Henry Hill

Some questions, given that Henry Hill was noted to be a bit of a liar...

1) Was he really as close to Paul Vario as he claimed? In the book and in the film, Paulie seems to view him almost as something like a son.

2) Was Paul Vario himself as big a bigshot as he's described, wth hundreds of guys reporting to him?

3) Is it honestly realistic that an un-made associate could live as luxuriously as Henry is portrayed as living, even if the local Capo or Boss had him in his favor?

4) Why didn't the Mob ever put out a contract on Henry after he flipped? His whereabouts were pretty well known after he got kicked out of the Witness Protection Program so I'm surprised no up and comer tried to take him out after Goodfellas came out or that a guy like John Gotti didn't put a price on his head.

5) How much of Hill's story is fact and how much is fiction? Were Jimmmy Burke and Tommy D as crazy, respected and feared as portrayed?

6) Henry went back and forth on claiming murder; He sometimes claimed he'd killed people other times said he never did. What do you guys think? Do you think Henry ever killed anyone on Paulie's or Jimmy's orders?

yes.

yes.

yes.

what good would it do?

he has been known to exagerate, but as far as tommy, yes. jimmy was a bigger gangster in real life than the movie.lol

the only thing i ever believed is that he was there.

Agree with everything that sit says. I think Henry was a huge exaggerator but I think he kept it pretty straight when talking about that moment of his life. Jimmy Burke was a significant figure.

yeah, Jimmy was the real deal and Tommy was real crazy by all accounts.

It's an interesting lifes story at the minimum....

vario was one of the biggest 'g's in that family.and thats saying a lot. he had like what,a dozen guys in his crew at one time? say ten guys'on the record' with each guy and, yeah, i can see a hundred guys 'technically' answering to him. but this isnt a gang of hundreds of hardened criminals. its the milk man who needed a 'friend' to help him collect on a winning number ticket. or, to use the movie, a restaurant owner who needs to collect a tab.plus he had union business and 'rights' to jfk. definately, a 'power house'.

He was too high profile at that point. It would have been suicidal to clip a rat as famous as Hill at that point.

We've touched on this many times before, but there's really no upside to killing a rat after he testifies. The damage is already done and you run the risk of really pissing off the Feds. This isn't Sicily (or even Canada).

If you can get to a guy before he testifies, that's one thing. To clip him afterwards has very little upside. And forget about that "sending a message" nonsense. Who wants to send a message if the price you pay is life in jail for your entire crew?

shows what a moron gotti was for sending guys after gravano.

i love watching these documentaries where someone says 'the mafia has placed a twenty million dollar bounty on his head'lol! hell if there was even the slightest chance of getting paid that much i wouldve popped gravano myself.

1. Yes, He grew up around Paul Vario and learned from him. He worked with other people when he later grew up but he still stuck with Paul for family dinings, etc..

2. Someone who was a made man, a captain, and later the consigliere of the Lucchese crime family.. well, I wouldn't say he had 10 people reporting to him.

3. Henry knew people who had money, he was around the big money makers and the big people who could give him a loan or something like that. Henry was a good money maker himself and whenever money wasn't in his pocket, He would go out and rob with his friends.

4. I agree with you. They should of hired a thug to do it and they did know where he was about but Henry co-operated valuable history to the feds and his reward was protection. Even if Henry was killed by a random, the feds would suspect LCN of doing it and would come down hard. They would go through their bills which they all probably didn't pay, and they knew their businesses. The feds can intimidate as good as The Mob.

6. Henry probably did kill someone for Jimmy or Paulie. It said at the ending that Jimmy never asked Hill to do a hit though Henry more than likely did.

you cant count to save your life.lol.

He didn't have hundreds of guys reporting to him, but he was as big as they come and he was well respected by the other Families. They'd use Vario as an arbitrator in disputes, and that is saying a lot!

Little bit off topic but Jimmy Burke died when he was 64 and would of got out 8 years later when he would of been 72. Do you think he would've had a role with the Luchesses? Or do you think he would be retired

Well, he sure as fuck wouldn't have taken a job at Wal Mart .

I'm just kidding, buddy. Jimmy was hardcore. Crime is all he knew. Luccheses, or independent of the Luccheses, he would have gone right back to doing what he did all his life.

I for one would have loved to seen Jimmy Burke as the door greeter at Walmart...

"Welcome ta fuckin' Walmart youse! Hey you - yeah you - dat your new caddy?!? What I tell you, huh?!? Is dat a fur coat?!? Don't buy nuttin! Don't spend crazy - you're gonna get us all pinched!!!"

pizza guy is it true that Joe Pesci caught his break as an actor working in a pizza parlor? A pal of the ol mans told me this and he done a bit of work in the industry, some big movies but small parts told me this story when we were doing a job together around 96-98. Just come back to me. Heard a scout was in the place and Joe Pesci was doing his thing and the guy just said "I've gotta hire him".

Not sure what point in his career this was but if I remember the story correctly it was early 80's. Before Raging Bull I think or before his big break whenever that was.

i think it was a restaurant actually,but yeah.

He was working as a singing waiter at Mario's on Arthur Avenue, Sean. And that is indeed a fact .

I heard that Imamobguy discovered Pesci and introduced him to his many Hollywood friends including Scorsese & De Niro...

What side of town? You remember?

marios.thats 'p.p.'s place isnt it pizza?

No, his place is across the street. It's called Rigoletto.

That's exactly how he told me it went down just like that. Thanks pizzaguy.

No problem, Dude .

pizza-who did he come up around? hes what about 65 or 70?

Late 60s. Not quite 70. He was real close to Larry Black and the Westside crew in Westchester. Mainly Yonkers. But he ended up with the Bronx. Him and Angelo (who was originally an East Harlem guy, no less). Very confusing, I know .

gotcha.'p' took over from larry black?and east harlem was trigger mike before fat tony correct? this the same angelo that oversaw the newark crew?

Yup. That's pretty good for a Brooklyn guy .

hey i got around in my day.lol.

I know you did. I'm just having some fun .

this reminds me of how crazy it was for Roy Demeo & Vito Arena to hit Patrick Penny in May 1980 for accidentally witnessing/testifying against Nino Gaggi in the October 1979 Eppolito hit... Penny came back to BK when he should't have but the Brooklyn D.A.'s office was kind of reckless too I think.

Also, for all books and other writing about 'the Mafia cops,' I'm unaware of anyone expanding on Patrick Penny and Louie Eppolito; "Mafia Cop" the book mentions Penny but doesn't even note he got fucking whacked. (Would love to see the OCHUr report on the Penny job someday.)

Well said Pizzaboy. I think that often gets overlooked - the getting to him before the testifying.