Okay so Everybody has seen goodfellas,the amazing movie based on the true story of henry hill but Was Henry Hill and James Conway presence in the mafia as big as it was shown in the film and are there still non italians that operate in the mafia and has their ever been any non italians that were made guys or has their been any non italians who were treated like made guys but never officially got the title
Okay so Everybody has seen goodfellas,the amazing movie based on the true story of henry hill but Was Henry Hill and James Conway presence in the mafia as big as it was shown in the film and are there still non italians that operate in the mafia and has their ever been any non italians that were made guys or has their been any non italians who were treated like made guys but never officially got the title
There has never been a member of the mob that didn't have at least some Italian blood. There's been plenty that were only Italian on their father's side, a handful that were only Italian on their mother's side, but all were Italian to some degree. That's the way it's always been and it won't ever change.
As for associates who have had the clout of made guys, yes. There were several guys like that back in the old days in Chicago. Some may suggest Meyer Lansky, to some extent. More recently, Gambino associate Joe Watts is an oft-mentioned example of this. So, while there are examples, it's still very much the exception to the rule.
Okay thanks for the information,My Grandfather told me that many non italians that were really good earners were Usually very accepted and involved in the Mafia like a made member,but how would the Mafia no if you were italian or not because there is many people who could pass for italian and can speak italian and know the culture, i guess my main question is how are they able to trace your roots back to the old country,i mean i can barely trace my roots with the information and insight that i have so how would the mafia be able to do it??
Okay thanks for the information,My Grandfather told me that many non italians that were really good earners were Usually very accepted and involved in the Mafia like a made member,but how would the Mafia no if you were italian or not because there is many people who could pass for italian and can speak italian and know the culture, i guess my main question is how are they able to trace your roots back to the old country,i mean i can barely trace my roots with the information and insight that i have so how would the mafia be able to do it??
That line about "tracing your roots to the old country" from Goodfellas is probably just that - a line. It's true that prospective candidates have to be well known for years. Including their history and their immediate family, where they grew up, and so on. But it's not like the mob is getting on a genealogy website and tracing it all back to Sicily or Italy.
I noticed that Roy Demeo didn't care if his crew members were not Italian. How 'made' they were, I don't know, but they did plenty of work for Nino Gaggi.
I noticed that Roy Demeo didn't care if his crew members were not Italian. How 'made' they were, I don't know, but they did plenty of work for Nino Gaggi.
The only made member of the Demeo "crew" was roy himself. However after Demeo was killed anthony senter and joey testa were made into the luchesses.
That line about "tracing your roots to the old country" from Goodfellas is probably just that - a line. It's true that prospective candidates have to be well known for years. Including their history and their immediate family, where they grew up, and so on. But it's not like the mob is getting on a genealogy website and tracing it all back to Sicily or Italy.
No doubt but look at Pistone they knew nothing about him and were ready to open the books for him. They just were going to take his word that he was italian? I think in the end it all depends on how much you can earn.
This has been discussed at length before. My take is that if you can earn, muscle, or both, you have a good opportunity to generate a power base for yourself within LCN. That being said, you should have a good "Rabbi"/ "Uncle" (respected made guy or better obviously of Italian decent) to watch your back when you inevitably step on somebody's toes. Because if you're NOT Italian, the odds are that the powers-that-be are gonna rule against you every time. That is unless the other guy is a laughing stock.
That line about "tracing your roots to the old country" from Goodfellas is probably just that - a line.
That line always reminded me of something that Puzo might have written if he was a journalist instead of a novelist. It's corny as Hell, yet oddly enough it was perfect for the voice-over in the film.
Not to take the thread on a tangent, but real quick: did the FBI pull Joe Pistone and later Jack Garcia prior to being made out of fear that the Mafia might not "turn the other cheek" at that level of embarrassment or was there another reason?
In regards to Joe Pistone, the only reasoning the FBI ever gave for pulling him was because they were worried that he was going to be ordered to kill somebody to get his button. In fact, he had already been given the contract on somebody, Bruno Indelicato I believe (they had a couple plans to deal with this problem. if Joe found Bruno, the FBI was going to take Bruno into custody and possibly stage a hit). If Pistone were brought into a room and ordered to kill a man, or somehow put in such a situation, that would be a disaster for an already successful operation and I think they feared such a situation. Anyways...that's the only reasoning that was ever given.
