Joe Masseria's Caporegimes

Who were his Capo's around the time of the Castellammare war Luciano and Genovese I know of since Luciano became Underboss when Morello was killed also who else and who was in Luciano's crew?

Some of Masseria's group leaders were Ruggiero Boiardo, Salvatore Chiri and Guarino Moretti of New Jersey, Frank Iacone of Worchester, Generoso DelDuca, Joseph Lanza, Rocco Pellegrino, Saverio Pollaccia, and Ciro Terranova. There are others but it is hard to say if they were group leaders around this time, or became capos after Masseria was killed or were demoted.

On one side of the Castellamarese War were the Castellamarese and every boss allied with them.

On the other side was everyone else allied to Joe the Boss. Therefore it is simply a matter of deciding which bosses existed at the time and who were they allied with, Maranzano or Masseria, to determine who was a "Capo" in the Masseria organization. What is a boss today was a lieutenant then, under the boss of bosses.

I think Masseria had his own gang, and then other gangs were allied to him and paid him tribute, such as Al Capone's.

Another kind of Capo Masseria had were the captains/group leaders within his own family. To discover that, someone has to do something very interesting. They need to construct a chart of the old Luciano Family.

Clearly Vito is there. Clearly Costello is there. Clearly Adonis is there.

If the old Corleonesi Clan that lived up in Harlem, the Morellos, were absorbed into Joe the Boss' organization, then you assign a principal to them and then you have another possible Captain in the Masseria organization. Peter Morello? Yes, Bigtime. He was definitely a group leader or leading figure behind Masseria. After he was assassinated, one of the Morello brothers probably took his place and that brother became another of Masseria's chief lietenants or capos if you will.

On a side note, I don't think Lucky Luciano ever held a position in the mafia lower than capo. I think he and his bootlegging operation were absorbed directly into Masseria's conglomerate where Charlie sort of became Masseria's driver, bodyguard, and assistant. Some would say maybe he wasn't Underboss, that Peter Morello was the closest thing to an Underboss in the Masseria mob. But that's why we're here, to find out. Did Underboss even exist at that time, or was it just the most prominent captain in a gang under the Boss? The Castellamarese weren't into bosses and gangs and mobs, but rather family and father. There was no "underfather" in the prehistoric Bonanno Clan. There was just the father.

The Masseria crime family and the Morello/Terranova one were one and the same. Masseria came after Giuseppe Morello. For various reasons Morello could not become a boss again after he came out of prison, so Masseria succeeded him while Morello advised him. Morello was his underboss, but in many ways "the power behind the throne." Salvatore Pollaccia was Masseria's consigliere. An accurate list of capos is impossible right now because we don't have that information. Luciano, Capone and Ciro Terranova were caporegimes, maybe Vito Genovese and Frank Costello were also. Frank Yale was one.

If you want more I suggest you read this article:
http://www.magcloud.com/browse/issue/739915

The reason I am not sure about that is because the Morello and Terranovas were an actual familial clan. Joe the Boss, so far as we know, was an outsider. Not blood related. Yet they kicked up to him. That makes me think he had people with him who helped him dominate the Morellos and Terranovas. I doubt Joe the Boss was Corleonesi from Corleone, which the Morellos and Terranovas probably were.

What I mean is that there was probably a merger at some point with the corporations being acquired being the Morello and Terranova groups.

The use of the terms gang mob and family are also murky. Maranzano was said to be the one to institute the use or return to usage of the term family to describe a mafia. Before him, supposedly everyone was in a gang or a mob. That's why I use terms like Masseria Gang or Masseria Mob. That would also make the ancient Chicago outfit called the Capone Gang, or Capone Mob. I think I've heard the former somewhere (Capone Gang), not the latter.

Well, about two years ago I read The First Family by Mike Dash and it had lots of content about what happened.

After Morellos convicton D`Aquila took his place as supreme authority over the fraternity. If I remember correctly Morello was sentenced to death at a fraternity meeting although later revoked, which must have been the reason why he was not allowed to assume his old position.

At the time he came out of prison his halfbrothers, Ciro and Vincenzo, were leading the Morello-Terranova Clan. One of his allies at that time was Umberto Valenti(East Village).

As of Masseria, his connection to Morello could have been a Man named Lima with whom he was arrested in 1907. Note Morellos sister Marie married a man named Giaoacchino Lima.

Basically, Masseria had luck. As Prohibiton started he was the one who profited more than others because his territory happened to be called the Curb Exchange (Kenmare Street, Little Italy).
In 1921 Masserias power was second only to D´Aquila, which is why Morello probably sided with his one time underling.

Little augie pisano, gyp de Carlo possibly

d'aquila never gets the attention that he should, names like lucky ,massaria, maranzano have the spot light.maybe from movies and press, they were impact guys..but d'aquila was a dominant boss ,close relations with buffalo clev, pitts. detroit ,the whole network..and no picture of him..tough to find..his son died in 2000, another guy who lasted was joe triana..guy went through every war early on ,lived to 100 years old..

Well, I am sure. Read the article it explains everything.

The article goes beyond what Mike Dash wrote in making connections to Italy as well as genealogical relationships. It also makes use of many rare Italian documents and trial transcripts. I like Dash and his book, but this shows the origins of the Five Families like nothing else does.

Has anybody read the book by David Critchley, "The Origin of Organized Crime in America, New York City, 1891-1931" -- it is $47 on Amazon, but seems like it could be a very informative read on matters such as this -- wondering if I should part with my money?

http://www.amazon.com/Origin-Organized-C...5883&sr=1-1

It's a good book. The softcover is slightly updated so I'd recommend that one. The newest issue of Informer with the most current information is only $5.

The book is very informative and a very good read for anyone who´s interested in the early years. But Critchley does not go into "charts" and doesn´t name, for example, who Masseria´s captains were. And who can really blame him? We can only speculate who the captains were because no one has actually figured that out. I totally agree with faithful about the top three guys (Masseria, Morello and Pollaccia). Other captains that are sure bets would be Luciano, Ciro Terranova, Vito Genovese, Carfano and Capone. After that, it becomes uncertain. We really don´t know if Costello was a skipper under Masseria or when for example guys like Mike Miranda, Rocco Pellegrino and Willy Moretti etc were upped. Someone mentioned Gyp DeCarlo. But DeCarlo certainly wasn´t a skipper under Masseria because he wasn´t made yet. Neither was Boiardo.

Al Capone a captain for Masseria? Because he was inducted by Masseria? So basically Capone was not recognised as an independent boss? Did Capone and his ego agree to being a captain for Masseria as well?

I forgot about the other gangs allied with Masseria, and yes Capone was a group leader under Masseria in Chicago. HK, Ruggiero Boiardo was a group leader during Masseria's time, I think you are thinking of his son Anthony Boiardo who not made at the time, but later on took over his fathers crew.

Where do the Castellano's fit into all of this? That is, weren't the Castellano's established in the mob even before Carlo Gambino came over from Sicily? If so, were they part of the Masseria organization or perhaps a third Sicilian organization?

