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A Sign of the Times

Posted By: NickyScarfo

A Sign of the Times - 05/05/15 05:53 AM

Interesting looking at the Mayweather Pacquiao fight, huge, huge event for celebrities,high rollers, businessmen etc. Only the most VIPs could really get tickets.
A fight like that, 50 years ago I bet there would be wiseguys all over it, ringside seats, free tickets etc etc. Now? I bet not one in attendance. I guess even up to the 1980s mob guys would be out in force at Leonard, Hagler and Hearns fights. Since then I guess they can't get in (banned from Vegas) or don't want to be seen there. Anyone heard of big guys from the modern era at say Tyson fights or more current??
Posted By: merlino

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/05/15 12:15 PM

If you get on the gaming boards exclusion list which most of those convicted felons are, its tough to be in casinos in vegas and AC, but ya you are right with the big fights in the past
Posted By: cookcounty

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/05/15 12:20 PM

why so they can get pointed out

"there goes the boss of the columbos sitting next to jay z"

would be on the commentary
Posted By: pizzaboy

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/05/15 12:21 PM

Originally Posted By: merlino
If you get on the gaming boards exclusion list which most of those convicted felons are, its tough to be in casinos in vegas and AC, but ya you are right with the big fights in the past

The overall percentage of wiseguys to wiseguys in the "Black Book" is EXTREMELY minimal. Look it up, it's all public record. It's more a matter of the mob having its hooks in boxing being a thing of the past.

Don't get me wrong, it's still a dirty game. But it's not corrupted by WISEGUYS like it was in the past. Today it's the corporations doing the dirty work wink.
Posted By: BennyB

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/05/15 12:47 PM

Also, this was the most expensive boxing match every with bootleg tickets going for a quarter mill. So there's another way it's different than 50 years ago.
Posted By: merlino

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/05/15 12:58 PM

Originally Posted By: pizzaboy
Originally Posted By: merlino
If you get on the gaming boards exclusion list which most of those convicted felons are, its tough to be in casinos in vegas and AC, but ya you are right with the big fights in the past

The overall percentage of wiseguys to wiseguys in the "Black Book" is EXTREMELY minimal. Look it up, it's all public record. It's more a matter of the mob having its hooks in boxing being a thing of the past.

Don't get me wrong, it's still a dirty game. But it's not corrupted by WISEGUYS like it was in the past. Today it's the corporations doing the dirty work wink.


Boxing is a dirty business from the Don Kings and arums of the fight world...and you are spot on I mean you had 2 guys make $100 million each to dance around and not get hurt, sad boxing is so shady from ali-liston to today....hagler-hearns, and leonard-hearns, duran, etc were some epic fights but those fighters got screwed in dollars from the promoters and shady people involved back then

and I hear ya PB with ol vegas and the fight game..and on your point i think an UC FBI agent got someone in the philly family on tape in a vegas casino talking about the philly rackets in the past 5-7 years
Posted By: pizzaboy

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/05/15 01:19 PM

Hagler's one of my five favorite fighters of all time. But the Petronelli brothers (his trainers) had DEEP street connections. From Boston all the way to 116th Street in East Harlem. And you know I never exaggerate when it comes to the Old East Harlem.

They were good guys, though. They just happened to be connected to people who went all the way back to the Frankie Carbo and Blinky Palermo days. I've heard that even after Eddie Coco retired to Florida that he was still in Boston every so often to watch Hagler train.

And if you don't recognize those names, do me a favor and just Google them. I don't have the time right now and my Dad's in a mood lol.
Posted By: Binnie_Coll

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/05/15 01:43 PM

im glad I didn't pay over a hundred bucks to watch that dud. in my day you could watch a fight free on television, or watch it the next week on "wide world of sports"

nowadays only the rich celebrities can afford to see one,and the heavyweight champion is Russian, so I could care less, and i used to be a great fan, until i got priced out.

besides, if rocky Marciano were in his prime he would have put that Russian to sleep in the first round.

and Carmen basilio would have killed mayweather.
Posted By: Girlie

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/05/15 02:45 PM

Ummmm. There were some there. They just fly under the radar these days. As much as we can. And no pictures are taken in public.

As Pizzaboy said...not many are/were in the 'black book'
Posted By: cookcounty

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/05/15 02:55 PM

Originally Posted By: Binnie_Coll
im glad I didn't pay over a hundred bucks to watch that dud. in my day you could watch a fight free on television, or watch it the next week on "wide world of sports"

nowadays only the rich celebrities can afford to see one,and the heavyweight champion is Russian, so I could care less, and i used to be a great fan, until i got priced out.

besides, if rocky Marciano were in his prime he would have put that Russian to sleep in the first round.

and Carmen basilio would have killed mayweather.



u have to out box mayweather, and i don't know if anybody can out think him n the ring
Posted By: getthesenets

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/05/15 02:56 PM

Originally Posted By: Binnie_Coll
im glad I didn't pay over a hundred bucks to watch that dud. in my day you could watch a fight free on television, or watch it the next week on "wide world of sports"

nowadays only the rich celebrities can afford to see one,and the heavyweight champion is Russian, so I could care less, and i used to be a great fan, until i got priced out.

besides, if rocky Marciano were in his prime he would have put that Russian to sleep in the first round.

and Carmen basilio would have killed mayweather.


