Chicago Outfit: The 28 members

Does anybody know who all 28 government recognized made Outfit members were as of the Family Secrets trial, Who were they and how many have died since?,besides Al Tornabene

There are some OK-ish charts floating around that will give you as good an idea as you're going to get. Check out Scott Burnstein's chart. It's not literal, IMO, i.e. characterzing all of those people as "soldiers" as if they're out there every day doing the Outfit's dirty work, IMO, is not accurate at all.

But if will give you a fair idea of who's involved... a lot of them are dead since that chart was put out though.

Yeah I was looking at that and I agree very exaggerated, What I got from it wasn't anything new really I got The Brothers DiFrinzo John,Peter,and Joe,plus Andriachi,Mattassa,Cullotta,Magnafichi,Fratto,James Indecino,Chris Spina,and some guys Scalise,and Sal DeLaurentis as well plus 3 Caruso's and possibly D'Amico and Sarno all in all thats that's a max of 17 and Tornabene who's dead and te three Jailbirds Lombardo,Marcello,an Calabrese ,Who's the other ten the government supposedly knows and we don't

This is from some posters particularly Pete83 and McScott on the other side.

Andriacchi and Joe Kong Cullotta are both sick with cancer and are inactive/retired Fratto seems to be on the outs with the higher ups since his conviction and hasnt been that active in Elmwood Park for years. He operates his extorion rackets mostly in the western suburbs Pudgy Matassa was never the boss of Cicero. He drives around Solly D on his daily rounds

Boss John Difronzo Street Boss Vacant (Rumored to be either Solly C Cautadella or Solly D Delaurentis but no official word yet) Consiglieri Marco D'amico

Elmwood Park Boss Peter Difronzo

Grand Avenue Boss Albert Vena

Cicero Boss Salvatore Delaurentis

Chinatown Boss Frank Toots Caruso

Also interesting to note is the old wild bunch crew seems to still be active with Jimmy Inendino being the head of that faction. they are a subcrew of Cicero though as they always were.

Caporegimes: Elmwood Park Peter “Greedy Petey” Di Fronzo Crew Street Boss Rudy “The Chin/Uncle Rudy” Fratto (will be replaced by Don Scalise while locked up) & Michael “Mikey Mags/Good Looking Mike” Magnaficchi MP/Cicero/Lake Cty John “Pudgy” Matassa, Jr. Crew Street Boss Michael “Fat Mikey/The Beard” Sarno James “Jimmy the Ice Pick/Jimmy I” Inendino Michael “Big Mike” Spano West Side Joseph “Joe Kong” Cullotta Crew Street Boss Christopher “Christy the Nose” Spina South Side Frank “Tootsie Babe” Caruso Crew Street Boss Leo Caruso/Bruno Caruso

Soldiers (star by name denotes higher status than others) Joe Abate – West Side* Joe Albano – South Side Robert “Bobby the Truck Driver/Bobby A” Abbinanti – Elmwood Park * Andy Affrunti – Melrose Park Anthony Alemam – Melrose Park * Frank Amabile – Melrose Park Joe Amabile – Melrose Park Jimmy Amabile – Melrose Park Ralph Amadeo – Melrose Park Tony Andriacchi – Elmwood Park * Donnie Andriacchi –Elmwood Park * Bobby Angelo – South Side Constance “Connie” Antongiovanni – West Side Michael Annecca, Sr – West Side Michael Annecca, Jr – West Side Joey Annecca – West Side Victor “Popeye” Arigo – Elmwood Park * Vince Auriema – Melrose Park Paul Balzano – South Side Phil Balzano – South Side Fred Barbara – South Side * Dominic “The Brow” Barbaro – South Side * Dominic Basso – Elmwood Park/FLA * Vincent Basso – Elmwood Park * Joey Bastone – Melrose Park* James Bastone – Melrose Park* Tommy Battaglia – Melrose Park* Chris Battaglia – Melrose Park* Joe Beli – South Side Robert “Bobby the Gabeet” Bellavia – Melrose Park (imprisoned) * Charles “Chuckie B” Bellavia – Melrose Park* Phil Bertucci – South Side Anthony Biancofiore – Elmwood Park Tommy Billante - West Side Mike Blasi – Melrose Park Robert Bonamici – West Side Joe Bonavolante -South Side Mike Botica - West Side Roland “Ricky B” Borelli – Elmwood Park * Louie Borselino – South Side Nick Boscarino – Melrose Park* Joe Bova - Melrose Park Salvatore Brocato – Elmwood Park Joe Broccio - Melrose Paek Albert Bruno – West Side Jimmy Buonomo – Elmwood Park Dominic Buscemi – South Side Frank “Frankie Breeze” Calabrese – South Side (imprisoned) * Anthony “Tough Tony” Calabrese – South Side (imprisoned) * Mike Canazero – Elmwood Park Jimmy Capasso - South Side John “Cappy” Capodice – South Side* Tommy Capione - Wesr Side Michael “Mikey Beef” Caracci – Elmwood Park Richard Carbonaro – Melrose Park Salvatore “Sammy Cards” Cardella – South Side Leonard Cardone – Elmwood Park Mike Carioscia – Melrose Park * Pasquale “Pasty” Carioscia – Melrose Park Peter “Bushy” Caruso – South Side* Morris “Mutt” Caruso – South Side* Frank “Little Frankie” Caruso, Jr – South Side* Anthony Carvotta – South Side Angelo “The Angel” Cassano – Elmwood Park* Dominic “Mennie” Cassano – Elmwood Park* Gino “Mean Gene” Cassano – Elmwood Park* Vito “Pops” Cassano – Elmwood Park* Bobby Cassimiro - South Side Ronnie Castaldo – Elmwood Park Joe Castaldo – Elmwood Park Nicky Castaldo – Elmwood Park Gerry Castino - South Siude Salvatore “Solly C” Cataudella – South Side* Nicholas “Nicky C” Catuadella – South Side* Frank “Frankie the Gunner” Catapano – Elmwood Park* Richard “Richie the Cat” Catazone – South Side* Don “Donnie the Cat” Catazone – South Side* Joe Caulderello – West Side* Robery Cechini – Melrose Park* Salvatore Cecola – West Side/LV* Anthony Cerco – South Side/LV Anthony Cerone – Elmwood Park* James Cerone – Elmwood Park* John “Little Jackie” Cerone, Jr. – Elmwood Park* Charles “Chuckie C” Cesario Frank Ciangi – South Side Angelo Ciaravino – South Side Virgil “The Truck” Cimino – Melrose Park* Joe Ciolino – Melrose Park Anthony “Tony Sip” Cipriani - Elmowood Park Anthony “Tony Sing Sing/Tony Julian” Ciragani – Melrose Park* Rocco “The Biker” Circelli – Melrose Park* Nino Cisternino – Elmwood Park* Joe Cocco – South Side Frank Colanani – Melrose Park John Coli - South Side Mike Coli -South Side Billy Coli - Soyuth Side Jimmy Colucci - South Side Jimmy Coniglio – Melrose Park* Jimmy Contis – Melrose Park* Ralph Contacessi – South Side Pete Costello – South Side Tommy Covello – West Side* Ronnie Covello – West Side* Carl Covelli - Melrose Park Bobby Covone – Melrose Park Phil Cozzo – West Side* Sam Cozzo – West Side* John Credidio – South Side* Ronnie Crevilone* - west Side Albert Cundari – Elmwood Park* Billy Cundari – Elmwood Park* Butch Cundari – Elmwood Park* Joey Cussamano – Las Vegas* Joe Cutrano – South Side Guy D’amico – Elmwood Park* William “Little Willie/Small Fry Willie” Daddano, Jr. – Melrose Park* Louis “Louie Lips” Daddano – Melrose Park* John Dadanno – Melrose Park* Richard Dazzo – Elmwood Park Richard De Angelo - South Side Butch De Angelis – Elmwood Park Salvatore “Sammy Powder” De Cesare – Elmwood Park Anthony De Core – Elmwood Park Anthony De Falco Salvatore “Solly D/Sal the Pizza Man” De Laurentis – Melrose Park * Mario De Marco – Elmwood Park Frank De Rosa – Melrose Park* Ronnie De Rosa – Melrose Park* Richard “Richie the Mouse/Mousie” De Santis – South Side* Ronnie De Santis Salvatore “Little Sam” De Stefano – Elmwood Park Dominic De Silvio Matt De Vito – Elmwood Park Joey De Vita – Arizona* Paul Di Caro – South Side Charles “Charlie Specs” Di Caro – South Side* Joseph “Joe the Spider” Di Caro – South Side* Frank “Frankie 51” Di Constanza – South Side* Dominic “Captain D” Di Fazio – South Side * Joe Di Fronzo – Elmwood Park* James Di Guillo – Melrose Park Dominic Di Maggio – Melrose Park* Nick Di Maggio – Melrose Park* Louie Di Riggi – Elmwood Park* William “Billy D” Dileniemo – Elmwood Park Jimmy D’melio – Elmwood Park (former cop/electronics expert) Renato “Ray Ray” Di Silvestro – Las Vegas* William Di Domenico – South Side* Jimmy Di Domenico – South Side* Vincent Di Varco – Elmwood Park* Robert Dinella – South Side* Ralph Dolendi – Elmwood Park Robert “Bobby D” Dominic – Melrose Park* Joe Donzelli – LV Anthony “Tony Seymour/Tony D” Dote – Elmwood Park* Carl “CD” Dote – Elmwood Park* Vincenzo Ercolino (Italy/Sicily)* Nick Falzone Romeo “Flap Jack” Familynappi – South Side* Frank “Frankie Pasta” Esposito – West Side* Richard Ferraro, Jr. – South Side Gerry Ferraro – South Side Nick Ferriola – South Side* Rocco Fillipino Phil “Philly Boy” Fiore – South Side* Vincent Fiorlano* Tommy Fiorlano* Joseph “Joe Pep” Forienza - Rockford Peter Frigo John “Tiger” Frisella – Rockford Mike Fusco – Elmwood Park (narcotics) Joe Gallo – South Side Natala Galluzzo - Rockford Salvatore Galluzzo – Rockford Anthony Garipo – Melrose Park Jerry Gasparini – Elmwood Park Richard Gelsomino – Elmwood Park (narcotics) FRank "The Fireman" Geraci - Rockford Gary Gilberto – Elmwood Park Michael “Mikey Jaws” Giorgano – Elmwood Park/FLA* Gary “Little Gags” Gagliano – Elmwood Park* William Galioto – Melrose Park* Sam Galioto – Melrose Park* John Galioto – Melrose Park* Robert Garippo Richard “Richie G” Gervasio* Anthony Giannone Nick Gironda – South Side Frank “Frankie Gig” Granata, Jr. – South Side* Joseph “Joe Glasses” Greico – Melrose Park* Mike Greico – Melrose Park* Frank “Frankie Drywall” Guidice – South Side* Tommy Guiliano* Chris Guiliano * Michael “Mickey the Gorilla” Gurgone – South Side* Sammy Gurgone – South Side* Jimmy Gurgone – South Side* Chris Guzaldo Phil Guzzino Nicholas “Jumbo” Guzzino – South Side* Dominic Guzzino - South Side Roland Ignoffo – Elmwood Park* Jimmy Iannantone – South Side Anthony “Tony Peaches” Imperato – South Side* Frank “Frankie Cigars” Imperato – South Side* Ernest “Rocky” Infelice – Former UB (imprisoned)* Sam “Sammy I” Inendino – Melrose Park* Tintner Inserro – Melrose Park Anthony Juliano Pietro “Mustache Pete” La Balestra – Elmwood Park (narcotics)* John Di Giglio* John La Mana Mike La Mantia – Elmwood Park Rocco La Mantina – South Side Richard La Mantina – South Side Richard Lantini – Elmwood Park (narcotics) Joe La Scola John La Placa Nick Lamonica John Lanno Antillio Lavorata Sam Lenocci Geno Levato Anthony Lo Cocco Joseph "Joey the Clown" Lombardo - West Side Rocco Lombardo – West Side/LV* Joseph “Little Joe” Lombardo – West Side* Dominic Longo Ralph Madia – South Side* Bruno Mancari – South Side* Pete Mancari – South Side* Al Mancini – Elmwood Park Robert Mangiamele – South Side* Dominic Mangiamele – South Side* Joe Mangiamele – South Side* Anthony Maggio – Elmwood Park Mike Maglieri – South Side Mike Malmenato – West Side* Frank Marasso – South Side Frank “Frankie Frankenstein” Maranto – Elmwood Park* James “Jimmy the Man/Little Jimmy” Marcello – Melrose Park (imprisoned)* Rocco Marcello – Melrose Park* Michael “Big Mickey/Bozo” Marcello – Melrose Park (imprisoned)* Chris Marcotte Dino Marino – Melrose Park* Louis “Louie Tomatoes” Marino – Melrose Park (imprisoned) Charlie Marzano – Melrose Park* Ralph Mascio Thomas “Skinny Tommy” Matassa – Melrose Park* Francis “Patty May” Mazza – Elmwood Park* Joe “Joey May” Mazza – Elmwood Park* Pete Mazullo Lou Mazzei Anthony Menolocino – Elmwood Park Phil Mesi – Elmwood Park Clement “Big Clem” Messino – Elmwood Park* Christopher “Little Dickie” Messino – Elmwood Park* Danny Milano Carmen Miglori – Elmwood Park* Alphonse Mitria Sam Molosi Bruno Monaco August “Little Augie” Monteleone Lou Morelli Ray Morelli Tommy Moretti – Elmwood Park* Leonard Muscia Saverio Mussilanni Robert “Louie the Lmb” Musserino* Romeo Nappi – SoutJh Side Joe Napoli – Stone Park PD Robert Natale – Melrose Park* Tommy Navigato – Elmwood Park Paul Nicolosi John Nitti – West Side* Nick Nitti, jr.* Orlando Nudo – Elmwood Park Joe Oliveri – South Side Cosmo Orlando Joseph “Joe Popeye” Pacella – South Side Jimmy Pacella – South Side Billy Pacella – South Side Frank Palaggi Mike Palermo – South Side Skippy Palermo – South Side Frank Pannos – West Side* Louie Pannos – West Side* Robert Panozzo Charles “Dapper Charlie/Handsome Charlie” Parilli – West Side* Louie Parilli – West Side* Fred Pascente – West Side* Joseph “Joey Grapes/Joey Pooch” Pasucci – South Side* Michael “Mikey Pooch” Pasucci – South Side* Dane Passo – West Side* Al Pavone – South Side* Frank Peccia – Elmwood Park Rocco Pelletieri – South Side* Tommy Pennavaria – Elmwood Park Sam “Blackie” Pesoli – Elmwood Park* Vito Pesoli – Elmwood Park* Lee Pesoli – Elmwood Park* Mike Petruzzi – Melrose Park (former top Tornabene lieutenant)* Lawrence “Hungry Larry” Petitt – Elmwood Park* Joe Pettit – Elmwood Park* Anthony Petronella Ralph Pezuso – South Side Tommy Piazzo – South Side Aldo “Junior” Piscitteli – South Side* Vic Plescia Phil Ponto – West Side Francesco Portera – Elmwood Park Bernard “Bernie Press” Prestigiacomo – Elmwood Park* Michael “Mikey Press” Prestigiacomo - Elmwood Park Bobby Pullia – Melrose Park* Tommy Pullia – Melrose Park* Richard Randazzo – South Side (narcotics) Sam Ranola – South Side Frank Reda – South Side Nick Regilio Roger Riccio – West Side* Frank Riggio Ricky Rinelli – South Side Vito Rizzo – Elmwood Park Rick Rizzulo – LV Ralph Rizzolo – LV Dominic Romanazzi Al Rosetti – South Side* Mike Rossi Bruno “The Bomber” Roti – South Side* Fred Roti – South Side* Jimmy Roti – South Side* Frank Roti – South Side* Salvatore Rotundo Carmen Russo Freddy Russo Anthony Russo Anthony Sabbia – South Side Anthony Sanello – Elmwood Park* Natale Saraceno – Elmwood Park* Vito Salamone - South Side Joe Salamone - South Side Joseph “Big Joe/Joe Sal” Saladino – Rockford John “Johnny Finooch” Salamone – Rockford Pete Salanardi Rosario “Ray” Salerno – Elmwood Park Robert “Bobby the Boxer” Salerno – Melrose Park* John Sansone Nick Sarillio – Elmwood Park* Dominic Scalfaro – South Side Terry Scalise – South Side* Charlie Scalise – South Side* Jerome “Jerry the Hand” Scalise – South Side (semi-retired)* Tommy Scalise Don “Donnie the Sponge” Scalise – Elmwood Park* John Scardina – Melrose Park John Sciacatta Larry Scialabba – Melrose Park* Peter “Chicago Pete/The Music Man” Schivarelli – South Side* Mike “Little Ike” Schivarelli – South Side* Emil Schulo – Melrose Park Ralph Scorpio – West Side Mike Segretti – Elmwood Park John Serpico – Melrose Park John Simonelli Anthony Solano – Elmwood Park* Sam Somenzi – Elmwood Park Joe Spagnola – Elmwood Park Michael “Little Mikey” Spano, Jr. – Melrose Park* Paul Spano – Melrose Park* Joe Spano – Melrose Park* Steve Spano – Melrose Park* Joe Spatuzza – Elmwood Park Anthony “Smiling Tony” Spavone – Elmwood Park* Anthony Spillone Vito Spillone Mike Spingola Richard “Richie Spits” Spizzieri – Melrose Park* John “Johnny Spits” Spizzieri – Melrose Park* Pasquale Spizzinoco – Elmwood Park Ronnie Stella – Elmwood Park Pete Storino – South Side Victor “Fat Vic” Stramaglio – West Side* John Taglianetti – West Side Michael “The Nephew/Handsome Mike” Talerico – South Side* Joe Talerico – South Side* William “Louie the Printer/Big Louie” Tenuta Ray Tominello – South Side/FLA* Ray Tornabene – Melrose Park* Steve Torrello Carmine Trombetta – LV Robert “Bobby U” Urbinatti Gil Valerio Carmen Vece – retired Melrose Park PD Albert “The Falcon” Vena – West Side* Joe Venezia – Melrose Park* Michael “Mickey V” Ventresca – Elmwood Park Bruce Ventura Vic Vita – Melrose Park* Dana Vivano – South Side Sam “Sammy the Blaster” Voldepresto – Melrose Park* Joe Volpe – Elmwood Park* Pete Volpe – Melrose Park Santo Volpe – Melrose Park Dominic Volpe – Elmwood Park Joe Zeno – Elmwood Park Michael “A-I Mike” Zitello – Elmwood Park