Castellano's were under Anastasia, D'Aquila, Mineo, and Scalise in the Gambino family who were with Masseria, Mangano was under Maranzano before the formations of the families. That is why it is hard to do a chart on this of everyone. The Castellano brothers were powerful, but Guiseppe Castellano, father of Paul might have been a group leader, but became a capo at the formation of the families. At the formation of the families, guys switched from other families to a new family. That is why it is a lot of guess work.

correct

During a conversation between Gyp DeCarlo and Sam DeCavalcante, which was secretly taped by the FBI, it was revealed that DeCarlo, Catena, Boiardo and Cy Rega became members of the Luciano Family in or around 1947. The transcripts can be found on Mary Ferrell. Before that, Boiardo was an independent bootlegger and head of his own gang. His son Tony, was made approximately ten years later.

That's great info hairy! Do you know if catena and decarlo were part of a smaller family in Jersey which was absorbed primarily by the Genovese and luchesse families in the 40s-50s?

I don´t think so. The Newark Family was disbanded in the mid 1930s and the made members were absorbed by all five NY Families. I think Catena was actually a member of Longy Zwillman´s group before joining the Italians. DeCarlo may have been an early associate of Willy Moretti (Genovese captain) but there is not much info on him before he joined the Mafia. Basically what I know is that he at some point had been an associate of Boiardo but that the two of them had gone seperate ways after a falling out.

I personally do not feel that this is accurate, for the simple fact that the Morellos and Terranovas were a blood family and Joe the Boss was an outsider, a stranger. There is no reason in the world for them to kick up to one man unless he had other people behind him.

Remember that they were all black handers and into extortion and terrorism. Ignazio Lupo was among them. These people are not easy to break or force them to kick up to anyone. You'd have to be mighty strong to force Ignazio Lupo's people to kick up to you. The Morellos had the murder stables. Before they even met Joe the Boss, they might have disposed of 60 persons.

For Joe the Boss' organization to be one and the same with the Morello/Terranova combine, that means Peter Morello and Ignazio and all the rest of the Corleonesi terrorists were kicking up to one single man, who had no gang of his own.

That's impossible.

I'm sorry, but Critchley and Newark and the rest of them leave a lot of blank areas when writing history from their research, and then they quote baseless anecdote when it suits them (Umberto Valenti killed by Lucky Luciano supposedly). If all anecdote is false, then don't quote it, ever.

De Carlo was once part of the Mazzocchi crew which was a rival gang of Boiardo's during prohibition. As the Mazzocchi brothers were killed off he became part of the Boiardo crew. At that time Moretti and Boiardo were at odds. Moretti was with Longy so was Catena.

Yeah you´re correct AG. I now remember reading about the Mazzocchi gang in In The Godfather Garden by Richard Linnett.

If you want to debate me on this then read the article I referred to in Informer magazine. It proves what I have been saying. Until you go over the facts in that article you don't have a leg to stand on.

LOL I am not buying your article. I will take your word for it though. No one will be making money off of me. You'll just have to lay out your logic as I have laid out mine. Or give me a link where I don't need to shell out $$$.

PS, let me also make one thing clear. Mob history doesn't interest me as much as mob lore and history mixed together, for the simple fact that we cannot know the real history more than half the time. The government lies, snitches lie, criminals lie, they all lie. History is written by the victors. People who are ONLY interested in established proven mob facts are probably missing out on 99% of the events allude to by the lore. Therefore a writer or writers who limit their writings purely to "FBI reports" and all of that I find to be the most boring of mob writers.

$5 is not $$$. The article contains years of research that cost a lot of money, including traveling and visiting archives around the country and copying reams of documents. It's not just my research, but also Angelo Santino and Lennert van't Riet. The measly few dollars doesn't go to us, it helps keep this journal on organized crime and law enforcement alive so it can continue putting out well-researched cutting edge material. If you're too cheap to put out a few dollars to see the material that can answer your questions (plus other high-quality articles), then I'm not going to bother. Five dollars is cheaper than a movie theater ticket or a lunch at most places.

Regarding your second assertion, I don't know of any writer who limits his or her writing to only FBI reports.

From the article.

That is a beautiful chart and the research done there is commendable.

One point of contention someone like me would have with it is the matter of Gaetano Gagliano, Tommy Lucchese's old skipper.

There was a photo circulated for years that was purported to be that of Gaetano Gagliano, the Boss of the old Gagliano Family, before they became the Lucchese Family.

Now research such as this comes out claiming to clarify history, except the picture they use of the man is of someone completely different, with a different first name.

Not helping the matter is the fact that no one knows exactly when Tommy Lucchese became Boss or when Gagliano died. Was it 1951 or 1953? You'd think we'd have an answer for something as simple as that, but we don't.

I for one am not convinced that the man on that chart, puported to be Gaetano Gagliano, but there called "Tommasso", is the actual Boss of the Gagliano Family. He could be, but I am not convinced. (hint )

According to findagrave, Gagliano died on Feb 16th 1951. If you look at the photos it clearly says that on his tombstone.

http://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=pv&GRid=18842&PIpi=95391

great find..there was an article in the 70's called "the two hundred"..might have been ny times..is it possible to track that down?

Sounds like someone reaching out for a freebie.

That photo of Tommaso Gagliano came from his citizenship registration that I took myself at the national archives.

I'm looking at the photos. That's the whole problem. The Gagliano there looks like a completely different person from the narrow faced Gagliano in the above chart.

And I noticed that Gagliano is listed in your link as "Tommaso "Tommy Gaetano" Gagliano". That is just not credible to me. I think before these books were put out, there was only one photo of Gagliano, that of the round faced man, and one name...Gaetano Gagliano. Now there are two photos circulating everywhere and more than one name ("Tommasso"). These guys over at the informer even tried to reconstruct the face of Maranzano himself. But if you use google, you will find that what the person did was take a photograph of the movie star Rudolph Valentino and transpose some editing over it, then claim that the artwork was the result of studying crime scene drawings and descriptions of Maranzano's body.

Look at the face on the right,

True Face of Maranzano according to the Informer Crowd

Now look at this,

Rudolph Valentino

They flipped the photo backwards and I'm supposed to accept that that is a credible Salvatore Maranzano? And that thin faced guy is Gaetano Gagliano? I don't think so.

You caught on to us, Alfa. On the basis of someone else's photo reconstruction you dismiss our article. Keep your $5.

LOL I worked for that 5 dollars.

Look, don't disown this. The one who put out Rudolph Valentino as Salvatore Maranzano was David Critchley himself, and he did it in the Informer magazine. The article is called "Maranzano Muddle".

Now the same crowd of people are trying to tell me that this guy...

Gaetano Gagliano

and this guy....

Tommasso Gagliano

are the same guy.

Yes I will keep my 5 dollars.

