Mafia Families in Canada

The NY Five families are famous,but also the Canada had its mafia families apart the Rizzuttos and Cotronis.

Anyone know why isn't born a Canadian Commission ?


Musitanos:

Territory:Hamilton,Ontario

Bosses:

Dominic Musitano 1950s-1995
Pasquale "Pat" Musitano 1995-today

Members:unknown

Papalia crime family;

Luppino crime family;

At Montreal there are the Cotroni family that was the calabrian faction while the Rizzuto are the Siclian faction;

Siderno Group

Territory:Ontario

I've read that the Siderno group is very powerful.

They are everywhere, Canada, Australia, Italy of course and the rest of Europe..

Recently they committed mayor multi million euro fraud at the flower auction in Aalsmeer over here in the Netherlands.

This is the bpower of the ndrangheta,same organization on Siderno in Italy and various gruop over the world that are semi indipendent except for the border of control.

Billy,I read that the ndranghetà in netherlands is very powerful,in an article is said that control an entire neighborhood in a big dutch city.

Are The Rizzuto's the only LCN family in Canada?

They are very active over here according to the national police, but I haven't heard anything about controlling neighborhoods, I think that would also be not in their best interest because that requires too much visibility..

Their modus operandi is more focused on white collar crimes such as fraud, money laundering and supplying drug dealers..

So maybe they 'control' some neighborhoods in the way that they supply the local dealers, in that way it can be true I don't know.
But controlling neighborhoods in a way LCN did in places like Bensonhurst and Howard Beach, no that cannot be the case, they aren't entrenched enough and don't have enough manpower over here too do such a thing..

The Mafia families in Canada are very diverse. From what I understand the 3 main cities are Montreal, Toronto, and Hamilton. Here's my guess on who's active:

Montreal
The Montreal Mob is probably a single family with two rival factions, Sicilians vs Mainland Southern Italians (Possibly Calabrese for most part). Though I think the beef is more about Rizzuto loyalists vs those who favored the old Cotroni regime. Either way I think the Montreal Mob is probably like the Chicago Outfit rather than your typical American LCN family. What I mean by that is they probably don't make guys the same way the LCN families do, and there are significant non-Italians in the group as well. Also considering the current leadership and their ties to Sicily, this family has strong ties to the Cun trera-Caruana Sicilian clan and I'm sure there are blood ties, this connection is what makes the family very powerful. Currently the Montreal Mob is under the control of the Sicilians, there's a new young leadership with Stefano Sollecito as the emerging boss. This power may be questioned soon when Arcadi and his two lieutenants, Del Balso and Giordano are released from jail, or perhaps not, we'll see what happens.

Toronto
Toronto is known to be controlled by the 'Ndrangheta clans for most part, while people do hear of the Siderno group, it's very important to understand that this is not a family, but rather a commission like body that was assembled to settle 'Ndrangheta affairs and disputes. From what I know there are about 7 or 8 'Ndrangheta families that operate in the Toronto region and they all have ties back to Calabria which makes them very powerful. There are also Sicilian mobsters operating in Toronto, the Cun trera-Caruana have presence there, also the remnant of Paul Volpe's crew (Former soldier of the Buffalo family), apparently this crew is headed by Peter Scarcella. The Sicilians in Toronto are obviously Rizzuto allies but I also hear that some of the 'Ndrangheta clans in Toronto are also Rizzuto's allies, while some of them are enemies.

Hamilton
In Hamilton you have the Musitano family, their origin is Calabrese but they are neither LCN nor 'Ndrangheta, yet they're respected and acknowledged in the underworld. My best description of them is they're like a glorified crew of some sort that was built in Canada rather than Italy. The other family is known as the Luppino family which from what I know were associated with or even part of the Papalia crew of the Buffalo family. The Violi brothers are in the Luppino family and if I were to take a guess, I would say the old Papalia crew is pretty much what the Luppino family is today, in other words they're the same family. I also know that these two families are rivals, the Musitanos being Rizzuto allies while the Luppinos are against them.

The biggest game is Canada is who controls the narcotics, and ultimately it's probably a bigger battle between the Montreal Mob and the 'Ndrangheta families of Toronto.

Think the [BadWord]-Caruana/Rizzuto ties died with Agostino. And I have this opinion that maybe Leonardo Rizzuto is in a leadership position now to be the olive branch between the new, young leadership and Arcadi & Del Balso, Giordano & Co. Not to mention Rocco Sollecito, Stefano's dad is still around and involved.


And according to Business & Blood, Arcadi has to worry about guys trusting him again.

Arcadi will be lucky if he lives a month after being released. I'm not so sure he has anything to come back to.

