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Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years

Posted By: Krsheely

Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/11/15 05:35 AM

Which of the five families and even Chicago and Philly are best primed to either prosper the most or at the least maintain the best? I would say Genovese but they have a lot of very old higher ups other than Barney. Do they have enough capable schooled young guys or not so old guys at least?
The Gambinos? I know they have finally shaken off the gotti weight n it's back. Are the Sicilians and the remaining old school guys as well as the capable gotti captains the way to go in the future.
Luchesse,Colombo, bonnano?
Posted By: IvyLeague

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/11/15 06:44 AM

If we are picking a single family, it would undoubtedly be the Genovese. A real argument can't be made about any other family (even the Gambinos who are a strong #2), especially those remaining outside New York who's relatively small recruiting pools continue to shrink.
Posted By: domwoods74

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/11/15 03:45 PM

In my opinion 3 . Genovese , gambino and lucchese , there rest r fighting for scraps
Posted By: Skinny

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/11/15 04:26 PM

the west side has plenty of young guys. Not just barney, guys like pagano, dipietra, al generosa, stevie arena, steve buscemi is a younger guy who was a shylock under the ianniellos, hippy gets out in a few years, etc. Gambinos will better off too. just my opinion, good topic!
Posted By: Serpiente

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/11/15 05:07 PM

I agree with the others above . But not knowing much about all the families I would have to say it's staying as it is .The one thing all of them have going for them that has not been ,is that they have more coming out of prison then going in. How long this is aloud by LE never know . But one thing I do know that the young guys need role models . It just makes it much more the way it was before ,and was ment to be.Very ugly the way it has gotten to be . The quality of guys is very important in that life . From what I have seen it was the first thing to go . They always had a few in each family ,they were usually the hitters and the smart more classy guy was your earner . But when that balance gets out of whack other things follow.
Posted By: pizzaboy

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/11/15 05:28 PM

Originally Posted By: Skinny
the west side has plenty of young guys. Not just barney

Barney's almost 60, looks every day of it, and he's still not nearly as active as he was before his wife died.

I get everyone's point, but he's a grandfather. People act like he's still the Boy Wonder. But I agree with Skinny's assessment that they have some young guys. The two guys they just made who are with the guy running QD's crew are both in their late 40's. That's young for them.

Originally Posted By: IvyLeague
If we are picking a single family, it would undoubtedly be the Genovese.

I agree.

Originally Posted By: IvyLeague
A real argument can't be made about any other family (even the Gambinos who are a strong #2)

You won't believe it until you read it in a press release or in Jerry's column, and that's fine. It's your prerogative, you're entitled to it, and I've always given you the respect that you deserve.

But if you're talking about a strong number two, there are areas (especially in the Bronx and in Westchester), where the Luccheses aren't just number 2. To put it into horse racing parlance, they're 1A.

The Luccheses are tied at the hip to the Westside. So if you're saying that the Westside is going to be strong ten years from now (and who really knows anyway?), then you shouldn't discount the Luccheses. My two cents.
Posted By: moneyman

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/11/15 05:35 PM

It's interesting to think about where the Gambino's will be in 5-10 years, their admin looks solid and seems to made up of guys who know the deal - ie not Peter or Junior Gotti

Columbo's look like the first family that will become insolvent.
Posted By: pmac

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/11/15 07:35 PM

Outside of NYC I think merlino will still be boss in 5 and as charismatic as he is the guys a born leader and probly build a small army down philly Florida and south jersey.
Posted By: Vknicks

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/11/15 07:38 PM

Like Pizza said it has to be the Genovese and Lucchese, and i think a big reason is the are where they operate the Bronx is so different from the other boroughs, the bigger poverty leads to more crime which leads to LE having to focus on more violent crimes which leaves many of the bookmakers, pot dealers, loan sharks and other OC activities to operate more openly
Posted By: pizzaboy

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/11/15 07:57 PM

Originally Posted By: Vknicks
Like Pizza said it has to be the Genovese and Lucchese, and i think a big reason is the are where they operate the Bronx is so different from the other boroughs, the bigger poverty leads to more crime which leads to LE having to focus on more violent crimes which leaves many of the bookmakers, pot dealers, loan sharks and other OC activities to operate more openly

That's a big part of it and perfect examples of there being more blue collar LCN guys left in the Bronx and Westchester than in Manhattan and Queens (there are practically zero in Manhattan).

However, it's the construction partnerships that I'm referring to when it comes to the white collar money. They're incredibly profitable, completely legit and unbreakable.

The partnerships that the DiNapolis formed with Stevie and the old Salerno and Prince Street Crews back in the '80s are still honored, alive and well, and built on solid enough legal ground that the Feds can't touch them (unless they start inventing new laws, which is par for the course for agents and prosecutors in Federal Government).
Posted By: mightyhealthy

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/11/15 08:00 PM

I didn't realize they were completely legal.

I figured that kind of defeats the purpose. Why even bother being a boss/captain if you're making that kind of legit cash?
Posted By: Serpiente

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/11/15 08:03 PM

Originally Posted By: pmac
Outside of NYC I think merlino will still be boss in 5 and as charismatic as he is the guys a born leader and probly build a small army down philly Florida and south jersey.


Pmac you are very smart when it comes to OC ,but you are dead wrong with this guy.
Posted By: mightyhealthy

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/11/15 08:05 PM

If Merlino has built a small army in the next 2 years, he'll be in jail for life.
Posted By: pizzaboy

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/11/15 08:07 PM

Originally Posted By: mightyhealthy
I didn't realize they were completely legal.

I figured that kind of defeats the purpose. Why even bother being a boss/captain if you're making that kind of legit cash?

It's not 1950 anymore. If you don't have a solid legit business showing real money, you're not gonna make it. John Gotti couldn't operate with his "I didn't get a button to open a construction company" attitude. Not that he made it all that far anyway.
Posted By: mightyhealthy

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/11/15 08:11 PM

I guess what I mean is -- why bother with the other LCN stuff if you're making so much money legit? If a guy like Crea is smart enough to avoid violence because of heat, why even get close to the illegal stuff?
Posted By: Longislandguy14

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/11/15 08:13 PM

Originally Posted By: mightyhealthy
I guess what I mean is -- why bother with the other LCN stuff if you're making so much money legit? If a guy like Crea is smart enough to avoid violence because of heat, why even get close to the illegal stuff?

My guess is if you use your lcn connections to start a few successful businesses then act like you don't want to do lcn business after starting these businesses it's probably frowned upon.
Posted By: mightyhealthy

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/11/15 08:14 PM

Yeah, I figured, also figured that some of these top guys that have done time are respected enough to back away. Maybe they have?
Posted By: Longislandguy14

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/11/15 08:15 PM

Yea agreed
Posted By: pizzaboy

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/11/15 08:17 PM

Originally Posted By: pmac
Outside of NYC I think merlino will still be boss in 5 and as charismatic as he is the guys a born leader and probly build a small army down philly Florida and south jersey.

Aside from the fact that Merlino will probably be serving a Predicate RICO in five years, do you have any idea how many New York wiseguys are living part-time in Palm Beach and Broward Counties?

I hope he retires, but do you think Vinny Artuso and the Gambinos are just gonna let Joey build a "small army" when Vinny comes home next year? They have thirty guys in that area RIGHT NOW.

You could be right about Philly. I don't know and I don't care. My interest Merlino is recent, and it's only due to the fact that he lives close by when we're in Florida.