I have none of any of your posters knowledge, however in my remembering of the book " the valachi papers" joe valachi mentions he was married to mildred reina, the daughter of Gaetano reina who is listed in the chart in the last page. according to valachi reina was to become the leader of his own family, but was killed before maranzano appointed him. valachi also mentions that bonaventurna pinzolo was masserias underboss, and reina was one of his captains. now, a lot made have came to light after valachis book. written I believe in 1968. im sure you all know this but valachi is never used as a source, and I was wondering why.

Binnie, thank you for that. The whole pre Commission arrangement really isn't clear. We needed Bill Bonanno just to tell us that there were originally 3 families and not 5. Of course after you organize a thing, you have everyone on record, what their rank is, who their skipper is, and on and on. But back in the dark ages, back when "guys were blowing each other up every 2 minutes just because they came from a different part of Sicily", it's extremely murky. We shouldn't argue or try to impose our beliefs onto others regarding the pre-1931 Mafia. We should relish the discovery process of shining light into that dark part of American history and the history of many of our major American cities.

In regards to your comment Binnie, I must add that Gaetano Reina, just like the Morellos (and Terranova's?) was Corleonesi and probably mafia before he even came to America. So basically, most if not all of the Corleonesi were allied to Masseria, and all of the Castellammaresi were allied to Don Maranzano. But Maranzano was a Castellammaresi himself. Masseria was not from Corleone so far as we know. Yet the Corleonesi acknowledged him as the Boss.

Something is left out.

yes, and knowing you, you will solve this riddle. it might take you awhile but, I don't think youre going to give up. look forward your posts.

leaving aside the specific question of why the corleonesi would defer to an outsider, there is the basic question of the "mechanism" of affiliation . . . .

that is, if there were in essence 3 main "fields" of ny mafia pre-1931, one Corleone, one Palermo, one Castellammarese, then did gangsters with ties to one of these areas "naturally" or "automatically" gravitate toward the respective field? or was the mechanism much looser?

obviously mobsters like Costello and Anastasia had nowhere to go other than to join a family from a different region than their own

but how to account for a mobster like Lucchese, born in Palermo, but a close associate of such Corleonesi figures as Gagliano, Reina, Luciano, etc?

Well I hope you guys figure it out like we did. Should make for good entertainment :-)

hey hey hey now -- i intend to order the Informer issue pretty soon -- I meant only to say that based upon the charts, it looks as though the composition of the pre-1931 families was based largely upon regional affiliations, and yet there would seem to be many exceptions --

first, the major exception of joe "the boss" Masseria

and second, the many instances where mobsters with roots in one part of Sicily joined families that were heavily rooted in another part

and so all of this points to the question of affiliation -- which factors determined how mobsters affiliated pre-1931?

-- clearly the regional factor carried a lot of weight, as palermo mobsters seem to have joined palermo families, the castellammarese gravitated to the castellammarese, etcetera

and yet it appears the regional factor was not the only factor, whether in terms of which family a mobster might join, or even in the case of an outsider (masseria from marsala in trapan) taking over a corleonesi group

so what were the other factors? personal charisma? personal affinities? growing up in a certain neighborhood?

dominic calabrese ... ive been reading every post on this thread and find it very interesting. must take a ton of research to understand the structure of families before 1931. it appears as though your last question is really baffling. its as alfa romeo posted last night. something is missing here. something is left out. and your question alludes to this mystery. what else mattered besides the regional affiliations? I hope I read where someone answers this.

The only way genuine pictures of these guys can ever be authenticated is to track down family as I'm sure many of them had large families and photos have survived generations. The original maranzano picture is actually a guy named salvatore Messina a London gangster. There is so much info missing and the only way some of the blanks will be filled in is through research follow up and the use of family members to get background on these guys

Ok, from what I can glean so far, the dark horse that might help explain the mysterious power Joe the Boss had over the Morellos might be the Camorra.

After the Mafia/Camorra war ended in 1917, there was a merger of sorts that brought men like Rocco Valenti (originally a member of Camorra) into the Morello/Terranova group. Joe the Boss was also in the mix starting from some point unclear, though his Sicilian pedegree means Masseria was likely Cosa Nostra from the get-go, whenever that was.

I am suspecting, and I could be wrong, that Joe the Boss could control the Morellos because some of the old Camorra that were adsorbed into the Morello organization supported him. It's hard to imagine a blood related family of black hand terrorists paying monetary tribute to one man and not assassinating him, no matter how rich he was.

Could it be? The root of Joe the Boss Masseria's power was Camorra?

I am reading Last Testament of Bill Bonanno and he's not much help either.

The guy uses the name Tommasso Gagliano. One time. I saw that and thought, hot damn there it is. The name of the old Gagliano Boss was Tommasso. Then he uses the name Gaetano Gagliano twice after that, with no explanation. I wondered right there maybe he was influenced by some of the esteemed writers on this very board because even he, Bill Bonanno, seemed unsure.

Also, I notice on the impressive chart posted on this thread that the Camorra are not mentioned, neither is the Mafia Camorra War of 1916ish, or the subsequent merger between the Camorristi and Morellos that happened directly before and preceding the advent of Guiseppe Masseria. That's a huge omission. This thread is about who Joe the Boss' caporegimes were. No doubt some of them had to be former Camorristi. You give them positions of power to keep the peace.

Umberto Valenti was never a member of the Camorra. If you're going by Wikipedia the writers mix him up with Rocco Valente. Two different people.

I think you may be onto something here. the camorra may have been the strongest faction. they and the calabrian may be the oldest. not much is mentioned of the calabrian. but, I read where their the oldest of all. I got to read dashs book.thank you for the info alfa.

Correct

And btw, that is an old tiny factoid that I already knew from years ago and forgot.

You're too kind Binnie. And what you say merits notice. If the Camorra are needed to explain the origin of Joe Masseria and the base of his power, we cannot ignore any other "mafias" extant at that time to help us understand just what the Masseria organization was composed of.

It sort of all fits together. Maranzano being ethnocentric and disinterested in having relationships with non Sicilians naturally ended up being the general of the smaller army.

Masseria by dealing with different varieties of Italians (Camorra, Al Capone, etc) accumulated the more massive organization. Masseria would even back a non Sicilian (Capone) against a Sicilian (Aiello).

yes, and backing a non-Sicilian against another Sicilian was absolutely unheard of. nobody would dare do it. unless of course hes not Sicilian. I would suggest that masseria had the backing of the old country camorra. if he lived would his faction have won the war?

Masseria was less organized, and he was taken by surprise. Plus he had double agents in his ranks (Lucky and Three Fingers).

For him to win he needed a less ethnically diverse army. The Castellammarese were uniform because they all came from the same village. When the order went out to start shooting, there was no delay because the whole village took orders from one man. Masseria on the other hand had a variety of different bosses with differing degrees of loyalty to him. In Masseria's situation, he probably couldn't organize everyone underneath him to move like one army. He was less organized.

He was taken by surprise. The opening salvo was when Gaetano Reina was felled. But depending on who you read, either Masseria hit him, or Lucky and his confederates did it to make it look like Maranzano started shooting (and to keep Reina from making Maranzano too strong and thus wiping them all out). Either way, Joe the Boss couldn't choose how the war would turn out because he wasn't permitted to choose how and where it would begin.

