Percent of made guys who have actually killed?

In Donnie Brasco he talks about how there is a shortage of contracts going around and that guys can get made if their captain lies for them even though they haven't actually "made their bones". And the mafia today dosen't seem to kill as much as it used to. So what percentage of made guys would you say have actually "made their bones" or just killed throughout their whole career?

Well, there are a couple of things to put in perspective about the whole "making your bones" thing in the American Mafia.

1. Al D'arco said in his biography that the idea that you must kill someone to be inducted into the Mafia is not entirely true. Yes, some are required to do it, but others get in for being good earners. He wasn't required to kill anybody to get in, but he did admit to being involved in several murders later in his mob career (he did mention though, that if you are ordered to kill somebody, you must take the contract otherwise your the next person to get killed, that is no joke). He said it wasn't unheard of for guys to be involved in the mafia for over twenty years until they were asked to kill someone.

2. Even if one was required to murder someone to gain membership into LCN, he doesn't necessarily need to pull the trigger. For example, if you were the getaway driver, or if you helped dispose of the body, that counted as making bones too. I know the Bonnanos tried to reform the rules after the Donnie Brasco incident (a made guy must be with you when you go out and do the hit, and you must actually pull the trigger yourself). I do not know how well enforced the new rules are today, since the Mafia doesn't kill as much as they used to.

So, I think its far to say that there isn't too many murderers in the mob today, least not as many as in the past. I still wouldn't want to rub them the wrong way though.

Adding to what billymari posted, George Freselone also said murder wasn't a prerequisite to being made. His said if a guy was a good earner, the family didn't care if he had never seen a gun.

It seems the part in the making ceremony about murder, at least later on, was the willingness to carry it out.

Interestingly, in a recorded conversation about 10 years ago or so, Genovese acting captain Sammy Aparo said he thought about 40 guys in the family who were capable hitters.

Not that they'd ever need that many nowadays.

That could be interpreted different ways. He might be saying that there are only 40 guys in the family he trusts to do a good job, not that there are only 40 guys who have killed or are capable of killing.

I think it depends on the captain. If he's really really old school and isn't going to vouch for a guy unless the guy has protocol then you're going to have to take place in a hit. If the captain only cares about money he'll lie through his teeth and say the inductee is worthy.

Either way, whether or not the inductee has participated in a murder or not he'll need to be backed by people that have because the guys in the family who are killers will smell blood in the water and try to take advantage of the guy if he doesn't have tough people protecting him to some degree, be it the boss, his captain or guys working under him.

Interesting post.

I could be wrong, but in D'Arco's biography or somewhere else, I think he said that if someone was a good earner, he could pay his way in with a large cash tribute. In autobiographies, mobsters sometimes deny killing anyone, when it's a lie; I'm pretty sure Al had to whack someone get get in. He wasn't exactly a rising star in the family.

I always thought that in order to be made, you had to whack someone and be the one to pull the trigger. I guess I was really wrong about that.

I truly believed that D'Arco took a lot of people for a ride, he wasn't very believable and isn't the most credible person, similar to Leonetti.

No, just have to participate in one in some capacity with the theory being that no undercover cop could take part in a murder

IF someone HAS to be murdered... old, quick and clean, no kids or animals, no element of surprise... and no shooting someone in the back... all that shit is sick...

How about Chicago? Their practices have always been different; has there been a requirement "to do a piece of work" to get made there?

Not that many people have been killed there in the past twenty years and they've also put less emphasis on killing and outright violence.