BC,

You bringing up Marciano reminds me of this spoof I saw the other day of the barbershop scene in Coming to America.



It was used as a promo to Mayweather/Pac-Man fight...
Posted By: getthesenets

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/05/15 03:06 PM

Originally Posted By: pizzaboy
Hagler's one of my five favorite fighters of all time. But the Petronelli brothers (his trainers) had DEEP street connections. From Boston all the way to 116th Street in East Harlem. And you know I never exaggerate when it comes to the Old East Harlem.


Pizza,

the Hagler /Leonard fiasco....is what was the beginning of the end for the semi-boxing fan. The shady decisions, tomfoolery, and nonsense , though part of boxing's history....just became too much beginning with that night.

Sugar Ray was the articulate, photogenic boxer that brought in the mainstream audiences so he gets the decision...by dancing around.

I like Sugar Ray but never have I wanted somebody's head knocked off their shoulders more than in that fight.
Posted By: faffy444

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/05/15 03:10 PM

Originally Posted By: Binnie_Coll
im glad I didn't pay over a hundred bucks to watch that dud. in my day you could watch a fight free on television, or watch it the next week on "wide world of sports"

nowadays only the rich celebrities can afford to see one,and the heavyweight champion is Russian, so I could care less, and i used to be a great fan, until i got priced out.

besides, if rocky Marciano were in his prime he would have put that Russian to sleep in the first round.

and Carmen basilio would have killed mayweather.


agree with binnie, no way mayweather beats carmen basilio
or emile griffith pre benny kid paret, nor sugar ray robinson . 3 great welterweights. all of whom also made it as middleweights
Posted By: Scorsese

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/05/15 03:15 PM

The real power player in boxing at the moment is al haymon. Don't know too much about him but he represents a lot of boxers and is behind a lot of the tv deals and big fights.

He doesn't seem like a don king type of person.
Posted By: getthesenets

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/05/15 03:17 PM

Gotta ask.

As much as he reveled in the limelight, was there a famous fight that John Gotti was seen at?

There were a lot of marquee fights in Atlantic City during Gotti's era.
Posted By: Binnie_Coll

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/05/15 04:03 PM

Originally Posted By: faffy444
Originally Posted By: Binnie_Coll
im glad I didn't pay over a hundred bucks to watch that dud. in my day you could watch a fight free on television, or watch it the next week on "wide world of sports"

nowadays only the rich celebrities can afford to see one,and the heavyweight champion is Russian, so I could care less, and i used to be a great fan, until i got priced out.

besides, if rocky Marciano were in his prime he would have put that Russian to sleep in the first round.

and Carmen basilio would have killed mayweather.


agree with binnie, no way mayweather beats carmen basilio
or emile griffith pre benny kid paret, nor sugar ray robinson . 3 great welterweights. all of whom also made it as middleweights



you bet, faffy, you bet.
Posted By: Snakes

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/05/15 04:27 PM

He beats Basilio but not the other two.
Posted By: Serpiente

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/05/15 05:00 PM

I wonder who had knowledge of the injuries,I can remember back in the day that stuff and even race horses health would start the phone ringing.
I can only say someone made a lot of money,along with the fighters...
Posted By: pizzaboy

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/05/15 05:00 PM

Originally Posted By: getthesenets
Gotta ask.

As much as he reveled in the limelight, was there a famous fight that John Gotti was seen at?

Not a big fight. But not long before his son got married (April of 1990), he and his entourage were at the Razor Ruddock-Michael Dokes fight at the Garden. Dokes was a shot fighter by that time, and I honestly thought for a split second that Ruddock killed him. And I mean that.

Anyway, Gotti and his boys got a brief ovation by the guys in their section and took off right after the fight. I remember that fight and Gotti being there very clearly.
Posted By: TommyGambino

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/05/15 05:26 PM

Originally Posted By: Scorsese
The real power player in boxing at the moment is al haymon. Don't know too much about him but he represents a lot of boxers and is behind a lot of the tv deals and big fights.

He doesn't seem like a don king type of person.


Don't get it twisted. Haymon is corrupt, you don't get into a position of that power, wealth & influence without being corrupt in boxing, sadly. you're right though, he's the dominant player in boxing, he has $300 million to spend over the next 3 years. He's bankrolled by some seriously rich people.
Posted By: TommyGambino

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/05/15 05:34 PM

Originally Posted By: cookcounty
Originally Posted By: Binnie_Coll
im glad I didn't pay over a hundred bucks to watch that dud. in my day you could watch a fight free on television, or watch it the next week on "wide world of sports"

nowadays only the rich celebrities can afford to see one,and the heavyweight champion is Russian, so I could care less, and i used to be a great fan, until i got priced out.

besides, if rocky Marciano were in his prime he would have put that Russian to sleep in the first round.

and Carmen basilio would have killed mayweather.



u have to out box mayweather, and i don't know if anybody can out think him n the ring


