Loansharking

Out of all the rackets, this one is a bit of a head scratcher for me.

Extortion and protection rackets are very easy to understand. If you don't pay, they harm you. You have to pay money to keep other criminals from....also extorting you. Or you have to pay in order to enjoy the mob's political connections....which in a sense is what it means to be made and pay tribute to a Capo.

Union racketeering, almost self explanatory.

Contract rigging, also self explanatory.

Illegal gambling. Only way to explain this one is the mob must pay out more, and pay more often than legal lotteries in order to attract a loyal following.

But then you have loan sharking. Why in the world would you accept a mobster's money knowing what can happen if you don't or can't pay?

Is this a situation where you don't actually borrow money, but are assessed a "debt" due to some gambling bet that was lost? I don't get it. Maybe business owners that get extorted for protections payments and can't pay on time are then assessed a "vig" and listed as loan shark customers? It makes no sense. I wouldn't take a dime from a made man.

It's a big big money maker even today.

You have shys in illegal gambling places. You have them every where. Any place were people need quick money fast.

Also people who need quick money and can't get a loan from a real bank.

Beating people up? How can people pay you if you fucked them up?

You have to use physiology on them

Who is a good risk to pay? Guys that have families.

But to get a lot of money you have to have history borrowing from these guys. Or someone with a borrowing history has to vogue for the guy who wants the money.

So if he does not pay the man who vouged for you pays. Good luck in finding a guy who would do it for you.

Dead men can't pay. It's the threat of violence that makes people pay a shy promptly and in full. The actual act of violence rarely occurs.

loansharking, also self-explanatory

Please help me out here. I don't get it.

I understand the concept of not killing your debtor. That one is easy. But why in the world would a guy make himself a debtor and even give you the option to make that call? Someone said people need quick money. If your home is not in foreclosure, why? Just why?

Is it drug addiction? Are they lending to addicts that need a fix and have no money to pay it?

Compulsive gamblers always need money.

Poor people always need money because they are poor for example to pay the rent to keep on the electricity.

They also know no one in their family that they can borrow money from. Maybe because they loan them money and never paid them back.

Drug users are terrible risks. They can always go out and rob people for money to support their habit.

It's desperation, plain and simple. Not everyone can go to a bank. And sure, a lot of the time it's gambling addiction or drug addiction. But there's a grey area here. You might just be a good person with bad credit and you have a family to feed.

Thanks for the straightforward answer.

Why would a shy loan someone money. If they are a good risk to pay or let's say you think his wife is hot. You might use the excuse to fuck her or put her out on the street for a steady flow of money.

Desperation, vulnerability, for some it's the last option, they simply have nowhere else to turn.
There is also the criminal side where they back each other for drugs money simply to be sure that certain gangs keep the control of certain areas. Well that's the way it happens here.

Ok that's interesting. That's another angle. You front a guy drugs or drug money at interest(?), and this somehow helps you dominate a drug territory? It sounds like you are saying that the shy is also sometimes a drug distributor and will front drugs or money-for-drugs to the gang of his choice based on the fact that they are his allies.

They prey on desperate people who have nowhere else to turn for money, people trying to hide monetary losses from there significant others/families, immigrant groups who are afraid of deportation, and the biggest one of all- GAMBLERS.

Sportsbookmakers and shylocks go hand in hand, TRUST ME ON THIS ONE. A sportsbook without a corresponding loansharking operation is like a restaurant without food, a bar without Booze, MCDonalds without Fat people....

Loan shark guys will front money for legitimate and illegitimate business ventures. They will fuck a few people up, maybe kill a lowlife who is into them for a small amount, in order to establish a reputation as someone who is willing to go to extremes for their repayment.

It's a way controlling the gangs with out getting your own fingers dirty. It happens here a lot, with the criminal gangs against the paramilitary gangs, then we have the kinahan cartel who are supplying and funding the gang war in Dublin.

They may not kill you but they will take a finger or a toe or your car.

Stealing things from their home is the first step if they don't call you to revise the payment plan. Doing it when hubby is not home is part of it.

Can't pay they are open to a different payment arrangement. But don't call is a major problem. These guys think your spitting in their face if you don't call.

My old boss's first cousin was killed by the Detroit mob. Apparently, he had taken out a loan to open up a furniture business and never repaid. It was a pretty big deal and in all the papers. I think Burnstein even mentioned it on his Detroit mob documentary.

Thats extreme but getting major money is something I never really seen. Except for one guy who was afraid to carry a lot of money with him. Then if he lost gambling 20 to 50 thousand in a night. Shys paid and come to his house a few days latter on he paid them cash plus 4 or 5 percent interest.

It's an extreme example to say the least. But people read it and their imaginations take over. And that's exactly what the mob wants.

