Cleveland's Bookmaking Operation.....

Is it a town full of individuals or do they kick up.....

With Johnny Football in town and Lebron back there, I would think there's gonna be more action in the future.

Not in awhile from what I hear, but who knows.

Cleveland still has remnants leftover from their family but no formal hierarchy or structure. Everybody there is independent, but it wouldn't shock me if some young 20's or 30 year old kicks some action to Joe Iacobacci or RJ Papalardo...Joe Loose is often on Murray Hill in Cleveland's Little Italy.

I saw RJ at the Hooley Fest in West Park back in May, bought him a beer...which he walked down the sidewalk with, not giving a flying fuck about an open container volation lol.

RJ has done well in real estate and I don't believe he's been involved in gambling for at least a decade

Keep it coming, brother. I love keeping the Cleveland discussion alive lol.

What are you hearing from the Sabatini brothers? I heard that oldest one died. They were Pittsburgh based but took over operations in Ravenna and Peninsula after the Pittsburgh takeover.

Is RJ looking old? Any discussion about OC?

I didn't know there was a Little Italy left in Cleveland. I was there a few times back in 2006-2007 and didn't see anyone but college students and a bunch of black people.

Mayfield Little Italy still has great restaurants and quite a few former associates, bookmakers and Joe Iacobacci still frequents Nido Italia. Mama Santo's pizza there is legendary.

I have family and friends in and around Ravenna, I asked around but nobody I talked to even knew who the Sabatini brothers are.

Yea RJ's gettin up there I guess. Basically small talk, he's a pretty quiet, soft-spoken guy based on our two conversations.

Little Italy is cool, the Feast is awesome and is coming up in the middle of the month...the hottest women come from all over (I never miss lol). It is out east though, there's ghetto areas outside & around there no question.

Definitely great food. Matt Nido is a good friend of mine, I've always wanted to ask him what kind of stories he has, but never get around to it.

The Assumption Feast is incredible. Mayfield's Little Italy is still quite a good time, it's just a bitch to get to off the highway. I still elect Geraci's Pizza in University Heights as best pizza in Cleveland, but Mama Santo's is up there. The old days of Licavoli, Lonardo and company walking around there are gone but certainly not forgotten. The days of Tony Milano and John DeMarco were even better.

Must have been crazy.

Yea parking is nothing short of a bitch for that event, and no highways near by lol.

Did Sonny Geraci (lead singer from the Outsiders) have anything to do with Geraci's pizza? I know he's orginally from the Cleveland area & I worked a huge benefit they threw for him in November in Streetsboro...which RJP was at a table up front.

is Eugene Ciasullo ever in the area?

Eugene has been in Western PA for years, but does come back to Cleveland a few times per year, the Feast of Assumption being one of those events.

From my understanding, Sonny Geraci is related to the same family who has the restaurant near JCU.

http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=2519&dat=19921004&id=3W9iAAAAIBAJ&sjid=3nYNAAAAIBAJ&pg=1300,675284

http://www.leagle.com/decision/2002866281BR585_1795.xml/XENAKIS%20v.%20U.S.%20DEPARTMENT%20OF%20TREASURY,%20I.R.S.

https://www.courtlistener.com/pawb/8WKk/in-re-xenakis/

http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=2004&dat=19920409&id=HroiAAAAIBAJ&sjid=Q7UFAAAAIBAJ&pg=1180,1726924

***Hint- Copy and paste the link into your browser to read cases and articles

I havent been on for awhile but im back & ready .some of you posting bout cleveland & the hill seem outdated & talk of what you hear . Who the hell is matt nido ? There are alot of associates still around & the 10 made men. They keep a low profile & make $$$$$ . They go thru various legit businesses & have become smart in their activity .they may not be seen too much - but sure as shit their presence is felt & known .sabatini & his guys ,w/ pittsburgh connections go thru yngstwn.there will soon be some shit . Im sure you are referring to manny xenakis & his cohorts(not made men) but assoc .these guys are from the prato yngstwn- pitts connection . The others are yngstwn- cleve connection from the older days ,ie carabbia & co . Look forward to some real talk& info - not hersay or 3rd party stuff .Keep cleve thread goin & lets get some good shit to talk bout !!!

Good to hear from you! Always a pleasure to have input from someone with "Boots on the Ground" knowledge.