Mayweather wouldn't have been able to live with a ton of fighters in past years. The worst match up stylistically for him would be Tommy Hearns, Hearns would destroy him in a few rounds, he'd be outgunned in literally every department. Duran would have killed him at Lightweight, Robinson, Leonard, Gavilan, Whitaker (at Lightweight) Wilfred Benitez, Griffith, Kid Lewis, Napoles the list goes on, they'd all have beat Mayweather.
Posted By: faffy444

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/05/15 05:45 PM

Originally Posted By: Snakes
He beats Basilio but not the other two.


no way , shape, or form he beats basilio. basilio beat some great fighters in 2 different weight classes. including sugar ray robinson , tony demarco, ike williams, johhny saxton. he was always in great shape, had the toughness, and the heart of a lion.
Posted By: Binnie_Coll

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/05/15 06:18 PM

Originally Posted By: faffy444
Originally Posted By: Snakes
He beats Basilio but not the other two.


no way , shape, or form he beats basilio. basilio beat some great fighters in 2 different weight classes. including sugar ray robinson , tony demarco, ike williams, johhny saxton. he was always in great shape, had the toughness, and the heart of a lion.


yes, basillo had a bigger heart than any fighter, his heart was as big as marcianos, and never forget he beat sugar ray robinson with one eye, and, robinson was so great hardly anyone could beat him with 2 eyes.

robinson closed one of basillos eyes in the 4th round, I believe and still defeated robinson.

mayweather came along at a time when all the great ones were gone.
Posted By: downtown

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/05/15 07:13 PM

Anyone remember Dwight Braxton vs. Matthew Saad Muhammad fight at the Playboy Hotel & Casino in AC 12/19/81 Howard Cosell was doing the fight live and Nicky Scarfo and entourage sittng ringside.
Posted By: Belmont

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/05/15 07:22 PM

Mayweather clearly scored more points and out boxed Pacquiao. Am i happy with the fight? No, but then again these guys are in their upper 30's .
As far as Leonard and Hagler, i watched that fight about 20 times and each time i had Leonard winning by a point. He won. Why didnt Hagler apply more pressure and hit Leaonard more? Because Leonard kept moving and avoided getting hit, when they clashed, Leonard threw a flurry and scored, Hagler couldnt do anything.
Posted By: NickyScarfo

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/06/15 06:03 AM

I think Floyd is a very smart fighter, and people shouldn't hate on him (as a fighter.) This is a dude who is going to get out of the game looking ok and physically pretty decent. Sure we want to see action fights, but were not the one's taking those punches. He has found a way to win every fight so far without taking much punishment.
Posted By: ItalianForever

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/06/15 06:47 AM

Originally Posted By: pizzaboy
Hagler's one of my five favorite fighters of all time. But the Petronelli brothers (his trainers) had DEEP street connections. From Boston all the way to 116th Street in East Harlem. And you know I never exaggerate when it comes to the Old East Harlem.

They were good guys, though. They just happened to be connected to people who went all the way back to the Frankie Carbo and Blinky Palermo days. I've heard that even after Eddie Coco retired to Florida that he was still in Boston every so often to watch Hagler train.

And if you don't recognize those names, do me a favor and just Google them. I don't have the time right now and my Dad's in a mood lol.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=396c6NrTjLQ

Hagler talked like a white street guy from Brockton.
Posted By: cookcounty

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/06/15 09:34 AM

Originally Posted By: TommyGambino
Originally Posted By: cookcounty
Originally Posted By: Binnie_Coll
im glad I didn't pay over a hundred bucks to watch that dud. in my day you could watch a fight free on television, or watch it the next week on "wide world of sports"

nowadays only the rich celebrities can afford to see one,and the heavyweight champion is Russian, so I could care less, and i used to be a great fan, until i got priced out.

besides, if rocky Marciano were in his prime he would have put that Russian to sleep in the first round.

and Carmen basilio would have killed mayweather.



u have to out box mayweather, and i don't know if anybody can out think him n the ring


Mayweather wouldn't have been able to live with a ton of fighters in past years. The worst match up stylistically for him would be Tommy Hearns, Hearns would destroy him in a few rounds, he'd be outgunned in literally every department. Duran would have killed him at Lightweight, Robinson, Leonard, Gavilan, Whitaker (at Lightweight) Wilfred Benitez, Griffith, Kid Lewis, Napoles the list goes on, they'd all have beat Mayweather.



mayweather would fight different if he was in that era and he'd still be a champ

would he be undeafeated.........FUCK NO......but he's not a chump
Posted By: getthesenets

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/06/15 02:07 PM

Originally Posted By: pizzaboy
the Razor Ruddock-Michael Dokes fight at the Garden.


Thanks
That might have been one of the only big fights that took place in the Garden, in his era.. unless I'm forgetting. In my question, I forgot to factor in that South Jersey (AC) wasn't in Gotti's "realm"...Didn't make sense for me to assume that he would be front and center in a big fight in somebody else's realm.

People forget that Gotti was like a folk hero in this area..across age, ethnic and color lines...Some of it was people being distanced from the reality of what was going on....but people LOVED Gotti.