Posted By: mightyhealthy

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/11/15 08:18 PM

Yeah, I think pmac is dreaming about Philly/Merlino.
Posted By: pizzaboy

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/11/15 08:21 PM

Originally Posted By: mightyhealthy
If a guy like Crea is smart enough to avoid violence because of heat, why even get close to the illegal stuff?

Who says he does?

He leaves Jersey to Jersey, the street to the street (meaning the blue collar stuff), and his bread and butter is construction. Always has been, always will be. That's why he's so popular among the rank and file.
Posted By: mightyhealthy

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/11/15 08:22 PM

Originally Posted By: pizzaboy
Originally Posted By: mightyhealthy
If a guy like Crea is smart enough to avoid violence because of heat, why even get close to the illegal stuff?

Who says he does?

He leaves Jersey to Jersey, the street to the street (meaning the blue collar stuff), and his bread and butter is construction. Always has been, always will be. That's why he's so popular among the rank and file.


I don't know if he does. Maybe he doesn't. That would be the smart thing. I'm assuming the Feds are gunning for him.

EDIT: That said, I'd imagine people are kicking up to him... and those guys aren't clean... again just speculation
Posted By: pizzaboy

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/11/15 08:25 PM

Originally Posted By: Longislandguy14
Originally Posted By: mightyhealthy
I guess what I mean is -- why bother with the other LCN stuff if you're making so much money legit? If a guy like Crea is smart enough to avoid violence because of heat, why even get close to the illegal stuff?

My guess is if you use your lcn connections to start a few successful businesses then act like you don't want to do lcn business after starting these businesses it's probably frowned upon.

Again, Stevie's bread and butter was ALWAYS construction. He didn't get off as a street goon and THEN get into the demolition and building field.
Posted By: Serpiente

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/11/15 08:30 PM

PB was Stevie sought after cos he was doing so well in construction. Or did he always hang in the company of gangsters .
Posted By: pizzaboy

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/11/15 08:32 PM

Originally Posted By: mightyhealthy
I'm assuming the Feds are gunning for him.

Of course, they are. But with no murders, and the way he's mastered the plea bargain, the damage wouldn't be too bad. And that's assuming they have anything on him. He doesn't talk to many people these days wink.

Originally Posted By: mightyhealthy
EDIT: That said, I'd imagine people are kicking up to him.

He wouldn't be much of a boss if they weren't lol.
Posted By: domwoods74

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/11/15 08:47 PM

I know crea gets the credit for stabalizing the lucchese family , but I think some of that should go to bagels , he seemed to steady the ship after the brooklyn morons , d'arco and defede did what they did
Posted By: pizzaboy

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/11/15 08:49 PM

Originally Posted By: Serpiente
PB was Stevie sought after cos he was doing so well in construction. Or did he always hang in the company of gangsters .

The Feds didn't even know he was until Little Al flipped.

I'm exaggerating, of course, because he had already been named as an unindicted co-conspirator in one of Vinny DiNapoli's cases prior to that.

But when D'Arco told the Feds that Stevie had more construction projects than Sammy Gravano, it really set them off. You have to remember, this was the post-Gotti, gang busting '90s. If you were connected to LCN and you had money, the Feds wanted to seize it for themselves.
Posted By: Serpiente

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/11/15 08:57 PM

Originally Posted By: pizzaboy
Originally Posted By: Serpiente
PB was Stevie sought after cos he was doing so well in construction. Or did he always hang in the company of gangsters .

The Feds didn't even know he was until Little Al flipped.

I'm exaggerating, of course, because he had already been named as an unindicted co-conspirator in one of Vinny DiNapoli's cases prior to that.

But when D'Arco told the Feds that Stevie had more construction projects than Sammy Gravano, it really set them off. You have to remember, this was the post-Gotti, gang busting '90s. If you were connected to LCN and you had money, the Feds wanted to seize it for themselves.


Of course they do . But was he just a working guy and someone came to him ? or was he always involved one way or another ?
Posted By: pizzaboy

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/11/15 09:05 PM

Originally Posted By: Serpiente
or was he always involved one way or another ?

He was "born with friends." I won't cross that line, and I know you respect that because there's a line you won't cross yourself. And that's why I respect you.

But I want to make one thing PERFECTLY clear. He was never a punk. And to the posters who keep stressing his non-violent approach, well, all I can say is, you didn't know him thirty years ago. Like there was never any violence where construction bids were concerned. The guy was a beast with his hands. The perfect combination of businessman and tough guy. And it's served him well.
Posted By: Skinny

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/11/15 11:48 PM

he was a former boxer just like chin
Posted By: Serpiente

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/12/15 12:06 AM

Originally Posted By: pizzaboy
Originally Posted By: Serpiente
or was he always involved one way or another ?

He was "born with friends." I won't cross that line, and I know you respect that because there's a line you won't cross yourself. And that's why I respect you.

But I want to make one thing PERFECTLY clear. He was never a punk. And to the posters who keep stressing his non-violent approach, well, all I can say is, you didn't know him thirty years ago. Like there was never any violence where construction bids were concerned. The guy was a beast with his hands. The perfect combination of businessman and tough guy. And it's served him well.


Understood PB thanks
Posted By: pizzaboy

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/12/15 12:09 AM

Originally Posted By: Skinny
he was a former boxer just like chin

Yup. He trained at Joey DeDuardia's old gym in Morris Park for years (the old location run by the real Joey DeGuardia, not his son the promoter).

The son's a nice guy, though. Real smart. He's a lawyer. Started out as a Bronx D.A, which pissed off a lot of people lol.

Anyway, Stevie had great hands.They're bigger now than they were years ago. That happens a lot with ex-boxers. But he's aged quite a bit. That last picture that someone posted isn't even accurate anymore. But fuck, the guy's pushing 70. What do you expect?
Posted By: cookcounty

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/12/15 12:20 AM

if chicago re-shuffled their administration then they'll definitely be around

chicago has always been ran like a corporation so it'll be hard to stop

especially when the don has construction contracts at chicago public schools
Posted By: Rocco1313

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/12/15 12:39 AM

Is Crea originally from the Bronx or Harlem?

Also was the Prince street crew always involved with construction or did that start with Dom Truscello?
Posted By: pmac

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/12/15 12:44 AM

No body agrees if merlino not in jail he still boss of the philly family and they'll still be moving in a better direction in 5yrs. Look at all the bosses he the youngest did a shit load of time and is off restriction and could meet an go anywhere he wants.
Posted By: pizzaboy

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/12/15 12:56 AM

Originally Posted By: pmac
Look at all the bosses he the youngest did a shit load of time and is off restriction and could meet an go anywhere he wants.

And that's what will put him back in a cage.

But I don't want to gang up on you, pmac, You're a great kid who never starts trouble here. That's rare, and I'm always quick to point that out. So as far as Joey goes, we'll just agree to disagree.

And we almost never go to Florida during the summer, but you never know. So make sure you tell me when you're gonna be down there.
Posted By: mightyhealthy

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/12/15 01:18 AM

PB, would Crea ever consider backing off a leadership role to keep the heat off and focus solely on construction?

I mean, they are already diverting some heat on Amuso. But I mean really dialing it back. He isn't a kid, you know?
Posted By: DB

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/12/15 01:30 AM

I agree with PB and have always thought very highly of the Luchesse

And think they and the WS have more or less figured this thing out quicker then

Most in terms of having numerous legit organizations across many different industries from construction companies to arm machines lol that make a lot of legit money and
Truth be told are far less harmful to people then the legit companies on Wall Street . Plus the whole plea thing but what sets them apart from the others is they are businessmen today . The cowboy gangster days are over , sure there are plenty out there , but they don't last long .

