Anthony TG Graziano

per gangland he got shelved

crazy

thoughts?

Did Capeci give a reason? I mean this is the Bonnano Family we are talking about. They are very weakened and TG is one of the few remaining guys that was around when Rusty ran things and they were a force to be reckoned with. I have a few theories and believe it may be a result of one or more . . .

(1) Mob Wives and Hector Pagan were an utter embarassment, especially after Donny Brasco. They did not want to go through the humiliation and TG was directly involved in all that nonsense.
(2) He is intimately connected to Massino. There was some chatter that even Vinny Gorgeous should never have been considered the official boss because he was tabbed by Big Joey. Perhaps people view TG in a similar light.
(3) He is not completely competent as he is getting up there in years and almost certainly has lived an unleathy life (look at photos of him and even consider his daugter to be evidence of the Graziano family's physical health).
(4) Someone is consolidating power. I do not believe this to be Vinny TV since he always seemed to me to be something of a caretaker. Perhaps Vincent Asaro? People have always thrown his name about as a potential true successor to Massino. With the Gambino family (a historical ally of the Bonnanos) naming Cefalu as their boss and Cali is their underboss, there is a distinct movement back toward Sicilian control and an understated demeanor. As per Capeci a few years ago: "Asaro, a longtime Queens-based gangster is a certified old-school gangster who speaks Italian fluently and is well-respected by the Zips . . . " I am not sure where Asaro was born, but he is highly regarded by not only the Sicilian factions in his own family, but also by members of the Gambino, Genovese and Lucchese brass.

In sum, I have always viewed the Bonnanos (following Joe Bonnano's death) to be a bunch of extremely violent and/or stupid thugs. Rusty was VERY highly regarded, but he has always scared the shit out of me for some reason. I feel as though Massino, Santora, Rabito and TG are all from the same Rastelli-influenced ilk. I don't know enough about Vinny TV to pass judgment, but Asaro seemingly has far more respect and legitimacy. Maybe this is an attempt to clean house.

Just my 2 cents ...

Good stuff ovation... I think reason (1) weighs heavily. Even they must be like, "enough is enough"...

that show really does make them look like a joke.at least they didnt kill him just to send a message.

TG seems like a real soldier,im sure he's totally embarased of his family..I wouldn't be surprised if he was shelved or they let him retire...I kinda feel bad for this poor prick the feds won't leave him alone and his family is clearly half retarted

If I was the boss of the family I wouldn't care how much heat it brought on I would whack TG just to watch those idiots cry...I'm sorry if that comes on wrong I just hate that show..an just to send a message I'm not sure what that message is but I would fucking kill that fucked

no.no,no, and no. its bull shit. all of it. t.g.s not on the shelf,hes in prison. and he knows whos said this to.this fucking queer isnt even a made guy,trying to pass him self off as a fucking 'foot soldier' to kids forty years younger than him.hes a blabbermouth pussy. the rumor is 't.g.' has been shelved after he was sentenced. you can fucking bet when he gets out he has his stripes. 't.v.' doesnt have the stones to shelve anthony.vinny is only boss because t.g. didnt stand in his way. t.v. has never broke his cherry and never will. he is boss because he wanted it.and no body wanted vinny asaro there. hes a fucking brokster drunk. i will dispell any rumor right now, 'tv' is boss,whether he deserves it or not. t.g. will be a captain when he gets out if he wants to be. hes got to many friends.

shecky, tony r., and tony g. where sonny black guys not rustys.

First off, I did not read the Capeci column which is why I was asking for some color on the rationale and source of this information. Having said that, my comments were mere speculation from an observer.

Second, I was unaware that Asaro was not as highly regarded as some may think. What Gamms says makes sense given the fact that he has never really moved up beyond is present position. It provides a reasonable explanation.