Louie Diaz is a different person. A different cop that specialized in undercover work. I think he was involved in narcotics cases and possibly OC cases. He has also done some acting and been on TV.
Idk about Garcia but pistone was pulled cause he was going to have to kill someone.
Garcia is still shocking to me, even though he only infiltrated the crew that couldn't shoot straight. Shoot straight? Make that walk straight.
Garcia grew up here in the Bronx. He went to Mount Saint Michael, which, if you're in a lively mood, is almost walking distance to the strip joint that the DePalmas owned. And yet he was STILL able to get over on them.
The Feds should really build a statue of Greg. And put it in Quantico for continued good luck.
There was a story recently that Vito rizzuto made some non Italians , raynald desjardins and juan Fernandez . I don't believe that though , no matter how powerful the guy was he answers to bigger people than him and they woul never ever permit a non Italian getting there button
There was a story recently that Vito rizzuto made some non Italians , raynald desjardins and juan Fernandez . I don't believe that though , no matter how powerful the guy was he answers to bigger people than him and they woul never ever permit a non Italian getting there button
Ya i agree, i think that was just a case of fernandez(aka joe bravo) tooting his own horn trying to make himself sound important to the sicilians, and look at what happened to him haha.
There was a story recently that Vito rizzuto made some non Italians , raynald desjardins and juan Fernandez . I don't believe that though , no matter how powerful the guy was he answers to bigger people than him and they woul never ever permit a non Italian getting there button
Ya i agree, i think that was just a case of fernandez(aka joe bravo) tooting his own horn trying to make himself sound important to the sicilians, and look at what happened to him haha.
Happy Birthday Dell .
I revived this one because it wasn't part of the CHI VS NY, threads, that you love so much .
I've often wondered this question about whether or not any non-Italians have been made. In my opinion, there must have been a few guys over the past 100 years that were made that should not have been (according to the rules regarding lineage). Guys in the mafia have broken every single rule they've made. They've dealt drugs, slept with made guys' wives, disrespected the boss, etc. There is no reason to think that the rule regarding made guys having the proper Italian lineage has not been broken. The only reason we don't know for sure if it has been broken is anybody that was made and should not have been would never admit that their lineage did not meet the mob's standards.
Here is a hypothetical situation I was wondering about:
They say that you must be Italian on your father's side. So, my father was born in the United States. My grandpa was also born in the United States. My great-grandpa was born in Naples, Italy.
My great-grandpa emigrated from Italy to the US and married a Polish woman. They had a son (my grandpa). Then, my Grandpa married a French woman. They had a son (my father). My father married a Chinese woman. They had me. Am I eligible for the mafia?
That is an excellent question but technically you would not be at least half italian. During the 90's the rules were changed and guys that were half italian could be made,they want you to be half italian from your father side so that you'll have italian last name....But to be honest it is really hard for them or really anyone to check your ethnicity with out an ethnic DNA test(you cang get from ancestory.com for 100$)or knowing your backround or family members. So yes im almost 100% positive that their are or were members that have lied or have been told to lie about their ethnicity by other members so that they can be made....But if your not italian there is many other ethnic mafia's out their.... i might make a post all about that
Here is a hypothetical situation I was wondering about:
They say that you must be Italian on your father's side. So, my father was born in the United States. My grandpa was also born in the United States. My great-grandpa was born in Naples, Italy.
My great-grandpa emigrated from Italy to the US and married a Polish woman. They had a son (my grandpa). Then, my Grandpa married a French woman. They had a son (my father). My father married a Chinese woman. They had me. Am I eligible for the mafia?
Do you have Asian eyes?
I swear on my kids that's an honest question, and I'm not being racist. Because these guys aren't exactly bastions of liberalism.
Ask yourself this: If a guy's Dad is Italian but his Mom is Black, and he has his Mom's complexion, would they make him?
Well they'd sure as hell be more lenient with letting a guy into the fold if he were half Chinese than if he were half black.
Neither one of them are getting in.
The half-Italian guys who got squeezed in back then were from somewhat similar backgrounds on their Mothers' side. Craig DePalma and Junior Gotti were Jewish on their Mothers' side. A couple of half-Irish guys got made up in Boston.
Similar neighborhood upbringings coupled with European ancestry and they snuck in. No way a half-Asian or half-Black guy is getting made. Not in the '90s (when they were actually making mixed guys), and certainly not now.