It does seem tho that the Gambinos have regrouped
Posted By: pizzaboy

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/12/15 01:30 AM

Originally Posted By: mightyhealthy
PB, would Crea ever consider backing off a leadership role to keep the heat off and focus solely on construction?

He's already given up the street shit, and his focus IS solely on construction today. And I think that he will eventually retire, but not anytime soon. He's CN to the bone.

Originally Posted By: mightyhealthy
I mean, they are already diverting some heat on Amuso.

Capeci and the cops tickling the wire. If Vic's still "official" boss, it's in name only.

Originally Posted By: mightyhealthy
But I mean really dialing it back. He isn't a kid, you know?

I'm done talking about him.
Posted By: pizzaboy

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/12/15 01:42 AM

Originally Posted By: DB
Truth be told are far less harmful to people then the legit companies on Wall Street.

I agree with you. But the Feds will NEVER----EVER----look at it from that point of view. There are too many Wall Street types who are partnered with the American Government. The same Government that pays the Feds' salaries.

They're never backing off LCN. Terrorism or not, Mafia busts still make for one of the top two or three biggest press conferences. And that's what these politically motivated prosecutors live for--press conferences. The smarter guys get it. If they keep it where it is (semi-legit), they'll be fine.
Posted By: pmac

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/12/15 01:45 AM

The national hotel resort 18 august. We didn't get the rental. Cause every one said its hard to find parking everything in walking. 650 for me 650 for her. Please no hurricanes or tropicals. Only 5 days. I not from philly just give the guy credit. He's not Jr gotti got to give him that. He probably isn't the boss anyway.its probably gonna be hot as shit. And as far as new England big cheese n his bro if they don't have massive heart attack s there in charge. 5 yrs amuso crea and Madonna probably dead. Name a successor. Go golden state.
Posted By: DB

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/12/15 01:48 AM

Your 100% accurate and a big reason is Wall Street pays congressmen to keep LE of them

Pre credit crisis their lobby's wrote most of the financial laws , not our politicians but their lawyers and lobbyists and those days will be back sooner rather than later

If CN had a re do , that RICO law never would of passed as they would of paid to stop it and it didn't hurt them for awhile until they lost control of the judges , prosecutors , other LE etc.
Posted By: pmac

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/12/15 01:49 AM

Got pastrami greese on my shirt the rubbish.
Posted By: DB

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/12/15 01:49 AM

And they will keep it semi legit , or at least the groups you mentioned
Posted By: pizzaboy

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/12/15 01:52 AM

Originally Posted By: pmac
The national hotel resort 18 august.

Older hotel but a classic. Recently renovated and gorgeous. Every hotel within ten blocks has a great pool bar. Check out as many as you can.
Posted By: mightyhealthy

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/12/15 02:42 AM

Ok, sorry if I asked too many specific questions. I know you're in the thick of things, not trying to put you in a bad position!

Thanks for the insight. Always much appreciated.
Posted By: mightyhealthy

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/12/15 02:42 AM

Agreed on the Amuso in name only thing. Still smart though
Posted By: mightyhealthy

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/12/15 02:45 AM

DB, even post crisis, they wrote all of the laws. Dodd Frank was gutted. Pussy law. Accounting control fraud and looting should be larger LE concers than these LCN guys, without a doubt
Posted By: pizzaboy

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/12/15 03:04 AM

Originally Posted By: mightyhealthy
DB, even post crisis, they wrote all of the laws. Dodd Frank was gutted. Pussy law. Accounting control fraud and looting should be larger LE concers than these LCN guys, without a doubt

All true. You boys are both bright and very well versed on the inner workings of the financial world. Kudos on that.

But if Joe Bonanno doesn't write that egotistical whitewash pile of horseshit book, Rudy Giuliani doesn't read it, the Commission Case never happens, and RICO probably goes the way of the jaywalking ticket.
Posted By: mightyhealthy

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/12/15 03:26 AM

Thanks, PB. That's why I'm not very partisan. Both parties are financial and business oriented.
Posted By: Serpiente

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/12/15 06:43 PM

Originally Posted By: pizzaboy
Originally Posted By: mightyhealthy
DB, even post crisis, they wrote all of the laws. Dodd Frank was gutted. Pussy law. Accounting control fraud and looting should be larger LE concers than these LCN guys, without a doubt

All true. You boys are both bright and very well versed on the inner workings of the financial world. Kudos on that.

But if Joe Bonanno doesn't write that egotistical whitewash pile of horseshit book, Rudy Giuliani doesn't read it, the Commission Case never happens, and RICO probably goes the way of the jaywalking ticket.


Right on PB, this is why they had the rules they had . The slightest slip of the lip can bring big consequences ,and that's just what went down.
All through the 90's they were lose lipped and into the 2000 's also . It just is now starting that they are making the adjustments they should have made in 89.
And even though it will never be like it was ,at least the ones that are in it for the right reasons(if there is any) may be able to look each other in the eye.

On top of it all Giuliani is doing a series on A&E on the MOB and how they brought it down.
Carmine is HOT ! You know what he is thinking ...
Posted By: Alfa Romeo

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/12/15 07:14 PM

Originally Posted By: Serpiente
I agree with the others above . But not knowing much about all the families I would have to say it's staying as it is .The one thing all of them have going for them that has not been ,is that they have more coming out of prison then going in. How long this is aloud by LE never know . But one thing I do know that the young guys need role models . It just makes it much more the way it was before ,and was ment to be.Very ugly the way it has gotten to be . The quality of guys is very important in that life . From what I have seen it was the first thing to go . They always had a few in each family ,they were usually the hitters and the smart more classy guy was your earner . But when that balance gets out of whack other things follow.


Serpiente, you said something interesting in there, at least to me. You said too many hitters, no good, and too many classy money earners, no good. I can use my imagination concerning the too many hitters. But what is the usual outcome when you have too many classy earners? I honestly don't know.
Posted By: Serpiente

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/12/15 07:23 PM

Originally Posted By: Alfa Romeo
Originally Posted By: Serpiente
I agree with the others above . But not knowing much about all the families I would have to say it's staying as it is .The one thing all of them have going for them that has not been ,is that they have more coming out of prison then going in. How long this is aloud by LE never know . But one thing I do know that the young guys need role models . It just makes it much more the way it was before ,and was ment to be.Very ugly the way it has gotten to be . The quality of guys is very important in that life . From what I have seen it was the first thing to go . They always had a few in each family ,they were usually the hitters and the smart more classy guy was your earner . But when that balance gets out of whack other things follow.


Serpiente, you said something interesting in there, at least to me. You said too many hitters, no good, and too many classy money earners, no good. I can use my imagination concerning the too many hitters. But what is the usual outcome when you have too many classy earners? I honestly don't know.


No real logic" behind it other then they, start scratching" and clawing" at each other . Just look at the gas scam with Michael Franzese he started out alone" before it was over there were 3 or 4 families" going after the same racket.
That's just one of thousands ,and most times guys die from the good ones.
And or get so greedy they get busted because of the greed and then it moves up the chain..
Posted By: Alfa Romeo

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/12/15 07:34 PM

Originally Posted By: Serpiente

No real logic" behind it other then they, start scratching" and clawing" at each other . Just look at the gas scam with Michael Franzese he started out alone" before it was over there were 3 or 4 families" going after the same racket.
That's just one of thousands ,and most times guys die from the good ones.
And or get so greedy they get busted because of the greed and then it moves up the chain..