I brought this up about the rizzuto's not making people....I don't think they do

That's my thinking as well, they probably see it as some old outdated tradition and the people that are high up in the group know who they are and so does everyone else around them (Sort of like the Outfit). This may also explain why Fernandez thought he was made. Though I'm sure Italians get a higher priority and an easier time to get into the group considering that it's still an Italian Mob.



Apparently Liborio Cun-trera is among the new leaders of the Rizzuto family, not sure what his connection is to the actual Sicilian clan but he does carry the surname, so it's highly likely that the relationship is still there.

Yes I think the relationship is still there. Honestly, unless they all die I think they will continue a pretty close relationship as they have for years.

As for making folks we really don't know. We do know Vito Rizzuto treated Joe Bravo and folks like Desjardins like they were made, but I don't think they were. I also do think that is why so many were loyal to him before and after prison is because he was well known for bringing EVERYBODY together over the years. Yes those rebelled when he was away, but most went along with the show because they feared getting clipped like Nicolo Rizzuto was. If Vito doesn't go away none of this ever happens.

Are you completely sure this is correct?
My understanding was that they do in fact control a lot of territory, in Germany, Australia, Canada, it has been said that they are the only mafia in all five habitable continents.
It's not a street gang like presence, but I mean, this is the group that dug tunnels in the middle of the street in Calabrian cities, with no hint of reprisal...

I'm always reminded of the response when the Bonnanos offered Vito a capo slot;
They seemed genuinely unaware that the 20 or whatever soldiers was no longer a crew, but a full family, that was probably stronger than them...
Funny, I actually do,consider Vito a lot like Luciano in that he seemed to have no ethnic discrimination in regards to business, if you were Spanish, or French Canadian, of Irish, or Asian, or a Biker, or Blood, a deal come led be done...

I've asked the question a few times on the board, does anyone have info on the connection between New York and Toronto?
New York and Montreal?
Did Montreal form ties to the Gambinos? Did the Genovese form ties withToronto to keep the status quo?
How do the factions inside the wider Ø group impact alliances withNew York?
And the big X factor, how does Mexico affect the Canadian groups?
Any thoughts?

I thought that they were all basically the same family, formed with blood ties, I think they are still one family, on another note didn't the caruana [BadWord] like BUY the island of ARUBA? Lol

Has anyone ever heard of a making sesh ever happening in Montreal?....

Arcadi made a lot of enemies before he went to jail. But he had a strong crew too. So it wouldn't surprise me either way, if he didn't last a month or re-gained his position within the leadership

I guess what I was trying to say is that members like Desjardins and Bravo were like Guzik and Humphrey in the Outfit. In the sense that they were important members in the family, but can never be bosses.



I'm guessing that there's a relationship between the families of these cities but it's business only. New York has no say over Toronto or Montreal, the last time they tried to do anything was when Sal Montagna got deported and even then I'm not so sure the Bonnanos as a family had anything to do with it, perhaps it was Montagna acting on his own given that his chances of returning to NY were slim and he wanted to continue his Mob lifestyle in Canada, though to the bigger picture of that story it was more about the bigger Rizzuto enemies that actually carried those attacks, so with or without Montagna the same would have happened given the rival faction in Montreal being led by Joe Di Maulo and their allies in Hamilton (Luppinos/Violis) and Toronto (Some of the 'Ndrangheta families).



He certainly did have a very strong crew, it's going to be interesting to see how this new leadership is going to handle this. I actually would not be surprised if they bring him into the fold to keep the peace and strengthen the family. On the other hand that's assuming he goes along with their plans because if not, they'll get rid of him.

Of course there are still Cun-trera's in the Montreal group, like Liborio. But when people say the [BadWord]-Caruana/Rizzuto clan, they're usually referring to the exclusive Sicilian relationship which pretty much allowed the Rizzuto's to top the drug industry in Montreal. That relationship, doesn't exist anymore. While Rizzuto was in jail and after Nick & Nicolo had died, as well as Agostino, there were reports that the Cun-trera's were also friendly with the 'Ndrangheta clans that was supposedly against the Rizzuto's. There's a mention of there being a funeral for a high ranking 'Ndrangheta boss, and the [BadWord]'s , a large group of them were present at that funeral, and hopped on a Party bus afterwards with other 'Ndrangheta members and went to the reception of a [BadWord] who was getting married, in Business Or Blood.


And there's been some over on the RD forum who speculate that Agostino was the black sheep of the Cun-trera clan, and that that whole alliance hadn't been as close as always implied over the years. And that Agostino's relationship with the Sicilian Montreal clan stemmed from the fact that Agostino may have actually been a Montreal soldier before anything else, and that he was inducted under the Bonanno banner. As opposed to being a made member of the Siculiana clan like most of the older, more powerful Cun-trera/Caruana's were.