Third, please correct me if I am wrong, but Nepolitano was very much a Rusty guy up until the end. He backed Rusty when times were tough as did his crew. Sonny Black took Rusty's lead and encouraged his soldiers to develop the same mindset Rusty had.

you answer to your skipper.doesnt matter who the boss is.

You just proved my point:

If A (TG, Santora and Rabito) = B (Sonny Black) AND
B (Sonny Black) = C (Rusty) THEN
A (TG, Santora and Rabito) = C (Rusty)

no. that is not how it works.a soldier is loyal to his skipper.if the skipper decides to jump the fence,so does his crew.the crew doesnt answer to the boss. i see what you mean,sonny loved rusty.thats true,but his crew isnt in a position to even know rusty,yet alone decide to be loyal to him or not.

Gotcha - I just meant to say that since Sonny Black was loyal to and loved Rusty for most of his life and his crew was loyal to their skipper, the crew was - by the transient property - loyal to Rusty. You are more than likley right insofar as a soldier never knowing the boss.

I am more interested in what you think about Vinny TV. Do the older guys we have been discussing even find him credible as a boss? And why is he being called the "Acting" boss when there is no other boss out there. Vinny Gorgeous seems to have had his stripes pulled because of the Massino connection so it is as if they are starting anew with Vinny TV at the helm.

Also, where do your feelings about Asaro come from? I have never read anything like that about him.

Finally, what are your opinions on Sal the Ironworker? Had he not been deported and died, he seems like he would have been a viable candidate to take the helm...

agree gamms, think u nailed it

my thoughts for vinny are the same as i say when people question weather john gotti ever got his feet wet.how is a family full of guys who can pull a trigger supposed to follow a guy who cant.my wife is more capable than murder than vinny.i like vinny as a person. we went to the same h.s. he is a year younger than me.he just never was a gangster,his father was a real straifht shooter,as well liked as they come.vinny grew up working in his fathers store on new utrecht.where he later opened 'new utrecht electronics'. i remember when they were selling car phones.lol. he was never a tough kid.forty years ago if you tell me vinny was boss of the family,you would be shipped to the mental trauma wing.lol. i grew up fighting kids with sticks and taking crates out of the liquor truck and throwing parties on the roof the old 'ceasars' catering hall.lol. if a kid like vinny showed up,we would throw him off the roof.lol. i was amazed when i heard he got made.

in all fairness,vinny a is just to old school for the job.a boss doesnt get half in the bag and shoot up a bar in queens.'enough said'.lol

sal should have never been in that position.i am sorry he went the way he did,but he should have known better than to stick his beak in up there.

I believe "Mikey Nose" to be the boss of the Bonnano's, TV is a figure head or caretaker while the nose is in the can... Just my thoughts. TG was responsible for Hector as he was on record with him when he went bad. They used to kill you for that. So he could be shelved. But the again Depalma was shelved and came back too. Just my thoughts

Vinny basciano appointed himself acting boss (then informed massino after the fact) and when he went to jail appointed mancuso as acting and then sal montagna as acting just to be clear. All the secret tapes of Massino and Basciano support this. I have posted them in an old thread.

I have seen and heard that Dap, but what about the attorney for Massino that flipped and made him repeat over and over that Massino wanted him acting boss. I will research. I have seen posts on he appointed himself and Massino appointed him through the attorney

You are also correct on that, the attorney's name was Tommy Lee or something like that. Difference here is that, you cant question tapes and massino's and vinny's voice on them with massino himself alluding to the fact that vinny put himself there and then told massino. A witness (lawyer) can always lie to help their own situation out which we have seen. Tapes are tapes, 9 times out of 10 you can take them over a witness testimony especially if the direct subject which you are looking into is discussed.

mike is not boss.jerry capeci thinks his word is gospel.he is full of hot air. next week they will tell us about the kid from 'canarsie' that went bad. saying 'you heard it here folks'! bull shit.

t.g. is what ever he wants to be.

t.v. is boss because of tony rabito,tony g, tony green,sammy and louie a.

mike is not even a skipper,he will be out when he is a old man.

all im trying to say is..'some people are so far behind in the race they think there winning'. like jerry cspeci.