Aha. Thanks for explaining that. I remember the gasoline tax scam. And the way M Franzese explained it on TV was hilarious. But yeah, that was some kind of animal that was too big for him to ever tame. I also agree with you that too many schemers and successful schemes makes for a much stronger RICO case.
Posted By: Serpiente

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/12/15 07:51 PM

Then it is just like dope ,they want to give the guy 50 years and then the whole thing comes down.

I have no way of knowing but it seams to me that they are learning to insulate the from top to bottom .

Let's face it if a guy only knows the skippers name and never here's his voice no jury in the world can convict.
It take time for that kind of insulation to develop .
And only if LE let's it happen or if they would go after these other guys that are a real threat to our immediate well being.
But that's in my head ,that's the way I grew up .
Posted By: IvyLeague

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/12/15 07:57 PM

Originally Posted By: pizzaboy
You won't believe it until you read it in a press release or in Jerry's column, and that's fine. It's your prerogative, you're entitled to it, and I've always given you the respect that you deserve.

But if you're talking about a strong number two, there are areas (especially in the Bronx and in Westchester), where the Luccheses aren't just number 2. To put it into horse racing parlance, they're 1A.

The Luccheses are tied at the hip to the Westside. So if you're saying that the Westside is going to be strong ten years from now (and who really knows anyway?), then you shouldn't discount the Luccheses. My two cents.


Well, I'm talking about overall. The Gambinos are still twice the size of the Luccheses. And statements by the FBI in recent years put the Gambinos at #2. I don't discount the Luccheses but I don't think any of the three smaller families have ever broken into the top two spots, but simply fluctuated among themselves for #3, 4, and 5. It's one of the few times I disagreed with the feds, some of which said back in the early 2000's that the Bonannos had become the #2 family in NY.
Posted By: Alfa Romeo

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/12/15 08:23 PM

Originally Posted By: pizzaboy
Originally Posted By: mightyhealthy
DB, even post crisis, they wrote all of the laws. Dodd Frank was gutted. Pussy law. Accounting control fraud and looting should be larger LE concers than these LCN guys, without a doubt

All true. You boys are both bright and very well versed on the inner workings of the financial world. Kudos on that.

But if Joe Bonanno doesn't write that egotistical whitewash pile of horseshit book, Rudy Giuliani doesn't read it, the Commission Case never happens, and RICO probably goes the way of the jaywalking ticket.


Pizza, I have a different take on that scenario.

If Joe Bonanno doesn't write the book, Giuliani doesn't step in to take over Walter Mack's operation to suck up the credit, then instead of a Commission case where only the top guys plus Whack Whack go down, instead Walter Mack cleans out Ozone Park, Bensonhurst, and where ever wiseguys thrive becomes wiped out like Detroit. Ghost town.

In other words, Giuliani protected the mob.
Posted By: Binnie_Coll

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/12/15 10:22 PM

Originally Posted By: Alfa Romeo
Originally Posted By: pizzaboy
Originally Posted By: mightyhealthy
DB, even post crisis, they wrote all of the laws. Dodd Frank was gutted. Pussy law. Accounting control fraud and looting should be larger LE concers than these LCN guys, without a doubt

All true. You boys are both bright and very well versed on the inner workings of the financial world. Kudos on that.

But if Joe Bonanno doesn't write that egotistical whitewash pile of horseshit book, Rudy Giuliani doesn't read it, the Commission Case never happens, and RICO probably goes the way of the jaywalking ticket.


Pizza, I have a different take on that scenario.

If Joe Bonanno doesn't write the book, Giuliani doesn't step in to take over Walter Mack's operation to suck up the credit, then instead of a Commission case where only the top guys plus Whack Whack go down, instead Walter Mack cleans out Ozone Park, Bensonhurst, and where ever wiseguys thrive becomes wiped out like Detroit. Ghost town.

In other words, Giuliani protected the mob.


interesting take alfa, I see your point, the top guys go down but, the organization is still active, and well.

mack goes after the source, and busts it all up.

something else if that would have happened to the top guys in Chicago , or new Orleans, Giuliani would have been dead.
Posted By: pizzaboy

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/12/15 11:06 PM

Originally Posted By: Alfa Romeo
Pizza, I have a different take on that scenario.

Of course, you do.

Originally Posted By: Alfa Romeo
If Joe Bonanno doesn't write the book, Giuliani doesn't step in to take over Walter Mack's operation to suck up the credit, then instead of a Commission case where only the top guys plus Whack Whack go down, instead Walter Mack cleans out Ozone Park, Bensonhurst, and where ever wiseguys thrive becomes wiped out like Detroit. Ghost town.

Giuliani's mission is life was to break the mob. And although he failed, he did quite a bit of damage because he understood their mentality. Walter mack doesn't.

It's like when, pre-Donnie Brasco, they'd drop off agents from Wyoming on Mulberry Street and expect them to not get noticed. The old ladies were yelling out their windows in three minutes. Fact. My Uncle had a club on Baxter. I'd see the old coots yelling with my own eyes "dey cummin, dey cummin."

Originally Posted By: Alfa Romeo
In other words, Giuliani protected the mob.

Please. Protected my ass. How many of YOUR fucking relatives did he put away? The man I look up to most in the world, outside of my own father, will die at Coleman because of that cocksucker's crusade (even though Giuliani was long gone by then, but he helped put things in motion).

Alfa, I think you're a brilliant young man, an incredible researcher, and a great writer. But you just don't get the street angle. And you never will. I'm around it all my fucking life. I've kept myself straight. But I've lost more loved ones to Giuliani than you have at your average family Christmas table.

That's it. Please respect me there because it's not somewhere I usually go. But my temples are throbbing so hard right now that I could strangle someone until they turned purple and their eyes popped out. So enough with Giuliani. Please.
Posted By: mightyhealthy

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/12/15 11:58 PM

PB, I get that, but its an internet forum. The entire point of this thing is for people to disagree. I'm only sticking up for Alfa because he just came on here to speak his mind. I'm sure the last thing he wants to do is personally hurt you.
Posted By: mightyhealthy

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/12/15 11:59 PM

That said I hate Giuliani.
Posted By: Alfa Romeo

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/13/15 01:05 AM

Originally Posted By: mightyhealthy
PB, I get that, but its an internet forum. The entire point of this thing is for people to disagree. I'm only sticking up for Alfa because he just came on here to speak his mind. I'm sure the last thing he wants to do is personally hurt you.


You're right about everything there. Thank you brother.
Posted By: TommyGambino

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/13/15 01:14 AM

Alfa thinks Carl Gambino was an informant lol

All credibility went out the window when he said that.
Posted By: Alfa Romeo

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/13/15 01:15 AM

Pizza, it's nothing personal. Easy big guy! I'm only giving my take on Murder Machine. It's just like with any book....everyone pulls away from it with something different. For Yours Truly, Murder Machine was anticlimactic. I fully expected Walter Mack to do a sweep and clean up New York City....by the way the book read and progressed. But as a resident of New York City I knew something went wrong and had to read to the end of the book to find out what it was. And that something, was Ghouliani.

You're right. I'm busted. I'm no street guy. Never was. Only use a classic mafia boss as my avatar. But I can read. And what I read implied to me that Giuliani created the Commission case in the sense that he re-directed indictments to very top of the mafia. But he did not do the legwork, the detective work, or put in the hours building the RICO evidence. He didn't even appear in the book until relatively later as you turned the pages. Before him, every wise guy in New York City was in jeopardy. Walter Mack and the rest of them had a squad for every mafia family, and these squads were run like mafia families themselves. I continue to be mesmerized by the recount of history in Murder Machine.