Long story short, there may still be some marriage ties, but as far as them being linked together as one big family connected by familial and marriage bloodlines, solely loyal to each other, that isn't the case anymore.


And there were actually two groups against the Rizzuto's, they both stemmed from the Rizzuto clan itself, ie. Di Maulo/Desjardin's/De Vito, but Montagna had his own group which consisted of Giuseppe LoPresti's kid, who had become bitter and blamed the Rizzuto's for his fathers death and Moreno Gallo, I believe. Those two groups had the similar goal of eradicating the Rizzuto's, which led to the confusion that they were all the same group, although they were at one point allies, I don't think we can say they were the same group. Somewhere along the lines, Montagna & Desjardin's had a falling out which led to Montagna's death.

Sinatra,

I think you're right about the two groups being against the Rizzuto's until the falling out of Montagna and Desjardins.

I'm curious as to why you think Moreno Gallo was with the Montagna group?

Good Post, real interesting stuff...
I gotta get that Business and Blood book now...
I like how you break down the factions, it's impossible to explain the intrigues without doing so.
If you can add anything else, I would be most interested in reading/hearing it...

[img:center]http://postimg.org/image/mm75q0ed7/full/[/img]

The Countrera-Caruana-Rizzuto Family Tree

I sometimes wonder if their offer was a trap to lure Vito to NY so they could whack him. No evidence, obviously, just pure speculation... But the offer seems ignorant to me. Why invite a man whom is (even at that time) for all intents and purposes a boss of his own family to be a caporegime in NYC? If they were aware of Montreal's growing autonomy (and it seems highly unlikely to me that they didn't) and that wasn't the reason Sciascia was hit, then there's no real incentive to invite Vito to do anything.

On the other hand, the invitation could also just been to cover their tracks. IIRC Massino wanted to misdirect the Rizzuto suspicion elsewhere, so perhaps the invitation was simply to make them believe everything was business as usual. Could be their autonomy didn't really matter so long the drug racket continued to operate through the Bonnanos.

Anyway, I've always wondered what the motivation was to extend the invite. It just seems odd when you consider the overall picture.

Your 2nd part slumpy is why they asked Vito to be a capo. Massino knew it wouldn't look like a mob hit if they asked Vito, but more than likely Vito already knew who it was as soon as he was told George was clipped. Plus if Vito would have taken it, he would have been a capo in Montreal, not NYC.

I say Gallo was with Montagna, because there's evidence that it was Gallo who transferred Vito's sports book in the Toronto area, Platinum SB, which he was assigned with overseeing in Vito's absence, to the Calabrian's. And the other smaller sports book of Vito's which was under Gallo's watch, had been transferred to Montagna. Other powers who sided with Montagna were Domenico Arcuri Sr. he's the one who made the introductions for Montagna to others in the Montreal milieu. Along with Acuri were Tony Suzuki, Larry Lo Presti, Joe Renda & Giuseppe Colapelle. Though Colapelle was a plant for Desjardin's and him feeding Desjardin's information about what Montagna had planned is what led to the two sides being against each other and Montagna's ultimate death. The attempt on Desjardin's life was the first shot and it's suspected to have come from Montagna, the incident where Desjardin's & a bodyguard, Jonathan Mignacca were basically ambushed by guys in baclava's carrying AK-47's. Another evidence of this being Montagna was the fact that the shooters may have been from a Haitian street gang, which is why they were firing wildly and didn't kill Desjardin's or his bodyguard, not even hitting them. Montagna often used and employed the Haitian gangsters to enforce his extortion schemes of the cafes that were once under Rizzuto control, because he didn't have enough men backing him of his own kind. Montagna was the only one known for using them pretty much so that pointed to him right there, and Desjardin's knew it. Montagna tried to deflect blame back to the Rizzutos and went as far as saying the hit was ordered by Libertina Rizzuto, Vito's mother & Nicolo's widow. All of this scheming led to Montagna being killed by Desjardin's supporters.