Would you believe that I had a friend in MSG at the OTHER memorable fight night years later.....when Riddick Bowe's Brooklyn goons started the brawl.

No disrespect to Brooklyn.....but the next sport team that lands there should truly reflect the nature of that borough and just call themselves the "Brooklyn Trouble Makers"

*I'm a former NJ Nets fan STILL upset about the team relocating to BK...so anybody else reading this , relax....just jokes...
Posted By: Ted

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/06/15 02:52 PM

Originally Posted By: getthesenets

BC,

You bringing up Marciano reminds me of this spoof I saw the other day of the barbershop scene in Coming to America.



It was used as a promo to Mayweather/Pac-Man fight...

Hilarious.
Posted By: Scorsese

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/06/15 06:03 PM

You guys hear about may weathers problems with his former manager j prince a while back. Apparently he had some guys with guns go to mayweathers training and beat his business partner and some other people up. Floyd went running to bob arum and arum paid prince off.

Quote:
"Mayweather also found himself in some trouble when he was in a fierce contractual battle with former manager James Prince. Top Rank stepped in and advanced him $610,000 to settle with Prince, and also cut Prince a check for 20 percent of Mayweather's $3.05 million dollar purse for fighting Phillip Ndou.
The situation with Prince, a well known figure in the rap world, escalated to a dangerous level when several men showed up to the Top Rank Gym on September 11, 2003 and roughed up Leonard Ellerbe and former camp member Thomas Summers, sending both to the hospital.
Mayweather's camp has never confirmed the story, but both DuBoef and Arum claimed to have saved a "shaken" Floyd Mayweather, Jr., who told DuBoef 'These are bad guys, you have to help me save my family.'
"I said, 'Let me give James a letter of credit,' " Arum said. "And Floyd said -- I'll never forget it -- 'James don't take no letter of credit.' "
Apparently there's source claiming a gun was involved.

"Hey, listen, at the end of the day, when I look at guys, and some rappers that I ain't going to mention, that talk about gangsta, talk about street, talk about going to jail, talk about being hard on the street, that remind of Floyd Mayweather. Floyd Mayweather is no tough guy. And Floyd Mayweather can tell you about, and Ellerbe can tell you about when a couple of guys came up in Top Rank's gym and they was taking two to three weeks to scrub blood out of the stains of the carpet that was in there. Where was the gangsta then? See, they know I know." - Bernard Hopkins
Posted By: DB

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/09/15 03:34 PM

I wasn't there but a friend in the scene was at the boxing match last night at the Pru center in Newark . Some young Italian local kid was fighting , I think crom Passaic , he got knocked out

But anyway several WS and L guys were there . I heard it was a good showing for the guys . Apparently most of them earned the more dangerous way rather than legit .

Anyway just passing it along given this recent post and at least for this fight , a lot of the boys were out and yes their seats were good lol
Posted By: 22

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/10/15 07:59 AM

your dead on PB,from watching that mvie ''Raging Bull' the mob controlled everything,it's like you have had to take a dive to get shot at title.Also in ''American Gangster'' about Frank Lucas,that's where his problems started.No one even knew who he was and then he shows up at fight with this expensive fur type coat and hat,sitting in the front row.Went downhill for him after that.
Posted By: bronx

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/10/15 09:02 AM

sign of the times.. JR and Alite swinging it out on a computer, with families sitting ring side rooting.. I can bet there are many wise guys that stay home and play grand theft auto for hours a day..
Posted By: DB

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/10/15 08:31 PM

I know that's the popular story on Lucas but he was known by LE enforcement before then

That coat certainly brought unneeded additional heat but they were after him before that , thats just Lucas's version

Ritchie Roberts is still a somewhat active guy in the newark area , helping raise money for his old high school , he is from Weequaick , which was a nice Jewish neighborhood in his time with some Italians but is now a war zone . anyway I heard from the horses mouth about that fur coat story
Posted By: 22

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/11/15 04:18 AM

very interesting DB Thanks
Posted By: getthesenets

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/11/15 01:04 PM

@DB,

yeah Weequahic, Vailsburg, and Forest Hills were some of the really nice sections of Newark pre riots (and for some time after)

BEAUTIFUL homes,high performing schools,etc

I never attended neighborhood schools but schools open to kids from around the city...and the kids from Weequahic were snobs.

The problem was a whole lot of kids from those areas felt like they had to prove to the world that they were just as tough as the kids from the projects. Eventually these wannabes succeeded in ruining their own neighborhoods and making them just as bad as the old projects on Prince Street.

Never the same after the dawn of the crack era.

Anyway...there's a doc. about Richie Roberts and other alum trying to restore that high school and neighborhood.
Posted By: NickyWhip

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/11/15 01:54 PM

Great thread. Just read it top to bottom.

I like the Hopkins comment because he's from Philly and it's true funny. Plus I don't like Floyd's attitude. I think he's one of the best of his era; not in his weight classes.

The people on this thread are some of my valued posters on this site.