Nothing against you. I certainly am not happy people went to jail. It's a double loss, or quadruple. It's bad for their victims, bad for the victims' families, bad for them, and bad for their families. No one's gloating.
Posted By: Alfa Romeo

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/13/15 01:18 AM

Originally Posted By: TommyGambino
Alfa thinks Carl Gambino was an informant lol

All credibility went out the window when he said that.


I do believe Carlo Gambino was an informant in the sense of being some kind of high level drug trafficker with probably ties to the intelligence community of the United States. You are never connected to that degree to the G without the G using you for information in some way. He had to report in or give account to his handler(s).
Posted By: pizzaboy

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/13/15 01:28 AM

Originally Posted By: Alfa Romeo
Originally Posted By: mightyhealthy
PB, I get that, but its an internet forum. The entire point of this thing is for people to disagree. I'm only sticking up for Alfa because he just came on here to speak his mind. I'm sure the last thing he wants to do is personally hurt you.


You're right about everything there. Thank you brother.

And that's why I went out of my way to PRAISE Alfa here:

Originally Posted By: pizzaboy
Alfa, I think you're a brilliant young man, an incredible researcher, and a great writer. But you just don't get the street angle. And you never will.

I have nothing but respect for the great researchers here, and I'm CONSTANTLY sticking up for them when the "neighborhood guys" start ganging up on them. From Ivy to Hairy to Sonny to Alfa to every other great researcher who adds so much to these boards. I always have your backs when, insert name, "_______ from Brooklyn," tells you that you have no business on these boards.

I LOATHE wannabes. But there ARE a few things that you'll NEVER understand about the life if you didn't grow up around it. Mainly the things that drive these assholes into the life to begin with. If you're really interested in the sociological aspect of it, you can learn a thing or two from a guy who grew up with, but at least tried to keep his distance from, the local wiseguys.

And a lot of you boys are quite liberal. I'd think that the sociological part of what drove them to crime might me of interest to you. Christ, I could write a book. But I won't wink.

And I apologize, Alfa. You touched a nerve with Giuliani and someone close to me, but you couldn't have known. So I truly am sorry.
Posted By: mightyhealthy

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/13/15 01:29 AM

I guarantee you could write a really good fucking book.
Posted By: mightyhealthy

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/13/15 01:33 AM

(But obviously I know you won't)
Posted By: pizzaboy

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/13/15 01:35 AM

Originally Posted By: mightyhealthy
I guarantee you could write a really good fucking book.

Both my grandfathers and all of their brothers would come back to haunt me for the rest of my life. It would be on par with the "Scary Movie." But with White guys (well, Olive Skinned, to be more precise).

Posted By: mightyhealthy

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/13/15 01:50 AM

Lol
Posted By: Alfa Romeo

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/13/15 01:57 AM

Thanks for the props and respect Pizza, Sincerely. I Thank You.
Posted By: TommyGambino

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/13/15 02:02 PM

Originally Posted By: Alfa Romeo
Originally Posted By: TommyGambino
Alfa thinks Carl Gambino was an informant lol

All credibility went out the window when he said that.


Tommy Gambino, are you capable of a serious discussion?

I have a few questions for you.

If Lucky Luciano was freed from prison due to the influence of Navy Intelligence and OSS, the forerunner of CIA, do you think they set him free because they liked him? Or maybe they set him free because there was monetary gain in it for them?

If there was, where do you think the monetary gain was coming from? Drugs maybe?

Now, if Carlo Gambino was visiting Lucky Luciano in Italy, do you think it was just to bring envelopes of money, or to say "hi"? No it wasn't, was it. It was to carry out some sort of confidential talk. What do you think that talk pertained to? Could it have been drugs? Heroin to be exact? Maybe working out the pipeline of trafficking?

Is it starting to dawn on you that Carlo Gambino possibly shared the same intelligence contacts as Lucky Luciano?

No? If it isn't dawning on you, you're a senseless individual.


lol What a mong you are, stop living in fantasy land.
Posted By: furio_from_naples

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/13/15 05:27 PM

Out NY I bet on the Detroit Family, because was more like a ndrine that a sicilian family,everybody was blood related and like the ndrangheta if you flip you go against your real family,that is because only one made man Nove Tocco flipped and only for sell drugs.

There are 40-50 made men and stay in the shadows and think only to make money with the mafia bread and butter: loanshark,shylock ecc has a ties with sicily with the D'Anna brothers.

So I bet on the partnership and that the future boss surname wil be tocco,giaccalone or d'anna.
Posted By: Blackjack2121

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/13/15 06:21 PM

Originally Posted By: pizzaboy

You won't believe it until you read it in a press release or in Jerry's column, and that's fine. It's your prerogative, you're entitled to it, and I've always given you the respect that you deserve.


Let me tell you something there Peetz. The feds are infallible and always right, so if I don't see or hear\ an official FBI spokesperson it simply cannot be true. Same goes for made guys...if they are not listed on an fbi chart it simply cannot be true

whistle
Posted By: Blackjack2121

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/13/15 06:30 PM

Originally Posted By: furio_from_naples
Out NY I bet on the Detroit Family, because was more like a ndrine that a sicilian family,everybody was blood related and like the ndrangheta if you flip you go against your real family,that is because only one made man Nove Tocco flipped and only for sell drugs.

There are 40-50 made men and stay in the shadows and think only to make money with the mafia bread and butter: loanshark,shylock ecc has a ties with sicily with the D'Anna brothers.

So I bet on the partnership and that the future boss surname wil be tocco,giaccalone or d'anna.


There are not 40 or 50 active made guys on the street. Rather a total number including those retired/ semi retired and in prison.

The top guys are all legitimate millionaires many times over. Chicago Tony sold his insurance business for 50 million recently.

They still have some loose political ties as well as a good working relationship with the biker gangs and black drug gangs. I think like 90 percent of the family are all blood related somehow. Very interesting family
Posted By: SonnyBlackstein

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/13/15 07:03 PM

Originally Posted By: Blackjack2121
They still have some loose political ties as well as a good working relationship with the biker gangs and black drug gangs.


Source? And please cite for all three examples. Cheers.


My two cents for best prep for 5-10years. No change on the ladder ie Gen #1, Gamb #2, Lukes #3 but in terms of who fares the best in relation to how they stand now, the Lukes.

The WS and Gamb will take the vast majority of LE heat, focus and resultant damage.
Coupled that they're both twice the size also gives twice the chance for rats etc.
And all other factors are the same. All three still have Unions and institutionalized rackets, all have had a good run and enjoy good, stable leadership.
The diff being the Lukes cold fly under the radar with LE and being smaller, less likely to suffer rats.
So whilst I dont see the power order changing, it could well narrow.
Posted By: pizzaboy

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/13/15 07:26 PM

Originally Posted By: Blackjack2121
Originally Posted By: pizzaboy

You won't believe it until you read it in a press release or in Jerry's column, and that's fine. It's your prerogative, you're entitled to it, and I've always given you the respect that you deserve.


Let me tell you something there Peetz. The feds are infallible and always right, so if I don't see or hear\ an official FBI spokesperson it simply cannot be true. Same goes for made guys...if they are not listed on an fbi chart it simply cannot be true

whistle

I give up lol.
Posted By: Blackjack2121

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/13/15 07:47 PM

Originally Posted By: SonnyBlackstein
Originally Posted By: Blackjack2121
They still have some loose political ties as well as a good working relationship with the biker gangs and black drug gangs.


