Scarfo and Gotti

How was Scarfo's relationship with Gotti like?

they met in 85 after paul got whacked gotti said he got commision approval for pauls murder (he was lying). According to leonetti scarfo was impressed with gotti and gotti was apparently impressed with scarfo as they were according to philip quite similar

but raymond marananto apparently told the crow that gotti and the gambinos disliked the way scarfo was running the family marananto claims gotti said that to him face to face when they were in prison together they apparently thought scarfo was causing too much heat

"He's a sharp guy, I can see why our friend (Gigante) doesn't like him" says Scarfo

Wasn't there a meeting were Scarfo, Leonetti and Chuckie got together with Gotti and Gravano and Merlino got his usual drunken fool self and Gotti told Scarfo to whack him? Scarfo supposedly demoted him because he embrassed him in front of NY. Gotti then saw Scarfo as weak for not whacking him.

leonetti was not at that meeting. Crow talks about it i dont think he met gotti either it was a gambino high ranking member chuckie got drunk and insulted one of the gambinos wifes the whole thing was embarrassing for scarfo

i think this was before gotti became boss not sure who they met the crow only says it was a high ranking gambino

Gotti did meet with leonetti on more than one occasion with his uncle

i dont know he only talks of one meeting with gotti

I know he met with gravano several times

Leonetti speaks on meeting GRAVANO on several occassions. He only ever mentions meeting Gotti, once.

Everybody's correct(4 what i know),but i never researched 1 iota where gotti told scarfo 2 86 merlino...in all my yrs.,,I don't know 'bout that one,..

Sammy was around here five or six times that I know of . If I am rembering right it was when Phil was running things while Nick was in Texas .

Now there is a chance that Sammy and Phil just liked each other or they had some brain storming going both being # 2 in there family.


They went to a lot of places around here together and I only know of one time that someone was asked to go and that was Yogi.

I believe Phil is going to write a second book being more detailed or he is going to do a movie or something like it .

I do know for some strange reason he is waiting for his uncle to pass. This has been from many many Conversations with people very close to Phil , but something is in the works.

Perhaps he's waiting for him to pass so he can make up off the wall stories about his uncle. We all know how that goes. A person who was once close to someone writes a book about said person when that person is no longer around to dispute the information. Lol that would be hilarious, if out of nowhere Phil puts out stories about how Scarfo used to sleep walk and act out murders in his slumber.

Don't know about that . I do know he misses the life and wishes he did his time and did not write history the way he did.

I think he is doing not to cos his uncle any more pain and his family that love the life and the people in it .
He is very much in touch with certain family members and is around often .

He has stayed away from crime cos he knows how easy the Feds can flip someone and there is no way he can or could of got back into anything with out a red light on his head.

Not just that he has been living real good since the day he left .

I was joking with the last post. I bet he does miss being a wise guy, the power and the authority. But he knows better than to step back into the life. He'd end up like Sonny Riccobene, especially considering a lot of the guys he help put away are either back on the street, or their sons are in the life now and close to those with rank and probably hate his guts.

Read somewhere Sammy schedule it in early 86 cause he had been friendly with Phil down a.c. for a few years. It was at someone's house on Staten island and it had to do with one of the cherry hill gambinos action up at a club scarfo controlled. Pulled out a gun or something. Guess Sammy was down ac a lot in early 80tys and checked in with probably Phil. Closer in age.

Pmac and you would think they would of kept it low key . Well they did not they would go to two of the most suspicious and usual places a wise guy would go in DuckTown or Phil loved Caesars and would take guys for meetings out in a borrow of Atlantic City call Chelsea Heights To one of our favorite spots Teddy's Westend lounge it's no longer called that actually the guy that owns it now is a member here and has change the name .

But yea often wondered what it would have been like if Nick was put away longer and Phil had control. He was smooth and would think things threw , you never know where his and Sammys head was at cos it was looking real good for them back then.

whoh dude ..why don't b careful 'bout your messages...

That was meant 4 my man SinatraClub

I read somewhere that scarfo brought santo Idone up to Paul castellano to settle something with money, I think loansharking. But, Idone must of mouthed off and Paul told scarfo that he thought Idone was being fresh. Scarfo had to tell Idone to calm it down. That musta been funny. Paul thinking he's EF Hutton and Idone just starts popping off at the mouth about what he's owed.