Yeah, and when Capeci reported that Frank Cali' was the new underboss, nobody besides me and maybe one other person would even entertain the notion that it wasn't true. But what do I know, I'm just a ditzy broad. Capeci is God.

Who's Louie A and Tony G? The others are obvs Rabito, Sammartino, and Anthony Urso

Louie Ha Ha Attanasio

Almost thought you were joking Dap but what do Urso and Attanasio got to do with anything? They're both in jail until 2018

doesnt mean their not influential from the can as you know, look at the persicos as a prime example. Louie HaHa is major money maker and a hitter.

If he isn't, considering the embarrassment that is Mob Wives and Hector Pagan, he should be. Though in his defense about Mob Wives, he didn't want his daughter anywhere near that show.

Full of hot air? Capeci has a very good track record and much more credibility than anyone on the internet. The times he's been wrong and had to retract something have been very rare.

And, for the record, Capeci never said Mancuso is the boss.

He means Mancuso is not even a Captain.

louie is vinnys rabbi.

What Mike is not boss then lol? I was thinking the same thing.

gamms, I enjoy your posts alot and you obviously kno your shit but its sometimes hard to follow who your talkin about. Once I asked who you were talking about in a certain thread, your answer was "the old guy from Brooklyn" lol

why did TG always use to fuck with the younger guys like John pappa,lee dvanzo paciello.Im thinking if this guy was so high up y did he even bother talking to these guys who were in their early 20s at the time.Im sure a guy like queit dom and bellomo would never give those guuys the time of day

Did lee davanzo answer to TG?

davamzo rolled with the new springfield boys i believe and maybe the bath ave crew...not sure if that was TG's crew...dont think so....if you read Mob over Miami it's all about paciello...good read

What happend was tg knew dvanzo and was shaaking down his buddies then told dvanzo to clip one of his friends and dvanzo said no.

He should be shelved for having his daughter on that show, stupid.

Ramona's father was also mentioned in the article - John Rizzo, who's a Gambino soldier. Apparently he did what TG couldn't and made sure his daughter never mentioned his name on the show.

Well the Graziano family is in that line of work everyone else is writing books movies now for crissake tv...

Could you imagine waking up every morning with that bitchs monkey face next too you Brrrrrrrrr

I don't watch that show but given the upper echelon problems of the Bonanno's I was glad the judge realized that all mobwives might show up and give them lenient plea's too get the show on the road. Ivy so what happens to that hector pagon character didn't he kill someone, what kind of time is he looking at? I mean he didn't testify but he got the feds a conviction right?

yes that was in gangland this week as well

no time, hes in WP

he got kicked out of wpp

yeah so know idea where he is...i know he isnt in jail

he is in jail, just not in wpp, he will be out the can by the end of the yr most likely

I feel bad for his son. He really is a good dude, its not just mob wives bullshit. He gets a lot of shit for his dad. Ive seen grown men recognize him and give him shit. Kids to shy to stand up for him self.

Junior must be doing time.. He lied to the feds about robbing that high stakes card game ran by the lucheses I think and killed an associate, t.g got him a fucking pass for that stunt, which is insane and shows how heavy he is... Bet he's wishing he never did that now, considering he ended up getting secretly recorded by that pile of shit and got locked back up for it.. Don't understand how 1. You can inform against your wifes father, and 2. Wear a wire against your father in law who without him you're not shit, and who obviously saved his ass more times than we know I'm sure.

where did u read this?