Source? And please cite for all three examples. Cheers.


My two cents for best prep for 5-10years. No change on the ladder ie Gen #1, Gamb #2, Lukes #3 but in terms of who fares the best in relation to how they stand now, the Lukes.

The WS and Gamb will take the vast majority of LE heat, focus and resultant damage.
Coupled that they're both twice the size also gives twice the chance for rats etc.
And all other factors are the same. All three still have Unions and institutionalized rackets, all have had a good run and enjoy good, stable leadership.
The diff being the Lukes cold fly under the radar with LE and being smaller, less likely to suffer rats.
So whilst I dont see the power order changing, it could well narrow.


FUCK man I had a nice long reply for you almost done and I x'd it out. I will get back to you later as I am heading to the driving range
Posted By: Blackjack2121

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/13/15 07:49 PM

Originally Posted By: pizzaboy
Originally Posted By: Blackjack2121
Originally Posted By: pizzaboy

You won't believe it until you read it in a press release or in Jerry's column, and that's fine. It's your prerogative, you're entitled to it, and I've always given you the respect that you deserve.


Let me tell you something there Peetz. The feds are infallible and always right, so if I don't see or hear\ an official FBI spokesperson it simply cannot be true. Same goes for made guys...if they are not listed on an fbi chart it simply cannot be true

whistle

I give up lol.


You know I had to bust your balls on this fine Saturday afternoon, while you are what....2 or 3 ketel one's deep??
Posted By: SonnyBlackstein

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/13/15 07:57 PM

Originally Posted By: Blackjack2121
FUCK man I had a nice long reply for you almost done and I x'd it out. I will get back to you later as I am heading to the driving range


All good. Enjoy.
Posted By: Skinny

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/13/15 08:05 PM

pb my old man built Chelsea's on baxter. I don't know the exact year, im guessing in the 70s, did you ever go there?
Posted By: pizzaboy

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/13/15 08:26 PM

Originally Posted By: Skinny
pb my old man built Chelsea's on baxter. I don't know the exact year, im guessing in the 70s, did you ever go there?

No. My uncle owned the building directly opposite the back entrance of Most Precious Blood Church. The front is on Mulberry, the rear is on Baxter. It's just north of Canal. My biggest real estate regret is not buying that building from him.

He would have practically given it to me, and that's EXACTLY why I didn't buy it. But had I known that Little Italy would eventually become part of SoHo, with $2,500 studios, I woud have put familial pride aside lol.
Posted By: TommyGambino

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/14/15 11:56 AM

Originally Posted By: Alfa Romeo
Tommy, I expected you to reply exactly like that. Thanks for proving me right.


Proving you right? What an ego maniac you are, just guessing people are informants with no substance to you're argument.

Now piss off.
Posted By: furio_from_naples

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/14/15 05:23 PM

Originally Posted By: Blackjack2121
Originally Posted By: furio_from_naples
Out NY I bet on the Detroit Family, because was more like a ndrine that a sicilian family,everybody was blood related and like the ndrangheta if you flip you go against your real family,that is because only one made man Nove Tocco flipped and only for sell drugs.

There are 40-50 made men and stay in the shadows and think only to make money with the mafia bread and butter: loanshark,shylock ecc has a ties with sicily with the D'Anna brothers.

So I bet on the partnership and that the future boss surname wil be tocco,giaccalone or d'anna.


There are not 40 or 50 active made guys on the street. Rather a total number including those retired/ semi retired and in prison.

The top guys are all legitimate millionaires many times over. Chicago Tony sold his insurance business for 50 million recently.

They still have some loose political ties as well as a good working relationship with the biker gangs and black drug gangs. I think like 90 percent of the family are all blood related somehow. Very interesting family


Even was only 20-30 men on the streets,are are blood related but important stay in the shadow,old men talk with the politics while the youngs talk with the black and the bikers.
The Detroit family was the most similar to a ndrangheta family or ndrina.
So I bet on it.
Posted By: jipjones

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/14/15 06:00 PM

It will def always be interesting to c where the Philly Family is in the next 5 to ten.. With the Scarfo old guard and The Merlino Loyalist.. Joey better becareful!
Posted By: m2w

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/14/15 06:02 PM

Originally Posted By: furio_from_naples
Even was only 20-30 men on the streets,are are blood related but important stay in the shadow,old men talk with the politics while the youngs talk with the black and the bikers.
The Detroit family was the most similar to a ndrangheta family or ndrina.
So I bet on it.


being as a ndrina it doesn't mean always to be successfull, because when you induct only relatives you risk to not have a larger recruitment pool
Posted By: SonnyBlackstein

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/14/15 06:05 PM

Im still curios Furio as to ANY 'black gang/biker/politcal' connections Detroit has.

At BEST there are a few (prob only within community) booking and shy guys.

This drug connection/political/biker bullshit is just that.


Its a Harry potter film.
Posted By: pizzaboy

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/14/15 06:14 PM

Originally Posted By: SonnyBlackstein
Its a Harry potter film.

"Harry Potter and the Cauldron of Espresso."

J.K. Rowling and Nick Pileggi get together on the script. Marty directs. Win-Win.

And it mas mine and Sonny's idea, so I'm getting an intellectual property lawyer. Just in case anyone gets any funny ideas.
Posted By: mbo

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/14/15 06:32 PM

Sorry PB, its now public domain, so im stealing the idea. Im thinking michael imperioli with a top hat and glasses, would be a good Harry.
Posted By: SonnyBlackstein

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/14/15 06:54 PM

Originally Posted By: pizzaboy
Originally Posted By: SonnyBlackstein
Its a Harry potter film.

"Harry Potter and the Cauldron of Espresso."

J.K. Rowling and Nick Pileggi get together on the script. Marty directs. Win-Win.

And it mas mine and Sonny's idea, so I'm getting an intellectual property lawyer. Just in case anyone gets any funny ideas.


To quote Renee Zellweger; You had me at cauldron of espresso"

Call parcels, give this guy a tryout.

You do make me smile PB.
Posted By: Blackjack2121

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/14/15 07:10 PM

Originally Posted By: SonnyBlackstein
Originally Posted By: Blackjack2121
They still have some loose political ties as well as a good working relationship with the biker gangs and black drug gangs.


Source? And please cite for all three examples. Cheers.


My two cents for best prep for 5-10years. No change on the ladder ie Gen #1, Gamb #2, Lukes #3 but in terms of who fares the best in relation to how they stand now, the Lukes.

The WS and Gamb will take the vast majority of LE heat, focus and resultant damage.
Coupled that they're both twice the size also gives twice the chance for rats etc.
And all other factors are the same. All three still have Unions and institutionalized rackets, all have had a good run and enjoy good, stable leadership.
The diff being the Lukes cold fly under the radar with LE and being smaller, less likely to suffer rats.
So whilst I dont see the power order changing, it could well narrow.


The political ties are mostly in the form of a certain Italian judge, that seems to be referred a lot of cases pertaining to people in the detroit mob and connected to the detroit mob. And for some reason those cases are always seem to be sentenced well below the recommended guidelines. I think he may have even been investigated...not sure on that one. I am going all off the top of my head so I cannot recall the name right now.

The black drug gangs were dealt with with Nove Tocco(rat) and Paulie Corrado. I suspect some sort of relationship is still there to this day but I am not sure who would be the point man on it. They don't directly deal, rather give out loans to drug dealers for their shipments and are paid back with a vig.