10 made guys in Cleveland? I know of only 2 for sure, as there has never been confirmation of any guys being made when Joe Loose was "a self proclaimed" boss. Could you name the other 8 outside of RJ Papalardo and Joe Iacobacci? Please don't tell me that Lucarelli, DeNova are made.

Glad you're back, it's been awhile. JCB is gone, so I figure I'd never hear anymore stories other than the ones everyone knows & repeats lol.

I think JCB posts on Black Hand under the same moniker.

Thanks. Yea he knows his shit from around the OH/PA area.

Jcb knows his stuff & yes hes on blkhnd . As for the ten - theres a list & its accurate / dont forget about carrabia either .Loose was named not self proclaimed . That is fact . The tussle is old cleve lcn although close with ny are actually more connected w/ chicago . The other portion of yngstwn is w/ pitts . Carmine agnello also is a pain in the ass . Ny hates him & never can he go back . His pull is via buffalo & that you can bank on .im telling you this - the associates also have truly helped cleve lcn in a veryy big way . Probably if not for their involvment cleve might have been done .Cleve operations are a model of new times & ways . Things no longer are done the old way .But do believe if needed , things be handled just a bit different . Look forward to more input & conversation on cleve. Im not here to stir shit up or post garbage. These are fact & u wont find them on google ! Friend of henry good to see you ! Also this man is solid & very knowledgeable.

I am not convinced that Cleveland has 10 made guys or that Loose was "named boss." There is absolutely no documentation in any federal affadavits or court records and I don't believe that "Cleveland is smarter" than other families. I know Ron Carabbia personally and I know he is in Florida and enjoying his 80's and time with his grandchildren. Other than RC, there is NOBODY in Youngstown connected to Cleveland any longer. In Youngstown, there are absolutely no associates who are connected to Pittsburgh as Pittsburgh has been defunct since 2008. While I do believe that Cleveland and Pittsburgh has some gambling going on, I do not believe in any way, shape or form that there is a structured hierarchy.

I do believe that Cleveland associates helped out quite a bit, but I don't believe that there are 10 members. Could you provide the list and the source where you heard they are made?

What about Youngstown and all the cities or towns around it? I'm sure there's still stuff going on there with associates/former associates who get into illegal gambling, betting, or bookmaking as it's been around there for a very long time.

Can you please post the lists here?

There is definitely some illegal gambling going on with former associates, but not affiliated with Cleveland or Pittsburgh any longer. After the Strollo enterprise came down in 1999 with 72 convictions and after the death of Mike Genovese in Pittsburgh back in 2006, nothing more than some independent associates making book for themselves. Not nearly to the extent of what it was. Friend of a Henry could verify that as well.

Loose becoming boss was a decision made , w/ input & Approval from affiliated families . This was to be until cleve would choose their man . Everyone has opinions ,so you have yours. It is odd to me that there are still about 10 to 15 names not mentioned on here by any of you . This also does NOT mean they are made - but just not mentioned . They are very significant as to cleve lcn . Again , they are not made except for a few of them . A good Friend once told me this" if someone does not know , Don't be the one to tell them ." Also there are somethings I can not say- in order to not give myself up . I did not say cleve is smarter , but they have learned & practice the principals of low key & under the radar . Their $$$$$ is well invested & thru some legit & very lucrative businesses.All are aware & very cautious as to all the rats around here from lonardo to -------- up to now .They have many affiliates in florida ,vegas , calif,ny & Chicago .buffalo & pitts R questionable as to certain members .As im sure you know very well " if " you know anything , Loose screwed up alot of relationships - as to his fuck you approach . That Is why RJP is calling the shots .there was alot of mending to do over the years . I look forward to feedback & info on this . Hoping others w/ true knowledge can add in or shed light & even some unmentioned topics .

does anyone know if there are any young guys in Cleveland? or is it down to the old school guys, and once they're gone... LCN is gone too?

Only because you asked:

The beginning of the end of the Pittsburgh/Youngstown LCN started with the incarceration of Jo Jo Pecora from 1979-1983. This led to John LaRocca promoting Michael Genovese his successor. instead of Jo Jo who would have been his choice. John died in 1984. Thus Michael was Boss.

Michael's desire for the abundance of available drug money let to his promotion of Chuckie Porter to Under-boss. Chuckie rolled-over in 1990 and the end was in sight.

Henry Zottola, was the last of Jo Jo's original Crew. Although he never wanted the notarity of being a "Made Man", he agreed to Michael's demand when it became apparent that Lenny Strollo was going off the rails in Youngstown. Lenny then answered to him directly. Zebo died in 1998.