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Great post Dapper
I've heard Andriacchi was sick but never knew Culotta was sick.
I can't find links about either of them. Does anyone have one?
As you can see there's way more than 28

Cool post Dapper!thanx

Now dap how many of those are "soldiers" per say? Ivy has told me the outfit only has 28 formally made members left aka they had a ceremony and what not

123, i wasnt the one who made this list just sharing. I am aware the Outfit started using the formal making ceremony much later than most.

I was only wondering due to the fact that it seemed like a lot of guys for Chicago

Thanks for the post, dapper.

Who had the ceremony or not is a very confusing thing with the outfit. IIRC, Carlisi started it when he was boss, then it was kept on and who knows if it even still happens. So lots of old guys never got it, so who knows all had "the ceremony".

IMO, if i were boss, haha, I would have stopped it. There is no other competition in Chicago. Only one family, so no need for lots of official soldiers. Those in the know, know whose who. So having a ceremony only adds to "made" guys and people talking about it. And targets from the FBI.

Better to be thought to have 10 made guys than 100. Now, i have no idea if this is true, just my two cents.

yeah, i suspect most of the vast majority of those guys listed arent made with the formal ceremony but might be influential, the guys who are made have the * next to their name.

interesting. i literally know next to nothing about chicago. i always thought they did the ceremony different over there.

Nice post, Dapper. Most of it is fairly accurate. I will say that Elmwood & Cicero can basically considered separate families altogether though at this point, with Grand & Chinatown being considered their own families as well, albeit on a much smaller scale. that's the way Aiuppa set it up.

I'd also personally place Inendino higher up than Solly D down there.

Elmwood park is the only crew/family that doesn't make members anymore.

And Christy fuckin spina is not even a top three in his own crew, let alone a top guy in the entire fuckin outfit lol. anyone going by what the feds say is a goof, they literally have no clue as to what they're talking about.

So Rico what guy in Chicago do you think has the most power?

That's so difficult to say. Naturally you would say Johnny Bananas or his brother, or Inendino or solly d, but there are bookies like Marco Damico who have far larger net worths than both those guys. Grand avenue is by far the weakest crew at this point, so it wouldn't be anyone from there.

Who's strongest? Southside? Elmwood? Cicero?.

And what crew would say is scariest or most violent today

Elmwood is primarily white collar, so if you're talking legitimate business, yes they are the most powerful. Cicero is by far the largest and most feared, and they handle the majority of street level stuff. Chinatown & grand are incomparable to both Cicero and Elmwood, but Chinatown is by far larger and more powerful than grand.

What ever happened to the chicago heights and rush street crews?

So who would make a guy Into let's say the Cicero faction Marcello? and is thier any member who has been rumored to be inducted under Marcello or even DiFronzo previously ?

Marcello, Inendino, and the rest of the Cicero upper echelon made over twenty members during the early 2000s. Their names are not known, but there have been rumoured to have been some very young men that were in that group.

@eyes, Chicago heights is most certainly still active. Very little is known about that crew. Rush street was sanctioned into Elmwood, as was Melrose park.

Dapper, awesome post. The most comprehensive view of the Outfit I've seen.

Impressive chart. Kudos to the one who made it. However, only a small fraction of the guys listed are formally inducted made members, the rest are associates. Also, I´m not sure everybody on the list is still alive today.

No way that chart is even remotely accurate, people love to live in a dream world and make out the Outfit still are a big family.

If the feds say 28, I'd believe that over the chart.

The Feds have always been a couple years behind. 28 is way low. There are more than 28 guys on the deck at The Grotto some nights. Ricobenes do you know anything about a crew operating in Valpo? Is that part of Chicago Heights? Thanks.

the chart is accurate tommy, look at the paragraph of members dapper posted

I'd like to believe you but I can't, so why is it accurate? Just because it was made by a guy on the internet?

All we can do to speculate how many members a family has is google searching articles and looking for indictments I'm afraid and trying to get any info we can.

The feds know at least 90% of made members in every crime family, I believe that 28-40 is accurate.