He had double agents around him. That doesn't need any explanation. That really did him in. He would have been better off leaving Charlie Lucky alone.

How could Masseria have won it? Wow. All I can say is that if he couldn't get someone within the loyal tight nit Castellammarese clan to whack Maranzano, he probably would have to bomb them with TNT in their neighborhoods and speakeasies. There's no other way. I don't think Joe the Boss had the type of loyalty from his supporting cast that they would go out in unison and shoot down 500 Castellammarese.

Maybe the problem was that Joe The Boss's empire was too spread out? Maybe he had more men than Maranzano, but those men were not geographically situated in such a manner that they would be able to surprise the Castellammarese with a unified simultaneous attack.

I read somewhere that the match up was 500 Maranzano men versus 600 Masseria men, and about 200 people under Lucky Luciano and Company before he merged into the Masseria mob. But as soon as the Castellammarese war started, it became clear that Maranzano was stronger solely by the number of soldiers Joe the Boss was losing.

I'm reading Bill Bonanno. He says that Gaetano Gagliano resigned as Boss at a 1953 Commission meeting he (Gagliano) attended in person. If that is the truth then he and Tommasso are not the same person.

Bill got the year wrong. It was in 1951 (or possibly 1950) Gagliano announced that he is stepping down and asked the Commission to approve Lucchese as his successor. Gagliano´s first name was Tommaso and he DID die in February of 1951. End of story. I posted his obituary in one of the threads here some time ago. Use the search function to find it.

for whatever reason, it seems that the following figures were known both as Gaetano and as Tommaso/Tommy/Tom

--Gaetano "Tom" Reina, b. 1889 in Corleone - d. 1930 (his daughter Mildred married Joe Valachi)

--Tommaso "Tommy Gaetano" Gagliano, b. 1884 in Corleone - d. 1951

--Gaetano "Tommy" "Two-Finger Brown" Lucchese, b. 1899 in Palermo -- d. 1967

I used to know an old man everyone called "Tom" but his real name was Gaetano. I think the names Thomas and Gaetano have some close connection for Italians.

this is probably a stretch, but maybe this informs how Italians relate the two names =

Thomas Cajetan (pronounced Ca-'je-tan), also known as Gaetanus, commonly Tommaso de Vio or Thomas de Vio (20 February 1469 - 9 August 1534), was an Italian philosopher, theologian, cardinal (from 1517 until his death) and the Master of the Order of Preachers 1508-18. He was a leading theologian of his day who is now best known as the spokesman for Catholic opposition to the teachings of Martin Luther and the Protestant Reformation while he was the Pope's Legate in Wittenberg, and perhaps also among Catholics for his extensive commentary on the Summa Theologica of Thomas Aquinas.

De Vio was born in Gaeta, then part of the Kingdom of Naples, as Jacopo Vio. The name Tommaso was taken as a monastic name, while the surname Cajetan derives from his native city.

The english translation for the name Gaetano is Tommy. It might have something to do with the Italian nickname for Gaetano being Tano, which becomes Tom.

Carmela, I realize that you speak Italian, and that I, sadly, do not (though I intend to reclaim my heritage in this regard before I die) --- however, I thought it was Tommaso that is the Italian name for Thomas?

In other words, we have this series =

Tommaso (italian) ---> Tomas (Spansh) ---> Thomas (English/French)

Gaetano (Italian) ---->Cayetano (Spanish) ----> Gaetan (French)

but it appears that there is no English cognate of Gaetano

Gaetano derives from the city of Gaeta, whereas Tommaso derives from the Greek & Aramaic for "twin"

same with vincenzo.. some called jimmy..

in any case, for the larger purpose of this thread, I think it is safe to say that Tommy Gagliano and Gaetano Gagliano are one and the same person!

^^^ Tommaso is the Italian version of Thomas as well.
Like I mentioned above, when Italians call Gaetano, they usually say, Tano. I think this has mutated into Tom or Tommy. It has a lot to do with dialect, not always making grammatical sense.

Take for instance Calogero and how that becomes Luca (and this is italian to italian lol). Italian nickname for Calogero (which is generally a sicilian name) in which Sicilians will call, Caluzzu, which will become Luzzu, which becomes Luca. It doesn't have to make sense but things happen within different dialects.

Lilo, often used,

I love to talk about the old mafia, and, its origins. but, this can become confusing. yes, mildred reina was valachis wife. daughter of Gaetano reina. as valachi says in his book, if he woulnt have been murdered he would have been the head of the family, which is now known as the luchesse family. the valachi papers lays down some interesting history. im surprised its not used as more of a source.

very hard to get credible info the farther back you go.., you need some old harlem and lower nyc 1st ave.guys grandfathers stories or now great grandfathers.

calogero is a huge name in sicilia after st. calogero,,who came from africa..

I think Valachi is as credible as anyone else. I'm reading Bill Bonanno now. He says that because Valachi was a low level guy, that he had no clue what was going on around him. Then this same Bonanno says that Cosa Nostra formed in America because Sicilians felt discrimination in America. That's not the truth and he should know it because his family as well as the Corleonesi came through Ellis Island mobbed up from head to toe.

I read the Valachi Papers long ago. But isn't it true that the library version is the redacted record and not the whole affidavit he gave to law enforcement. That stuff is top secret, no?

The questions you pose here should keep this thread going a little further.

Very interesting. That Lucchese was a slippery snake wasn't he?

clearly the Castellammerese were more closely knit, a kind of "closed field" to anyone not from the immediate area

the other groups were more of a big tent, seemingly

would the Corleonesi have been just as closed off to "outsiders" as the Castellammerese had the Morello gang leaders not been imprisoned for so long?

perhaps the Corleonesi had to band together with others, and defer to Masseria, out of weakness?

did Masseria have a Trapani power-block supporting him? or were his supporters and allies simply less attached to, less conscious of, their roots, i.e., somehow more "American" than other early groups?

alfa, concerning [ the valachi papers ] the book came out in 1968, and ive never heard about redactions in the original. maybe years later for what reasons I cant quite understand. of course anything is possible with our government. if their were redactions in 68 and withheld from the original book I would most definitely like to see the redactions. another puzzling item is the fact that valachi was there when maranzano set up the five families. not three but five, valachi was there. as to bill bonnanos assertion that valachi was low-level that's always been the rap on him. however he was very close to vito Genovese, vito being the best man at his wedding. also had a strong association with the luchesse faction. he was along with his boss vito Genovese a major drug dealer. with French connections, he may not have been so low level after all.........