And the funeral I mentioned earlier where the Cun-trera's were present was for Cosimo Stalteri, and long time and well known enemy of Vito Rizzuto and his Sicilian camp. In the 60's Stalteri was the Camera Di Controllo for the Toronto 'Ndrangheta, and he was appointed by Giacomo Luppino, Paolo Violi's father-in-law. After this funeral both groups bordered a chartered bus and went to the wedding anniversary reception of a member of the Cun-trera's. Among the guests of that reception were numerous members of the Commisso Crime Family, known enemies of Rizzuto. Among those members of the Commisso's were Sam Calautti, a notorious hitman for the 'Ndrangheta. He was the suspected killer of Vito's man in Ontario (or maybe Toronto, I forget), Guy Panepinto. At the time, he was also among the top five suspects in the murder of Nicolo Rizzuto. This reception took place less than seven months after the murder of Agostino Cun-trera and his bodyguard, Gerlando Sciascia's son, Liborio. The surveillance captured showed the Cun-trera's & the Commisso clan in a state of relative peace and ecstasy, they were breaking bread with each other, which if Vito was around, was basically a mortal sin. But after observing that the Canadian law enforcement saw this as a shift in times where Blood Ties no longer mattered, and it was all about money.



And there is more than one reason why Massino offered Rizzuto a caporegime spot. The whole thing with Sciascia and throwing Vito off tracks were one. But another reason was to reign Vito in, honestly. After Sciascia died, Vito stopped kicking up to NY. Over the years as the Rizzuto's grew in power in Montreal, they started to send less and less of their earnings back to NY. But at the time of Massino's boss reign, they were DEFINITELY still kicking up. After Sciascia died, Vito completely cut off the NY Bonanno Family. This was during a time where the Bonanno's strength was waning greatly, and Montreal had surpassed them in power, they earned more money, they had more connections in Montreal, and because they were earning more than the Bonanno's in NY all together, as it is assumed, they WERE the stronger of the two. Vito knew it, Massino didn't have the guys or strength at the time to really combat Rizzuto & his clan. This was the beginning of every Bonanno of stature turning witnesses. And NY just couldn't do anything for Montreal, they couldn't stop the drugs from coming in or going out, they couldn't interfere with their grip on the construction industries in Montreal, and they couldn't shut Vito out politically. Vito had ALL the power in Montreal, and the fact of the Bonanno's being based in NY, the Montreal guys simply didn't NEED NY. Massino, naively believing that Vito had this pride in the Bonannos and felt that rising from a soldier, in NY terms, to a Capo of his own crew, would be some sort of honor to Vito, and would make him just forget about Gerlando Sciascia, who was basically Vito's best friend, named Vito the Capo of the "Montreal Crew". When actually Vito viewed it as a slap in the face, as technically there was no "Montreal Crew" for the Bonanno's any longer, in Vito's mind. They had outgrew the Bonannos in Montreal and had become their own family of sorts and Vito was BOSS, and had been for a long time, after taking over from his father. Massino actually sent Vitale down to Montreal to inform Vito of his "promotion" and the news that they were looking for whomever killed Sciascia, not the other way around. Vito knowing Massino was behind it already, in an eery display of his all knowing, had a emptied seat next to his, around a table while Vitale and a couple of NY Bonanno guys met with Rizzuto and a couple of his men, Vitale knew that the empty chair was an intended sign to Vitale and whomever sent him. He was basically telling them without saying anything, "where's my friend, where's my right hand? You guys did it, and I know it". And at this meeting Vitale testifies that Vito turned the promotion down and sent him back to NY with the message for Massino. Massino knew he'd lost Montreal and just chalked it up as a loss. Which I think is a testament to Massino and his prowess as a boss, while he clearly loss face in Montreal, he knew there was little he could do about it, and basically that was the last time Massino had contact with Vito. I don't think the later Bonannos, and Massino and the following bosses, really had a good idea of what was going on in Montreal, Massino and majority of the Bonanno's considered Sciascia as simply his soldier, and later his Capo, who'd come there from Montreal, when in all actuality, he was Vito's eyes and ears in NY, basically in Cosa Nostra terms, he was the closest thing to Vito's "underboss". And killing him severely soured Rizzuto on the Bonannos. And theres more evidence that they simply just didn't get it by sending Montagna down there. He had to find out the hard way that while he may have been a mob boss in NY, in Montreal, he was nothing.

Either there's something off about the information you're giving or I had it wrong all along. Here are my issues with this post:

- Why would Giacomo Luppino appoint Stalteri to be the Camera Di Controllo for Toronto? As far as I'm concerned the Luppino family is not 'Ndrangheta, so Giacomo had no say in such matters.

- It's still unclear which family Calautti belonged to exactly. We do know that he was a 'Ndrangheta hitman and there's suspicion that he killed Vito's father (Though not confirmed), but it's unclear whether the Rizzuto's killed him or not. There's a chance that he was killed by one of the 'Ndrangheta families over internal 'Ndrangheta disputes in the area (The same goes for the Verduci hit).