The biker gang ties go back decades, with the outlaws and more recently the Highwaymen of Detroit. Tocco even put a hit out on Harry Taco Bowman, the Detroit Outlaws president of the time, but he was indicted and sentenced to life before anything could be done with him.
Frankie the Bomb Bommarito is or was the liason for the biker gangs and the mob. When Jackie the Kid took over, he immediately demoted the bomb and took most of his rackets. There was even a late night meeting to squash things but the Bomb felt it was a hit being set up and didnt go through with it. Once he was demoted, tensions between the mob and the biker gangs were at an all time high without the bomb, who the clubs respected as an intermediary.
Posted By: Blackjack2121

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/14/15 07:11 PM

I got a good article on this saved give me a few...
Posted By: Blackjack2121

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/14/15 07:12 PM

According to law enforcement and underworld sources in Michigan, relations between the Detroit mafia and the Motor City biker scene have soured in the three years since legendary mob leader Vito (Billy Jack) Giacalone died of natural causes and his best friend Frank (Frankie the Bomb) Bommarito was demoted from his post as captain overseeing Giacalone’s old crew.

Ties and business dealings between the two factions date back to the late 1960s and early 1970s. Bommarito, 85, had been the Italians’ longtime liaison with the local motorcycle gang landscape, building ironclad links with the area’s various biker organizations. He mediated a gambling-turf dispute between the mafia and notorious Outlaws international MC gang president Harry (Taco) Bowman in 1992, getting Giacalone and his brother, Michigan mob street boss Anthony (Tony Jack) Giacalone (died in 2001), to lift a murder contract on Bowman’s head. FBI records cite Bommarito with helping hide Bowman when Bowman (in prison for life) was on the run from the law in 1998 and 1999.

Upon Giacalone’s passing in the winter of 2012, his son, acting boss, Jack (Jackie the Kid) Giacalone, 64, immediately pulled Bommarito out of his eastside capo slot, took several of his rackets away (the ones he shared with Billy Jack) and partially shelved him, allegedly replacing him with David (Davey Donuts) Aceto, the younger Giacalone’s former driver and bodyguard.

Aceto, 57, is respected, but doesn’t have the connections in the local biker community, centered on the eastside, like Bommarito does and in turn Bommarito’s presence has been dearly missed, a ripple effect Jackie the Kid may have underestimated, per sources.

“The bikers in this city revere Frank the Bomb, he can go into any clubhouse in Michigan and have the red carpet laid out for him like nobody I’ve ever seen, that’s kept a lot of problems at bay for a lot of years because of how much they think of him,” said one ATF source on a federal motorcycle gang task force. “I don’t know if Jackie totally understood what a troubleshooter he was for his dad in that world. He plugged a lot of holes on the ship. These aren’t easy people to deal with. They’re fucking nuts. You have to have the right approach, the right temperament. The Bomb’s always had that. Now, he’s off the map over there and things are kind of starting to run amuck a bit.”

Exclusive Gangster Report sources reveal that much of these current tensions between the mob and the bikers in Detroit arise from an incident that occurred in the late summer of 2013 when a “very close” lieutenant of Giacalone’s perpetrated a shakedown of an unsuspecting Highwaymen MC gang-backed attorney for 50 thousand dollars.

Since Bowman went down and a large chunk of his Outlaws organization was dismantled in the late 1990s – the Outlaws housed its club’s international headquarters in Michigan –, the Highwaymen, the Outlaws’ bitter rivals, became the biggest, most powerful biker gang in the area at the dawning of the New Millennium and continue to hold that title today.

The frequently-used Highwaymen attorney had gotten into trouble with the gang for carrying on a romantic affair with the girlfriend of one of its members while he was away in prison, prompting a Giacalone soldier to intercede, falsely purporting to be acting on behalf of Highwaymen brass and collecting 50 large on the lawyer’s belief that the Giacalone button man had squashed the beef and was going to invest the cash into a restaurant that never got opened.

The lawyer complained and the Highwaymen administration went “berserk.” Despite demands from the bikers, the shakedown money has never been returned and the ill will from the situation has bled over into mutual gambling and drug rackets shared by the club and the Detroit mafia, which have now ceased.

Jackie the Kid
Jackie the Kid
Giacalone himself has been barred from Highwaymen-controlled strip clubs and bars and the bikers allegedly trashed a mafia-ran after-hours gambling den in the immediate aftermath of the gang’s leadership learning of the shakedown, per sources. These same sources say Giacalone is eager to quell tensions and has reached out to Bommarito, his former ally now-turned nemesis, via Detroit LCN street boss Peter (Petey Specs) Tocco, to ask him to smooth things over in return for a portion of his former rackets back. It’s unclear how Bommarito responded to the request.

In addition to Bommarito’s absence being felt on the Italian side of things, the absence of Highwaymen heavyweight Gary (Junior) Ball has added to the flames of discontent, if not prevented them being stomped out before they starting burning. Bommarito’s counterpart within the area’s gearhead gangster contingent, Ball, the Highwaymen’s well-liked liaison to the Italian mob, was convicted in a sizeable federal RICO case in 2010 besides the Motor City’s then-reigning biker Godfather Leonard (Big Daddy) Moore.

Newly-appointed capo Joe (The Hood) D’Anna, a shrewd, sway-gaining Sicilian-born wiseguy set to go on trial on federal extortion and racketeering charges stemming from the savage beating and attempted murder of a restaurant owner in suburban Detroit, has reportedly begun making his own personal inroads with the Highwaymen, “picking up the scraps” from the Bommarito void. D’Anna, according to sources, has leveraged the uncertainty on the eastside that spawn from Bommarito’s removal as captain.

The territory now belonging to Davey Aceto and once belonging to the old Billy Giacalone crew, keeps its homebase on the south eastside in Warren, while D’Anna, 61, headquarters out of the north eastside at his restaurant Pomodoro (formerly Tira Mi Su) in Shelby Township

The colorful and capable Frankie the Bomb has gone “independent” in recent years, remaining active in the underworld following his 2012 demotion, however with his own ragtag crew of multi-ethnic non-mob connected thugs, thieves and gangbangers surrounding him instead of traditional LCN figures. He unsuccessfully shopped a reality tv show about his unique “retirement days” and love of karaoke in 2013.

Billy Jack was the Bomb's best man at his wedding in 1994
Billy Jack & the Bomb in the 90s
Bommarito came up in the Detroit mafia as an armed-robber and cat burglar in the 1950s and 1960s, part of “The Cigar Gang,” known for leaving cigar butts at the locations of their scores and answering to Billy Giacalone’s regime on the eastside. Soon, Frankie the Bomb became Billy Jack’s all-around right-hand man and No. 1 enforcer and was inducted into the mob by Don Joseph (Joe Uno) Zerilli in a 1974 ceremony with Giacalone as his sponsor, per court records. The pair had just gotten out of state prison after serving almost five years for armed robbery (Bommarito) and possession of a blackjack (Giacalone), respectively.

The man that turned Bommarito into authorities for his robbery of a popular local steakhouse in 1968, a one-time Cigar Gang goodfella named Joseph (Joe Coupe Deville) Colombo, was found strangled to death and stuffed in the trunk of his Cadillac Coupe Deville at a downtown Detroit parking garage in the weeks after the Bomb and Billy Jack headed off for their stay at Jackson State Prison in January 1969. The Bomb famously jumped naked out of a giant cake at the duo’s going away party.