Valachi is hands down 10x more reliable than bill b. he may have only been a soldier but he was there from the beginning and had an unbelievable memory. The book was not redacted valachi wrote over 1000 pages and Maas had the task of deciphering it and making it into a readable book. Valachi's info is reliable and w/o it the history of lcn would be 99.9% conjecture instead of the 90% it is

my sense is that anybody who gets made is reasonably well informed about mafia matters and pretty damn competent at what he does for a living (allowing for specialization among muscle work, drug-dealing, and white-collar work)

lots of associates and strivers (at least back then), but only a few get made

now maybe today things are organized differently--certainly the modern-day Genovese appear to keep members in the dark about who is the boss and who does what (and of course 'ndrangheta takes this to an extreme with the Santa)--but i think back then everybody who was initiated into the mafia knew who the other members were ----> indeed, i recall reading somewhere that the entire membership of the NYC mafia (all families, all members) was convened from time to time in great halls, whether by Masseria or Maranzano, I am not sure . . . .

People, there is a treasure trove out there. We don't know the half.

Yes this is wikipedia, but anyone who read Peter Maas book like me and Binnie knows this is the truth...

"In 1964 the US Department of Justice urged Valachi to write down his personal history of his underworld career. Although Valachi was only expected to fill in the gaps in his formal questioning, the resulting account of his thirty-year criminal career was a rambling 1,180-page manuscript titled The Real Thing.[3][4][5]

Attorney General Nicholas Katzenbach authorized the public release of Valachi’s manuscript. He hoped that publication of Valachi’s story would aid law enforcement and possibly encourage other criminal informers to step forward. Author Peter Maas, who broke Valachi’s story in The Saturday Evening Post, was assigned the job of editing the manuscript and permitted to interview Valachi in his Washington, D.C., jail cell.[3][4]

The American Italian Anti-Defamation League promoted a national campaign against the book on the grounds that it would reinforce negative ethnic stereotypes. If the book’s publication was not stopped they would appeal directly to the White House. Katzenbach reversed his decision to publish the book after a meeting with President Lyndon B. Johnson, an action that embarrassed the Justice Department.[3][4]

In May 1966, Katzenbach asked a district court to stop Maas from publishing the book—the first time that a U.S. Attorney General had ever tried to ban a book. Maas was never permitted to publish his edition of Valachi’s original memoirs, but he was allowed to publish a third-person account based upon interviews he himself had conducted with Valachi. These formed the basis of the book The Valachi Papers, which was published in 1968 by Putnam.[3][4]"

So there you have it. The real "Valachi Papers" is not called that, but is called "The Real Thing". Peter Maas' Valachi Papers is only 285 pages long. "The Real Thing" from Valachi himself is 1,180 pages.

To put that in perspective, that is 895 missing pages if Maas' version was the edited version, but it's not even the edited version. Even the edited version was banned. We just got some interviews and that's it.

ill take valachi word over bill bonnanos any day, and Christy tic, you are so right, valachi opened the door as to give the country a enlighted view of the inner workings, as the initation ceremony, how it was set up, capos, soldiers, and the bosses. he was of tremendous value. and dominic calabrese. why, some keep on insisting valachi was low-level confuses me.

the more relevant comparison would be between Maas' originally intended edition and the 285-page edition

plus if Valachi wrote the manuscript by hand, probably less words per page

even so, it would appear that certain information was censored -- why?

alfa. ive never known that. now im wondering what the missing papers contain, no doubt, the g is protecting elected officals whom valachi squawked on. for gods sakes why all the secrecy for over 46 years. he went in front of congress, what more could he have withheld. and katzenbach wanting to suppress it. ok, one theory Johnson... valachi may have known about the hit in dallas and it involved Johnson. or maybe he mentioned old man joe kennedy. harry Truman, who was deep with pendergast in k c. this is a big fish. how do we get the original version.

again, i think it is because people imagine that "soldiers" are at the bottom of the hierarchy. but when you factor in all the associates, strivers, wannabe's, the soldiers are fairly highly placed in the criminal world ----> especially back then when the mafia had a much deeper pool of talent to recruit from

in reading your post a second time I am convinced Johnson put the brakes on it. [ katezbach wanted to give the ok to publish, but, after a meeting with Johnson decided not to ] whats with that!!

dominic calabrese, you are exactly right. and also by dismissing him as low level, take away his credibility also.

San Calogero is the patrone of my husbands town, Porto Empedocle in Agrigento. Yes he was from Africa and exiled.

getting back to the question of regional affiliation . . . .

Valachi was born in East Harlem, but his parents were from Naples

He married the daughter of Reina the Corleonesi

but after the defeat of the Masseria side, he became the bodyguard of Marranzano -- which seems to contradict the notion that the Castellammarese were closed to outsiders (especially non-Sicilians)

and then he was eventually assigned to the Luciano family, which as we see from the Informer diagram descended from the Morello gang (Corleonesi)

however, Luciano was born in Lecara Friddi (relatively close to Corleone)

Genovese, like Valachi, was Neapolitan (Tufino) by birth

Costello was Calabrese

also worth noting that Luciano seems to have had little love for Lercara Friddi, and not much more for Palermo ----> it was Naples where he chose to live after being deported to Italy

Bonanno, Galante (even though US-born), etc -- they all seem to have identified very closely with Castellammare del Golfo

that's very clear to me. thank you for that post. dominic.

Maybe I got beyond myself. Maybe Maranzano was opposed to dealing with non Italians, not non Sicilians.

Ok, no one get excited. This might be too good to be true. I found a link. Check this out...


The Real Thing

In the upper left, there are two tabs. One is called Overview. The other is called Finding Aid.

If you click Finding Aid, a page opens up that describes the contents of what is apparently TWO boxes of information.

alfa cant bring anything up ive clicked on the box oo1 where it says joe valachi papers 801 but cant bring up anything.

Let me try to help out Binnie, you gotta see this...

Try This Link

i'm no expert but , dont think maranzano a staunch sicilian would have had valachi a neapolitan as a bodyguard

no, tried clicking on the real thing. box oo1 pp 1-810 [ 1 of 14 folders ] nothing comes up am I on the right page?

Binnie, thats what i get too. Is there a link to the actual files/material?

barry, its true though, he was his driver. he laid it all out. looking now for the missing 8oo pps of [ the valachi papers]

benny3balls alfa romeo is looking. this thing wont open for me either. love to see it. do you hear Johnson stopped the publication of over 1100 pps.

I think you guys are seeing right then. You should see a screen that lists the contents. The contents might be available for research, but not by a click on the internet.

But I think this shows one thing: The government and/or Maas did not burn Joe Valachi's affidavit. It's there.

Those are the real Valachi Papers.

Just in case the link is malfunctioning, here is a cut and paste....

"The John F. Kennedy Library
Columbia Point
Boston, MA 02125
617-514-1629
www.jfklibrary.org

Administrative Information
Collection Overview
List of Series
Container List
Administrative Information

Abstract
Papers 1964. Organized crime figure. Handwritten and typewritten manuscript of The Real Thing, which served as source material for The Valachi Papers (1968) by Peter Maas.

Access
Open.

Usage Guidelines
Some of the archival materials in this collection may be subject to copyright or other intellectual property restrictions. Users of these materials are advised to determine the copyright status of any document from which they wish to publish. The copyright law of the United States..."

and

"Container List
/expand/collapse Expand/Collapse All


Series 1. The Real Thing: The Expose and Inside Doings of Cosa Nostra.