- Not all 'Ndrangheta families were Vito's enemies, some were in fact allies. As a matter of fact the Commisso family were known to be a Rizzuto allies in the Toronto area, the DeMaria family on the other hand were known to be Vito's enemies. So this whole Commisso's and Cun-trera/Caruana's getting together is not all that surprising given the fact that besides alliance, there's business to be made.

I doubt we'll know the full truth, but I grew up in Hamilton and have lived in the Greater Toronto Area all my life, so let's just say that I hear things locally.

I didn't say the Rizzuto's killed him, but at a time where lines were clearly blurred, and the Sicilian/Calabrian beef were still reported to have been going on, it was just suspect that he was present at a Sicilian function when like I said, at the time he was one of the top five suspects for the murder of Nicolo Rizzuto. And seven months after Agostino was killed, assumingly by a Calabrian clan from the Greater Toronto Area. And literally everything I mentioned came from Antonio Nicaso and the Business or Blood book, of course you can't put everything put all your faith in print. But I'm almost certain the Luppino's were a Calabrian 'Ndrangheta clan mixed up with Maggadino's Ontario crew. And it was assumed back during those times that the Ontario Calabrian's were all just a part of Maggadino's Buffalo Mob, which over the years has proven to not be so accurate. And in most sources today, the Luppino's are identified as a Calabrian 'Ndrangheta clan.

According to Nicaso in 1962 Stalteri was elected to the position of Camera Di Controllo and the other calabrian bosses. I had have much reason to doubt that to be honest. The Comisso's have also mostly always been identified by the RCMP & the press has Rizzuto enemies, not exactly allies. During the time of Vito however, he had everyone working together, but once he went to prison, old feuds and vendetta's were pushed to forefront and it seems that working relationship between the Siciians & Calabrians, stalled for that moment in time. Like I said, you can't put everything in print, and I could be completely wrong about this, but I just don't think I am in this case (regarding everything I said in the above post.)

Here's another tidbit, Ken Murdock, the guy convicted for killing Pops Papalia on the orders of the Musitano's. It's always been suspected that the Rizzuto's perhaps backed the Musitano's in that hit and their attempts to establish themselves in Toronto by killing off other Calabrian's. Anyway, Murdock once told Crime Reporter James Dubro, that Pat Musitano "wanted to kill Remo Comisso, Johnny K9, the Luppino's and a host of other people. Pat was going crazy with this Godfather non-sense." Now that sentence doesn't put much into perspective but IF Vito were backing or at least had given his okay or his nod of approval toward the Musitano's plans, thats one thing to do away with the always peaceful relationship of the Rizzuto's & Comisso's.

I just assumed that since Sciascia was, in theory, the capo of the montreal crew and lived primarily in NYC that they would expect the same of Vito.

Brona, I actually think Calauti was hit by the Rizzuto faction simply for the fact it was thought through most circles that he was in fact the one to at least kill Nicolo Rizzuto. If not, he could have been given up under the theory of peace. Who knows at this point though.

I do think Verduci was not killed by the Rizzuto's though.

Slumpy, I just don't see Vito going to NYC. I'm not sure if the Rizzuto's even trusted NY, much less after George Sciascia was killed. I'm not even sure NY would take him being a capo either, but who knows. I just think at that point Vito didn't want to be in NY with the laws getting tougher and with RICO, etc. You have to remember that Canada is still in the 50's with their laws compared to the U.S.

Well me neither, which is why I question why they made the offer in the first place. It's just not plausible for Vito to move anywhere and I find highly unlikely that the Bonnanos thought anything different. Surely they knew what the situation was in Montreal and what killing Sciascia meant for their relationship with them.

Maybe they wouldn't have expected him to move, I don't know with any certainty, I'm just assuming that to be the case since Sciascia was a NYC resident. We agree it is likely Vito knew regardless of the precautions Massino took to hide the truth. it was probably just creating a layer of plausible deniability, even if it wasn't a very good one - Could be nobody ever expected Vito to take them up on the offer. If they act like nothing had changed than perhaps Vito would doubt his sources that Massino was behind the hit. It works. It wraps up the loose ends, but it leaves a lot to be desired as a plan. It leaves way too much to chance, and obviously Vito was having none of Joe's bullshit anyway.

Ultimately I question why Joe would even fear Vito finding out the truth. Fear of reprisal? Unlikely. Loss of business interest? Far more plausible. But if we operate under the knowledge that Montreal was establishing itself as an autonomous family with less connection the Bonnanos then there is strong motivation to want to off both Sciascia and Rizzuto, perhaps backing the old Cotroni faction in some way.