+1
Posted By: DB

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/11/15 02:59 PM

Yeah that sounds about right plus back then newark was very territorial so they also had to protect their neghborgood from the surrounding towns but at one time Weequaic was one of the best schools around

My lord Vailsburg is bad , anywhere around that city of Irvington is just sad . Completely lawless and i mean completely , then again if u have balls and like value , those Irvington go gos ain't so bad

Btw - nice avatar , IMO that is by far the best made and most realistic show that was on TV . Wey- Bey was always my favorite
Posted By: BKLYN2NASSAU

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/11/15 04:01 PM

Originally Posted By: DB
Yeah that sounds about right plus back then newark was very territorial so they also had to protect their neghborgood from the surrounding towns but at one time Weequaic was one of the best schools around

My lord Vailsburg is bad , anywhere around that city of Irvington is just sad . Completely lawless and i mean completely , then again if u have balls and like value , those Irvington go gos ain't so bad

Btw - nice avatar , IMO that is by far the best made and most realistic show that was on TV . Wey- Bey was always my favorite


Good post DB
Posted By: getthesenets

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/11/15 05:25 PM

@DB,

I'm old enough to remember when Irvington was called "Ghost town" because they had tough police officers who enforced town curfew. Literally NO foot traffic in the town after 7pm. Again, this is mid 1980s. And again..wannabe tough guys who lived there ruined that town slowly.

Nothing I hate more than kids who live in quiet safe neighborhoods who want to play "gangster".

That town was always...and is still known for factories and strip clubs. If you've ever seen the film Belly, the strip club shootout between Rico and Method Man took place in a famous strip club there. Right along the GSP.Your man,Weebay appeared briefly in a few scenes in Belly.

Thanks about the avi, tribute to the actor Jamie Hector my fellow Ayisyen. My "paisan".

Doc. about efforts of alum to restore Weeqhahic is called "Heart of Stone"





Posted By: getthesenets

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/11/15 05:39 PM

Originally Posted By: Scorsese
You guys hear about may weathers problems with his former manager j prince a while back. Apparently he had some guys with guns go to mayweathers training and beat his business partner and some other people up. Floyd went running to bob arum and arum paid prince off.


Scorsese,

J. Prince's name has been ringing since I've been listening to Mr. Scarface, back when he had a different last name. Heard a lot of stories about this guy..rather not repeat some of the ones that haven't been confirmed but YES...I read about the situation with Floyd. I wonder where all of the Mayweather goons and hangers on were when those 5th Ward boys ran up on them.

I'm from the old school and maybe a bit naive so it's hard for me to be scared of a person who isn't physically intimidating and whenever I saw pics of J. he looked like a preacher of a small church or an accountant....but if one third of the stories are true......he's one scary dude.

Recently, ex NBA player Steve Francis got his chain snatched on stage....on camera...and J. made a phone call and got it back.
Posted By: DB

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/11/15 09:27 PM

Ha that Rico dude cracked me up , big banana chunks on his lips , dropping dimes on his comp

Never heard about this Prince dude


Floyd will be liked by his boys until his $ runs out

Ali daughter tore him to shreds in an interview and in a respectful way , saying he is just a lil boy with money and some power , she was spot on
Posted By: cheech

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/12/15 10:51 AM

Originally Posted By: DB
Yeah that sounds about right plus back then newark was very territorial so they also had to protect their neghborgood from the surrounding towns but at one time Weequaic was one of the best schools around

My lord Vailsburg is bad , anywhere around that city of Irvington is just sad . Completely lawless and i mean completely , then again if u have balls and like value , those Irvington go gos ain't so bad

Btw - nice avatar , IMO that is by far the best made and most realistic show that was on TV . Wey- Bey was always my favorite



D thought Wey-Be was gonna popp him but he just wanted to look out for his fish.
Posted By: Scorsese

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/12/15 12:00 PM

Originally Posted By: DB


Never heard about this Prince dude



A BRIEF HISTORY OF HOUSTON RAP EXECUTIVE J. PRINCE DEFENDING EVERYONE FROM THE GETO BOYS TO DRAKE
BRIEF HISTORIES
By Brandon Caldwell

James Prince is a man of few words. Yet when the Houston OG speaks, things move. There’s an interview on YouTube from 2012 in which Prince, CEO of Rap-A-Lot Records and boxing promoter, is discussing a potential bet with 50 Cent over a fight between Andre Ward & Andre Dirrell. “I’m not about that lip wrasslin’,” he says in a thick drawl. “If I say it, I mean it.”

Those sentiments were echoed last week when Prince extended what he called a “courtesy call” to Lil Wayne, Birdman, Diddy, and Suge Knight over improprieties issued towards his family and in particular, Drake. “Drake is family. And the weak shit from Puffy & Suge is on my radar,” Prince says on the call. “First of all, Puffy, feelin’ like he can put his hands on my family … opened the doors for his family to be touched. You reap what you sow.” The entire 1:49 message can be heard below.