Extent: 2189 pages.

Arrangement: by type of material.

These papers document the life of Joseph Valachi from 1920 to 1964. They mainly consist of a manuscript which describes the beginnings of Valachi's life of crime and his experiences as a member of Cosa Nostra, commonly known as the Mafia. The manuscript details the inner workings of this organized crime group and the activities of many members of the New York unit of Cosa Nostra. The manuscript is unedited and is written as one would speak. For a more concise, easier to read version of Valachi's story, see The Valachi Papers, by Peter Maas, G.P. Putnam's Sons, 1968.

Box 001
Display/Hide Digital Identifier The Real Thing: Pages 1-810 [1 of 14 folders]

Display/Hide Digital Identifier The Real Thing: Pages 1-810 [2 of 14 folders]

Display/Hide Digital Identifier The Real Thing: Pages 1-810 [3 of 14 folders]

Display/Hide Digital Identifier The Real Thing: Pages 1-810 [4 of 14 folders]

Display/Hide Digital Identifier The Real Thing: Pages 1-810 [5 of 14 folders]

Display/Hide Digital Identifier The Real Thing: Pages 1-810 [6 of 14 folders]

Display/Hide Digital Identifier The Real Thing: Pages 1-810 [7 of 14 folders]

Display/Hide Digital Identifier The Real Thing: Pages 1-810 [8 of 14 folders]

Display/Hide Digital Identifier The Real Thing: Pages 1-810 [9 of 14 folders]

Display/Hide Digital Identifier The Real Thing: Pages 1-810 [10 of 14 folders]

Display/Hide Digital Identifier The Real Thing: Pages 1-810 [11 of 14 folders]

Display/Hide Digital Identifier The Real Thing: Pages 1-810 [12 of 14 folders]

Display/Hide Digital Identifier The Real Thing: Pages 1-810 [13 of 14 folders]

Display/Hide Digital Identifier The Real Thing: Pages 1-810 [14 of 14 folders]


Box 002
Display/Hide Digital Identifier The Real Thing: Pages 811-1180 [1 of 6 folders]

Display/Hide Digital Identifier The Real Thing: Pages 811-1180 [2 of 6 folders]

Display/Hide Digital Identifier The Real Thing: Pages 811-1180 [3 of 6 folders]

Display/Hide Digital Identifier The Real Thing: Pages 811-1180 [4 of 6 folders]

Display/Hide Digital Identifier The Real Thing: Pages 811-1180 [5 of 6 folders]

Display/Hide Digital Identifier The Real Thing: Pages 811-1180 [6 of 6 folders]

Display/Hide Digital Identifier Correspondence: Peter Maas & Joseph Valachi"

So that's TWO BOXES of material. There's the 1,180 pages right there.

He might have stopped publication, but the access on the folders I linked here lists them as OPEN.

Therefore someone could read them. You just have to go through the procedures to get it, but you could. Living in Boston MA might help also. One thing is certain. You won't be reading the real Valachi Papers with a click of your mouse. I just wanted everyone to see that they (the papers) exist, somewhere, and that they are publicly accessible....in some way.

did he go to the port empedecole club on bath ave

alfa romero. good work. at least we know when we read the original valachi papers, we got spoon fed baby food, compared to what we could have had, thank you alfa. maybe we can still find a link somewhere. thank you again this is unique.

Thank you Binnie

If anyone is interested, they're in the process of putting up Valachi's original manuscript online on http://www.onewal.com/

Just click on articles-menu and scroll down to the 4th one.

thank you for the site sonnyd, ive been looking for it. read the first installment interesting but, missing over 100 pages or more. didn't read anything that I didn't now before from reading the valachi papers. maybe the next installments will be more to our interest.

Thanks, Sonny, that's some interesting stuff right there.

It's great to see that going up on Onewal, but the typeface is too fine. It's not an easy read unless you maximize the page size.

I'm also curious as to when they started putting Valachi's The Real Thing up on Onewal.

EDIT: I am reading it now and don't understand why so many connecting pages are omitted.

alfa, that's my thinking also. in the first three hundred pages it appears as though over a hundred pages are missing with no explanation as to why said pages are missing. if they release another section of pages and the result is the same with over a third of the pages missing. why release them at all? if their going to release only certain portions what good can they be to researchers?

That's a shame Binnie, because it really is good stuff.

The whole thing has been released and is open to anyone. The problem is that it's over 1000 pages long and that's a lot of money to spend at the photocopy machine. Copying at the National Archives isn't cheap. I copied maybe 300 or so of the most important pages because it was just getting too expensive.

faithful, what was the major difference between whats available now as to the original.. { valachi papers ] what if anything did you learn that wasn't in the original.

Then leave the end off? Why omit what's in the middle?

Something is wrong there.

I thought faithful had a feeble explanation. its been made obvious that their keeping 100s of pages from the public. evidently they think we are 6 year olds. and wont question their decisions.

What's feeble about my explanation? Have you ever been to the National Archives? They give access, but it's a process and they don't give you your own copies for free. It costs money that comes out of the researcher's pocket.

I don't know what you're talking about them keeping 100's of pages from the public. The Valachi manuscript is available at the JFK Library in Boston and the National Archives in College Park, Maryland. I looked thru the whole thing at was all there. Nothing was being kept from the public. If you want copies to bring home, then you gotta pay something like 10 or 15 cents a copy. Multiply that by a 1000 pages and you're talking $100 to $150, unless the price of copies went up.

ok, was there anything in those pages at the archives that you felt should have been in the book. or, were their any revelations concerning the cosa nostra that were not in the book. I guess I should say was it worth your while to go over the pages, and will what you read contribute to your research.

I know this opinion is not agreed with by many if not most, but I am going to have to say that Gaetano Gagliano probably did relinquish the boss' seat to Tommy Lucchese in 1953 and died shortly thereafter. The reason I say this is because I am reading Bill Bonanno and again he said it twice that Gagliano stepped down in 53.

Unlike us, he knew was Gagliano looked like. He said he called him "Uncle Tom". Anastasia was "Uncle Albert", and so on.

Bill Bonanno was married in 1957, therefore it follows that he was probably mature enough and clear headed enough to not only remember who Gagliano was, but also when specific Commission meetings occurred, and who was present. The only way he could have gotten the date wrong for the moment Gagliano stepped down is if he thought a Commission meeting that occurred in 1951 actually occurred in 1953.

Now remember, each Commission meeting was supposed to be spaced 5 years apart unless it was an extraordinary session. The first was 1931, then 1936, then 1941, then 1946, then 1951. Bill records a meeting in 1951, as well as the minutes. But then he says there was another distinct meeting in 1953 that he called an "extraordinary" meeting. It was there and then that Bonanno says Gagliano resigned.

I'm sorry, but I do not buy that that Tommasso Gagliano was Tommy Lucchese's old boss.