I guess my point is this:

if Joe knew the Rizzutos were for all intents and purposes their own family, why invite their boss to be the capo in a foreign borgata, even if he remains in Montreal? It seems unlikely to me that Massino thought that Montreal was still totally onboard up until the Sciascia hit. They must have been parting ways long before that.

But maybe that doesn't really matter so long as the drug connect is still operating through the Bonnanos. But if that's the case, then it still leaves the question: Why make the offer to Vito personally?

That's what bugs me. The offer doesn't seem to make much sense unless it's just a really bad plan. It would make far more sense had they asked Vito to send someone else, to take George's place. It almost seems like a backhanded insult, saying sort of like saying "being a capo in NY is better than being a boss in Montreal".

You have to remember that Vito still controlled the drug routes in and out of Montreal, and I imagine they were paying a pretty big tribute to Massino. He knew more than likely that if Vito found out they clipped Sciascia that they would either retaliate or quit kicking up. I'm sure he didn't quite worry about going to war with them, but he knew he would be losing a LOT of money if they pulled out which with that meeting and the empty chair it seems Sal got the idea with Vito turning down the promotion and when he seen the empty chair he knew their relationship was over.



You have to remember that Sal even admitted in court that they had no idea how many guys were even in the Montreal crew and that goes back to Vito keeping a low profile and his guys keeping a low profile.

The drug routes kept running, but the Bonanno's lost control after Sciascia and of course that catapulted Vito into what the family was just before Massino testified against him....



Sciascia had to come to NYC to report to Massino, Vito at that point did not. After Sciascia was killed there was no way he could get Vito into the U.S. to even kill him. Vito had too many ears and eyes in Canada for Massino to get anyone in there to get to Vito. Nobody in Canada would even try to clip Vito at that point and time.

But really all we can do at this point is guess because nobody has ever flipped up there and probably won't for a while. Until then almost everything is up in the air except Desjardins killing Montagna since he pled guilty to it and there is a publication ban on it....lol

Sciascia was simply the go-between for Montreal & NY during Vito's reign at the top. But he was a man of serious stature in Montreal. And I'm explaining why I think Massino made the capo offer, and it has to do with the NY Bonanno's simply being out of touch with Montreal. When Vitale went to Montreal for that meeting with Vito, Vitale asked how many "soldiers" the Montreal have, Vito responded by saying something along the lines of "we're our own little family. There's about 18, 20 of us, and we stay by ourselves and everybody respects everybody else"...When Vitale went back to NY, he reported to Massino, "They have their own little splinter group".

It was assumed by NY that Montreal didn't have that many made guys, they simply didn't know. There's two reasons for this, which reporters have put forward, one is that in Montreal, Vito didn't do the usual "making ceremonies", no one knows how exactly people were made during this period, but one thing is for sure, it wasn't the typical LCN way, especially in regards to NY, no lists were being passed up to NY with associates names on them, so simply, the guys in NY simply didn't know what the hell was going on with Montreal. Another reason is that this all took place in 2001, the FBI had begun to hit the Mafia, the Bonanno's included so hard with indictments, that they just simply didn't have the manpower to keep up with current events in places outside of NY.

Another thing, Vitale says that Montreal used to kick up big, but the last time he personally saw any envelopes coming from Montreal was around '98-'99. They were still kicking up right up until Sciascia got hit, and then it all stopped. With that said, it becomes a bit more clearer why Massino made a capo offer to Vito, he wanted to keep the money coming in, and he simply did not know how powerful and independent the former Montreal Crew had become. And it's not just Massino, but it continued with Sal Montagna, and he had to find out the hard way that NY had no say in what was going on, he couldn't just come in and takeover because nobody in the Montreal Mafia cared that he was a Bonanno boss. They were the Montreal Mafia, and they put that first, they valued their own relationships over that of an outsiders, and NY simply did not know that.

I don't understand why people think Vito and massino wasn't on good terms untill George gets killed. He new Joe wasnt a joke he was with him when they slaughtered the 3 capos and got all there men to get inline. Vito new he had 100 + guys. Read some book were Vito was caught on a wire helping vinny ocean of the decav family smuggling Persian rugs into USA to get around some type of taxes. So he was probaly doing little deals with all the families. There's probaly alot of other relationships then just the bonanno family.

Don't know where you heard half of this, but it's not entirely accurate. No one ever said Rizzuto & Massino weren't on good terms. Like I said, prior to Sciascia being killed, Montreal was kicking up to NY, but it began to become less and less of a tribute. After Sciascia dies, the envelopes stop coming, period. Both Vitale & Massino testimony supports this fact as they both stated such. With Vitale going as far to say the last time he personally seen a kick up from Montreal was '98 or '99.