Well they'd sure as hell be more lenient with letting a guy into the fold if he were half Chinese than if he were half black.
Neither one of them are getting in.
The half-Italian guys who got squeezed in back then were from somewhat similar backgrounds on their Mothers' side. Craig DePalma and Junior Gotti were Jewish on their Mothers' side. A couple of half-Irish guys got made up in Boston.
Similar neighborhood upbringings coupled with European ancestry and they snuck in. No way a half-Asian or half-Black guy is getting made. Not in the '90s (when they were actually making mixed guys), and certainly not now.
Same with Chicago. The only made guys I can think of who are mixed with something else are either Irish, Greek, or Polish.
Under another topic (guys cutting deals while serving long sentences),I mentioned Chuckie Porter,a Pittsburgh Mob guy. He was made despite being half Italian(on his mother's side). He rose through the ranks and became Underboss under Michael Genovese.
Under another topic (guys cutting deals while serving long sentences),I mentioned Chuckie Porter,a Pittsburgh Mob guy. He was made despite being half Italian(on his mother's side). He rose through the ranks and became Underboss under Michael Genovese.
Porter's another good example. Although, like you said, in his case the Italian blood was on his Mother's side.
Under another topic (guys cutting deals while serving long sentences),I mentioned Chuckie Porter,a Pittsburgh Mob guy. He was made despite being half Italian(on his mother's side). He rose through the ranks and became Underboss under Michael Genovese.
Porter's another good example. Although, like you said, in his case the Italian blood was on his Mother's side.
I remember my first encounter with Chuckie. I had no idea would he was. When I was introduced to him a very wise man from Warren, Ohio looked at me and "rolled" his eyes. Another friend told me he was a real "up and comer" and may be "The Man" some day. Many believe that Chuckie's heavy involvement with drugs and Michael's desire for all the money led to the end of what we knew of the Pittsburgh LCN ;-(
The Pittsburgh Mafia definitely began a downward spiral once they got into the drug business. Porter's main dope guy on the street was Eugene Gesuale,who was known as "Nick the Blade". He established a major drug ring that included suppliers like the Pag#n motorcycle gang,and Paul Mazzei,the guy mentioned in "Goodfellas" as Henry's Pittsburgh connection. Gesuale was one of those guys that was pretty much hated and considered a complete animal by everybody.(Animal was another one of his nicknames). In most cases,when Law enforcement puts these guys away,it is business and not personal.The mob guys and the cops both understand that they are just doing their jobs,and there is some small amount of mutual respect. In Gesuale's case,the Feds really hated him on a personal level. He was a sadistic scumbag,who enjoyed inflicting violence on associates,citizens,and women,all pretty much equally. I'm sure that when he got popped,a lot of champagne corks got popped as well.
There were two men in the Rizzuto family in Canada which were made members, one was Spanish i think and the other i forgot. They were send to Italy for some business, but they got killed there by the other mobsters which they did business with because they were made man but not Italians. It was a message to Vito Rizzuto not to take any other race into the family as a made men.
My point was that a half chinaman would be much more likely to be brought into the fold (not made) than a mulatto. Italians have never been reluctant to do business with Oriental crime families. Black gangs, on the other hand..
There were two men in the Rizzuto family in Canada which were made members, one was Spanish i think and the other i forgot. They were send to Italy for some business, but they got killed there by the other mobsters which they did business with because they were made man but not Italians. It was a message to Vito Rizzuto not to take any other race into the family as a made men.
the two alleged made guys who were spanish in canada are juan fernandez(aka joe bravo) and raynald desjardins. and i say alleged bc the one and only source that says they were made was fernandez himself when he was talking to the sicilians while being taped, what i took from that was fernandez was just talking himself up trying to make himself sound important. its hardly proof that rizzuto made two guys that had no italian blood at all. with every single report filed on desjardins over the years, none even suggest that he might've been made(that doesn't mean he wasn't important though). and we defiantly don't know the exact reason why joe bravo was killed, most likely it was either on orders from rizzuto himself or it might've had something to do with the massive arrests against the Bagheria family that happened right around the time of his murder.
My point was that a half chinaman would be much more likely to be brought into the fold (not made) than a mulatto.
Well, I thought the question was specific to being made. If I misread it, that's on me .
Originally Posted By: HuronSocialAthletic
Italians have never been reluctant to do business with Oriental crime families. Black gangs, on the other hand.