Seen that to whip. Scarfo brought him to NYC and I done was being very aggressive and Paul was besides himself. Scarfo thought it was not funny at the time but then thought it was.

Was it something to do with idone area down Maryland or so.ewherd down there. An it was gambling. I done thought they were stepping in his turf. Did he die In jail or the street. He had some bullshit Rico trial all on a little gambling but the feds had a hard on for any scarfo capos.

Be careful about what?

The irony of Gotti complaining about someone else bringing too much heat !!

that was 4 serp..nevermind anyways serp.

i got very mixed up ,forget about it.

You aint kidding

Good point....

But it did keep him alive and safer from Chin

Yeah pmac the article is below about Idone. As for Gotti, it didn't appear to matter to scarfo if he beefed with the gambinos. He went to castellano and Gotti with problems and they also killed for each other. And he had the west side behind him. I'm sure scarfo respected Gotti though. But, he wasn't after Gotttis approval. Scarfo knew the rules.

http://articles.philly.com/1990-01-09/news/25907968_1_mob-boss-mob-captain-scarfo-family

This is true Nick sr . many think it was him and Bobby Manna responsible for everything with the westside getting together with Nick sr. But Nick was close to other big guys way before Manna .
Tommy Ryan was around here often and may of had a house on the island many of his soldiers in a couple skippers did .
But Tommy Ryan was big into boxing and would be down here in a local bar called Rocky's it was a friend of his and he was Rocks manager or promoter getting old can't remember but lots of fighters were from Philly and many there families had houses down here.

I could go on and on and throw a lot of names around but I don't like to do that unless it's been in the news already.

The bar was owned by Rocky Castellani and it was a known place for westside guys and we all know that Bruno was close to Gambino so it was difficult times in NY for the two families but when they came down here things were different.

I still think Phil Leonetti is going to do something whether it be Netflix or the second book but there's so much that he did not tell !!!

The Chin did not meet with Nick just for ha ha he knew him and knew about him long before Bruno getting killed there's guys were all involved in the fight game and when you know the out come you can make a lot of money and I am sure that they made big money cos there was fights in every casino and before that in every arena or convention center in the tri-state .

"There's so much he did not tell"...maybe ,just maybe u could give us a little snippet to wet our beaks?..serp,please? ..I got nothin'2 lose by asking..i enjoy when u tell us behind the scenes of the older days..anyway,I hope ur doin' alright in this overheated summer down there. Been 2 our place in L.B.I.a few times.nice but scorching.

Serp cannot wet our beaks cos that would be telling... It most likely involves various beefs and murders etc that he committed with his uncle (which I doubt he'd ever talk about)

Oh, does anyone know IF Phil testified against Tore Scaffidi? Who came
to his rescue when Phil was getting UFC choked out inside....

Bet Tore wish he didn't jump in.

http://articles.philly.com/1987-08-06/ne...nal-institution

I just know that he told what he was made to tell the rest Phil he did not say .

I did read his book but it was a few summers back and I think the suff in the book was the same shit the Feds made him talk about .

Don't get me wrong he did say other stuff but just to fill in what lead up to to what they wanted to hear.

Also this area was packed with mobsters from NY , Philly , and other . A.C. was a open city for them and that was huge cos they felt comfortable here the law was laid back with them the mayors office has always been with them ,till lately now the Government breeded the area so bad there is almost nothing left .

Anyway he knew all this stuff and all the old guys from all the other families Christ Morris Levy was around here and all his guys I think he had a office on Pacific Avenue on the edge of Ducktown he always had a crew with him , just saying it was endless down here and he knows much of it trust me.

Yeh I've read Sammy's book endless times over the last two decades & when Phil mentioned Sammy in his book, he just repeated the same stuff Sammy wrote about but made it appear like some inside info which it wasn't

The only new thing he offered was that when he saw Sammy in protective custody after they flipped, when they would walk the yard.. Phil claims he himself was done with the life but Sammy had other plans and was even trying to get him to join him once they got out

Serp
Unless you are referring to a different bar that leonetti went to, it was on trenton ave. its still a bar though.

Cash :yea that was Teddys he had the bar and Sherry had the kitchen and a little gangster Deaker was one of the chefs.

But that was one of hundreds that was in the area it was a favorite because it was out in the Heights nice and quiet out there In the evenings .