^^^gangland and the mob wives tv show, they mentioned him being kicked out of wpp (for lying) but still being locked up a few times

junior was also a suspect in another murder, hector was a serious leg-breaker out on the street even vinny tv was scared of him when he met up with him according to wiretaps

Dap can you post some of those wiretaps?

they were in some old ganglands about tg and hector, i will see if i find them

Thanks

im a member to gangland any idea which week

it was one of the articles that talked about hector and tg dont remember which week

I know in Cosa Nostra everyone is met through a third party, whether being made or an associate. This being said you are also responsible for anyone on the record with you. If they go bad you get whacked or knocked down depending on who you are. This being "JR" Hector Pagan is plenty enough reason to shelve "TG". As I see it the Bonanno's and many othe LCN families are so battered they need earners like "TG". Maybe its just a rumor about "TG" going on the shelf maybe it is real. The Mob Wives show could never be good for any LCN guys. JMO

Last nite on Mob Wives Karen Gravano used the term ''she was going to put a cap in somebody''.You have got to be kidding me.She's trying to sound so tough and she's portraying herself as a 2 bit hood.

You actually watct that shit?

Honestly Karen is the main reason i dont even watch 5 mins of it. Id rather watch Big Ang.

cant find anything stating Junior is in jail

If you're talking about Hector Pagan i'm not sure if this is the same one but if it is he'll be released in 2014 - http://www.bop.gov/iloc2/InmateFinderSer...mp;x=93&y=4

i dont think thats him because i think HP is in his late 40s

i eat my words.its true,his son in law got the promotion.

What is true? The fact that TG was shelved?

And whose son in law are you referring to that is now Consigliere?

funny story how lana use to beat on him, i also wonder whether he learned that he has to file his taxes to avoid any future tax evasion charges lol

not him, highly doubt he would be in brooklyn

he was never consiglieri.

he got broken from skip.

I still don't follow - Are you saying that Graziano was never Consigliere? What do you mean "he hot broken from skip"?

Also, whose son in law got the promotion? And what promotion are you referring to?

Broken means demoted

Graziano was never the official consigliere and if you look at his indictments he is listed as a capo

I agree. I think Jerry knows his stuff and I think he's getting a bad wrap here. I respect everyone's opinions though

The guy used to be around Rastelli, Mirra and Lefty. He's a big guy.

Tg got demoted to soldier, his son in law is now skipper of the crew. I'm not saying names but its not too hard to figure out who it is.

tg was appointed official consig by massino in feb of 2001 after spero was officially sentenced and told tg of the promotion on a trip to mexico, but you are correct in terms of tg's most recent hierarchical position


out of curiosity, does anybody know who was the colombo member who won the sitdown with tg when tg wanted to whack john pappa and calvin hennigar after they shot up the topless joint?

I read when Lana and Porky divorced TG was in the room doing the negotiation or part of it. LOL

Dap, I looked for an hour googling that sitdown and all I came up with is Colombo reps. No names. Most articles are just the same ones anyways, just reprints. Would be interesting to know why they saved him as he could of ratted. Was the sitdown after the Scopo hit? I always liked TG heard he once he blow torched a victim and drug one behind a car. I am sure someone else did the work probably JR.

^^u serious? lol

porky was/is a ridiculous earner - had freaking pete rose the baseball player as a customer

Yes Ivy posted the burning thing in a Graziano post in July 2011 on here. He would no more on that.



Post #609453
Maybe Ivy can shed some light on that sitdown he is always very up to date with his info. Very well researching by him. JMO

Porky and Joey Vollaro are the biggest bookies in NY!

I mean Tony.

He actually was the consigliere and was indicted as such back in 2002 on two cases in New York and Florida. When he came out of prison his rank had changed to captain and that's what he was indicted as most recently.

Why the rank change is anybody's guess. In my opinion, it probably had something to do with the boss and underboss in the administration he was a part of flipping. Of course, he didn't flip himself and still carried a significant rank as captain, though no longer part of a new administration. But that's apparently changed now with the problems with his former son-in-law and the TV show.