Lenny rolled-over in 1999 and the end was in clear view.

IMHO Pittsburgh/Youngstown LCN, as we grew-up knowing and respecting, died in 2002 with Charlie Murgie.

A few months ago I was with an "old friend", a former employee of Joey Naples. He thought that if there was anyone left with any authority it would be Bobby I. I sincerely doubt that anyone of any authority, at least as we knew it, is left ;-(

he also posts here under bugsyvegas1930.

LCN has been gone in Cleveland since around 1994.

Good stuff, Spadine.

"Loose becoming boss was a decision made?" By whom? By that time, Chicago did not make decisions for Cleveland, we're talking about the mid to late 1990's after Peanuts. Chicago and New York were all removed from making those decisions for the smaller Midwest families. Now, I do believe that a "few" Chicago and Cleveland soldiers still did some business, but there has never been any documentation of a meeting between DiFronzo and Loose or RJ. I truly respect your knowledge Spadine, you definitely know quite a bit but I can tell you with 100% certainty that nobody looked at him as a boss of a family. Loose was never reported or observed meeting with a boss of another family, which is a big indicator that none of his counterparts viewed him or Cleveland as a family anymore. I do believe he had the support of associates in Cleveland, but at that time, he and RJ were the last and only two soldiers that were made by Angelo Lonardo in his short stint as acting boss after Licavoli got sent away. They were the last two soldiers who happened to made by the respected, old guard in the end stage of the Cleveland Family, as they were both made in 1982 and Lonardo was indicted in 1983. Most of the other guys and entire upper echelon were in the can. I believe Loose may have some schemes and some gambling, but on a much smaller scale. Also, from my understanding, RJ is pretty legit working as a broker in his brother's real estate business. It wouldn't shock me if he possibly may have a piece of the gambling, fronting the $$ for a few bookies...but he's in his mid 70's and if he threatened anybody, somebody would run right to the FBI. Again, I truly respect your knowledge and your connections to a few people. If other bosses around the country didn't bother to acknowledge him, then even if he allegedly made some guys, are they really recognized as friends of ours. This is a shaky topic, I hope you see my points.

Yump sure thought he was Boss!!!

Sadly some of those mooleys even attend the feast!! and A good number of our Italian youths act like them .

Here is some of the rackets on going on these days.

http://www.cleveland.com/court-justice/i...related_stories

No mention at all of LCN activity. More remnants and associates of the old syndicate independently operating.

Exactly , if the there was LCN in Cleveland wouldn't they be taking of Piece of Marty? One of the companies tied up in the raid . Also got popped with Basil in the early 80's.

I do believe that a few former members may operate on a smaller scale and are still feared to a degree, but Licavoli brought down this former powerhouse of a family. Along with Scalish not formally inducting many new members is truly ashame considering the the family was once a force to be recokoned with.

1920 called, they want their racism back

LOL...that's funny ChrissyScars. It certainly was a different time in those days.

I just call them like I see them.

LMAO. Equally as funny Mr. Strococs!

Yes Small and feared to some degree is accurate in my opinion, allot of mob talk in Cleveland big mob culture. . The family became paper tiger. I think Scalish not bringing in new blood was the major downfall. Obv Lack of respect for Licavoli didn't help either. It would of been interesting to see what happened if Leonardo had taken over.

If he didn't get indicted, you could bet he would have made new members, he was the one who made Loose & RJ after stepping in for Jack White. Nobody will ever know for certain, but I've often wondered that myself. Angelo shocked the U.S and his longtime counterparts and hurt a lot of important, high profile mafioso with his testimony, some of the families never being able to fully recover. KC, Milwaukee, Cleveland etc. what do you think he was worth when he died? I've heard from a few very good sources, somebody who was a nephew that had stashed $9 million cash away in case he ever needed to leave the country.

When he died I dunno? Honestly I have no idea. I am not sure what he was into with investments and other business. but 20 years off the street can eat up allot of that cash. Especially when He and his wife lived A long time. I guess at least 5 Million.

I often wonder what Scalish and Jack white were worth as well.

Scalish was said to be worth $15 million plus Buckeye Vending. Jack White's $$$ is probably still buried and Tony Milano was worth more than all of them combined!

Can you imagine how much Jack white stashed away. You think that cheap bastard tipped off anyone as to where his cash was. Maybe his nephew?