Why should I believe there are 70+ made guys?

The guys with the * are the confirmed made guys from my knowledge, probably number around 40. The 28 member figure was from 2007.

Im thinking around 30 made and perhaps an additional ten who have the status but no ceremony ie Sarno,Feriolla,etc

even if the some guys are not made they have the power/influence of some soldiers.

Sorry, but you're wrong, bud. The feds don't know much at all, actually. Maybe in NY cause guys are flipping right & left & getting caught with their dick out, but 90% in Chicago where nobody talks & nobody gets arrested is ridiculous. These are the same feds that legitimately thought Joe fucking Lombardo was the head of the outfit, when in reality, he ran its weakest crew. 40-50 made guys is a very low estimate.

For the last time nick ferriola has no status lol

@fried yes the valparaiso area & any type of gambling in Indiana, along with the casinos out there, belong mainly to the Heights. I personally know absolutely nothing about that family, other than they mainly deal with each other now, and sometimes Cicero.

I get a little lost when people refer to separate families in the Outfit. Are these 'families' not just autonomous crews? How was a split in to multiple 'families' allowed to happen. Thanks

Okay Barrett, excellent question, and I will try & explain this fascinating situation as best I can:

During the Outfit's arguable peak (the Giancana period), it was ran as one family. Sure, it was much larger, & there were more crews than the current 5, but no matter what happened, Ricca/Giancana had a final say in pretty much everything that took place. This proved detrimental, obviously, to the Outfit's longevity & well being, so during the mid to late 70s, Aiuppa/Cerone/Accardo constructed a different type of system, one where each crew was separately insulated and an entity unto itself, a "family", if you will, with Cicero & Elmwood Park being the two heaviest of these families, and Grand Ave, Chinatown, & the Heights being the three sub families, which continues to this day. Aiuppa also implemented people he trusted at the head of each family. In doing this, he allowed the outfit much more breathing room and insulation. LaPietra, Lombardo, Cerone, etc were all technically beneath Aiuppa & his Cicero family, but ran their own crews as if they were separate families entirely. IE, if you were/are a Chinatown soldier, you have no business fraternizing with an Elmwood soldier. You deal with members of your own family & answer to your boss. Likewise, the boss of, say, Grand Ave doesn't have to get everything okd by the top boss. He controls is crew as if it were his own private family, obtains much more power/control/responsibility. Families were in turn almost encouraged to not associate with members of other families, very similar to the NY set up, obviously on a much smaller, more secretive scale. Hope that helps, any other questions, please ask.

hey rico does the outfit involved with any families in other cities or is it just chicago area today?

Sure they do

Which ones might I ask? I could see something like Gary, Indiana but I thought they were long defunct in places like Omaha, Des Moines, Milwaukee, and Vegas where they once had crews.

Doubt they have anything in Gary. Almost all black there

Nothing is ever defunct in Vegas lol, especially these days with how gigantic it is, they're still out there. LA area as well as San Diego, and KC, MO, Cleveland, and I'm sure some guys rub elbows with ny & philly/ny guys, but that's nothing new. Outfit has always had heavy interests in Mexico, Caribbean, central America, and especially aruba and south America as well.

I must remind you guys that Rico was caught lying recently. Just saying...

No I wasn't, al capone is my cousin haha we went to da bears game on Sunday. This clown just crawls right out of the woodwork ehh

That´s funny! Where have you been the last two weeks or so? I bet you´ve been lurking around in the dark but haven´t been able to post. Howcome?
And yes, you were caught lying. How can you deny that?

Where have I been? What the hell kind of question is that? What do you care? First you want to know where I "get my information from", then what I do during my spare time. What's next? Want my address & telephone number? And I don't recall ever lying. I do, however, recall clowning on some puny little goofball though, that I remember...

Sorry guys but yall sound like a couple! kidding!cheers

Ricobenes comes across as a blatant liar to me, giving out all this information like there facts when he has no proof.

Let me guess, your from Chicago Rico? Just because Chicago is now one of the smaller families you try and make things up, very sad individual.

Well, he´s certainly an individual who´s got his facts wrong that´s for sure.

Rico, you are still not going to answer any of my questions are you? Being defensive does not help you in any way, I can tell you that. Why don´t you just admit that your sources are in fact crazy ideas popping up in your head while reading comic books and taking baths?
You are living in a fantasy world, pretending to be a wiseguy who knows stuff about the outfit just because you "heard things on the street". It´s time to wake up and smell the coffey my friend. Get back to reality, get real and stop bullshitting about the outfit being an all mighty gang with pull throughout the US, Mexico, Carribean, Central America etc. You look like a fool.

One more thing. I hope I´m not hurting your feelings...but Giancana was a muppet!

Giancana was a muppet alright,BUT one of the best muppets around at the time

I want to add something about the Giancana situation...yes Giancana was a muppet but the Chi Outfit made a LOT of money and international connections during Mooneys reign,so the real boss of the Outfit after Capone till 1972 was RICCA.After Ricca's death a lot of his proteges were eliminated,including Giancana for what ever reasons.

Supposedly Frank Nitti was boss after capone until his suicide apparently to avoid prison because he was claustrophobic .

I always thought Ricca and Accardo were of equal status in the Outfit?

This is just my opinion...you can read in many Chi Outfit books or docs or what ever,that on the meetings Ricca always had the last word.I remember Chuck Giancana sayin in his book that even as kids they knew that Ricca was the real thing not Nitti,now why would he lie about that?!.My opinion is that Nitti was a front boss for the Chi commission.Ricca and Accardo were the young turks,takin over things at the time.One time Ricca went to jail and Accardo busted his ass of work to get Ricca out,so what does that tell ya?!

I like how you start off by saying it's your opinion then present it as fact . Anyway...you're probably right i barely know anything about Chicago haven't read any books on them. I probably hearrd that in a cheesy documentary

Youre not the first one sayin that but...what can i do?!

Okay is this hairyknuckles guy the officially appointed thread derailer around here or something? Just constantly sticking his nose where he knows he's not welcomed. Am I getting what do you people call it, trolled and I didn't even know it? Hahahaha

Guys, take this stuff off the boards. If you can't speak to each other civilly then ignore each other.

Toodoped no offense pal you seem like a nice guy but you're completely lost

Yes camarel nitti certainly became boss after capone left, and was really the top guy during capones last few years. Nitti was really a very intelligent, rational guy, and I believe would have became the long reigning boss with Ricca by his side. Ricca said he learned a lot of his aesthetics from Nitti. But like you said, the can was just too much for him, and he would have rather died than flipped, Chicago style

No Accardo was never, ever on the level of Ricca haha, and they were never young turks together. Accardo was a mid level level Taylor street guy that moved up to the Patch (grand ave) during the prime of Taylor st & Giancana/Ricca's 42 Gang. It then became Taylor St. vs Grand Ave during that period back then, with Accardo/Cerone heading Grand Ave (the weaker crew) & Giancana/Ricca controlling Taylor st, which was the absolutely powerhouse. Giancana was Paul's protege, and Jackie Cerone was Accardo's. There was a ton of hate on Grand Ave & Cicero back then because they were the two weakest crews, and it ended coming back to bite Sam in the ass when he came home, as Aiuppa's Cicero had ironically become the dominant crew in a very short period of time (joey o was one power hungry guy). Things changed rather quickly & drastically when Giancana went away & Aiuppa was free to place his trusted Cicero guys where old Taylor st guys previously sat pretty. Chinatown is a prime example of that. Hope that helps.

Also don't be ridiculous the outfit isn't some mega gang that controls various parts of the world. They just aren't as tiny as some of you might think. They have interests & a few guys here & there throughout the places I mentioned haha, its not like they're controlling cocaine distribution in Venezuela or something pfffhahahaha

SC understood buddy I'm done with this specimen hahaha

On the chart it says they have operatives in Italy. Is that true?

First of all thanx for the compliments,second i dont agree on the part that Ricca and the others learned a lot from Nitti,they considered him as an idiot and third...who the f**k sad somethin about the present outfit?!Im talkin about the past,the Giancana times and yes,in thouse times they couldve improt cocaine even from Venezuela if they wanted to

Eyes, yes I'm sure that's true.

Also no one ever considered frank Nitti an idiot honestly where in shit's name do you kids come up with this crapola?

And I wasn't responding to you with the modern outfit stuff, that was someone else. Other people post here......crazy right?

Also don't be ridiculous the outfit isn't some mega gang that controls various parts of the world. They just aren't as tiny as some of you might think. They have interests & a few guys here & there throughout the places I mentioned haha, its not like they're controlling cocaine distribution in Venezuela or something pfffhahahaha

^^^ Who are you refering to here?

"Import cocaine" Hahaha "yes ill have seventy kilos of fishscale, please. That will be debit"

I don't know, I forget, someone who got their panties bunched up on the last page, I'm starting to lose count haha!!!!

You like to fly dont you?

I like traveling

I like strip clubs.Say hello to your family from me. im off!cheers

have you seen this chart ricobenes?
http://img823.imageshack.us/img823/7967/outfitt.gif

Chicago has always had a relationship with Detroit as well. There is a Detroit solider living in the West Burbs of Chicago, but I don't know the arrangement the families have together.

Ahh I'm on the mobile Eyes, it won't load. Who made it and how old is it??

scott burnstein in 2010

I'm sure its the same as Cleveland or anywhere else, Fried. Couple guys rubbing elbows & breaking bread. Remember people saying "oh Cleveland is dead, collinwood is dead" and then the Fratto taps get revealed & turns out, WRONG, hahahah

Rico,

Couple of questions for you. Does the Chinatown crew have the River North area? A lot of bars, restaurants, properties have sprung up in that area in the last decade. I know the Barleycorn, Moes Cantina owner is a Bridgeport guy. A few years ago before Richie Cat passed he stopped into BOSS Bar with a young Italian bodybuilder type. I was the only guy in there that afternoon. All of the staff came up and greeted him like he was royalty. Did he have a piece of it? Also are you familiar with the Marco Island. Outfit has been going down there since the Capone days. Seems like a lot of the CME/Oakbrook guys have places down there or no?

Fried, I will not comment on the river north area, sorry. Yes Marco island has always been an outfit hotbed.

rico have you ever been to gene and georgettis

Yes of course, many times. Why?

If that's the chart that has Joe Andrich as a top guy, its pretty far off. Any chart that has Chicago as one family is going to be off, its two now. There isn't a viable outfit chart out there and probably won't be another one for quite some time. People are just gonna have to accept that for what it is.

do you think it's a mob hangout?

you should make a chart

Haha I'm not making a chart. Gene & Georgetti's of course is a hangout, that's the obvious one. Volare & the Gibson's patio are the other two in that area, amongst many others, but those are the three you will see a lot of older heavies at. The young guys have different hangouts, naturally.

Please explain this a little more. What positions do you speak of that "sat pretty". How is Chinatown a prime example of that?

Very informative. I have been looking for something like this for a while. Thanks.

Also, in this setup, how often did each crew boss meet with Aiuppa? Ever? Never? Would they have to? Could Aiuppa supersede a crew bosses decision?

Ok, I will agree to disagree on a few of those things but some of it seems solid. Which guys did Aiuppa put in to Chinatown, and who did they replace? Offhand can you name any Aiuppa loyalists that came in to power after the Giancana loyalists went away? Who were his loyalists basically.

