Bonnano's?
Correct?

Technically the Bonnano's killed their father and uncles and as learned from on here

The Rizzutto/Bonnano's were trying to kill the sons and cousins

I guess that's where LUPPINO came in and was protecting them under one Buffalo banner.

If I have the story correct?

The Violis have plenty of ties to the Bonanno crime family in that the investigation to them by the RCMP and the investigation into the Bonannos in Canada by Vincenzo Morena were parallel investigations that were linked and intertwined.
Also, I think it was deduced that the Violis attended the Morena induction ceremony. Nickle, correct me if I'm wrong.

But it's interesting that they didnt come out and SAY, they were Bonnano members, and even MORE interesting that they DIDNT correct the Hamilton police.

Also, I've NEVER seen either the Violis or Luppinos on ANY Bonnano chart by any of the respected reserachers.


My point being, if Bonnano soldiers, it must be pretty recent that they were made right?

WHO would have made them? Rastelli, Massino, or Montagna when he got deported? And when? Also, if they were Bonnano members, why didnt Montagna use them, and their crew, instead of street gangs, the Frenchman, LoPrestis son, the unmade Calabrian Mirarchi....


I keep hearing about the Bonnanos Canadian crew. NO ONE HAS NAMED EM!

That big Bonnano xmas party where ALL the capos showed, WHO REPRESENTED CANADA? Why no Violis or Luppinos, or someone there?






I feel like they woulda showed up on the FBIs radar, or someones charts.

If they are Bonnano members, about what time period you guys think they were made? Which boss, which era?
And what crew are they with? The Bronx?


Do you think Montagna made the brothers?

@Tampa, that is what I heard. Also, did you see the theory on Twitter that Antimafia alerted us to?


And did you see the Manning tweet thread showing police intelligence of Pat Musitano talking with Johnny “Catz” from Buffalo in ‘98. It appears the Musitanos were still tight with Buffalo after the Pops Hit, and Manning said Buffalo gave permission for the Pops murder. In my mind that changes everything. Here is the twtter thread:

Musitano Talking to Catz in ‘98

I read something on another forum, I cant substantiate it. So it's not anything confirmed, but I read, i think it was Anthony Todaro? That the Todaros gave the go ahead on Papalia, and that the Violis were sore over it.

From what i read it wasnt really the Rizzutos. But I'm in no way qualified to validate any of that, so it's just speculation.

The Luppino family and the Buffalo crime family have had a relationship lasting for decades I can't see the Todaro's using the Musitano's to kill Papalia. It would of been contracted out to the Luppino's.

@Ciment: Does it matter that Manning indicated Buffalo didn't order the Musitanos to hit Pops; rather, they gave their permission for it to happen?

By the way, I've attached the intelligence picture manning posted for those who don't do twitter. Here is the twitter exchange

MANNING: Police recorded conversation between Pat Musitano and two UK males circa 1998, just after the Paplia homicide.
I have over 2,000 docs I’ve not even looked at yet, but you’d be shocked how often #hamont officers come up as ‘subjects’

COMMENT: Is that Johnny Catz from Buffalo?

MANNING RESPONSE: What I was thinking....

COMMENT: So Buffalo was still tight with Musitanos after Pops hit?

COMMENT: I heard rumors Buffalo ordered it, but never believed it then... Always thought, and think it was reported that, it was Musitanos moving in on Buffalo’s control of area rackets since Buffalo had been greatly weakened by Local 210 going into federal trusteeship.

MANNING'S RESPONSE: Never ‘ordered’ it, but permission was given. Also have intel reports suggesting the Papalia brothers knew what was going to happen.

I originally thought Papilia and Borillo were Bonanno
But They were not they were Buffalo

So really what happened was

1) Rizzuto participated in the 3 vapors murder.
2) He solidified his position with at the time was the new boss of the Bonanno family Massimo.
3) Rizzuto/Bonanno took over Montreal.
4) Rizzuto/Bonanno took out Papali and Boriello who were Buffalo, with the permission of Buffalo am in.
5) The fact that Buffalo did not retaliate wasn$t a sign of weakness.
6) So whomever Buffalo, dictated to take over their roles at the time they OK'd the hit, should he Morgan likely still in charge.

So the story line that they went defunct and they got hit and could not avenge the murders because they were too weak, was FALSE.

So the Mustiano's did the hit with the backing of the Rizzutto's/Bonnano's with the permission of Buffalo.

Do I have this correct?