I bet he left some to his nephews, some to that guy who lived with him and who knows if he was able to retrieve everything he had stashed. It couldn't have been in that tiny apartment.

I wonder if his lawyer knew or if he had an accountant?

I wonder if his lawyer knew or if he had an accountant? [/quote]

You have to figure he told someone. You know your in the can for the rest of your days. Since white had been around so long you have to guess he had A major package somewhere. Hopefully he didn't tell Rockman hahahah

There are different opinions . But I can tell you this , Maybe i stated it wrongly . There was a decision made here in cleve - and no meeting w/ difonzio or such .cleve was on its own @ time because of the rats & indictments on all .the decision was thru an agreement that chicago was ok w/ it as well as ny . Remember salerno & tronolone were close & in fla . Thru fratto , scalise & janeeces suggestions to difonzio (via rjps closeness - it was formally "allowed" no one made the decision for cleve but cleve .as for paul lish or darby(steve calcaveccio) who were j whites two closest friends , if you know, & really know , they too were sloppy & not well dressed ever . Just like jack - this is w/ no disrespect but word .also as i read all of this ; there are alot of names unmentioned here .eugene , loose ,rjp, oliverio & all otthers Will be at feast this weekend - as other out of towners as well ! If you know them & by face - you will see this for yourself ! Gotta go - we'll talk more im sure

Spadine how have you been my friend?

What does there sloppy dress have to do with Jack whites money? Did you know lish ? White was A loner !

Sure those guys are very respected in Cleveland. There are allot of names never mentioned on these boards mostly of people who were not made guys. So with out people to fill the ranks the traditional Lcn faded away. So A few guys attend a the feast. So that means there is full blown lcn in Cleveland?. Sure plenty of rackets going on. I will say it again there is no gas pedal in Cleveland.

Did Zebo ever make his bones ?

I have no "direct" knowledge, but he was suspected of multiple murders in the late1970's and early 1980's for Jo Jo Pecora. Friend of Henry, hence the name, will be able to better answer. Although he and Zebo broke bread on many occasions, Friend of Henry was as close as you could be without crossing the line of no return.

Last thing you want is direct knowledge of A murder ! Was just curious about Henry , Since Strollo never pulled the trigger and he got made.

Lenny Strollo certainly pulled the trigger on a few occasions on orders from Jimmy Prato. It was the late 1960's and it happened with Pat Feruccio. If I'm not mistaken, they whacked two guys who were brothers from East Liverpool, OH.

Fortunately Henry never allowed me to even consider "The Life". I was truly a "Family Friend", but a very close friend.
Thus a simple answer to the question: Yes, Henry was made late in life by Michael in a very private ceremony.

As you would suspect: Murder was never discussed - period.

As I previously stated: Henry was part of Jo Jo's original crew. He went with Joe to West Virginia. He built a really nice ranch home not far from the clubs and lived with his second wife, Sheila and raised their daughters.

Henry started as a bus-boy at Club 30 then as pit-boss at theJockey Club and finally as Casino Manager at the Red Dog.

After the clubs closed in West Virginia, he was the Jo Jo's go between with Paul Hankish, Pat Ferruccio and Lenny Strollo. He and Pat were avid stamp collectors ;-) Henry also managed a homemade pasta business in New Castle, Pa.

As the All-American Club in Campbell grew into one of the highest grossing casinos outside of Las Vegas, he was assigned to protect Pittsburgh's sizeable interests.It was under Lenny's control and managed by his lifelong friend, Bernie the Jew. Bernie, a degenerate gambler, real tough guy and loose cannon, became harder to manage. Thus Zebo, one of the very few that Bernie feared and more important, respected, spent most of his evenings at the club.

After Joey Naples death, Lenny really got too full of himself. BTW: Lenny didn't order Joey's demise. Michael grew concerned that Lenny would really go off the rails and insisted that Zebo be made. After-all, how could/would Lenny, a made man himself, take orders from a non made man?

Henry never wanted to be made as he always felt he didn't need a target on his back, just let me make money. As I learned in later years, Henry always felt that Jo Jo held him back because he refused to be made. He always felt that he didn't make the kind of money he deserved and realized that this was his opportunity. If fact he told me he never made any real money until Michael took over.