Diddy is most likely in J. Prince’s crosshairs because of that incident when Puffy punched Drake in December at Club Liv in Miami, allegedly from a dispute over the rights to the song “0-100.” Why is Suge mentioned given the fact that he, Irv Gotti, and Prince were pretty much the “big bad wolves” of rap figureheads in the 90s? Suge’s aligned himself with Lil Wayne, who forever has earned the scorn of the Prince family due to Wayne’s and Cortez Bryant’s (Wayne’s manager) alleged mishandling of Drake’s royalties and money owed to Prince’s son, Jas.

“Lil Wayne is a [fa***t], his manager is a drunk, and his lawyer is a thief,” Prince says on “Courtesy Call.” “So fuck all of them together, disrespectful lil’ punks.”

Whenever J. Prince checks someone, these “courtesy messages” are issued before things get out of hand. He issued one toward Charlamange Tha God over disparaging Drake constantly on The Breakfast Club on New York’s Power 105.1. He’s done so repeatedly on records throughout the history of Rap-A-Lot Records—named after his older brother Sir Rap-A-Lot—going back as far as tapes in the late 80s and early 90s. He’s the original manager of Floyd “Money” Mayweather, whom he met while trying to get Mike Tyson to join his clientele. Floyd himself has an interesting story of leaving Prince’s management in 2003, one that alleges Prince had goons rough up Mayweather’s right hand man Leonard Ellerbe at a gym.

There are stories about Prince that sound like hip-hop fables. Tall tales, like the rumor that Scarface was able to set foot in dangerous Chicago hoods because of Prince’s relationship with Gangster Disciples’ founder Larry Hoover. Or the story of Prince sending a goon to knock out a bootlegger but refuse to do so because cameras were around. It’s hard to believe that a man who may not stand any taller than 5’9” is arguably the most feared figure in the history of Southern hip-hop. It might also be hard to believe that this guy is one of Drake’s most ardent supporters. But J. Prince has plenty of credibility in the music world to back up whatever he’s saying. The blueprint he forged with Rap-A-Lot helped set the foundation for other labels built on the Southern rap aesthetic such as No Limit, Cash Money, and Suave House. Prince still soldiers on, almost in a rather unique position as the most beloved boogeyman to ever come out of Houston, Texas.

RAP-A-LOT AND SUCCESS

Prince formed Rap-A-Lot Records in 1987 as a way to keep his brother off the streets. A used car salesman with a hell of a sales pitch, Prince had a connection not only with street guys but athletes as well. The itch to make a dollar, however, consumed him. “I grew up where poverty was a serious burden on my family and that had a major part in my mind developing,” he told Andrew Noz in a 2012 profile for NPR. “I wanted to break that poverty curse that existed.”

The original lineup for the Geto Boys didn’t even feature Scarface but rather a lineup of Raheem, Sir Rap-A-Lot, and DJ Ready Red, along with Prince Johnny C. Any record from the group’s 1988 debut Making Trouble sounds like Peewee’s Playhouse in comparison to their more refined, darker material. From the moment Scarface and Willie D joined the group in 1989 and subsequently released Grip It! On That Other Level, things swung in Rap-A-Lot’s favor. Soon they became Houston’s version of Def Jam, housing acts such as the forever introverted Z-Ro (in the early 2000s following his stint with Screwed Up Click), Devin the Dude, Do or Die (one of the few non-Houston acts to crack big on the label), Big Mike, and both members of UGK, who each released highly acclaimed solo albums on the label.

Rap-A-Lot’s core, however, was gangsta rap and the earliest stages of horrorcore. Ganksta N-I-P’s South Park Psycho, which was released in 1992, followed the Geto Boys’ dark and brooding movement with small tinges in traditional G-funk. South Park Psycho was followed in that vein by Big Mike’s Havin’ Thangs and Big Mello’s Funkwitchamind in 1994.

Prince has admitted that the Rap-A-Lot formula—an indie releasing constant albums and crafting enough of a force that major label distributors such as Priority—may never be repeated again, or at least not to the success he and labels soon after had. At the moment, Rap-A-Lot isn’t releasing the full swath of albums it did in its heyday, and Prince has let it be known publicly that he’s fallen a bit out of love with the music industry.

“This whole game right now is a game that I'm not that excited about anymore because of the new structure and all these different ways of being able to get music without paying,” he told NPR in 2012. “It kind of kills my spirit from an entrepreneurial perspective.”

BECOMING THE BOOGEYMAN

Controversy and J. Prince have damn near been bedfellows ever since the Geto Boys originally faced conflict over getting distribution from David Geffen when they were signed to Def America. Geffen pulled the Geto Boys’ self-titled major label debut LP in 1990 over its explicit content. Prince alleged racism on Geffen’s behalf, and Geffen responded, issuing a statement that, according to the New York Times, said, “While it is not imperative that lyrical expressions of even our own Geffen artists reflect the personal values of Geffen Records, the extent to which 'The Geto Boys' album glamorizes and possibly endorses violence, racism and misogyny compels us to encourage Def American to select a distributor with a greater affinity for this musical expression.'”