Vito Rizzuto never met Vinny Ocean, and Vito was never caught on a wire discussing him or any other Decavalcante Family member. And not ever about helping them. That also isn't true. What actually happened, was Sal Vitale brought that deal forward to Vito Rizzuto in one of his trips to Montreal in '92. Palermo knew that at that time, Bonanno still exerted control over Montreal. Because of this, he solicited Vitale's help, seeing as he was acting Bonanno underboss, in recruiting the Montreal guys in a scheme to import and export Persian rugs. US had an embargoe on Persian rugs, Canada didn't. All it simply was, using Vitale as a middleman, the DeCav's sent someone to NY, who was then sent to Montreal, to simply pick up the rugs, and bring them back. That was all. And Vito or any of the other members of his administration and close circle, ever personally transported the rugs themselves. Again, Vito Rizzuto and Vincent "Vinny Ocean" Palermo, never met.

And there isn't much to support the Rizzuto's dealing with any of the other families outside of the Bonanno's, the Gambino's, and very recently in a singular situation, the Lucchese's. Of course though, they loosely did business with all the families due to their position in the Pizza Connection.

Ya Sinatra I read that in that book 6 the family probaly 5 years ago I don't really remember it to good. I didn't no there a embargo on them rugs weird. I agree with basically everything else once they killed vitos best friend George he ended his relationship with massino. They tried to play him like a sucker no respect. I guess George only had 1 soldier in NYC baldo amato of the pizza trial fame. Sal vitale met him in a dinner and gave him the bogus story to that the family didn't OK the hit.

It was really just New York arrogance, and aloofness, if they were serious about maintaining Montreal, they shoulda had Their own man up there like Vito had his in NewYork..
What do you guys think about that Gambino arrest with Lupoi? Are the Bonnanos fronting for the Gambinos, with the Gambinos securing the loads, the Bonnanos taking the heat for both the Gambinos and Canada?
What I've been wondering for the longest is, was that bust a continuation of the Old Bridge operation, where they were basically trying to "reactivate" the Sicilian mob, or did they go where the money goes and do business with the Calabrians?
Like the calabrians had direct ties to Colombia, but they have been usurped by the Mexicans. So how does this all work exactly?
Is it that the Mexicans are trying to move into New York, but can't make inroads with the Dominicans there? Soooo, they form a relationship with the mob to ship Coke outta the country. Here is what I don't get, they have been getting Coke from South America and sending it to Spain, West Africa, that big port in Calabria, what ever one is friendly at the moment,so why do they now need to ship it through New York?
It could be that whatever route they were using has been compromised, so they need a reliable partner in the states to facilitate the deal. This is why I keep asking the question, did Cali replace Rizzuto in the great scheme of Italian American Narcotics trafficking?
He has the pedigree, the stature, the front (his food companies) connections, family ties, ect... Where does the Queens/Calabrian/Genovese thing fit in?
It's like they are making New York, Thier Montreal, a transshipment point for their Coke going out the country....
Any thought on any of this?

Thanks for the posts Dix and Sinatra, it's been a very interesting conversation. Is there any place I can read Massino's testimony?

There might have been a little of it in the first Rizzuto book but I have yet to see anything showing the whole testimony though.

Yes I love threads like these. Me and Sinatra have disagreed before, but we always kept it clean and classy and I respect that. Like I told him in the other thread, I'm eating my words now and he was right about Leonardo Rizzuto running things. I would say at this point it's easily Leonardo running things with Stefano Sollecito as his underboss and his Father Rocco being in the consigliere role.

The Mexicans have greatly increased their presence in the Northeast in recent years, including New York. Colombians are still the main suppliers in New York City but Mexican and Dominican groups are bigger in the rest of the state. But the Mexicans are now the dominant traffickers as far north as Philadelphia and are the main suppliers of heroin in New Jersey. They've already started supplying Dominican groups in some cases. Both the Colombians and Mexicans still depend a lot on the Dominicans to middle the drugs. This is all according to the most recent NDTA and HIDTA reports. Incidentally, the Colombians simply relinquished control of most of the smuggling into and distribution within the US to the Mexicans, choosing to take the safer, more insulated role of manufacture and supply.

The Mexican cartels formed partnerships with the Ndrangheta because it knows the lay of the land in Europe and controls distribution routes. I'm not sure how much, relactively speaking, gets shipped through NY (seems like a big and unnecessary risk) unless NY is the destination. The recent Queens bust that alleged Genovese financing wasnt the first example. Back in 2008 some Genovese associates were also caught up in Operation Solare that targeted the Gulf Cartel and Ndrangheta. The 2014 bust of the Ndrangheta which you mentioned, and included associates of the Gambinos and Bonannos, was similar.