Ultimately his dream was the casino on the Indian reservation. All of that came to an end with Chuckie. Additionally Henry was diagnosed with a terminal bone cancer. He was placed on a donor list but felt that one of his "close" FBI friends may have held him back. Thus his early death ;-(

Last thing you want is direct knowledge of A murder ! Was just curious about Henry , Since Strollo never pulled the trigger and he got made. [/quote]

Lenny Strollo certainly pulled the trigger on a few occasions on orders from Jimmy Prato. It was the late 1960's and it happened with Pat Feruccio. If I'm not mistaken, they whacked two guys who were brothers from East Liverpool, OH. [/quote]

Thanks he probably did, I remember reading Strollo saying he was made eligible for induction after helping setting up Charlie the Crab. I Guess I misread what he was saying there. I took it as that would of been his participation in A murder.

Imagine taking the risks and not making much cash. I think allot guys ended up being brokesters . I could see the feds doing that . Probably saying to give it to some Joe Citizen. Anyway thanks for the info

Lenny Strollo certainly pulled the trigger on a few occasions on orders from Jimmy Prato. It was the late 1960's and it happened with Pat Feruccio. If I'm not mistaken, they whacked two guys who were brothers from East Liverpool, OH. [/quote]

Thanks he probably did, I remember reading Strollo saying he was made eligible for induction after helping setting up Charlie the Crab. I Guess I misread what he was saying there. I took it as that would of been his participation in A murder. [/quote]

Keep in mind that Lenny was and is a sociopath. Lenny gave the Feds "what they wanted" which was the corrupt politicians such as prosecutors, judges, the Mahoning County Sheriff, Campbell Police Chief, Mahoning County Engineer, crooked union officials and prominent businessmen and Charles O'Nesti, former Youngstown Fire Chief who was a top aide to congressman Jim Traficant. Lenny was not going to be honest about who he clipped personally because his plea bargain and 12 year sentence depended on it.

Scalish good to hear from you .i can see some still cant read between lines. THERE IS still lcn here . Not just because of feast . My friend , i knew & know each of these names i mention personaly . Jacks clothes have nothing to do with his $$$$ . Im just stating how cheap he was . This also led to demise of cleve because no new guys were really made - hence he didnt want to share anymore of the cash w/ others . I wish i knew you or you knew who I am - you therefore would not question what i have stated . There is plenty more but to not give myself away things need be left alone & you westsiders always had a problem w/ us . I would say irish if i had to guess . Cleve is nowhere near what they once were , but there are still those left w/ many associates & they do operate in lcn heirarchy. Again , if you knew , rjp does in fact lead minutemen which is his main thing as to the partner of the other part of that business which is run by a certain member & his close ally. Stay tuned !

Minutemen is a temp agency that was run by old Sam Lucarelli. Let me ask you, why does the FBI not acknowledge Cleveland as a traditional LCN family? Are the FBI and Justice Department that stupid? While I believe that a "few" former members may be running schemes, they are not relevant in the LCN scene throughout the nation or even recognized as a family any longer. RJP is 75+ years old, hardly intimidating anymore. Loose is a joke, always was, always will be in terms of respect. Are you trying to sell to the board that Cleveland is alive and well? There are more Albanians and Slovak's running schemes in Cleveland than there are Italians.

Feast starts tomorrow, can't wait!

Word is your getting your button at nido tonight?

I am gona stop down for A drink tongiht. See you there

LOL! Next 3 nights it's on. One of my favorite weekends of the year.

The fbi nor jd are that stupid.they still have 2 guys on cleve & youngstown . I think they are confused bout some things w/ the different families & connections. Just my thought, but alot of others agree . You seem to know things that do not come from google & also respectful in your ways. Im sure you were close to or very good friends of the players .No sales ! Im personaly telling you they are alive & well . Nothing like days past in no ways . But alive & operating .They have alot of legit & very lucrative businesses .This helps in keeping low profile .I have a question if you will answer /if not i understand . Your name indicates vegas & just wondering if you are there or originally from . ? RJP runs it & Oliverio runs its sister co 888- ohio comp./ also minutemen has large companies they own(same type ) in chicago & few other cities .FBI tried in vain to nail them in chicago - but were unsuccessful . All of these chi town ties were from prior years ago . No disrespect , here either , but Loose strained those as w/ other families , becuz of his ways . He wasnt business savvy & brutal attitude were not welcomed by others .Also you are correct - they are not muscle like old days . Trust this - if need be , they can flex & w/help of chitwn or ny .(fratto , scalise , distefano-bigtime shy - ,janeece & few others who were very close w/ Cerone & difonzio . We talk later - i will get some input from you & continue

If i see you , i will buy you a drink also . We'll bs & enjoy the food & sights ! I guess you just are a ballbuster like we all are . But my friend w/ all honesty- im not , never was or posed to be a member in any way . I dont google or post crazy shit - only what i know & can speak of . I hung around & was & am close to alot of the guys- past & present . Anyway im surf we 'll talk more

IMHO Spadine only speaks of things he actually has knowledge of, not something he simply found on the internet.