FBI agents followed Bommarito in the summer of 1979 as he shuttled Giacalone and other syndicate dignitaries to a gathering at a swanky hunting lodge near Ann Arbor where Giacomo (Black Jack) Tocco was inaugurated as the new boss of the Detroit LCN branch in the wake of his uncle Joe Uno’s death 18 months earlier.

In late 1985, Frankie the Bomb was indicted for taking out a murder contract on former crime family associate Ernest (Ernie the Greek) Kanakis and served another five years behind bars. Kanakis killed three made members of the Giacalone crew dispatched to execute him in a hostile takeover of Kanakis’ lucrative gambling business in July 1976. Acquitted of the triple homicide in a 1977 trial, the stubborn Ernie the Greek refused to leave the Motor City after being banished from the area in an edict by the Giacalone brothers following his beating the charges in his case due to pleading self-defense.

When Billy Giacalone went to prison because of twin racketeering busts in 1992 and 1998, Bommarito was named acting capo of his crew. After being upped to underboss of the Family upon his release from his last of an array of prison terms in 2004, Billy Jack had Jack Tocco tap Bommarito as official capo of the crew, a job he held until Jackie Giacalone replaced him with Tocco’s blessing three years ago in the weeks following Billy Jack’s death in February 2012. Jack Tocco died last July, months removed from naming Jackie the Kid his full-time successor.

Bommarito and Jackie Giacalone are considered two of the suspects in the 1985 gangland slaying of Detroit mob soldier Peter (Fast Pete) Cavataio – both were implicated by former Giacalone crew strong arm John (Crazy Johnny) Pree in grand jury testimony. Pree, who flipped for a short period in the 1990s and then recanted his debriefing and testimony in front of the grand jury, was mafia running buddies and best friends with Carlo Bommarito, Frank’s son.

The younger Bommarito, “made” in 1995 by Jack Tocco, died of a drug overdose in 2008. Informants have told members of law enforcement that the od was actually a hit called in by Billy Giacalone and okayed by Frankie the Bomb. Billy Giacalone was publically cursing Carlo for being a “junkie” and a “snitch” in the months leading up to his alleged overdose.

Pree walked free in the fall from a 1993 conviction for operating a home-invasion ring targeted suburban drug dealers along with Carlo Bommarito. Celebrating his 85th birthday in October, the still-spry and sharp Frankie the Bomb continues to hold court daily at Danny Boyz Social Club and Tattoo Parlor.

And here is the bomb in all his glory on his birthday...lol
Posted By: Blackjack2121

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/14/15 07:15 PM



There is Dave DOnuts Aceto, who the bomb was replaced with. Jackies right hand. [img]http://s10.photobucket.com/user/rosevill...120038.jpg.html[/img]
Posted By: Blackjack2121

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/14/15 07:16 PM

Last photo is not working for some reason you have to click on it.
Posted By: SonnyBlackstein

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/14/15 07:47 PM

Blackjack, youre a GREAT poster. Seriously.

I genuinely value your contributions to this board.

But dude, seriously? This is just Scot Burnstein regurgitated, no?

Now SB is a lovely guy, no dispute, but as has been discussed ad nauseum, has made several ridiculous unsubstantiated claims and also a vested interest in propagating a thriving LCN in the D. So just because an unsubstantiated blog writes something, does not make it so.

Ever been to detroit? I have. Several times and a gentified middle class suburban Italian community IN THE LEAFY BURBS (to reinterate) a LCN family does not make.

Do they have some book n loan? Sure.

An Italian judge, biker gangs, the crips etc etc they don't.
The feds say so, anyone who's been there says so and the sooner you look at the evidence and not a vested interest unsubstantiated authors claim, you'll see that Detroit is not an LCN criminal genius lair, but a mostly extinct one.
Posted By: IvyLeague

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/15/15 02:51 AM

Originally Posted By: SonnyBlackstein
This is just Scot Burnstein regurgitated, no?

Now SB is a lovely guy, no dispute, but as has been discussed ad nauseum, has made several ridiculous unsubstantiated claims and also a vested interest in propagating a thriving LCN in the D. So just because an unsubstantiated blog writes something, does not make it so.

Ever been to detroit? I have. Several times and a gentified middle class suburban Italian community IN THE LEAFY BURBS (to reinterate) a LCN family does not make.

Do they have some book n loan? Sure.

An Italian judge, biker gangs, the crips etc etc they don't.
The feds say so, anyone who's been there says so and the sooner you look at the evidence and not a vested interest unsubstantiated authors claim, you'll see that Detroit is not an LCN criminal genius lair, but a mostly extinct one.


+1

Posted By: Blackjack2121

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/15/15 11:18 AM

Originally Posted By: SonnyBlackstein
Blackjack, youre a GREAT poster. Seriously.

I genuinely value your contributions to this board.

But dude, seriously? This is just Scot Burnstein regurgitated, no?

Now SB is a lovely guy, no dispute, but as has been discussed ad nauseum, has made several ridiculous unsubstantiated claims and also a vested interest in propagating a thriving LCN in the D. So just because an unsubstantiated blog writes something, does not make it so.

Ever been to detroit? I have. Several times and a gentified middle class suburban Italian community IN THE LEAFY BURBS (to reinterate) a LCN family does not make.

Do they have some book n loan? Sure.

An Italian judge, biker gangs, the crips etc etc they don't.
The feds say so, anyone who's been there says so and the sooner you look at the evidence and not a vested interest unsubstantiated authors claim, you'll see that Detroit is not an LCN criminal genius lair, but a mostly extinct one.


They certainly had joint interests with the outlaws and highwaymen at the very least before the Bomb was demoted.

The other stuff, I guess we will have to agree to disagree on as we obviously don't see eye to eye.

I do believe Detroit has a viable family, albeit a very small family. You don't.

We aren't going to agree on everything.

And Ivy with the cheer leading? rolleyes
Posted By: Blackjack2121

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/15/15 11:44 AM

By the way Sonny, the judge in question is Macomb county circuit court judge Carcetti...he is the one who gave the light sentence to the D'anna brothers for the baseball bat beating that the feds took up...

Two Michigan brothers who authorities say attacked the owner of a rival Italian eatery in suburban Detroit have been sentenced to two months in jail and three months house arrest.

The Macomb Daily of Mount Clemens reports that 59-year-old Giuseppe D'Anna and 47-year-old Girolamo D'Anna also must serve three years' probation.

They were sentenced Friday in Macomb County Circuit Court after pleading no contest to assault with a deadly weapon and witness intimidation.

Authorities say the Shelby Township brothers attacked Nonna's restaurant owner Pietro Ventimiglia with an aluminum baseball bat on April 28 after he expanded across the street from their Tirami Su restaurant.

Ventimiglia was hit 11 times and at least once in the head. An attorney for Ventimiglia said the sentences for the D'Anna brothers are too short.

http://www.mlive.com/news/detroit/index.ssf/2012/01/metro_detroit_brothers_sentenc.html
Posted By: SonnyBlackstein

Re: Family most prepared for next 5 to 10 years - 06/15/15 03:46 PM

Originally Posted By: Blackjack2121
An attorney for Ventimiglia said the sentences for the D'Anna brothers are too short.


I agree the sentences were short. But drawing the conclusion that there is something illegal (bribery etc) occurring from a short sentence is a huge leap. There is also zero evidence to support this. And concluding that the D LCN has 'political ties' because of this is a long, long bow.

But I guess we'll just agree to disagree.
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