Well, I don't know about Chicago. If you know anything about me, it's that I don't speculate about things outside of my own region. But years ago here in New York, the Harlem numbers games were shared by the Italians and the Blacks, and there was rarely a beef. Bumpy Johnson and his crew were pretty close with some of the old Westside guys on 116th Street and the Luccheses on 108th.
Now I realize that's a long time ago, and you're probably thinking of the more modern day Black gangs (Crips, Bloods, etc.). But if that's the case, I'll just point out that it's fairly common knowledge that Vinny Basciano was in the junk business with LOADS of Black and Dominican gang types. And that's within the past twenty years. And Vinny ended up a boss.
But again, that's New York. I'll take your word about Chicago.
What is the modern day mafia going to do to make new members? Obviously, they started accepting 1/2 Italians because they needed to bring in new members and there weren't enough full-blooded Italians.
Anyways, this begs the question, will the mob eventually start making guys that are 1/4 Italian (have only one full Italian grandparent)?
I think they will have to because immigration from Italy is way down. This isn't the 1920s anymore. The more you widen the talent pool, you have a better selection of high quality, committed, money-making criminals. On the other hand, if you widen the talent pool to 1/4 Italians, being a mafia member may lose meaning, which mean guys don't feel as loyal to the group. What do you guys think?
What is the modern day mafia going to do to make new members? Obviously, they started accepting 1/2 Italians because they needed to bring in new members and there weren't enough full-blooded Italians.
Anyways, this begs the question, will the mob eventually start making guys that are 1/4 Italian (have only one full Italian grandparent)?
I think they will have to because immigration from Italy is way down. This isn't the 1920s anymore. The more you widen the talent pool, you have a better selection of high quality, committed, money-making criminals. On the other hand, if you widen the talent pool to 1/4 Italians, being a mafia member may lose meaning, which mean guys don't feel as loyal to the group. What do you guys think?
Everything you've just described is called attrition, and attrition and assimilation have done more to change the face of the American mob than RICO and everything else combined.
But no, I doubt they'll ever take 1/4 Italians (whatever that means in this melting pot day age).
I doubt they'll ever take 1/4 Italians (whatever that means in this melting pot day age).
I dunno, I could see this happening, maybe even making non-Italians... not anytime soon, but when the New York 5 (which I predict will ALWAYS be around in some form or another) have finally evolved into something totally unrecognizable. I'm talking 100+ years from now or at some distant point in the future like that.
I doubt they'll ever take 1/4 Italians (whatever that means in this melting pot day age).
I dunno, I could see this happening, maybe even making non-Italians... not anytime soon, but when the New York 5 (which I predict will ALWAYS be around in some form or another) have finally evolved into something totally unrecognizable. I'm talking 100+ years from now or at some distant point in the future like that.
I'm almost 55, Ivan. I doubt I'll be here in a hundred years .
But down the road? That's what I meant with my sarcastic "melting pot" remark. I guess I should have used one of those silly smileys .
The whole idea that you have to be "fully Italian"/"100% Italian", or have an Italian last name or have an Italian heritage on your father's side in order to be made or join is a myth that people who know nothing love to spread around. The myth of this is perpetuated by myths, and movies and TV shows about the mob that are not based on reality at all.
When mafia members from Sicily, Calabria, and other parts of Italy first immigrated here to the states over a century ago yes you did have to be completely Italian. But it was not that difficult to tell who was Italian and who was not, and there were very few if any first generation Italian-Americans then since they were very young or just being born.
However the whole "you must be completely 100% Italian" in order to join the mob or be made has not applied for over a century, and the idea it does is a myth perpetuated by the media and people who are in the mob who believe the BS history they hear that's not accurate. Even in NYC with the five families you do not have to be completely Italian to join, and it has been this way since the 60s. They never have actually "changed it back". People who claim that they have or that you must be 100% Italian to join believe misinformation and myths about the mob that are not true that get spread around. The stuff the rats and fed reports claim is not necessarily true either.
If they restricted membership to people who were only completely Italian that is Italian on both their father and mother's sides going back to their great-grandparents, or even further back nobody in the United States would be able to join, and not everyone in Italy now would be able to join either.
You do have to have an Italian heritage but it can be on either your mother or father's side. Yes someone who is 1/4th or 1/8th Italian, or even 1/2 Italian can join as long as they are completely Caucasian, and look Italian.