I am pretty sure 1-3 are correct.... They can be confirmed with CBC News Article "The Rizzuto Family" by Corrine Smitth she writes:



We don't really know if 4 is correct
Given Manning is right--we can assume number 5
And who knows about number 6--things can change quickly.

Here is the link to the CBC NEWS article: CBC NEWS: "Rizzuto Family" by Corrine Smith (Nov. 2010)

The theory that Buffalo would give the go ahead, permission or contract to the Musitano's to have Papalia hit, does not make sense in my opinion. The Rizzuto's being behind it is more believable. They were allies with the Musitano's.

I believe more Peter Edwards and Antonio Nicasso's theory that Rizzuto wanted to expand into Ontario and Papalia,Violi and Luppino's were in his way.

Let's entertain that Buffalo gave permission then the Luppino/Violi's would have to have been consulted and be part of the decision because of their long history with the Buffalo crime family. What benefit would the Luppino's get from this. All that would do is give more power to their enemies. Rizzuto and Musitano's were allies and the Rizzuto's are no friends of the Luppino/Violi's.

Unless, and it would not surprise me with the Rizzuto's, that it was their ultimate goal or plan between Buffalo/Musitano/ and Rizzuto's to oust the Papalia and then proceed to the oust Luppino/Violi's ?

But that would start a war with the Commisso's because of their family ties with the Luppino's.

Can both be true? Would it be too much of a stretch that Buffalo was fed up with Pops and signed off on the hit because he had Angelo run over and Pasquale beat up? Did the Rizzuto's use this bad blood to expand into Ontario? Did Buffalo get a piece for allowing this to happened? Weren't the Musitanos know to be allies of Buffalo too?

This raises a lot of questions. One thing is for sure Edwards is knowledgable and reputable, and we shouldn't dismiss what he wrote in Business or Blood.

If does if you understand how the Mafia works. Perhaps Papalia had fallen out of favor with Buffalo and had become disposable. I think the Rizzutos could've gotten into trouble with the admin in New York (Sciascia still being alive) if Buffalo wouldn't have sanctioned the hit and people having to answer for it. This is exactly what happened with Panepinto. Since nobody did answer for it (unless Angelo's murder was related) it makes a lot of sense.



Then why didn't they just kill them all? Why leave the vengeful kids of Paolo Violi alive? Because Mafia politics protected their safety. Too many people opposed to it (Toronto and New York) so they couldn't do it.



The Luppinos didn't need to be consulted at all if Buffalo gave permission as Papalia was a member of their family. If they gave permission, that'll be it.

While you were writing your message I was revising my message and entertained the fact they can both be the case. Refer to my previous message.

My responses were based on the long standing relationship between the Luppino's and Buffalo.

What happens in Hamilton affects the Luppino's. It is common sense that your business associates would be consulted.

and why he didn't go after the Violi sons was obviously a change of heart for precisely the same reasons you gave.

It would be better for business perhaps (hence why Montagna consulted so many people), but if Buffalo decided to kill Papalia (or sanction his murder) the Luppinos could do nothing else than go along with it since it would be a family matter.

Yes, there is nothing the Luppino's can do, but on the other hand the Luppino's can decide to form an alliance with other New York families that will gain their respect. This is why common sense prevails.

Really depends on the relationship between the Luppinos and Papalia.

Yes, it does but the Luppino's would also be cautious of the Musitano's gaining more power or territory.

What about the fact that Papilia and Boriello borrowed $7,200,000 from Nicolo Rizzuto, and he wanted to get paid back, neither one made any effort to pay him the money back.

$7,200,000 that is a BIG slap in the face.



.

In my opinion you do not go to the remnants of a defunct familyal and ask their permission to whack on e of them.

You just whack em, and say F.U. You can't do anything aabout it.

In my opinion you do not go to the remnants of a defunct family and ask their permission to whack one of them.

You just whack em, and say F.U. You can't do anything about it.

That's against protocol. Of course New York breaks the rules all the time.

Could be a legitimate reason, also for Buffalo to go along.



In 1997 Buffalo was still a viable family.

They all want influence in Hamilton because there is also a pretty big Sicilian community.

What's against protocol?

https://www.thespec.com/news-story/...mpaign_id=localnews#.W_A1uKGVrsM.twitter

Mob, murder and the Hamilton connection

When California Dreaming Becomes Deadly: Was Hamilton (ON) Mob Figure “Made” In L.A. In The Weeks Before He Was Killed?

https://gangsterreport.com/when-cal...n-l-a-in-the-weeks-before-he-was-killed/