EDIT: Yeah I have the same question as PP.

I knoe Angelo LaPietra was the South side captain for a while

Right, LaPietra was the big one. Skids Caruso ran Chinatown for almost 20 years and was "asked" to step down so that Aiuppa could implement Angelo, who nevertheless continued to take care of the Carusos & the Rotis, as Aiuppa wouldn't dare snap those 1st ward ties. Taylor st was completely deactivated & all of its action shifted down Ashland to Chinatown, with LaPietra going from mere capo in Cicero to fully fledged king of Chinatown. Melrose park was sanctioned into Elmwood park, because Aiuppa did not want a crew to be based out of his hometown, therefore making Elmwood Park the second largest crew. Cerone was given Elmwood, making him 2nd in command, with accardo continuing to act as consigliere as he always had. Lombardo who was close with Cerone was given grand ave (at an extremely young age) after accardo & Cerone left for Elmwood. Keep in mind Aiuppa reached out to accardo/Cerone when Sam & Ricca froze them all out. Aiuppa had brought Cicero back into fruition which was deemed an impossible task (which is why Sam "gave" it to him, despite Aiuppa pleading for his hometown of Melrose park). Aiuppa/Cerone/accardo had been planning to overthrow Taylor st since the early 60s, they just needed to wait out their opening. Trust that if Sam hadn't gotten unlucky Aiuppa never would have became boss.

To answer PPs questions, like I stated, Aiuppa set up the outfit like a miniature version of NY if you will. of course Aiuppa & Cerone still maintained top control and final say in serious situations, but each crew boss was given much more power, and that particular crew boss's capos became more powerful, and the crew in general. Bosses were/are encouraged to keep to themselves and encourage their soldiers not to associate with soldiers from other crews. Rarely is a Chinatown guy familiar with the inner workings of the Elmwood park crew, etc etc. for example, if you'll read through, say, Nick Calabreses testimony, he said he had met Al Tocco & Marcello (and others) for the first time during his making ceremony, in his late 40s, had never seen them or heard of them previously. That was not uncommon. If a guy from Cicero gets popped, he wont be able to give them anything on any of the other crews, and due to the intimacy of his own crew/family probably wouldn't flip (hopefully) on them either. It was pretty genius, and allows the outfit to operate in relative secrecy until this day. Carlisi/Marcello & DiFronzo did a lot to continue Aiuppas vision as well. Infelice almost ruined it for everyone haha

So im guessing there's nothing going on in taylor street today?
And do you know much about Toots Caruso? Not much about him online

Taylor street & Melrose park are just Italian neighbourhoods now, there are no crews there anymore. Cicero is very strange. The name of the crew is Cicero, but there is no business conducted in Cicero and no Italians live there anymore, they just run the town & tax the Hispanics that live there now, and the Cicero crew operates out of SW burbs.

Skids Caruso was a guy from Taylor st, strong made guy out of giancanas 42 gang. Sam gave him Chinatown when the Italians first settled into that area and Skids made it his own, married into the roti family I believe, and the rest is history. His son & namesake, you know who, current king of Chinatown is the Caruso most think of when they hear the name these days. Lapietra mentored Skids kids well and always kept them relevant down there. Skids is a legend and one of the most well respected guys in the history of the thing, tough guy, so are his kids.

So is Frank Caruso one of the most powerful capos in the outfit today? Or is it Matassa, Pete Difronzo, ect

Matussa

Tootsie Caruso is the boss of Chinatown & has been for over a decade now, yes that family is extremely powerful. Pete is extremely wealthy & powerful as well, matassa is not near either of them in terms of power, but also a very serious guy.

I mean I would assume he's a very series guy could you please elaborate? I think I changed my mind and would go with Difronzo I don't follow the outfit as closely as other members of this board do but hasn't Difronzo's allegiance been questioned before I feel that he may feed some information to the feds in order to keep things running no?

Is he involved with unions? Chicago Construction Companies seem to run deep when they can outbid a non-union company by $50 million dollars on a job!

I'm sorry I don't know who or what we are comparing.

Who has the most influence within the outfit? Everyone thinks their such a mystery I think they have a lot of legitimate business's that launder a lot of money that's just be speculating though I'm not an expert on the outfit

Influence is such a broad term. Influence in regards to what? If you're talking the two most respected, powerful guys, you have to say probably Johnny Bananas or Jimmy Inendino, but they are old, old men. Bananas in particular is a little old man that you can see driving down Harlem every day getting coffee and going home to his little two flat. Those guys aren't active street guys in any way, but they're probably the two most respected elder statesmen & garner the most respect. Johnny never even wanted to be boss, it was dumped on him when Marcello went away the first time. Elmwood park isn't so much active on the street. They've even let Cicero have a lot of their turf. Elmwood is large grocery store chains, huge legitimate companies, casinos, condos, and so forth. Not to say there aren't still feared hard heads in Elmwood, but its absolutely nothing like Cicero, Chinatown, or even grand ave or the heights. If you want real old time, old school Chicago outfit, you go out to Lombard, Westchester, bridgeport, Berwyn, etc. As far as most feared, id say guys like Tootsie & Solly D are still very powerful, very feared individuals. They are still relatively young(ish) & active on the street, especially the Carusos. The older guys aren't anything to worry about anymore, no one is worried about johnny bananas geriatric ass breaking down their door lol. The young guys control a lot now, especially young Cicero guys, and you won't hear their names until 10-15 maybe 20 years from now, if they ever get popped for anything. I'm sure it'll happen eventually

^^ Yeah I bet your a solider

Lol you wish. Then you could all run & tell your buddies that you talked to a real outfit guy!!

W

lol Yeah whatever man The outfit my ass

Haha go ahead & think that Italian street level crime in Chicago doesn't exist, they love guys like you. Keep them under the radar.

Also I believe you implied pudge matassa has more power than Tootsie Caruso & Pete DiFronzo...what would lead you to assume that?

Who the fuck is pudge matassa



I haven't been able to shit in two days ...

Haha dicknose you're killing me

But I've also heard that Difronzo might be an informant as well. Not to say I also haven't heard the top echelon of Chicago is loaded in terms of owning property and money.

Are you kidding? The DiFronzos own tons of property and are millionaire's.
And dicknose pudgy matassa is the captain of the cicero crew

Sorry nicky that was a typo on my part. I "have" heard that Difronzo and company are very wealthy

I love how you're an expert on the outfit now since you've asked Ricobenes a few questions

When did i ever say i was an expert? I never asked any of the things he told me in my post because i knew that before. Nice try

Nicky i was kidding it was just funny that after 4 pages of your questions you started providing the answers

Ok but everything i know wasn't from asking questions on here

The best laugh today had gotta be the roy demeo andy warhol colored portrait on mobguys facebook

Well done then

What's his facebook name

You're kidding me Link?

I'm not gullible btw i just wouldn't be surprised

Paul Castellano i'm not sure exactly though cos he can't be the first guy with that name

Yeah there's like 50 of them

Found it

http://en-gb.facebook.com/paul.castellano.14

LMAOOOO


It is interesting that he escaped prosecution in the family secrets case especially when nick calabrese named him in open court as being involved in the spilotro murders...does make you wonder especially since the feds said they have a few high ranking outfit guys who have been informing for the fbi for decades.

Nick didn't just name him as being at the murders, he also mentioned him as representing Jack Cerone/Elmwood Park at his making ceremony, which is also pretty huge. Whatever he did, it worked. He drives around the city like some middle class old man.

Also, pudge matassa is an Elmwood park guy now. He was under Vince solano on rush street for years, and went to Elmwood after they deactivated rush st & sanctioned it into elmwood, he's supposedly under Marco out there.

I don't think Difronzo is an informant.
Rico do you know the current health status of joe cullota and joe andrachii? A lot of people say their really sick, have cancer, ect. Do you know if that's true?

Who knows, accardo & difronzo are probably dry beefers, but they probably had something worked out that benefited everyone, and Johnny bananas sure as hell ain't going down for anything, he manned the ship when no one else wanted the responsibility, and he's ancient compared to those guys (except for Lombardo who fucked his own self). Marcello fucked himself too, with that mistress of his, but he will be back out and take back the reigns. But no way Johnny bananas was going down for a trio of knucklehead derpyderp idiots (The Three Calabrese) that shit where they ate one too many times. The only one on par with DiFronzo in that trial was Marcello. The Calabreses, schweihs, & Lumpy the clown was Grand & Chinatown guys, respectively, the two weakest families. The Calabreses especially were strong guys around the Port, but in the grand scheme of things they were just three Chinatown made guys that got popped for bein reckless clowns & dabbling in drugs. Not bosses of anything or top level guys.

I thought Marcello got life in prison?

"A confidential FBI informant, who felt abandoned by the Outfit and was motivated to talk, told the feds in 2007 that Mutt and Jeff “were the current Outfit bosses in the Chicago area,” according to the previously sealed federal document.
It details the bloody rise of Sarno in the mob, and Cataudella’s alleged supporting role...based on three confidential informants, including a veteran source who provided information for the last 25 years and is “personally acquainted with numerous top members of the Chicago Outfit.”
Another informant associated with two Outfit crews said the motive to provide information was “because many individuals, including a member of the Chicago Outfit, had abandoned” the informant.
The veteran informant noted that Sarno and one superior, Anthony Zizzo, had been involved in a “drawn out feud” over money shortly before Zizzo disappeared in August 2006, never to be seen again.
Zizzo had previously been assigned by mob bosses to straighten out something that Sarno had “f----- up” and that mistake had enraged then Outfit chief James Marcello, according to the veteran informant.
While one informant put Sarno and Cataudella at the top of the Chicago Outfit, another informant advised the FBI that Sarno was still turning over money to reputed Outfit underboss John “No Nose” DiFronzo, also known as “Johnny Bananas.” Another source of information noted that Sarno was higher in the leadership structure and collecting money from reputed 26th Street crew boss Frank “Tootsie Babe” Caruso."

http://www.fivefamiliesnyc.com/2011/03/new-fbi-document-details-rise-of-mutt.html

"Calabrese testified in 2007 that DiFronzo was among the dozen or more men who fatally beat Anthony and Michael Spilotro in 1986, but he was never charged.

"We've tried to heal over the years," Patrick Spilotro said by phone from Arizona, "but there's still one person out there — John DiFronzo — who has not been indicted or convicted."

http://www.fivefamiliesnyc.com/2011/06/weakened-by-convictions-chicago-mob.html

Here's a video interview with John DiFronzo

http://www.fivefamiliesnyc.com/2011/06/meet-boss-of-chicago-mob-john-no-nose.html

wonder who they are...

This is old news, and it obviously didn't do much damage. Family secrets trial was pretty irrelevant too, besides Marcello getting canned. But Cicero is so large & well organized that it wasn't a huge road bump.

didnt that guy sarno just get 30yrs in the feds that' 25yrs with good time i say thats alife sentence for anyone over 40ty especially for tall obese people.

yeah Most likely I heard is health is in bad shape right now
I agree that family secrets was way overhyped

Fat fuck sarno will get out much sooner than that, if he doesn't have a heart attack first. In all honesty, Cicero is much better off without him. His family has started the FREE BIG MIKE t-shirt craze here in Chicago, I guess one of the NY mob wives was seen wearing one, the outfit hates that shit, but that is a classic example of why sarno was headed to the can eventually anyways

Rico do you believe Frank Caruso kicked money up to Sarno? I've heard many people say it but i don't think that's true.