Yes some people do try to get their son, grandson, or great-grandson to join. It's like this in Italy too. They do this despite how their sons or other male relatives are not completely Italian and if the son or other male relative wants to join they easily can despite being 1/2, 1/4, or 1/8 Italian. But if the son is biracial or mixed race such as being Italian, and Asian, Italian and Hispanic, or Italian and Black they do not do this as there's no point and their relative will not be accepted into the business no matter how much they earn or who they are related to.
They would never let someone who is fully, half, or part Asian/Indian, or black, and part Caucasian Italian join or be made. Like that actor Giancarlo Esposito on breaking bad who played the Chilean drug dealer he's Italian and black; but looks black or mixed race. There are also a lot of illegal immigrants from various African countries in Italy now, and some become citizens and marry Italian people and they are not allowed in. The same goes for children or grandchildren of people from various Asian and even European countries who emigrate to Italy, marry an Italian woman or man and do not have a heritage that is actually Italian.
hmmm...what exactly does an italian look like , i'm not a full italian but 1/4 sicilian and 1/4 greek but i'm also mixed with some Danish and i think that probably why i have blond hair and blue eyes but i do have a cousin who is full italian and hes dirty blond and has pretty fare skin so my main question is how exactly do you classify the looks of an italian???
That line about "tracing your roots to the old country" from Goodfellas is probably just that - a line.
That line always reminded me of something that Puzo might have written if he was a journalist instead of a novelist. It's corny as Hell, yet oddly enough it was perfect for the voice-over in the film.
The whole idea that you have to be "fully Italian"/"100% Italian", or have an Italian last name or have an Italian heritage on your father's side in order to be made or join is a myth that people who know nothing love to spread around. The myth of this is perpetuated by myths, and movies and TV shows about the mob that are not based on reality at all.
When mafia members from Sicily, Calabria, and other parts of Italy first immigrated here to the states over a century ago yes you did have to be completely Italian. But it was not that difficult to tell who was Italian and who was not, and there were very few if any first generation Italian-Americans then since they were very young or just being born.
However the whole "you must be completely 100% Italian" in order to join the mob or be made has not applied for over a century, and the idea it does is a myth perpetuated by the media and people who are in the mob who believe the BS history they hear that's not accurate. Even in NYC with the five families you do not have to be completely Italian to join, and it has been this way since the 60s. They never have actually "changed it back". People who claim that they have or that you must be 100% Italian to join believe misinformation and myths about the mob that are not true that get spread around. The stuff the rats and fed reports claim is not necessarily true either.
If they restricted membership to people who were only completely Italian that is Italian on both their father and mother's sides going back to their great-grandparents, or even further back nobody in the United States would be able to join, and not everyone in Italy now would be able to join either.
You do have to have an Italian heritage but it can be on either your mother or father's side. Yes someone who is 1/4th or 1/8th Italian, or even 1/2 Italian can join as long as they are completely Caucasian, and look Italian.
Yes some people do try to get their son, grandson, or great-grandson to join. It's like this in Italy too. They do this despite how their sons or other male relatives are not completely Italian and if the son or other male relative wants to join they easily can despite being 1/2, 1/4, or 1/8 Italian. But if the son is biracial or mixed race such as being Italian, and Asian, Italian and Hispanic, or Italian and Black they do not do this as there's no point and their relative will not be accepted into the business no matter how much they earn or who they are related to.
They would never let someone who is fully, half, or part Asian/Indian, or black, and part Caucasian Italian join or be made. Like that actor Giancarlo Esposito on breaking bad who played the Chilean drug dealer he's Italian and black; but looks black or mixed race. There are also a lot of illegal immigrants from various African countries in Italy now, and some become citizens and marry Italian people and they are not allowed in. The same goes for children or grandchildren of people from various Asian and even European countries who emigrate to Italy, marry an Italian woman or man and do not have a heritage that is actually Italian.
While you make a good point about the difficulty of discerning full or 100% Italian blood today, far removed from pure Italian stock as many prospective members would be today, the idea (which was in fact re-made the rule when Joe Massino was boss of the Bonannos in the early 2000's), it basically meant to the mobsters who were making the rules that both the guy's father and mother had to be Italian. In their way of looking at things - that meant the guy was 100% Italian, whereas a guy could be potentially made prior to that (at least during the 1980's and 1990's) by being what they would consider only 50% Italian on the father's side. How strictly that is actually followed is another story. I tend to agree that as long as a guy is white, has an Italian heritage (including an Italian last name), and the powers that be want him in; he'll get in.