I also believe that he was a Cleveland "Family Friend" much like I was a Pittsburgh "Family Friend".

Thus I hold his opinion in high regards.

Now I can buy what you just said in regards to legitimate businesses. I'm not from Vegas, was watching the movie Bugsy when I signed up for the forum. I do hail from Northeast Ohio and I knew a few guys...I'll leave it at that. My contention is that Cleveland doesn't have a traditional hierarchy like the old days, but more of a few elder statesmen like RJ and Loose who still have associates. RJ is in his mid 70's though, gotta be winding down. I know for a fact that Carabbia is not involved in illegal activity and spends most of his time in Sarasota around his son and is an officer of Sky King Fireworks...ironic! I appreciate your candid demeanor as well. Enjoy the feast, I'm craving a pie from Mama Santa's!

I will certainly defer to you guys above in regards to the NE Ohio scene, but what I am told and understand is sometimes at odds with what I am hearing here. There are some outstanding posters on this site, but some of the info. is a little outdated with all respect. I have seen FBI agent Roger Greenbank quoted on this forum in regards to NE Ohio/Pittsburgh, but in all truth he has been gone for almost 15 years and the current lay of the land has changed. While I wholeheartedly agree that the old power structure is gone, the structure itself has not..at least that is my understanding. Some of the names that have been mentioned as highly regarded "associates" who were going to be made in the late 90's are still around and functioning as made soldiers...again, from what I am told. I also read someone on this site say that there were 18 made men remaining in Pittsburgh...that is certainly not true, but saying that Sonny C. is the last remaining is also a stretch.

Sonny is the last made guy from the traditional LCN family in Pittsburgh. It is true, there are associates left who continue "smaller scale" bookmaking operations, but they are certainly not made. While SA Greenbank has been gone for a while, he still consults with the FBI in Pittsburgh. Mike Genovese was the last official boss as after he died, it was only Bazzano Jr and Sonny who were left after Genovese's death in October of 2006.

As I said above, I will defer your expertise, but I am getting different feedback. Do you know who "Tim" might be...his name has come up several times, but I don't have any idea of who he might be. Also, from what I am told, the FBI really has no to nominal interest in what these guys are doing, so I'm not sure any of them have any good info. at this point. I have recently heard, more than once, that Bobby I. is really running things while Sonny plays the ponies, and that the whole kick up scheme is still intact....at least in regards to book/sharking.

Timmy Leonardo...somebody pm'd me about him and he has never come up in any case regarding OC in Pittsburgh for the last 30 years. Bobby I always was an independent associate of LCN but he is pushing 85. Again, I don't doubt that there is bookmaking going on, but the traditional LCN hierarchy died with Mike Genovese.

Keep in mind that the FBI and the Justice Dept had dismantled the crime family and it's factions. West Virginia went under after the 1990 trial of high ranking associate Paul Hankish. The 1999 cooperation of Lenny Strollo who secured close to 70 convictions in Youngstown alone put the nail in the coffin on the NE Ohio faction. By the year 2000, the only made guys (with the exception of Strollo & Porter who defected) left were Mike Genovese (died in 2006), Pat Ferruccio (died in 2006) Charlie Imburgia (who was retired and died in 2002), Sonny Amato (died in 2003), Sonny Ciancutti and John Bazzano Jr(died in 2008) who were all in their 70's and 80's by then. The Altoona faction went under after the conviction of John Verilla in the mid 80's. The LaRocca's still had associates in Erie but their strength there went away when James "Westfield Jimmy" Salamone died in the late 1980's. Mike Genovese only made 5 guys in his 21 year reign. Chucky Porter and Sonny Ciancutti in 1986, Joey Naples & Lenny Strollo in 1987 and Henry Zottola in 1989-90.

Spadine or Bugsy, who are those two brothers that were at Nidos all weekend? They look like twins, early 50's. They were there from open to close, even behind the bar. I see them downtown a lot, they dress like they're straight out of gangster movie lol, but are pretty cool to talk to.

I don't live in Ohio any longer, so I missed the feast this year. I come back to Youngstown 3-4 times per year.