According to rap urban legend, J. Prince allegedly stepped in to defend Pimp C after he and Master P got into a disagreement over whether Pimp was properly compensated for his work on P’s “Break Em Off Something” track from The Ice Cream Man in 1996. Master P allegedly kidnapped and pistol-whipped the UGK rapper over some of the latter’s remarks. But, allegedly, when he called J. Prince for a green light to kill Pimp C over the disrespect, Prince furiously told P not to harm Pimp C and to let him go. Although nobody ever admitted the story on record, the lyrics on Pimp C’s 2005 song “I Know U Strapped” seem to back it up.

Perhaps the most famous J. Prince move of all occurred in 2000 after Scarface released his Last Of A Dying Breed LP, which features taunts at Drug Enforcement Agency officer Jack Schumacher and other agents. A 12-year investigation conducted by DEA agent Ernest Howard, which began in 1988, targeted Prince and Rap-A-Lot Records for involvement in drug distribution concluded suspiciously when then Attorney General Janet Reno canned the probe into the label. A rumor spread that the case had been withdrawn due to political pressure after Prince supposedly donated $200,000 to then-Vice President Al Gore’s presidential campaign, although government officials and Rap-A-Lot spokespeople denied the claim, according to MTV.

Democratic California representative Maxine Waters intervened on Prince’s behalf, writing Reno a letter detailing how Prince and associates feared for their lives due to “police harassment and excessive force,” while Howard, on behalf of the DEA, testified in a congressional hearing that he ended the investigation for fear of agents’ lives and safety.


DRAKE AND RAP-A-LOT

For many, J. Prince is the man who lets his voice drag and punch people in the throat on the intro tracks of Rap-A-Lot albums. He dragged former associates of his, the prosecutor Paula Goodheart, and Lil Troy on Scarface’s Emeritus album. He was the voice who led Bun B’s classic Trill album in 2005 and who celebrated the return of The Geto Boys with The Foundation in 2005. Even if his hand is strongly in the boxing arena, he still has a presence in rap through his son, Jas.

Jas Prince discovered Drake from the days of the Toronto rapper releasing tracks on MySpace, right before Comeback Season truly took hold, when Drizzy’s style was heavily influenced by Phonte of The Foreign Exchange and Little Brother. Jas brought Drake not only to Lil Wayne but also to his father. That’s why J. Prince’s name is included as executive producer for Thank Me Later & Nothing Was The Same. Prince joked during an appearance on The Breakfast Club in January 2014 that he knew nothing of a rumor that he stopped a tour bus with Drake and Wayne on it in order to see it right that his son got his fair payment for album points. J. Prince, in other words, has had his eye on Drake’s business arrangements for a long time.

And, just in time for the sixth anniversary of So Far Gone, the mixtape that really brought Drake (and, in a smaller way, Jas) to the forefront, the issues between the Princes & YMCMB surfaced once more. Legal documents have been served over album points for Drake and unpaid royalties, which could be in the millions. Personal issues have also spilled into public after Jas’s former fiancée Christina Milian left him in the summer of 2014—allegedly for Lil Wayne. Rap-A-Lot openly protested any of support of Lil Wayne during Drake’s Houston Appreciation Weekend concert last June.

Prince himself is usually soft spoken but when you provoke him, things change quickly. You in a sense need to get a pass from J. Prince to do anything in Houston. Since his extended Canadian family was messed with, the boogeyman of Southern rap is around again—just in time, it should also be noted, for Drake’s new album If You’re Reading This It’s Too Late. Some people are interpreting that project’s title as a shot at Birdman, and, with its shit-talking, old school attitude throughout, it’s a release that undoubtedly benefited from the promotion of J. Prince doing some shit talking on Drake’s behalf. J. Prince is going to stand up for the artists he supports, and he’s still not here for any lip wrasslin’.
Posted By: getthesenets

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/12/15 01:27 PM



feature about J. from local Houston channel
Posted By: getthesenets

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/12/15 01:40 PM

Originally Posted By: Scorsese

Perhaps the most famous J. Prince move of all occurred in 2000 after Scarface released his Last Of A Dying Breed LP, which features taunts at Drug Enforcement Agency officer Jack Schumacher and other agents. A 12-year investigation conducted by DEA agent Ernest Howard, which began in 1988, targeted Prince and Rap-A-Lot Records for involvement in drug distribution concluded suspiciously when then Attorney General Janet Reno canned the probe into the label. A rumor spread that the case had been withdrawn due to political pressure after Prince supposedly donated $200,000 to then-Vice President Al Gore’s presidential campaign, although government officials and Rap-A-Lot spokespeople denied the claim, according to MTV.

Democratic California representative Maxine Waters intervened on Prince’s behalf, writing Reno a letter detailing how Prince and associates feared for their lives due to “police harassment and excessive force,” while Howard, on behalf of the DEA, testified in a congressional hearing that he ended the investigation for fear of agents’ lives and safety.



Political influence is the difference between being a gangster and being a criminal.


Posted By: Scorsese

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/12/15 04:40 PM

getting back on subject he actually is still very active in the boxing world.

Jay Z, J. Prince, Andre Ward Celebrate Roc Nation Deal at ‘Throne Boxing’ Event

James “J” Prince and his client, boxer Andre Ward, was recently spotted alongside Jay Z at Roc Nation Sports first boxing event. Throne Boxing was held at Madison Square Garden this past Friday (Jan. 9) and aired live on FOX Sports 1. Celebrities in the building were Rihanna, Angie Martinez, Jack Gyllenhaal, Spike Lee, Rosie Perez, Fabulous and many others.