The whole idea that you have to be "fully Italian"/"100% Italian", or have an Italian last name or have an Italian heritage on your father's side in order to be made or join is a myth that people who know nothing love to spread around. The myth of this is perpetuated by myths, and movies and TV shows about the mob that are not based on reality at all.
When mafia members from Sicily, Calabria, and other parts of Italy first immigrated here to the states over a century ago yes you did have to be completely Italian. But it was not that difficult to tell who was Italian and who was not, and there were very few if any first generation Italian-Americans then since they were very young or just being born.
However the whole "you must be completely 100% Italian" in order to join the mob or be made has not applied for over a century, and the idea it does is a myth perpetuated by the media and people who are in the mob who believe the BS history they hear that's not accurate. Even in NYC with the five families you do not have to be completely Italian to join, and it has been this way since the 60s. They never have actually "changed it back". People who claim that they have or that you must be 100% Italian to join believe misinformation and myths about the mob that are not true that get spread around. The stuff the rats and fed reports claim is not necessarily true either.
If they restricted membership to people who were only completely Italian that is Italian on both their father and mother's sides going back to their great-grandparents, or even further back nobody in the United States would be able to join, and not everyone in Italy now would be able to join either.
You do have to have an Italian heritage but it can be on either your mother or father's side. Yes someone who is 1/4th or 1/8th Italian, or even 1/2 Italian can join as long as they are completely Caucasian, and look Italian.
Yes some people do try to get their son, grandson, or great-grandson to join. It's like this in Italy too. They do this despite how their sons or other male relatives are not completely Italian and if the son or other male relative wants to join they easily can despite being 1/2, 1/4, or 1/8 Italian. But if the son is biracial or mixed race such as being Italian, and Asian, Italian and Hispanic, or Italian and Black they do not do this as there's no point and their relative will not be accepted into the business no matter how much they earn or who they are related to.
They would never let someone who is fully, half, or part Asian/Indian, or black, and part Caucasian Italian join or be made. Like that actor Giancarlo Esposito on breaking bad who played the Chilean drug dealer he's Italian and black; but looks black or mixed race. There are also a lot of illegal immigrants from various African countries in Italy now, and some become citizens and marry Italian people and they are not allowed in. The same goes for children or grandchildren of people from various Asian and even European countries who emigrate to Italy, marry an Italian woman or man and do not have a heritage that is actually Italian.
While you make a good point about the difficulty of discerning full or 100% Italian blood today, far removed from pure Italian stock as many prospective members would be today, the idea (which was in fact re-made the rule when Joe Massino was boss of the Bonannos in the early 2000's), it basically meant to the mobsters who were making the rules that both the guy's father and mother had to be Italian. In their way of looking at things - that meant the guy was 100% Italian, whereas a guy could be potentially made prior to that (at least during the 1980's and 1990's) by being what they would consider only 50% Italian on the father's side. How strictly that is actually followed is another story. I tend to agree that as long as a guy is white, has an Italian heritage (including an Italian last name), and the powers that be want him in; he'll get in.
\ OK you're basically saying what I'm saying in my post.
Just because a person's parents or grandparents have Italian last names that does not always make them Italian as a lot of people have immigrated to Italy and married Italians, or Italian people have married other Americans who have a heritage that's not completely Italian.
Joe Massino is not a "boss" or in a leadership position at all anymore. The rule they claim does not apply and has not for over a century. It is also as you said if they really want a guy to join they'll allow him to.
The majority of Italians (by this I mean people who are born in Italy) if you look at their genetics are not even "100% Italian".
You have Italian people who have a Greek heritage, Norman (French) heritage, a Byzantine heritage, German/Swiss/Austrian heritage, and other types of heritages from other people or countries.
Most of the five families utilize Ancestry.com to make sure they are making real Italians.
They do not go that far into checking to see if someone is actually Italian in their heritage.
I honestly wouldn't be that surprised if the Genovese family did.
Actually, they're probably the most assimilated and Americanized of the five New York families. The other families---especially the Gambinos and the Bonannos---have made a lot of Sicilian born members over the past decade. And to be perfectly honest, the Genovese family has basically shunned them.
But I get what you're saying. They obviously do a MUCH better job of vetting their associates before proposing them for membership.
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