Phil loved it there cos he could hang out with a calmer crowd and have drinks or a good meal and if need be right off the bar was a little private room with a fireplace and it was always set up for a little private gathering if you get my point .


The guy that got it from Teddy is a member poster here.

Yeah it's called The Vagabond now, great place- terrific food and many craft beers if that's your thing (not me)

Serp- did u guys ever hang out at the Wonder Bar on the water? I was thinking about heading down there for NFL Football Sunday one of these Sunday's in September when it's still nice out to be on the water and drink/ watch NFL Football.

Dante the Wonder bar was a complete dive bar back then nothing like now . But yes had drinks there but just to use the pay phone or to get beer out on the boat it never had a outside bar like now we had to run up the rocks to go around front to get beer it had a very scary dock back in the day.

Serp, who was Sherry?..a chef of some sort or a moll who knew how to cook..she showed Deaker the ropes? They had a small menu...

Hoodlum: Teddy and Sherry ( chef ) seemed to care very much for each other don't know if they were lovers and Sherry always had a blonde with her I thinking she was the hostess but always with her the cook he was all over cooked at Copsy's restaurant when it was Atlantic City it also move Off shore( mainland ) in the 80s but he did everything not just cook.

He burned a lot of bridges around here I heard he move south does a mobile RV casino pretty elaborate set up .

Oh,o.k., deaker 4 some reason rings a bell..can't figure..oh well.

serp,

I know some regular people in South Jersey who said Gotti met with Scarfo in Angelo's in A.C a few times. I believe I know the owner's name of Angelo's(Sonny I believe) but will not give the last name. Supposedly Gotti gave Sonny a clock that was in the restaurant. I have been to Angelo's about 20 years ago. Just thought you might know. You seem to have more inside info than most

Philly: I was in the place since I could walk once a week or more and yes the old owner name was Sonny it was his fathers and mothers place before him it is now his son and daughters that Owen it with the son Angelo having controlling interest .

I would talk to Sonny every time I was in there , he was the type of guy that if you wanted something told in the neighborhood or in City Hall just tell him if you get what I mean .

The story about the clock I don't think it was true cos he would have told it a thousand times to every customer that he knew that walked in the joint just the way he was and everybody knew it.

But there were many many meeting in there with Sammy and a bunch of other guys that would come to the city to see Nick or Phil cos Angeloni's was way to hot for meetings with other families.



There is only one clock in the joint other then the bar and it's not from Gotti .

But old Sonny could tell a hell of a story !!!

I personally think Angeloni's is a much better overall restaurant than Angelo's.

Serp- what's your opinion? Also, did Nicky Sr, Nick Jr, Phil, etc prefer one over the other? I know Angeloni's you could spit on from Scarfo's house on Georgia Ave...

Dante: I agree the thing about angelo's is that they get the masses they are still doing 100 150 lunches and well over 500 dinners and that is great in AC these days.
Most people don't know that Angelos banquet rooms are busy and they use frown foods for a banquet but at least for most part they are using fresh food for lunches and dinners I only eat the specials cos the cook picks them and puts there best in them.

Angeloni's is fresh food and you corner Italian restaurant very good back in the day it was all around great but that was because of the people .

And yes Angeloni's was there go to spot (the guys that is) And Nick and Phil were very very comfortable there .
It was like a save house cos it is in the center of Ducktown and it was a tight neighborhood and we knew if there was a stranger in town.

To the best of my knowledge, the only person in the Philadelphia family Leonetti testified against was Santo Idone.

Leonetti didn't flip until after the big RICO trial that made most of the guys go away for 20 years.

serp, I remember castellani, he fought bobo olsen for the worlds middleweight title in 1953, his manager was jimmy doyle, and I'm thinking that was Thomas [tommy] eboli, who later got whacked, am I right about his manager?

Binnie: yes

ty, serp

Yea man .... Also I am not a researcher but if u are he was down in AC and down beach often my father and grandfather used to tell me the guys in his crew that were around here in season and also some if the Westside skippers had houses down beach so it was very populated with Westside guys from Wayback .

again, ty serp, I consider you one of the best and most knowledgeable posters on this site, many here like to boast about who they knew,and what they know.

you never put up a front, meaning YOU ARE THE REAL DEAL.

thank you for responding to my post serp.

Binnie : just a kid that grew up on a street like anyone .

But thanks

But what's weird most of these people know each other and or marry into the families just the way it is.