Roc Nation’s entry into the boxing world isn’t a surprise. Up until this point, the management-promotions firm has contracted many top athletes in every sports category except boxing. Jay is a known lover of the sport, so it was just a matter of time when boxing would become his next chess move.

How well will Roc Nation fare in the boxing world? This is the question most boxing critics wonder. But if who they are bringing on is any indication, then Roc Nation may just have the savvy to become a power player in boxing.

Their most recent newbie is Andre Ward.

Legally, Roc Nation can not manage Andre Ward since he already has a manager, J Prince. Therefore, Roc Nation will serve as the official promotional powerhouse for the WBA super middleweight champion. Ward is Olympic Gold Medalist status and boxing record of 27-0, 14KOs. With Jay Z’s star power, celebrity friends and marketing expertise, the buzz surrounding Ward should blossom tremendously in no time.

Andre Ward was previously working with Goossen Promotions.

Throne Boxing will air two additional events on Fox Sports 1 as part of Roc Nation’s three-fight deal.
Posted By: DB

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/12/15 07:55 PM

Very true chech


But my fave wey bey part is when he copped to that murder he didn't too ( to help Bird )
For a Pit beef sandwich " with extra horseradish "

Shit don't get better than that

bey was the definition of soldier , and as he said " shit i just do what they tell me to do "
And when something Inevidently always goes wrong " man always some shit " and always non chalent . Plus he only one that went head to head with Omar , no winner , no loser

Just loves that dude
Posted By: DB

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/12/15 08:02 PM

Man my minds playing tricks on me and

My block are some of my fave oldies
Posted By: cookcounty

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/12/15 08:05 PM

shit aside from chicago texas is a gd hub

nine times outta ten, they're more organized than chicago
Posted By: oldschool3

Re: A Sign of the Times - 05/13/15 07:44 PM

Originally Posted By: getthesenets
Originally Posted By: Scorsese

Perhaps the most famous J. Prince move of all occurred in 2000 after Scarface released his Last Of A Dying Breed LP, which features taunts at Drug Enforcement Agency officer Jack Schumacher and other agents. A 12-year investigation conducted by DEA agent Ernest Howard, which began in 1988, targeted Prince and Rap-A-Lot Records for involvement in drug distribution concluded suspiciously when then Attorney General Janet Reno canned the probe into the label. A rumor spread that the case had been withdrawn due to political pressure after Prince supposedly donated $200,000 to then-Vice President Al Gore’s presidential campaign, although government officials and
Rap-A-Lot spokespeople denied the claim, according to MTV.

Democratic California representative Maxine Waters intervened on Prince’s behalf, writing Reno a letter detailing how Prince and associates feared for their lives due to “police harassment and excessive force,” while Howard, on behalf of the DEA, testified in a congressional hearing that he ended the investigation for fear of agents’ lives and safety.




Political influence is the difference between being a gangster and being a criminal.
Well put Get, nothing truer!


Originally Posted By: getthesenets
Originally Posted By: Scorsese

Perhaps the most famous J. Prince move of all occurred in 2000 after Scarface released his Last Of A Dying Breed LP, which features taunts at Drug Enforcement Agency officer Jack Schumacher and other agents. A 12-year investigation conducted by DEA agent Ernest Howard, which began in 1988, targeted Prince and Rap-A-Lot Records for involvement in drug distribution concluded suspiciously when then Attorney General Janet Reno canned the probe into the label. A rumor spread that the case had been withdrawn due to political pressure after Prince supposedly donated $200,000 to then-Vice President Al Gore’s presidential campaign, although government officials and Rap-A-Lot spokespeople denied the claim, according to MTV.

Democratic California representative Maxine Waters intervened on Prince’s behalf, writing Reno a letter detailing how Prince and associates feared for their lives due to “police harassment and excessive force,” while Howard, on behalf of the DEA, testified in a congressional hearing that he ended the investigation for fear of agents’ lives and safety.



Political influence is the difference between being a gangster and being a criminal.


Posted By: getthesenets

Re: A Sign of the Times - 02/12/16 11:20 PM

in the can't-make-this-up category

Ted Cruz's campaign is using an old Geto Boys song in an ad targeting Hillary Clinton



This is weird because I read about Reagan using, and not noting the irony, the "Born in the USA" song by Springsteen.

ok...I'm out of the loop and was just told that the show "Office Space" used the song and that's probably where a lot of people know the song from.

Cruz's people don't know that J. Prince appears on the original song rapping as Bush Sr. talking about REAL gangster moves.
Posted By: getthesenets

Re: A Sign of the Times - 02/12/16 11:31 PM

Originally Posted By: Scorsese
You guys hear about may weathers problems with his former manager j prince a while back. Apparently he had some guys with guns go to mayweathers training and beat his business partner and some other people up. Floyd went running to bob arum and arum paid prince off.





from the start to about 3:34 the issue is discussed by Arum.
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