Yes if you'll scroll up I said that. Obviously Chinatown is beneath Cicero, they are a sub family, Cicero is the big daddy down there. Sarno is Cicero. Doesn't make him more powerful than Frank, but his crew is more powerful

i just realized your username is from a pizza place

Haha derp. More of an Italian food joint

watching this video it says rudy fratto is a top 5 guy in the outfit. They are also saying he's boss. http://abclocal.go.com/wls/story?section=news/iteam&id=8407085
He also mentions gene and georgettis
http://abclocal.go.com/wls/story?section=news/iteam&id=8818674

Joe Fosco has been pushing the idea of DiFronzo being a dry snitch. He has some hatred/anger towards DiFronzo, so take it for what its worth. The guy does know his stuff, but there may be more to it.

One of DiFronzo's business's is a garbage hauling company. And there was a big story a few years ago because the tribune or sun times was found out that his company had a contract to haul garbage from a bunch of government buildings. The paper was wondering how a reputed mobsters company could be awarded a government contract. Don't remember how that ended up.

I'll tell you how it ended up: D&P is now the largest dumpster company in the Chicagoland area...... Like I said, DiFronzo & accardo were probably dry snitches, or had some old fed buddies up top from back in the day. Who knows. All we know is that Elmwood Park has been untouchable ever since Marco got out of the can. They were the only crew besides the Heights not touched during family secrets. They continue to operate & their legit businesses just keep on expanding, marianos is the new hot grocery store chain throughout the city, rivaling whole foods market in some areas.

Fosco is fosco, he is obviously extremely educated, but his views tend to be biased, obviously, especially towards Bananas & Elmwood Park, and I suppose its deserved, they did ruin his life, although he most likely brought the majority of it upon his own damn self.

Did you two check out the Cooley interviews i linked? I started a new thread for them, not sure if they've ever been posted or whether or not you seen em, but they're interesting to say the least.

what happened to fosco?

Rico,

Cooley claimed that Marco ran gambling in Rockford, but Saladino of Rockford was aligned with Calabrese and the Chinatown crew. How did that work out? Also was Marco with Cicero at one point? I know him and Sarno are very close. I assume Sarno named his son after him.

This is my line at Marianos.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tncd84NYJ1Y

His story is the reason he started ANP, it is well documented on there. It is too lengthy for me to get into here, revert to anp.

Cheech (frank Sr) was a sloppy idiot, slopped things up up there, toots is close with Marco from way back, asked him to help clean things up, that's really the gist of it.

Marco spent 17 years in Cicero, him & Mooch Eboli were more or less Obrien's adopted sons, since Obrien couldn't have kids due to an unknown STD. Yes, fat sarnos punk kid is named after Marco.

Rico what is don scalises current involvement in the outfit?

Also what's actually going on with Mike Magnafichi why is he listed on charts still?

I cannot answer that sry

He's inactive & has been for over a decade. He's supposed to have a tag on his head, obviously, but I tend to think he's such a pathetic, broken down character, that they'll just let him burn out. He's irrelevant & harmless anyways. Saw him in line at a grocery store a few weeks ago and he did not look good.

I'm curious to know this: how come the Outfit has gone from one of the most powerful crime families in the US, to supposedly a mid-sized family run by a bunch of old farts who barely do anything except shuffle around social clubs and run video poker machines and a few legit businesses.

New York, no many how many times the Feds hit them always come back. Even the Colombo's, hell they aren't going away. The Genovese Family controls the entire port of New Jersey even in this day and age.

I'm not saying it's true, but it just seems Chicago slided in a very short period of time.

one word. competition.

Which is also strange because the New York Families have a lot more competition than the Chicago Outfit. Where does the Chicago Outfit receive major competition from ? Gangster Disciples ( who are busier shooting each other up than anything else ) ? Triads ( who only operate within their own community ) ? Latin Kingz and La Raza ? The Irish ? Middle Eastern clans ?
I'm not saying the groups I just named are completely disorganized, but in my book the Chicago Outfit is still the only criminal organization over there capable of infiltrating politics or pulling of labor racketeering.

The outfit seems like more of a suburban operation mostly involved with gambling and loansharking which to be honest isnt going to attract any competition, there sort of lucky in that sense that no other group has any large interest in gambling or loansharking otherwise there status might have been extinct a long time ago. The street gangs control most of the drug trade and big drug markets in chicago with the mexicans or whoever supplying. As far as polictical connections read this article. http://www.chicagomag.com/Chicago-Magazine/January-2012/Gangs-and-Politicians-An-Unholy-Alliance/

Well now that's just simply not true. Sure, that is what the outfit would love to have people believe, but they are alive and doing very well, much better than they were doing during the first half of this decade. The biggest blows dealt were the jahoda & Cooley testimonies. Losing the 1st ward was the big one, but they just picked up & moved most of their business to the suburbs.

If you think the outfit is a couple of old farts that shuffle around social clubs & have a few body shops, youre an idiot, and sorely mistaken. They LOVE that people think that though.

It most certainly attracts competition. The competition just can't do anything about it. There are plenty of minority street gangs trying to beef with them over gambling/prostitution/drug sales out in stone/Melrose/Elmwood park, along mannheim road & Harlem ave, and other outfit controlled areas. Those neighbourhoods are just too outfit-heavy/heavily Italian. Keep in mind that the Outfit 100% controls law enforcement in: Elmwood park, Melrose park, stone park, Cicero, Berwyn, Westchester, darien, river grove, oak park, Lombard, Chicago heights, island lake, & several other suburbs. Even if the African/Hispanic street gangs wanted to infiltrate the underworld of those areas (we are talking HUGE areas, putting all of those towns together), they would have never been able to make more than a dent, at best paying a street boss tax to operate out of there. Chicago is hyper segregated, the gangs control their own areas. Why would the outfit desire control over blown out crack hole neighbourhoods?

Not entirely off topic, but thought you'd might like to read this.

http://abclocal.go.com/wls/story?section=news&id=3936339

you misread me. if the giants only played there scrub team for ten years, will they be able to compete against the rest of the nfl? competition is good for anyone. who does chicago compete with? the latin kings? the tri state area you got eight familys. chicago has one. big difference.

I don't recall replying to anything you said

then perhaps it wasnt directed torwards you?lol.

Well whether it was or wasn't, comparing the two is futile & ridiculous. Organized crime does not work like the NFL. The Outfit is better off & more powerful without competition. They never had any to begin with.

how are they better off?they got 28 guys.

Haha oh lord here we go again derpderpderp

your the 'expert'.lol. your to good to enlighten a cousin of yours from ny?

Not at all, there is 6 pages of "enlightenment" in this thread alone.

honestly the thread about dickienoses green shit is more entertaining than six pages of praising and worshipping a few old farts in chicago for masterminding a vast multi million dollar criminal enterprise.lol.

I don't think any of this was meant to be entertaining. If that's what you're looking for, I'd stick to threads about the loud mouthed goofball primadonna dives out east I also don't see any "worshipping of old farts) going on. Care to elaborate? You can believe what you'd like, obviously, no one is trying to convince you personally of anything. If you're going by what the feds "know", you're going off of "facts" that they've contributed that have been proven to be incorrect on many different occasions. Once again, it is what it is.

im laughing at the fact that you feel its your duty to 'defend' these guys like your defending the bears.lol. talk all you want about ny wiseguys, you wont see me defend them.hell they dont even defend each other.lol.

When & where have I defended any of these men. They're all scumbags & evil people. I don't say anything about NY guys because I don't know anything about NY, nor do I care to. I refuse to comment or question anything that I am uneducated on, what's the point? Besides, from what I can gather, those NY guys are pretty good about letting the world know what they're up to anyways, no? Anyone can just sit in the distance and fap "the feds said this the feds said that well i heard on the news derpderpderp". Also, I can't stand American football

What is it about Chi town guys always routing for the outfit like its their home team. You guys are always exagerating what the outfit really is these days. I am no expert on the outfit but it seems like on every forum I have been to the chicago guys act like there are a ton of mafia members and they are the most secretive family still to date. I just dont get it. I know the feds are not always right but why am I do believe forum posters on the internet who say there are so and so amount of members or that the outfit has so much political corruption like its 40 years ago or something. Do you know more then the feds just cause you live in Chicago??? You may know a few little things here and there that dont make the news like others of us Philly do or anywhere else cause your from the neighborhood. But I just dont get how you can over evaluate the Chicago outfit like many Chi town posters do. Sorry to include all Chicago guys as its probably not true but thats the pattern I have seen on these forums.

More derp, not interested

dont like american football?you even from chicago? or america?

I knew there had to be something off about you. No lika americana futobala?lol Anyway, I wasn't trying to be stupid (although I did have to look up what derp meant). Just trying to understand why Chicago guys seem to think there is more going on with the Outfit then there actually is? I have noticed a trend. Not just you. I was hoping you can explain where it comes from. I follow philly the closest and think I know a lot about them thats in and out of the news. But you have never heard me praise them or talk about them being bigger then they actually are. The FBI are on point with the amount of members and there basic activites. But when you talk to a chi town guy they are always talking about how secretive the outfit is and that the FBI doesnt know anything about them. But yet this guy on the internet who lives near Chicago knows more and I am suppose to believe them instead.

Well I was born in southeast Sicily but have been in Chicago since I was about 7. We grew up on basketball, soccer, and dutch style kickboxing. I appreciate & respect American football, I just wasn't raised on it, so i can't get into it wholeheartedly. Even upon moving to the states, we didn't watch it in the household

that makes sense. im sicilian on my fathers side.palermo.my mother has a little castellemarese in her [is that how you say it],but her family is mostly from naples.

maybe we are cousins.lol.

What town?

Buddy, buddy, no one is asking you to believe anything. This whole thread was more or less three Chicago guys shootin the shit, not much else. Ever think that you notice this trend because (gasp!) there may be some truth to it? I don't think there is a need to talk or gossip about philly, those guys do a good enough job of that themselves. You'll never catch a chicago guy on access Hollywood like a skinny merlino. the fact is, the outfit are certainly the most secretive group, this is not debatable. The feds are completely unreliable when it comes to the outfit, I don't know what is so difficult for you to grasp about this. Just because the clowns out in philly shit where they eat and walk with their nuts out doesn't mean Chicago is like that. The ideals & traditions are extremely different here. Being flashy & flamboyant is considered cowardly & shameful

Augusta

Ehh, close enough. And who knows, we could be! Two of my old man's brothers ended up in the bronx.

This is a little far-fetched. I have friends that have moved from other countries and they assimilated. Unless you were home-schooled I don't get it

Sicilians don't assimilate. They come to the US, find each other from their hometowns in Sicily, and stick with each other for life.

Well I agree with you as far as the ones who come for over there. But as far as having children and involving them in sports within the community and what not they don't want their children to be left out

I don't think he was serious, I think he was trying to, what do they call it, "troll" me.

very true.most italians in general. eighty percent of carroll gardens is from the same town. the whole bloomfield avenue area in newark is from avellino.

^^^^ My husband didn't have to learn to speak english until he was 19 and they moved out of Bensonhurst to Jersey.

perhaps your pizzaboys cousin.lol. me all my family was born in brooklyn. except for that spoiled prick my cousin from long island.little turd is a pediatrist now. lol. probably the easiest field in medicine. goes to school for seven years to tell people there feet stink.