Bill Bonanno got the dates wrong, Gagliano stepped down in 51' and died in 53'. Some sources say that he was semi retired after 1946 and let Lucchese run things before he retired.

Yes, there's some interesting things in Valachi's manuscript. I don't recall if I used much of it. Dave Critchley used some for what he wrote about Buster from Chicago. There's a few more details in the manuscript than what was found in the Maas book. Alex Hortis may have used some things for his book too.

Modern researchers can make more sense of the extra details in the manuscript than writers from the 1960s because we have learned so much since then. A few things that I remember that were interesting was that when he was a kid he lived on 108th Street in East Harlem. In 1912 a lady named Pasquarella Spinelli was killed in her stable (you can read about the infamous Murder Stable online); he went over there and spat on her dead body because once she kicked him out when he tried to sleep there. Later on he talked about a top guy to Ciro Terranova named Big Dick Amato (in the 1920s I don't think there was a sexual meaning to his name) who was killed in 1930, and he had some run-ins with him. There's a few more details about Buster from Chicago. Toward the end of the book he goes on a rant why bosses like Vito Genovese are unfair to soldiers like Joe Valachi.

Since you haven't read the manuscript I can tell you that it's not an easy read. A single paragraph can go on for several pages. So can a single sentence. Valachi did some crazy page numbering, like he could go from pages 1 to 10, then go page 10a, 10b, 10c and so on before going to page 11.

Tommy Lucchese supposedly testified that Gagliano died in 51, not 53.

Bill Bonanno said that the 53 extraordinary Commission meeting was called by Gagliano himself to name Tommy Lucchese and step down. That is very specific.

"Now remember, each Commission meeting was supposed to be spaced 5 years apart unless it was an extraordinary session. The first was 1931, then 1936, then 1941, then 1946, then 1951. Bill records a meeting in 1951, as well as the minutes. But then he says there was another distinct meeting in 1953 that he called an "extraordinary" meeting. It was there and then that Bonanno says Gagliano resigned."

When the Commission was created in 1931, it was decided that they have to meet every five years so the chairs could be ratified for the next five year period. In between, the Commission met every time there was a cause for them to meet.

I´ll say this again, Gagliano´s first name was Tommaso, not Gaetano. He died in Feb of 1951. Bill Bonanno got the year wrong when he said 1953 in his book. Camarel posted in this same thread I believe, photos of his tombstone. I have posted his obituary found in NY Times dated Feb 16th, 1951 (in another thread). I don´t understand the confusion about Tommaso Gagliano´s name and death. It´s like trying to explain what the capital of Canada is to someone who thinks it´s Toronto.

Hairy, please stop bringing your facts into this conversation! :-)

Will do. I hate killing a perfectly sane and healthy discussion.

Having read the stuff you put up online, I think it's fair to say Valachi was a world class rambler! And I don't mean he liked to walk! Not really surprising that Peter Maas cut a lot of it out of the book to make it read better. No conspiracy, just good book editing.

Just to get back to the opening post, I would say Charlie Luciano, Ciro Terranova, Tony Bender, Joseph Pinzola, Sam Pollaccia, Rocco Pellegrino and Gaetano Ricci are good contenders for Masseria capo's, with Frankie Yale a possible(although I tend to think not) but certainly Little Augie Pisano after Yale and Frankie Marlow's death.

I don't think that's the only point. The point is that if you are doing a public service, you do it in its entirety. To tell the public what is or is not useful information for their consumption, from a document meant to be an expose, is unacceptable and a failure.

Peter Maas was forbidden by some nazi thought police from publishing the entirety of Valachi's rambling. No doubt to protect someone on the law enforcement side of the corruption equation. What is the excuse now?

Some of the gaps occur at very interesting parts of Valachi's story.

Here is a good example...

"First they told me that Joe the Boss Masseria had sentenced them all to death because they were Castellamarise. Now I will try to explain just what this meant. It is a certain small country in Italy and as everyone knows that there are all difference dialects in the Italian language, in other words, I will tell the difference between the Sicilian and myself.
I am from Naples that is my people were, and I don't understand the Sicilian language as I do my own. They didn't tell me why they were sentenced to death but they tell me that the little that they were they......"

Then the rest is omitted. That's crazy. I think at a minimum, certain parts are being omitted because people are writing books based on them.

Here is another stunning omission...

"Now we had to get the furniture right away so we went to a guy that we know and we went 106 Street, Third Ave., because we knew that he will deliver it right away. Now the other mob have connection with the police after all they are nobody's fools so when they went 106 Street the guy got scared and told them that I was the guy that went in there and bought the furniture and he even told them that my sister was with me. Then I...."

And just as it touches on police having corrupt ties to a mob, it trails off right there.

That's wonderful.

I have no dog in this hunt but check this out. Also has pics of his stone.

http://findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?pag...amp;df=all&

I already posted that on the first page dixie . It clearly says on the tombstone Tomasso Gagliano died Feb 16th 1951. What is it your trying to say Alfa that this is a completely different guy or what? I'm confused . Anyway i think Hairy has cleared this up with his above post.

alfa, I concur with you completely, and what difference would it make if the corrupt cops were named now, in some cases almost 90 years later. maybe im wrong but, there has got to be a reason for the missing pages. and I certainly don't think there missing because of editing concerns. because attorney general katenzbach went to Johnson and was told to hold back 1000 pages. now that wasn't for the sake of editing.

My bad, I haven't read this whole thread and I use findagrave a lot so I looked it up. Guess I need to start reading every page

Yes, Peter Maas had problems with the government allowing him full access in the 1960s, but that was before the Freedom of Information Act. Now you're free to go to the National Archives, spend your money to make copies, scan the 1000+ pages and post them online. When are you going to do that, Alfa?

now, faithful, you know full well, everybody cant go to the national archives, that's why we depend on researchers, and authors like yourself, to give us the story. now, when you publish your book I will buy a copy. please don't leave any pages of the valachi story out.

I don't know for sure who is right, these guys here who leave out pages of a public expose and introduce contradictory photos of Gagliano and Maranzano, or Bonanno. How many immigrants at that time were named Gagliano?

Maybe the original Gagliano boss was Tommasso, not Gaetano. Maybe the photo of Tommasso is the right guy and he died in 51. Maybe the original photo of Gagliano with the tough guy round face is a false photo like that of Salvatore Messina circulated as Maranzano. But how can we really be totally sure?

What is the proof that Tommasso Gagliano is the right immigrant? A newspaper clipping of his passing? That's not 100% sure.

Here it is...

Tommasso Gagliano Newspaper Clipping

That's it. That's our proof that this Tommasso Gagliano was the boss of the old Gagliano family.