You referring to the short chubby guy ? Owner angelo & his friend al m. Or someone else / there were quite a few guys there loose, oliverio , rjp & his brother , ralph & mike bucci , lucien & rick , - you gotta be more specific . One thing also , rjp really isnt involved in realestate - its his brother . Rjp is pres & runs minutemen & believe this - its a huge $$ maker . Ohio comp - run by oliverio is its sister co . Owned by late sam luc( no relation to ron luc ) they have places in chi town & ny . There is proof from feds & fbi on all thi. You have to back in early 2000's & mid- late 90's & see they went after them & couldnt prove anything. Its on file .& it shows cleves direct connect to chicago & ny .ny is all thru fat tony & trafficante who kept low in fla . & set alot up also to vegas fromthere . Bookmaking is huge for them & the russian & albanians they deal w/ for computer scams . - check out some of the old pill mills & see who they trace back to . We'll talk more . I was born & raised on the hill & lived there from 50's thru 80's & still go quite a bit . Not made or an assoc - just very close & know alot - saw alot & was around almost all of the old & new guys

picture123 by roccoDCleveland, on Flickr

picture1234 by roccoDCleveland, on Flickr

What are the Bucci's up to? Weren't they involved in arson?

More specific than "look like twins"?

^^

No arson here ! Mike is deputy dir . Of NE Regional sewer & soon will take ciaccias place . Bosse just does his own thing .

I dont know who you are referring to . I understand look like twins - but short or tall / fat skinny ? There were a few different people back there on dif nites & occasions , this is not to avoid you or becuz i cant answer - im just tryin to think who . If is who i think , they arent anyone - but just friends or cousins

Cool. I know they act like they're connected lol! They wear a bunch of rings, jewelry and such. Hair spiked up some, tan and dark hair. Brothers for sure, could be twins. Pretty cool though as far as i can tell.

Oh and you were right, my buddy Matt who is a chef there is last name's not Nido. Truth is I don't even know half the girls last names i date:/

Is this rocco related to john delzoppo( dead)
Youve posted pics to me before that were no one . Maybe 2 tezt me ? Oh well , i know what i know &who i know and i've nuthin. To prove. Im Not made , never was , never considered .just a guy who saw alot , know alot & close to past & present guys . Theres alot of names not mentioned & they were & are connected & some were even Made men . Drop a few & we'll go from there
I have many pics & stories -- & it sucks becuz it would give me up . Im sure people look @ this & talk w/ others & inforn them.so better safe than sorry.

Actually those two pictures I posted are two Murray hill guys who were associates . The ones I sent you before were also associates.

David Perrier

Paul Lish

I know this. Im a litlle younger & that possibly could be paul @ a much earlier age( i really dont think so) & that is not dave . I dont remember the other pics. Stroc , im not looking to get ina pissin match over a fuckin thread - its a waste of time . Ive told you on many occasions - i know only what i know & no more . If i say anything specific , refer to any exact incidents - it would be known( immediately) who i am . Sunday @ nido, @ the infamous "gangster ball" as its referrrd to jokingly, i looked at the people there i dont know, also ( i met people & was told their names) & i must admit - i kept wondering if one of them could be you . Also if u knew who i was , you wouldn' t be questioning anything & in the same respect i may not be questioning you if i knew you . So i'll leave it @ that .back in the day , you would have seen me w/ little Billy from chitwn whenever he came in. In fla w/A & D D' aug ,& here - ally , bonbon , occh ,loose , glen , john,& so forth & many many associstes , judges , black art , yelsky , giulianni, willis& on & on. So my ffiend til later.,arrivadecci

Defiantly is Paul Lish and Dave.

picture12345 by roccoDCleveland, on Flickr

Bones was a great man . Loved him .he , ciro , archie , gary midget, mutt , trunzo all gone . Good guys ! Delano really one of only of those guys left. Delguyd & few others- man those were the good old days . Pic of perrier has to be from 1975 or so & if thats paul that has to be from the 60's - still am not sure thats dave though . Actually drove his old brown olds cuz he was destryed on ludes! Hair much lighter , no beard but thick mustache . Saw Fritz grawe - he didnt think it . U remember young pete digravio ? Got the pizza place over in euclid . Look stroc , trust me , if ur from the neighborhood you would know me instantly in seeing me & know theres no bs here .sure to talk more _ take itease .

he was A world class ball buster. I posted A bunch more I cant figure out this site and the pictures. It takes me to long to get the pics up. The names should be posted with the pictures. I don't care if your from the hill or not just posting the pictures for the forum.