So where does your info come from?? And how many times are you going to use the line " i don't need to gossip about (insert town other then Chicago), those guys do a good enough job of it themselves. lol. Get a new one Buddy, Buddy. My gas station attendant calls me buddy, buddy. Hes got one of those funny hats on though. I'll ask him if hes from Chicago. lol. No one said the Outfit is not secretive. But they are also one of the smallest families. Why am I to believe you is my question? What do you have to offer that the feds don't? O I forgot your from Chicago. So let me try. The Philadelphia family is by far the best in the unions racekteering. You know cause they have never been caught. Thats some secret shit there. lol. There aren't no Union racketeering in Philly just like the Outfit isn't some big ass family that nobody knows any members of. And you proved my point about being a fanboy when you starting prasiing the outfit over Philly. You see I could care less about guys in philly. But please explain to me how they walk with, how did you say it? There nuts out and shitting where they eat?? do some homework their Buddy Buddy. The last ligambi family had no made guys rat and have been on the street for 12 years without being flamboyant. I think you saw your buddy from chicago Fratto with Joey merlino on TV and you think you know it all. So my basic question to you is. Why do you believe the FBI is so unreliable when it comes to the Outfit? And I don't want to hear the ideals and traditions are different or because you said so cause you live 4 miles from some guy your uncles friends brother once knew who was connected. What is it that you know that the FBI doesn't?

I played kiddie American football & played a year in HS just because it was the thing to do, and to get girls, but always found it to be boring & tedious. Too much standing around for my tastes, although the action was fun. I dunno I just was never able to invest fully into baseball or American football. I'll root for da bears I guess, not a die hard or anything though. Love me some Giorgio Petrosyan though, K1 Max champ!

Oh god lol I think answering this crapload may give me an aneurism . Way waaaaaay too much derp. When did I ask you to believe me? Stick to philly, ill stick to chi

i walk with my nuts out all the time.im glad to see its catching on down in philly too.

Well to be fair to the outfit guys, it gets pretty fuckin cold here!

well its more popular than ever down at the shore now. last summer i saw snooki doing the same thing.

Booyah!

http://www.gangsterbb.net/threads/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=675097#Post675097

Re: The scariest mafioso of all time. Who is it?
ricobenes

Made Member
Registered: 10/04/12
Posts: 155
I was born in the patch, so grand & damen area, not two blocks from the Lombardo compound, moved to the Chinatown area when I was in HS, but now reside in the south burbs

so hes not from augusta?

Pffff man what the hell is going on over there these days, shameful to say the least

Ehh it was typed in haste, I also said Joe batters was from Taylor street, when he was a grand ave kid, smith park to be exact.

Right, because when we're typing fast, we all tend to forget what country we're born in. Please, I know you're not born in Sicily. I spotted you a mile away.

Right right, because its everyone's fantasy to be born in a shitty dirt poor fishermans town. Right

Who the fuck knows what your fantasies involve: fish, donkeys, da Bears. Point is you're a liar. Next.

Great response. The broad that fantasizes about being edie saggy tits falco is giving me shit for a typo...adorable. buzz off you creepy twat

Hey now Charmaine had some nice ta ta's worth fantasizing about. And you're lucky I don't offend easily. But you're still a liar.

Have a good one!

Have some respect! Just cause you can't keep up with the big dogs doesn't mean you should call a woman a name like that on a forum no less. You wouldn't in real life little guy.

I bet this is Imamobguy but under a different nickname

since I wrote to much for you to absorb last time. Let me ask you one simple question. How many members do you THINK the Outfit has? And what do you base this OPINION on. And I will stick to whatever the fuck I feel like Buddy Buddy. By the way, do you own any 7-elevens?

aint that the fucking truth.lol.

your just pissed because mobwives chicago was canceled.lol.

I'm picturing this batshit homely dame pulling her ratty hair out, scouring through my past comments lolol, go cook a meal or clean something for your imaginary husband

hey rb, try showing just a little bit of respect to people who have been around on the boards longer than you and actually provide fact based information, rather than just hometown gossip, as we have more than our fair share of that already, and its one of the main reasons why the OC forum on this site has not been what it once was in recent times.

Hah well can ya blame them? Schweihs's crackhead kid & fecarotta's niece were the only two legit characters, the other three (four?) were daughters of "cops/guys who knew a guy who knew a guy who knew a guy who knew a guy". That show was doomed from the start.

derpderpderp there are 7 pages comments to go over, kid derpderp I'm not in the business of repeating myself

you just described yourself

then why did you just say 'derp'. five times?

Nah you're right, i should show respect to some crusty basement dwelling dame that pretends to be married & spends countless hours going over bogus federal documents & archiving comments posted here......

zing. I'm digging that NY wit, were a bit more blunt out this way

and in 7 pages of bullshit you brought nothing to the table but half truths and lies. Cant have a conversation with you. Im done. O yea, i thought you said your dad liked Football?

Ricobenes calm your self down!lay off the crack

you made my point, you have no respect for people here and i'd be willing to bet you won't last much longer. another thing, who the hell in this day and age would troll the internet "pretending to be married? if i was gonna make myself out to be some bigshot, i could come up with a much better story than just being married. also, carmela is quite pretty.

says the spazzed out village idiot. You're right, im clearly fuming

i can tell. if you had a lttle more brains you wouldnt talk to a woman like that. not on the internet,not in public, anywhere.period.id smack you just for talking like that around a woman. i can tell your a kid, but show some maturity. we are on the internet yeah and you can say what you want.but show some respect.

Wooooo...i feel offended!what am i gon do?!?!?!

You're absolutely correct, I've got no respect for any of you pastey goofball flunkies . I mainly come here to engage in banter with Nickyeyes, PP, friedraviolifarts, and one or two other normal, coherent human beings. and I agree, who would pretend to be married in some internet forum? obviously a very disturbed individual, with far too much time on their hands now if you'll excuse me, I'm going to go take a huge sloppy shit and finish the rest of this leftover gnocchi in the process, mmmmmmm

[/quote] i can tell. if you had a lttle more brains you wouldnt talk to a woman like that. not on the internet,not in public, anywhere.period.id smack you just for talking like that around a woman. i can tell your a kid, but show some maturity. we are on the internet yeah and you can say what you want.but show some respect. [/quote]

LOL oh pipe down, you little world wide web hardass. we both know you'd never say any that to my face. I'll talk to her however the hell I damn well please, thanks for your concern though....I'm sure she appreciates your faux white knight efforts derpderpyderp

lol.a nother guy who wants to fight me.

The big dogs lolololol. You're funny

Funny how? How is he funny?

Nicky - it looks like we missed all the fire works in here!

Public Service Announcement - picking a fight with Carmela is like shooting spit balls at a battle ship! Good luck!

That chart is riconkulous; it lists anyone who has been mentioned in the same breath as anyone associated with the Outfit for the last 30 years as a "soldier."

There is a far greater chance of the Outfit being completely defunct than there is of it having even a fraction of the power people are suggesting on here.

Show me information from law enforcement or a reputable journalist or preface everything you write with "I would like to believe..." X-Files style.

Other options:

"It sends a chill up my spine to believe XXX."

"It captures my imagination to believe XXX."

"It gives me a sense of self importance to suggest XXX."

"I like the fantasy of believing XXX."

Lol I found that amusing as well. I really never meant to hurt any feelings, everyone here is bunny rabbit sensitive though.

Eyes, you check that report on the Outfit & the natalee holloway cover up?

I was being sarcastic

I think I may have trumped that rule, she cleared out pretty quick

So was he, eyes

Ricobenes, if I wanted to make up things about myself, I think I'd say I was some single broad, not going on and on about being married.

Other than that, you don't bother me none. I know what I am, I know who I am, what I look like and who I'm married to. But, most importantly, I remember WHERE I WAS BORN. lmao.

I understand lashing out at me is your defense, and I'm ok with that. All guys act like you when they've been caught lying. You're backed into a wall, so you come out swinging. None of your words negate the fact that you're a liar. Nobody can take you seriously now.

wut

And that chart is accurate. If anything the soldiers are very high up associates that would be made if it was NYC. But for the most part there all soldiers.

Exactly - "funny like a clown", Goodfellas?...

Oh god, it's back. Will. Not. Engage. Miserable old hags. Lololol

Woof Woof. Don't flatter yourself. I doubt you hurt anyones feelings. There goes that inflatted Chicago ego.


And thank you Jonnynonos. Thats been my point all along and have yet to get an answer. The inflated picture of the outfit is just ridiculous on this thread.

anybody who has spent more than a day or two doing any serious mob research will tell ya that chart is about as far from accurate as you can get. seemingly anybody who has ever had any dealings(either direct or indirect) is listed. that chart looks nice, but its been a running joke for anybody serious about OC since it came out.

spmob, he hurt my feelings.in fact he scared me so bad i had to change my depends.lol.

as far as the actual strength of the chicago.ill be the first to say i dont know. i just have a nose for bull shit.

Wow you guys really had to explain sarcasm. Guess that joke was lost on all.

derpderpderp "I've seen casino I read an outfit book once tony accardo joey the clown"derpderpderp

I must be losing my touch...

Ok then tell me one person on that list who is not a soldier

Really? So it's your opinion that Mike Magnificci is a "caporegime" ?

It's your opinion that Frank and Nick Calabrese were mere "soldiers?"

You guys are utterly delusional.

Like I said: Show me a reputable news article or a police report of recent activity backing up your claim or begin each claim with "I am in love with the idea of a powerful Outfit and as such I would like to believe XXX."

I could give a fuck how powerful the outfit is. No one said the chart was 100% correct. And yes, the Calabrese bros were high level Chinatown soldiers. What would lead you to believe otherwise?

"Oh but ricobenes I saw them on tv and family secrets and chuck goudie and frankie breeze was da boss" zzzzzzzzzz. Come on now lol

As opposed to what? Your street knowledge? No offense but no one is going to tell you over drinks at Richard's Bar that the Outfit is involved in major drug and arms trafficking operations, are they?

That seems to be what you're implying.

That inside people with real knowledge of the situation have give you the inside deets.

I will assume that it is just your imagination run wild. Othewise why don't you share with us where you get your information. Even if it's not a specific indivicual name, just say "a cousin of a high ranking mobster" etc.

lol.if i told you guys who my cousin wad yousd think im nuts.

The chart never listed Mike Magnificci as a capo it was a lieutenant. He might be inactive now bout at one time he was

Magic Johnson????????

When did I imply that some shitbag at Richards feeds me info? I honestly could care less about what you, or anyone else thinks. We both know that the bulk of your info comes from Dane placko, ipsn.org, and a bunch of dusty old news articles, that much was apparent when you expressed sympathy for that dirtbag Calabrese jr & admitted to believing Joe batters was the top boss for decades, so what's the difference? Eyes, PP, friedravfarts, and myself just come here to bullshit once in a while, no one is trying to convince anyone of anything. And frankly, its no ones business where i get my information from. That's private, and once again, I'm not sharing anything specific, nor detrimental, so again, what's the difference? Believe what you'd like, means absolutely nothing to me.

In general you can't disprove a negative.

Anyway, to answer the original question, here are the 28 members. I actually copied this from one of Ivy League's old posts.