Tony Rabito acted for him right?

yeah i dont recall of the top of my head if it was ever revealed who was that colombo guy who represented them at that sitdown. The Joseph Scopo hit was in october of 1993 and the murder conspiracy/sitdown with tg was in 1994

The Genovese family is said to run the biggest sports book in the New York/New Jersey area.

Yeah, Rabito was indicted as the acting consigliere in 2007.

Vollaro and Porky are the biggest SINGLE bookmakers in ny, more specifically SI. There could be bigger, but not on SI. This much i know...but i agree with u, as a whole genovese has more sports action.

What family are porky and Vollaro from?

Porkys a Bonano.

Vollaro is a Gambino who reports to The Corozzos.

Was he charged in that last indictment against Corozzo's crew?

No. I dont think hes made either

Vollaro flipped and worked for the feds, he never was made


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_Vollaro

His dad, Tony.

here's a little history lesson for everybody on both joseph and his dad anthony

"He wanted to be Michael, but he was a little more Fredo.

Joseph Vollaro, 42, the key witness at the center of the feds' 62-person indictment against the Gambino crime family, was desperate to become a "made man," but he ended up a mob rat.

He was so eager that he even lied on the street about being an anointed Gambino member, according to court records. When his lies got back to his first wife's uncle, "Little Sammy" Corsaro, the No. 2 in the Gambinos' New Jersey hierarchy, he was called on the carpet before John "Jackie Nose" D'Amico and John "Junior" Gotti, the acting bosses.

"Jack D'Amico got in the center of it as the boss, arbitrated it, realized that Joey didn't do anything wrong and just said that's the end of it," Steven Lenehan, a mob associate and federal witness, testified during a mob trial in the 1990s.

Lenehan agreed to set the record straight about Vollaro, the man he helped convict in 1996.

He described Vollaro as "friendly, generous, ambitious and a little gangster crazy."

Vollaro has been described as the head of a trucking company who lucked into his association with Gambino mobsters after meeting capo Nicholas "Little Nick" Corozzo in jail. But he was actually born into a life of crime.

His father, Anthony Vollaro, ran one of the biggest illegal gambling rings in the city, based in the Tottenville section of Staten Island, according to court records.

Anthony Vollaro's operation pulled down "well in excess of $50,000 in a given day," according to the testimony of NYPD Detective Kevin Martin.

"Tony Vollaro was someone of substantial authority in the operation, and Joseph Vollaro, as a result, was also someone with management-level authority," Martin said.

But the younger Vollaro was considered green, and a little over-eager.

"Joey had a tendency to overstep his bounds on occasion," Lenehan testified.

He bragged about having a direct line to the boss, D'Amico. D'Amico was nabbed in the recent FBI sting, and Corozzo remains on the lam in the same case.

In reality, Vollaro worked at the edges of the crime family, steering gamblers in Essex County toward his father's gambling book, according to records.

"He wasn't made because he hadn't established the needed mob political skills he need to navigate the induction process," Lenehan said.

"Another year, two at most, I'd get him primed for the 'jump,' but I flipped."

So did Vollaro. In 2004, he began cooperating with the FBI rather than take a life sentence in prison for possession of 2 kilos of cocaine."

http://www.nypost.com/p/news/regional/item_KuoETgJ9zPDfcs01JYy2zL

Is there another source besides Wikipedia for that information? I tend to mistrust Wiki.

Check the articles underneath the Wiki article. Or read about the 2008 bust in general. Joseph Vollaro was at the heart of the bust. He was a trucking company owner and drug dealer. He met Nicky Corozzo in prison.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/09/nyregi...ref=slogin&

Operation Old Bridge wasn't it?

Exactly, most wiki articles have citations nowadays.

still cant find anything regarding Junior in jal

They have spoken about it a few times on mob wives, he got kicked out of wpp for lying about his crimes but is still in jail somewhere and supposedly getting out. I am pretty sure Capeci mentioned it in passing in one of his old columns about the case/mob wives.