The truth is, debtors rarely get seriously hurt. And almost NEVER get killed. But the threat of it happening is the great motivator here.

There are a million brokesters and beats walking around the Bronx. You see them walk into a bar and you say to yourself, How is that guy still walking around? But it happens. He knows how to play the game. Beg Peter to pay Paul, etc.

http://gangsterreport.com/surving-the-mob-ernie-kanakis-had-9-lives/

I'm going to read this later but had a glimpse at it and looks interesting.

a recent example. the motivations are stated and are obvious

http://www.rocklandtimes.com/2014/09/10/...hark-operation/

Plus I mean you have to consider the fact that a lot of the people who would be interested in taking a loan shark's loan probably don't feel like filling out a bunch of paper work or waiting a couple hours at the bank. With a loan shark they can get the money quickly and without a bunch of paperwork. Lol so less hassle?

Just finished reading this. Very good mob story compressed into a short essay. Interesting unexpected twists. Suspense. Read this when you get the chance.

If you look at the cases, most of the mob's loansharking goes hand in hand with it's gambling operations. Let's say a bettor owes a $50,000 gambling debt but doesn't have the money to pay up. The mob is happy to simply charge him 2% (or $1,000) a week interest on that debt. That doesn't come off the principal. It's just what the guy pays to not have to pay back the entire $50,000 or get put in the hospital. They'll "juice" the guy indefinitely or, perhaps, to a point and then let him pay off the principal over time. Violence is the mob's ultimate insurance but they have any number of ways of recouping their money. Maybe the guy has a business they can bust out or take over. And many gamblers willingly go along with paying so much every week to float a loan because they always figure they will get more money the next game or whatever.

I noticed that (the balance between gambling and shylocking).

And using a loan to become a silent partner in a mark's business and then busting it out is a technique I am aware of. It just made no sense to me how someone could get into debt in the first place, willingly. But thank you to everyone who is answering this long lingering question for yours truly. Turns out there are plenty of reasons they get into debt. I don't know if most of them are good reasons however.

years ago..a shylock would be at card games, if guys needed money they got it from him if they wanted to..the house would pay the interest on the first week and then if it was not paid back the guy would assume the loan..

Ah, the lure of easy money. That makes a lot more sense now.

Do you remember Chip from Lydig Avenue? Guy was an ex-motorcycle cop. He was never made of course because of his history in law enforcement. But he made a a Hell of a second career just hanging around card games and loaning money.

PB!

Your face's changed!
Say it aint so PB! Say it aint so!

Mickey! Where for out thou Mickey.......

hello pizza, no never heard of him..he had to be real close to a nice guy to get that job..lock money..

That's the Coach. Mickey's still alive and well across the street .

They're both dead so it doesn't matter. But he was around Danny Squire. He had an office at the old Riddler's on Westchester Avenue.

today i wouldn't be surprised if the exhumed some guys and indicted them..it's slow out there. no big drug cases or murders.

It's true. Makes you wonder how much they regret hitting guys years ago. They're still making a living even without getting heavy (most of the time, anyway). Because when you hit a certain age you start to regret all the lost time you spent inside.

It sure is quiet out there.

Crea, Cefalu, Westside.

Not a murmer.

Hell of a run....

very true, the animals are gone..gas..sammy ect..

Guys like that can survive on their old reputations. Stevie for instance. I wish I had a dollar for every article I've read that calls him white collar. And don't get me wrong, it's true. Today it's true. But if you knew him thirty years ago you'd be singing a different song. The guy is fucking fearless.

Anyway, like I said. These guys are older with reputations that will follow them around for the rest of their lives. But the guys who are 40 today, and never even cracked an egg, it makes you wonder in they'll be as feared when they're in their 60's. Personally, I just don't see it.

you are correct, in time a guy that wants to be a lion will step up and make a challenge to the new guard..that 40 group ..it is just history..it repeats..a i. e. gotti or a casso may be festering some place

Allways wondered about Crea,was he related to someone?I mean he was made rally early.I think we mentioned him once before PB on the forum,he was a Yonkers guy,right?

PS Love the new haircut

alfa, I managed a pawn shop for 20 years, we charged 20% interest a month. and the interest didn't come off the principal.

it was completely legal. and I was writing loans from when we opened til when we closed. nowadays payday loans are the sharks, and juice guys,

some states ban payday loans, under ussery laws, they charge more interest than loan sharks and they are legal, go figure.

Andrew Cuomo banned the payday loans here in New York. And yet his asshole father actually denied the existence of the Mafia as recently as the '80s.

Not that I'm in favor of payday loans. I'm just pointing out the liberal hypocrisy that's so rampant in the Cuomo family. They're self hating Italian Americans to the nth degree.

yes, you are quite right pb, however new Yorkers keep electing them.