1. Joseph Andriacchi
2. Dominic Basso
3. Robert Bellavia
4. Frank Calabrese
5. Bruno Caruso
6. Frank Caruso
7. Leo Caruso
8. Marco D'Amico
9. John DiFronzo
10. Joseph DiFronzo
11. Peter M. DiFronzo
12. Salvatore DeLaurentis
13. Rudolph Fratto
14. Michael Gurgone
15. James Inendino
16. Joseph Frank LaMantia
17. Joseph Lombardo
18. Rocco Lombardo
19. Michael Magnifichi
20. James Marcello
21. Louis Marino
22. John Matassa
23. Salvatore Muserino
24. Albert Roverio
25. Michael Spano Sr.
26. John Eugene Spizzirri
27. Richard Allen Spizzirri
28. Michael C. Talarico

You are the one who addressed me in particular. Believe me, I am more than happy to ignore you, since you never post anything interesting.

If you don't want to discuss it with me, than don't address me.

Logic is not your strong suit.

Mikey Mags was one of the most powerful made guys in the city during the late 80s/early 90s. He is now a broke, alcoholic bum that the outfit kicked to the curb years ago, just like Fratto.

That list is a joke, and ivyleague is completely clueless. Nothing new there though. Please, ignore me, I would like that very much.

and where is your proof that all those people in the chart are not made? You've never responded to that

But sometimes you like to say that ppl are lost,and "these facts are not true",and this and that,and after that "I'm not sharing anything specific" or "Believe what you'd like, means absolutely nothing to me.
" bla bla bla bla...aaahhhhh shut up!!!youre a nice fello!stay cool to the ladies.theres a lot of this gay menace thing goin on and we dont need that shit right now!!! last glass of mr.jack and im off!cheers yall

my brain just exploded.

So johnnynonnos, if the outfit is so small today and almost defunct, then why do they have CASINOS IN ARUBA? I think most small families don't have that.

How would you suggest I "prove" that?

Where is your source for this?

that cracked me up.lol.

http://abclocal.go.com/wls/story?section=news&id=3936339
If you can't prove there not made then how do you know they aren't?

I posted a link about in regards to the Outfit & the natalee holloway cover up a few pages back, before the clowns derailed the thread.

There it is. And mike Posner is a cronie of bobby Dominics, not even close to being a top guy

nick, one associate who owns a casino is not the same ad having a casino on the strip paid for with a teamster loan and skimmed from. patsy conte owns key foods. that doesnt mean the gambinos control the supermarkets in the city. just my two cents.

Well, that is interesting.

But I never said the Outfit was completely dead.

you don't think the outfit is getting anything from it?
And is Posner even an Italian last name?

kid no offense,but that makes as much sense as saying, you must be a madeguy because no one has any proof that your not one.

long story short, the 'dusty news articles' are going to be right over some random fella on the internet ninety percent of the time. there are guys who can tell us who is made in chicago and who aint.and ricobenes isnt one of them. carmela already caught him in one lie.

maybe comp rooms and maybe a airplane ticket, but more than that?

The outfit doesn't operate anything like NY. There are a few similarities, but it is obviously on a much smaller, tighter, more organized scale. And they have had heavy interests in gambling on aruba & st. Barts (amongst other islands/resort areas) for many years, that is nothing new.

well he is getting mad saying that people on the chart are not made but he doesn't a link to prove when he's getting mad at rico and me for doing the same thing that he's doing except the other the way around.

The dusty old news articles certainly wouldn't be more right. I like how this clown stole my "kid" line, original.

Eyes, posner is a jewish guy from lake county, he's been a grand ave/Elmwood whipping boy for many years, and yes the outfit certainly take heavy advantage of him & his business prowess.

Boo fucking hooo Carmela caught me in a lie. Boo fucking hoo I wish I was sicilian. Boo fucking hoo I forget where I was born when I type too fast. Boo fucking hoo I just found out from my mom that I was a load she wishes she took on her back.

Eyes let him get upset. This is the same guy that bought the Calabrese Jr sob story. Just let it go.

nicky i havent got a clue whos right and whos wrong. im just saying, random assholes on the internet who cant produce proof arent always right. look at me, if i was lying dont you think someone wouldve called me out by now?then notice rico weho has had a half dozen people disagree with him. just use your judgement is all im saying.

why are you getting so angry about this??

You do realise you don't need a crime family to have interests in a casino or business in a different place. If i had the money i could buy a casino or a restaurant in monaco if i wanted and send someone there to manage it for me as well, doesn't mean anything.

haha thats great...and riccobenes your not contributing your being an ass dude let it go an get back to chicago chinatown cicero or whatever

yeah but he's been involved for decades

I'm not angry. What makes you say that? This clown is a joke. I caught him lying. You should be angry for him trying to get over on people.

Do yourself a favor Nicky, mind your fucking business.

No, I have made my argument on here several times if you go back and read.

There have been no arrests for any Outfit related crimes committed since 2004.

The Outfit hasn't killed anyone since 2001.

Frank Calabrese Sr. was caught on a wire lamenting the diminished state of the Outfit as far back as the late 90s. He said "... you could take the whole thing over if you just got rid of five guys... that's it... it's come to that."

And a bunch of other anecdotal evidence that would strongly suggest it is in piss poor shape.

well if your posting on a public forum, its pretty much everyone's business so pm him if you get so offended by it

Anthony Zizzo?

Lol uh oh the skank returns. Listen, sweetheart, whatever irrelevant spat you think were involved in (it began with an innocent typo), you lose. Now chin up, shut up, and go fix us a plate while we banter.

This has become a real sandbox. Alright, everyone take a breath and count to ten, and then chill.

Frank Calabrese, Jr and Sr, were a couple of simpleton idiots, they couldn't take anything over even if they put their fuck all everything into it. That's why he's rotting in solitary confinement. He would say make a dickheaded claim like that, jealous, envious, bitter guy.

Rico just earned himself a two week vacation for his flaming crap. One more time and he's gone for good.

An innocent typo is not forgetting where you were born and in what country. So you lied about being born in Sicily. But why? A lie isn't a typo.

Nicky, I don't like people coming around to lie, don't get it twisted. Why should you believe anything else he says if he lies about where he comes from? But as far as me getting angry about him trying to insult me? Not even close. How can a guy that doesn't know me insult me?

Sorry my mistake; you are correct. 2006.

Anyway, Nick Calabrese flipped, and in spite of the above post, had enough information to put away two of the biggest guys in Marcello and Lombardo for crimes committed 30 years ago, and solved something like 15 murders.

Between Calabrese Sr.'s wire and Nick Calabrese's flipping, absolutely nothing like you guys are suggesting came out. Nada. Zilch.

Thank god No nose , Nine pages of bs before someone answered my question, sweet

LOL. You got it. Looks pretty solid.

Also I'm Gunna go ahead and add Sarno as the only new significant made guy, I have absolutely no proof of this and it's merely a hunch but I believe Marcello probabley inducted both "Mutt and Jeff" aka Sarno and Sal Cautadella

I believe Muserino has passed but not for sure.

Definitely.

I actually went to Sarno's trial for a day. He didn't testify but he was sitting in the box. It was pretty cool. He is really f**king fat.

I guess the rumor is he had Anthony Calabrese knock down Chiarmonti.

Did you ever read the wire they had on Anthony Calabrese? Pretty cool.

http://media1.suntimes.com/multimedia/010708mob2.pdf_20080106_16_32_33_17.imageContent

The Westside might have some interests/rackets/guys on the ports of NJ,but take it from my personal experience (which I dont say on here very often) they DEF dont control the entire port, not even a quarter of it. This is not too diminish them on there, but just saying their control is very often overblown/overstated.

id say other than port newark.thats right.

i have no personal experience, but of coarse they wouldn't control the whole waterfront. but as far as OC is concerned, they have the nj ports on lockdown.

do tell

I would agree with that as far as OC is concerned.

I second that, DD... Come on, sit - we won't tell nobody!

Im DEF including port newark on there,as a matter of fact thats where I have the most personal knowledge and recent (as in I was out on the Port last week). The Westside def has interests there just not as pervasive as many people think. Hope I didnt misinterpret your post, lol.

is the big guys brother in law still in 1804?

as far as my cousin, no. sorry.

can you give us a hint? like rank, family he's in

Dont know i am not knee deep on the union side, not my professional forte. Just know what I hear from others involved. 1804, i hate those corrupt bastards.



boo, you cant ease us with the possibility then back out...lol

cousin, father, uncle, brother, brother in law, godfather, hell just saying my last name would give away half my family.lol. pizzaboy is the only guy on here who knows some of my family...thats just because hes smart like a fox and knowd his shit.

nicky, hes from brooklyn.lol.

luchesse? Genovese?

no.no.

Colombo? Bonanno?

lol.hes the mayor.lol

think i know who it is but i wont be the one that puts it out there

its bloomberg.lol. hes really a paisan.lol.

Thank you SC so much.

i check the forum and this thread had about 5 more pages than the last time i saw it, i was like wtf then i read the whole thing, makes sense now.

No joke I was doing the same thing and that Rico kid was pissing me off just reading his posts. Thank God for getting rid of that jerkoff.

For the people who are putting any credence in the chart: You would have to believe that there are that many active "soldiers" running around the city doing the mob's dirty work almost constantly without any of them having been arrested for anything for nearly 10 years.

That is an absolutely asinine proposition.

Also, another question for those who think the Outfit is not a very tiny fraction of what it once was. I asked Joe Fosco this once as well: If you don't have people like Harry Aleman running around murdering people left and right, how do you keep the bookies in check? Also, if the mob isn't murdering people--which it isn't--why would someone like, say, Sarno, continue to kick up to DiFronzio? When you read the history of the mob it is filled with murder upon murder for precisely those reasons: Bookies refusing to pay the street tax, people flipping and underlings who didn't respect their superiors.

In short, I don't see how the Outfit operates without violence.

Fosco's answer to the first question was that the customers keep gambling with the Outfit bookies because they are generally old and think someone like Angelo LaPietra is still around and is going to come after them. Also, as everyone knows, the Outfit reportedly cuts deadbeats off now. Thirdly, these people are also people who don't know how/have no interest in placing a bet on the Internet, which is obviously an older demographic.

Interesting, what were they referring to about that girl getting gang banged ? was she raped or something?

They seemed more concerned that this guy might hire some one to kill them when they were threatening to kill his family. You think they were trying to make it out like they had some major back up.

I don't know what they were referring to with that bit about the girl... apparently something the guy wearing the wire did.

And I'm not sure why they freaked out so much when they guy indicated he was frightend of them... I can only guess they perhaps smelled he was fishing for something, or that they were just offended that he was characterizing them as dangerous criminal types.

Are you talking about "Da Pizzaboy" that is associated with Big Lou Malnati?

dont know the name.

Mother of Christ and all that's Holy!! He's alive and cracking wise no less!! Don Cardi is back! Great to see you, DC. Hope all is well with you and your family after the Sandy storm. Really good to hear from you!! Hey sitonmyface11 - Lou Malnati's is one of the big pizza parlors here in Chicagoland. Don Cardi was pulling your leg.

2nd time you´ve been caught with a lie. Rico, I suspect this being only the tip of the iceberg? On a second thought...don´t bother answering.

Good work Spmob and Carmela!

Nice job, Hairy. It's good seeing you here again .

I quit looking at this thread five pages ago. Too much rooting for the home team. But that douchebag Rico takes it to a whole other level.

