Still make sense today a making ceremony?

I mean that is the ceremony where stings the index,a blood drop on the
the holy saint and then burn it and pronounce the oath etc. I mean for the Genovese that had only 5-6 rats can still be worth, but for the Colombo that have about twenty rats ?

It's what separates us from them, it'll always be done....IMHO.

maybe they strip you naked and do a cavity search but it'll be done...

You think the Gambino's are slapping guys on the back and saying good luck?

I was referring to the peak of the oath: "Must you become ash like this holy saint, if you'll betray the family"beautiful ceremony, but how many of them think that it is outdated because now the Mafia is no longer a secret, even a boss of the five family flipped and even mob wives, certainly in Sicily made a lot of laughs on the American colleagues.

"Either it has meaning or no meaning." - Phil Leotardo

Well Massimo thought he was gonna change a lot of the rules+ induction ceremony no gun or saint I'm betting 100 percent they went back to traditional. Mater fact some Colombo guy Sousa got made by sonny franses and the pricked the finger burned paper. Then in 2010 around December the Colombo's didn't go threw with the ceremony cause the old guys didn't want to get hit with a gun charge. They were rite the feds were watching the inductee complained he had to bring his on gun to it. Think he got made in the MDC prison so they changed another rule. So now that papa guy can get his button and some other lifers

x2

They'll always have the ceremony.

Chicago's an abheration.

Are those guys even Italian??

Why, did Chicago not bother with the ceremony or are you talking about the last couple of years? I've always wondered about the Outfit and their making ceremony since in the 30-40s I doubt anybody bothered with it, you were either "in" or you weren't.

Maybe Chicago have a making ceremony, like most things with the outfit they keep things in house

The Chicago Outfit wasn't Sicilian-based, so they did things a little differently. Not having a making ceremony is the biggest one.

It was a rumor that was proven false in the family secrets trial that they didn't have a formal ceremony. They did.

Frank Calabrese was on tape talking about it...and I think his brother that turned rat talked about it on the stand also.

In one of the first undercover tapes played at the Family Secrets trial, a speaker identified as reputed mob boss Frank Calabrese Sr. recounted for his son the ceremony at which Outfit members become "made."

The underboss, the Outfit's second-in-command, and capos, who led the street crews, initiated new members one by one, cutting their fingers and then burning a holy picture in their hands, the elder Calabrese said in the 1999 conversation. The bosses checked out if anyone flinched in pain, according to the tape played Monday in court. Candidates had to have a murder under their belt. "You know what I regret more than anything?" said Calabrese, accused by prosecutors in 13 gangland slayings. "Burning the holy pictures in my hand. That bothers me."

In his first full day on the witness stand, Calabrese's son, Frank Jr., who identified his father on the tape, testified about murder and intimidation as his father glowered at him from under furrowed brows, his chin jutting forward in defiance at times and amusement at other times.

In an undercover tape played in court Monday, the elder Calabrese expressed some regrets at being made a full-fledged member of the Outfit in the secret ceremony years earlier. On the tape, the elder Calabrese said he told his sponsor, Angelo LaPietra, boss of the 26th Street crew in the early to mid-1980s, that "I didn't want it."

"I would be strapped down and if I wanted to do something else, I couldn't," Calabrese was heard on the tape telling his son.



The elder Calabrese told his son that to qualify, a made member had to have committed at least one murder, though the initiation could take place years later, the son said.

But the elder Calabrese gave plaudits to Mario Puzo, author of the "Godfather," saying the book's depiction of the making ceremony was "very close" to the real thing, his son said.

What part of the boot do most Chicago Italian-Americans come from Ted?

I think we're talking about Naples. Capone, Ricca, etc.

I feel like Chicago isn't really Cosa Nostra per se, they are the mob but they don't seem to follow any of the traditional rules. Marcello half irish. Turning made men into cops? But they seem to take other traditions more seriously, like not hurting families, etc..I don't think Capone was even made...maybe he was in New York but I doubt it. They were just doing what everyone else was doing during Prohibition it seems. In the Tony Accardo book by Roehmer, Accardo gets made by just a hand shake or something it says dont know if thats true and it also happened when he was very young allegedly.