Friend_of_Henry

I see you mentioned Pat Ferruccio name - I used to do some business with him. His Attorney "Howard" was good friends with my Wife and I and other Friends. "Howard" used to represent a lot of guys in the Area.

Also I never see anyone mention the Bookmaking Operation in Akron. Never mention the Sicilian Club or Nick Anthe's later. Any of the Real Estate Deals and Land Swapping with a certain Youngstown Developer, etc.

Someone mentioned Sabatini's - I remember Jimmy Sabatini in the Asphalt Business in Youngstown Area. Is that who someone was referring to?

I first met Pat, through Henry, at a restaurant in a motel owned by Lenny Strollo. Pat was the first guy I knew that drove a Rolls. Henry took me along for several other cups of coffee with Pat over the years, but never any discussion of his attorney, at least in front of me.

Never any talk of Bookmaking, only the vending business. A few dinners at Nick Anthe's ;-) Which Real Estate Developer in Youngstown? The one in Boardman or the one on the North side of Youngstown?

No, not Jim Sabatini. The Sabatini family that is mentioned is from Warren, Ohio. They operated a very good restaurant in Warren for a number of years.

Yeah, Pat liked the Vending Business of course - lots of quarters.

Real Estate Developer in Boardman of course - I remember in Akron when the call came in to another Real Estate Family Member on his red phone. Or when the call was made the other way and said Ed D or Eddie however you want to say Sr. name. I was there on many occasions back around 1979-1981 era. Ed D was the largest unsecured creditor for that Developer's Bankruptcy and I was the second largest unsecured creditor.

As my wife says: "six degrees of separation"! I'm one of two EJD Sr. God-Sons. I'll bet we have met. Send me a PM if you want to discuss this further.

in reading the posts about Cleveland, didn't see anything about the danny greene- john nardi war. the book "kill the Irishman" says danny greene killed 8 made Cleveland guys who were out to kill him.

says john nardi was using greene and his celtic club to help him rise to boss of the Cleveland family.

Binnie, you got my nose open. Now I gotta read about Danny Greene. Eight made men? Wow!

yeah, alfa, I understand there was a real war. haven't read the book yet. appreciate your input.

I don't know if he killed 8 Made guys, but him and Nardi were responsible for a couple of Cleveland guys being blown up, and they were also supposedly involved in the disappearance of Lips Moceri. And yeah, Nardi had ambitions of becoming boss of the Cleveland Family, I think Greene was aware of this as well, felt like if Nardi was at the top, he wouldn't have to take orders anymore or give the Italians a cut of whatever he was doing, I suppose.

yeah, ive got to get the book 'kill the Irishman" but, I do understand that he was with nardi, and, it was a bloody war.

no u don't, u walk past them in fear for your life

LMAO!!!

is corbo's still here..

Funnily enough I just watched the film version of this last night, never having heard about Danny Greene, the man had 9 lives.
It's either called Kill the Irishman or Bulletproof Ganster, worth a watch, haven't read the book.
Also the guy who planted the bomb that killed him turned and his arrest led to the Mafia Commission Trial.

If you're referring to a guy from Youngstown as the "guy who planted the bomb": He never turned. He did his time and now spends most of his time in Florida.

The young lady in the produce business, depicted in To Kill the Irishman, was also from Youngstown.

I was referring to Ray Ferritto. Another intriguing story, setting up his own crew after doing his time and leaving the programme.

Good post, Henry.

Best poster in regards to Ohio .

Thanx for your endorsement. Although I don't think I'm the best regarding Ohio. I know of at least one better.

However I might be pretty good when detailing my personal FTF experiences with the LaRocca era Pittsburgh crew.

Well, to a New York guy, Ohio and Western Pennsylvania overlap. I guess it's similar to a guy from the midwest thinking that the Bronx and Staten Island are right on top of each other when nothing could be further from the truth.

Friend of Henry is certainly an insider who I value and am proud to call a "friend."

Well i got this thread started and from what i read. There is no one that gets kicked up to in Cleveland....Relocating to Mentor Ohio and interested in the Cleveland history....

would really like to see some new pic's from clev. , nobody's going to track you down from the mob there. any milano family picture's ? some pic's of roma gardens are they still open?

Go to the black hand forum and there are tons of Cleveland photos.

Thanks