It seems like Tommy Lucchese was Gagliano's representative to high level meetings....for decades. Gagliano appeared in 1931 and then didn't reappear in public for another 20 years. Freaky. Then finally someone circulates the rumor that Gagliano stepped down in 53 to make Three Fingers boss. I'm sorry but that is creepy. It wouldn't surprise me if Gagliano was a sick man for a long time and needed Tommy to rep him in public, nor would it surprise me to learn that Tommy disappeared him (like Albert did Mangano) and then just quietly took over. It's weird that Bill Bonanno would record a specific commission meeting, called by Gagliano himself, for the express purpose of naming Lucchese as boss. Either Bill was there and it happened, or he wasn't and someone lied to him, and that lie had to originate with Tommy Lucchese himself.



That what makes the omissions so egregious. We already had a cover up happen decades back. I read the excerpts on Onewal from top to bottom. Whatever was deemed sensitive by President Johnson is not on there.

Yes, Tommy Brown stood in for Gagliano for many years as a loyal underboss, Gagliano seemed to be a very private man, but it's untrue to say that Tomasso Gagliano didn't appear in public for 20 years or anything like it. He just didn't attract the attention of the law. Plus, from what I understand, he was very much a white collar mobster. Unions and business infiltration was his speciality.

If Lucchese was going to disappear Gagliano he took a very long time doing it. People tend to forget that Gagliano was older than the earlier boss Reina and when Gagliano passed away he was in his late sixties



Not sure if you're seriously suggesting there that Faithful is an agent of Governmental disinformation?

I'm not going to respond to all that Alfa, but the fact is Faithful1 has been to the National Archives and read the 1000+ pages of this. As you said Onewal hosts excerpts not the full contents, until you have been to the National Archives yourself and read through it all you can't exactly claim "coverup".

Better yet take Faithfuls suggestion - Now you're free to go to the National Archives, spend your money to make copies, scan the 1000+ pages and post them online. When are you going to do that, Alfa?

That is a sound suggestion, Caramel.

Better get yourself a big red pen to delete all the crap that Valachi wrote. It might save you a few bucks when copying!

The other poster was complaining about the cost.

If it's 15 cents a page and 1810 pages, that's only $271.50.

Let me just stop right there. I don't have much more to say on the topic.

Not bad for a 5th grade education and having a bullet lodged near his brain stem compliments of NYPD.

It's 25 cents for paper copies. If copying from microfilm it's 50 cents.

sonnyd, nobody is accusing faithful of being an agent, hes a researcher and albeit a good one. but I keep asking myself, what was so sensitive that Lyndon Johnson woulnt allow peter maas to publish all the pages he wanted to. there has to be a reason. and im continually speculating on what it could be.

dixiemafia. gagliano? gagliano? oh, now I get it. didn't he play offensive tackle for the bear? [ he, he, he, he ]

If I were to simply reproduce the Valachi manuscript it would be the most boring thing out there. Researchers aren't in the business of just copying and selling copies. What they do is take the most important, useful and relevant information to make it into a story or an educational work with a good narrative. I also use FBI reports, Secret Service reports, etc., but if I just photocopied them it wouldn't be taking the nuggets to find out what happened. You gather the necessary facts from the many different sources to figure out what happened. In Valachi's case we can use info from his manuscript, then we also want to verify and cross-reference so we can learn about his associates, bosses, etc for a bigger story. The manuscript is a source, but it does not make enjoyable reading.

Don't forget flight costs if you live far away, hotel costs, travel costs, and you gotta eat. When I was there I had to pay for all that, plus I wasn't out to copy just one thing, but a whole lot of things. You know those FBI docs uploaded to Mary Ferrell? I spent hundreds copying them years before that Mary Ferrell site was up. That was at College Park, Maryland. Then add doing that at archives in New York, Chicago and San Francisco.

Another thing about the federal archives: you can't just go looking around and grabbing what you want when you want. You have to fill out forms to have what you want pulled and delivered to you. Then you pick what you want copied and you show it to another guy who's job it is to make sure you don't have classified material that mistakenly went into a file or that you don't steal the documents (like Bill Clinton's ex Secretary of State Warren Burger, who stuffed documents down his pants to steal them). Then you make copies one page at a time, which is time consuming. Plus you have to return some of the stuff you have out so you can request more stuff.

Or you could pay them to copy the documents for you at around 50 cents a page.

Binnie, that was back in the 1960s before the Freedom of Info Act and when J. Edgar Hoover was still around. They were very protective of their territory back then and it was a fight to get anything. It's not like that anymore.

And..... you've yet to produce a single page of it, where is your 15 Cents paid for a page? You like to criticize people that go out of their way to find this info simply because it costs you a few Dollars to read their findings. Frankly he deserves to make a profit, even though it will more than likely slightly exceed the money he spent if even that.

faithful, I understand. thank you.

I totally agree with that. Well put!



We know that Tommaso Gagliano was born in 1884. Now, check out the pictures Camarel posted earlier. How old was he when he died? In addition, take a look at the name Pomilla. The Pomillas were related to Gaglianos. Nunzio Pomilla was a member of the Lucchese crime Family and Gagliano´s brother in law.

Now, take a look at the obituary. It says he lived in Yonkers. I can guarantee Gagliano, the Mafia boss, lived in Yonkers. This was mentioned by an Lucchese informant when he gave up info on Gagliano. I have that in one of my FBI files. We also know his wife´s name (Giuseppina). The marriage is mentioned in Dave Critchley´s book. Giuseppina is mentioened in the obituary.

Now, stop trolling!

Talkin about agents of governmental disinformation...shit like this happens around the world...

http://www.veteranstoday.com/2012/10/12/diary-of-an-israeli-shill/

Very good. That is probably him. Personally that makes me think the first photo of the round faced man that circulated as Gagliano is about as real as Salvatore Messina's. I cannot see that photo and the photo of Tommasso Gagliano as being similar. Valachi said Gagliano was a tall man. The narrow faced Tommasso Gagliano photo could credibly be construed as a tall person.

Very funny. Did it ever occur to you that it was my objective all along to get someone like Hairy to explain to me exactly who was Tommasso Gagliano?

I stumbled across this blog -- written by Bill Feather -- which is extremely relevant to this thread =

http://mafiamembershipcharts.blogspot.com

Hi dominic_calabrese, you asked about how men like Gaetano Lucchese and Francesco Castiglia (Frank Costello) were able to cross over into borgatas different from where their families originated in Italy.

I think in Tommy Lucchese's case, it had to do with him being a young member of the 107ht street mob as a youngster, and then graduating into the Reina mafia family as an adult. Tommy basically built his street cred being a young hoodlum in a gang that carried on in Corleonesi territory of Manhattan. The 107th street mob was likely a junior mafia that the Morellos and/or Reinas recuited from.

Salvatore Maranzano (July 31, 1886 – September 10, 1931) was an organized crime figure from the town of Castellammare del Golfo, Sicily. He is accused of instigating the Castellammarese War to seize control of the American Mafia operations, and briefly became the Mafia's "Boss of Bosses". He was assassinated by a younger faction led by Charles "Lucky" Luciano, who established a power-sharing arrangement rather than a "boss of bosses" in the hopes of preventing future wars.

http://youtu.be/WACvACqlGtk?list=PLQhDH_WZbs1N0jqZ9y9naMtgUfZ3VoVbo