I'm not sure how much there really was to the whole "reactivating the Sicilian drug pipeline" of Old Bridge. That bust did result in both the American LCN and and Italian OC groups being mentioned in the 2009 NDTA but not much since then, including no mention at all in the 2015 report. The Gambinos are still involved in the drug trade as much or more than any other family but I don't think Cali taken Rizzuto's place in that respect.

luppinos/violis are same family by marriage. fall under the umbrella and control of Ontario clans.
musitanos had close relationship with verducci, which might explain their house being firebombed?
when u consider verducci represented the colluccio clan who are allegedly at war with the fiolomeni clans here in Toronto.
there is still a lot we don't know.

most of the articles out there always blame the Montreal Toronto angle, especially when calutti and verducci got killed. but both these hits could have been internal disputes, using the montreal angle to the plotters advantage. meaning it would automatically, seem like these hits were revenge from rizzutto.

if we are to believe rizzutto was as crafty and smart as they say he was. no way he would of ordered a hit on calutti in woodbridge 2min away from a cop station, no matter how vengeful he was at the time. it was said at the time that verducci was killed b/c he was trying to take over territory in Vaughan that montreal had controlled. its more likely verducci was trying to take over calutti's gambling territory after he was killed. reports are verducci was allegedly plotted against by the filomeni;s. which might make a good case that sam worked for the filomeni clans and two others. (demaria, commisso)
point being I would not read too much into the articles.

I think u are seeing chaos in the Toronto ranks as 2 of the big bosses are no longer on the streets: demaria in jail, abrruzze deported.

The reality of it is, it's all theories. You say you wouldn't put too much into articles, yet you're basing your theory as more correct, based on a report, the same thing you just said not to read too much into...I don't understand that.

Its been said Rizzuto wasn't the same man he was coming home as he was going away. He was driven by vengeance, not business and being methodical. Look at Ducarme Joseph, one of the last victims. His own people claimed he wasn't involved with Nicks murder, yet according to Adrian Humphrey's almost every Mafia soldier in Montreal did. Not only that but he was almost undoubtedly in collusion with Montagna as it was his soldiers picking up the extortion tabs for Montagna. Joseph was done in, in a way that wasn't common with Vito and his usual ways, he was murdered in broad daylight, much like Nick Jr. Was penetrated with machine gun fire and his lieutenant and store manager was also hit. It didn't fit the pattern of Vito Rizzuto & Montreal Mafiosi, yet, they're the prime suspect in his murder.


For what it's worth, I think Verduci's murder was the first shot in a friction between the Coluccio & Figliomeni clans. This theory is supported by wiretaps from Italy, and reports from Adrian Humphrey's. Things kicked up between those two clans only after Verduci was hit. Because of this, and the fact that Calautti is among the main suspects in the murder of Nicolo Rizzuto & Agostino [BadWord], I still believe Calautti was hit by Rizzuto loyalists.

Again, like I said, it's all theory.

UR RIGHT. MY POST WAS INFLUENCED FROM RECENT REPORTS. SHOULD HAVE EXPLAINED IT BETTER. ALL THEORIES IS CORRECT, WE CAN SPECULATE ALL WE WANT, BUT THE TRUTH IS WE WILL NEVER KNOW THE FACTS, UNLESS SOMEONE FIPPS.

It remains in the cell sidernese Jimmy De Maria, among the most influential boss overseas






Tue, 01/13/2015 - 11:15



interesting article from Italy

http://www.larivieraonline.com/resta-cella-il-sidernese-jimmy-de-maria-tra-i-boss-più-influenti-doltreoceano



He took part in the summit of the 'Ndrangheta, despite an obligation not to offenders. For this reason, the Court of Toronto decided that Vincent "Jimmy" De Maria remains in jail. Writes this morning Pasquale Violi on the newspaper of Calabria. De Maria was arrested in November of 2013 after breaking his probation. Sidernesi origins, considered a "top player" the Siderno Group, Jimmy is among the most respected and influential boss of Missisuaga, a Toronto area stronghold of the 'Ndrangheta from across the ocean. Along with Carmelo Bruzzese, who was also in custody in Canada, it is one of the people closest to Carmine Verduci, boss axis Locri-Toronto, was killed during an ambush in Woodbrige in April 2014.

https://nationalpost.com/news/teflo...aly-as-federal-court-overturns-irb-order

Teflon Don of Canada dodges deportation to Italy as federal court overturns IRB order

Interesting Jimmy was said to be one of the main rivals of Vito Rizzuto.

This guy is ridiculously low key. He has LE, tax authorities and everyone imaginable surveilling him, yet he is a big time boss.