Ever since Family Secrets, it's been known the Outfit used the ceremony at some point. The continued question and debates have revolved around did it always use it and, if not, when did they start using it.

I was under the impression Chicago "went formal" under Joey Aiuppa regarding the cermonies.

There are ceremonies in a lot of other organizations that are supposedly secret.

Your in an exclusive fraturnity when asked to join.

They can ask you for favors and they can do favors for you.

Like the free masons they do that shit. The only thing I know about it as people have to propose you for membership.

You got to be able to shut your mouth about it. There has to be a reason why they want you in.

Plus the connections you have from being in can do you a lot of good financially.

Someone in my immediate family is a mason. He never talks about it. He goes to meetings and sometimes he wears his tux.

Years ago when there was no formal making ceremony, a soldier was made with a handshake, a dinner in his honor, and a promotion, meaning that now he was a supervisor over soldiers or he may have his own separate Franchise. These important actions make the man, not a Ceremony pricking someone's finger which in my humble opinion is silly. Also, and very important. a soldier has to have committed or have been involved in a murder in order to be made. This was how it worked for years before Auippa wanted to be traditional and implement the finger pricking, holy card burning Ceremony.

Il Camorrista (The Professor)

The oath in prison.

I baptise this room as it was baptized by the our three old men,if they baptized it with irons and chains, I baptise it with irons and chains, I look up at the sky and see a star that fly and is baptized the room with words of omertà and formed society.

Tell me, boy, what you go looking for?

of my qualification of young honored

how much weighs a picciotto?

As a feather scattered to the wind

and what represents a picciotto?

an omertà sentinel that goes round and round, what he sees, hears and earns brings into the society if you betray this bread will become lead and this wine will become poison.If before I knew you as a young man of honor, from this moment o I know you how picciotto belonging to this body of society.

Furio I'm glad you posted this. Love the movie, this scene especially. Ben Gazzara was AMAZING in this. One of the most underrated movies (maybe not in Italy) but I think it deserves to be much more popular.
Giuseppe Tornatore's first major movie and one of his best.

Furio, another scene I love is the montage of the NCO-Camorra war, with people being killed almost every day, the movie shows it incredibly well.

The whole NCO/Cutolo saga is crazy and incredible. Imagine one guy in a US prison creating a prison gang and making it powerful enough to take on the entire 5 families... that's just so you guys can have an idea how powerful this guy and his organization were.

Yes,Malandrino especially if you think that the movie was made in 1986, just three years after the end of the war between NCO and NF, the movie despite the good receipts was seized by the authorities and the version of 4 hours for the TV was never aired; Cutolo in 1992 wanted to tell what he knew, but some say he was threatened with death (not his but that of his family), and since 1982 has been under the 41 bis, when the 41 bis still didn't exist and now at 74 years old, will die buried alive in the cell.

Talking about making ceremony,the innovation of cutolo was you became soldiers of the NCO even if you were in prison even for long sentences or even if you had 16 years, was enough that you were able to kill.

I've always found Cutolo more interesting to read about than Riina. Both were pretty crazy and their stories aren't that much different but Cutolo they say he had that magic charisma, like a cult leader.
You probably read it but there's interviews with ex-Cutoliani and you can tell they saw him as a God almost. Not only they were willing to kill for the organization, but they were ready to die any moment for him. Blind loyalty like that is impossible to find anywhere else, especially not in the American CN.

Furio you mean Cutolo wanted to make a deal or just talk to an interviewer? That's an interesting story.

you've grasped the point, Cutolo created from nothing an army, giving to every desperate the power to kill anyone in return for absolute loyalty, but this was also the weakness of the NCO compared to other clans less numerous but composed of men more professional.


Make a deal ?

With a dozen life sentences the only deal could be have a hour of exercise per day & once a month to talk with his wife and family.
Cutolo also has tried for years to get pregnant through artificial insemination Immacolata his wife who in 2006 gave birth to a little girl Denise (thank goodness that not born a male!)

thats what i think about being made you get some action and good money and control a racket