Rico is gone. He won't be back anymore. (He had been suspended and while serving his time he tried opening another membership here).

Great news, SC .

But just for the way he spoke to Carmela, I hope he dies of hemorrhoids.

He said I have ratty hair!!

I didn't even read that part!

But when he told you to go cook for him I thought he crossed a line. Doesn't he know that you can't cook?

Time to put it behind ya, pb.

Oh, stop your bitching. At least you have hair.

Is what I'm saying! He obviously wasn't paying attention.

I can't. It's Vitelli's fault, and he doesn't even post in this section. I just can't get the picture of the guy farting fire out of my head.

Lol I appoligoze for my thread going a little rouge guys, I never planned for it to get highjacked by some Chicago jerkoff who clearly has no class whatsoever

Not your fault, kid. It seems that a lot of the younger posters outside of New York want the mob to be a little stronger than it is in their little corner of America. But that kid was especially sick in the head.

Carmela I am sorry you were spoken to like that, it was crude and not warranted

What was his new name? What did he post?

That's sweet, thank you. I think it bothers you all a lot more than it does me. I don't take any of that stuff personally, but thank you.

I told you so...

It's bad when you start talking to yourself on a message board.

BUT....The Focus of Life Begins At Home...

I heard that!

Good Morning Mark...

It seems that when we get a member from Chicago they can never stick around and inform, educate and assist. They seem to chest pound, exaggerate and boast about things that mostly aren't true thus leading to their demise. I wish YoTonyB would post more often. He seemed to have some pretty good knowledge about The Outfit but he doesn't come around that much any more.

How goes it, DNM? To the Shoutbox?

The problem is there is nothing really to talk about. I think that's why ANP was so popular; Fosco would spill the beans on current and past issues X, Y and Z that people didn't know about before.

But for those of us who weren't literally born into a mob family, there's really nothing new to talk about and hasn't been for a long time.

So you're left with posting questions like "How many people do you think Tony Spilotro killed" or something like that, which isn't going to interest most people who have already read a bunch of books etc.

Agreed, jonny - especially with The Outfit being as secretive as it is. BTW - I do enjoy your Windy City posts and talk. We don't get too many Chicagoland people here.

Micky "poopsicle" Mangano

He sccops cat shit for a living owns a vet over on the south side and a pizza parlor. He's a rising start and a major player some say hes the illegitimate kid of Milwaukee Phil.

Thanks! I'll stick around... it's nice to have a place to talk about Outfit stuff.

It's weird... Black Angelo, the Don and this most recent guy (to a lesser extent; some of his posts felt like BS, even about the historical stuff, and on the current state of the organization he couldn't have been more wrong) are extremely knowledgable on the Outfit, astounding, really, in their knowledge of the ins and outs of the history of the structure of the crews and stuff, but they all are also basically fans of the Outfit and (as we just saw) tend to vastly overstate its current power.

By the way, I don't really put the guy who was banned on the same level as the other two I mentioned from ANP. Though he clearly knew a lot, I think there was a fair amount of "bluffing" in his assertions regarding both past and present. But he did have enough context to give it a veneer of truth.

lol - was this the guy on the BB named "bridgeportvet"?

It is good to have a forum to talk Outfit stuff. We all know that not all things posted are always 100% accurate so you gotta take it with a grain of salt. jonny - Any chance you can get the ANP guys to come over here every now & then?

NoNos,

I still think there is a lot going on in Chinatown/Bridgeport. Do you ever get down there?

Was very interesting reading those guys on ANP. Didn't find that site until after they left/were banned but it was a great site to read about the stuff.

Would love for those guys to start posting here. They, it appeared, had great inside and historical info on the outfit.

Deja vu

Are you talking about Chicago gangsters or Chicago politicians?

What's the difference?!?

Hi Mark,

I don't know those guys personally but if Fosco ever posts another article on the Outfit I'll leave a note about this site in the comments section. I'm sure they still read it.

Good news, jonny - thanks. Go to shoutbox, okay?

Hi. Yeah I am down there often. This is just a guess but I would guess that for the old rackets of bookmaking etc. that is the last neighborhood in Chicago where it is still going on, if its going on anywhere. That being said, if you read Family Secrets by Jeff Coen there are a few bits that would lead you to believe that some time in the late 90s or early 2000s they just closed up shop. There is one particular passage where it says that they had been extorting a well known business owner for years and finally just went to him and told him he could stop making payments, after decades.

The guy who got banned was talking about Grand Ave. There are only a handful of Italians left over there and just a handful of Italian businesses. I'm sure Lombardo and others own a lot of the property and there is a social club there and perhaps a card game in one of the many abandoned storefronts but the area is still largely run down.

Chinese are huge gamblers so is imagine there is gambling in Chinatown still but, again, without the threat of violence I'm not sure why some Chinese guy would kick up to DiFronzio etc. although I suppose it's possible the Outfit could still have enough clout to protect them/ pay off the cops, particularly in that neighborhood.

I seem to remember that the Family Secrets trial revealed that the owner of Connie's Pizza chains were being shaken down... is that right?

Edit - just found story...

http://news.medill.northwestern.edu/chicago/news.aspx?id=40443

Yep. Connie's was looking to expand to the SW burbs and Hatch Chiaramonti thought he should get a piece since that was his territory. I believe that was part of the reason he got whacked is because Connie's belonged to Calabrese.

Ahhh... Tony "The Hatch" Chiaramonti - One of the last big "public" hits...

http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2001-11-22/news/0111220047_1_mob-boss-vestibule-lyons

i find it a little 'odd' that chicago can function with even 'hinting' of violence. dos no one seriously get hurt?surely someone gets smacked around every now and then?

Re: Connie's, yeah that was the guy. In 2003 they just told him he could stop paying. I forget who it was who told him, as I think the Calabreses were in prison. Someone had been collecting for them.

Sit: I havent heard about any violence at all since the Zizzo murder in 2006. I agree that the Outfit cannot function without violence.

Fratto did threaten people, in a fashion, though. And in that wire of Anthony Calabrese I posted earlier he threatened the guy. But in terms of any actual violence committed, nothing.

Nonos, can you tell me how you know there is zero violence in Chicago today?

who was it exactly that says they dont use violence?some o.c. author?

No one did. That's why his post made no sense

^^^^
I think he just meant that they haven't committed a murder since 2006. And the truth is, without the threat of murder, their strength diminishes exponentially. But it's just too hard to get away with today.

i have heard others on here claim something similar.im not arguing,it just sounds over-exaggerated to me.

It's widely acknolwedged by people like Howard Abinsky (sp.) and John Binder that the Outfit stopped using violence after Pendorf and Gambat, as well as the other federal indictments against them that basically saw the leadership decapitated. Not "stopped" but using it only in extreme cases. The example always given is that if you failed to pay a bookie in the past you get your legs broken. These days, they just cut you off.

Pizzaboy is correct, the fact that they haven't committed a murder since 2006 speaks volumes. I suppose you can believe they are still out there breaking arms and legs without it making the news if you want to, but frankly I haven't heard anyone ever say that, even the "pro Outfit" guys on ANP.

I personally have been scouring the news daily, incluing a dedicated feed, on the Outfit for abbout eight years, and I haven't seen anything indicating they are still roughing people up.

The only thing I think you can make a case for is the piece Fosco did on those two guys who he contends may have known Gianchinno. One was found stabbed to death in his apartment, the other missing. He said (if I remember) that he had heard they were pushing pills for GIanchinno. You can read all about it on that site if you want to. There's about a million posts on it.

On the other hand, consider that those two geriatric thieves, Reichel and Scalise, were going to break into Angelo la Pietra's old home under his daughter's nose (I think she's married to Kurt Calabrese) and try to rob it.

Considering what happened to the last people who tried to rob a Chicago mob boss, (infamous Accardo robbing) it's hard to imagine that those guys had any fear of a healthy Outfit, even though La Pietra is long gone.

Food for thought....

Is that the same Don Scalise who's allegedly a made man and "Replacing" Rudy Fratto, Hes listed as a street boss on the later charts, what's that guys deal NoNose?

Well if you mean murder then I agree. When you said violence I thought you meant beatings.

I don't know who Don Scalise is, although I think I remember Fosco saying he was not a mob guy.

No, this was Gerry Scalise... he was an old Outfit thief most famous for stealing a famous diamond in London. He and another geriatric named Alfred Reichel got busted by the FBI for trying to break into Angelo LaPietra's Bridgeport fortress last year. They thought he must have had money hid in the walls etc. Both are now in prison.

Like I said, it could be happening, but I haven't heard any word of it anywhere, not even on boards like this one, and definitely not in the mainstream news.

A lot of the Outfit's rackets were cut into by technology and changes in the law... there are casinos around here now, you can bet on line, instead of a juice loan you get a legal payday loan, porno is legal... and on and on.

I know you believe otherwise but my contention is that it is nearly dead and I will continue to believe so until someone shows me otherwise.

Even in Family Secrets, none of the crimes that were discussed took place any later than the very early 2000s, though the trial took place in 2007.

Probably the best evidence I can think of that the Outfit is still going strong was the fact that James Marcello was paying Nick Calabrese's family $4K a month for him to keep quiet right up until the trial.

But, again, I don't maintain that it's entirely defunct, but it wouldn't surprise me if it was very close to that.

If people believe otherwise, great, but I have seen no evidence supporting that position.

It's not like when the mob beats someone up that it gets reported and makes the news.

Good post. And they just legalized video gaming, I believe. Which seemed like a huge money maker for them.

Also for porn and paydays loans, I wouldn't be surprised for the Outfit to be heavily involved in those legit business's.

There were also all those rumors about guys with mob ties being involved with the bids for those casinos in Rosement and else where.

Rumors about them being involved in unions at O'Hare.

I have no idea how strong or prominent the outfit is. I just find it hard to believe in a big city like Chicago, with lots of Italians and the level of corruption in the city and especially in the suburbs, that the outfit would just completely disappear. Would make no sense to me.

I don't believe it was ever confirmed that Anthony "Little Tony" Zizzo is dead. He "disappeared" in August of 2006 and has never been seen since. I know there are many theories of his "disappearance" but he may still be alive?.. I seriously doubt that but it still may be possible. Has there been any wire taps or rumors of anyone taking "credit" for his "disappearance"?

I don't believe the Outfit is "dead" so to speak. I think they are the most viable family out there besides New York. I'm getting the impression that DiFronzo and the older guys aren't making a huge effort to keep it going since they are mostly legit and are friggin millionaires. I feel like one of two things will happen: it will die out like no nose said or it will break off into small sub gangs doing small scale gambling, extortion, loansharking etc.

I agree with you and think the outfit will basically be a bunch of different crews doing different rackets all under the umbrella of the "outfit"- which when you think about it is basically what it is now anyway.

Most mob hits today are just disappearances. Not public like they used to

Don Scalise is part of Marco's bookmaking enterprise. I don't know how active he still is though.

Nicky, if people involved in the Outfit were disappearing, a la Zizzo, you would still hear about it,

Mark I don't think they ever got anything on it.

PP there are not any Italian neighborhoods left. Bridgeport is it in the sense of a neighborhood like Brooklyn or he Bronx and I would guess its less than 10 percent Italian. There are a lot of Italians in the suburbs but they re ll third, fourth generation. They aren't gonna be any more inclined to go break some dude's kneecaps than a fourth generation Irish person is to join the IRA.

I meant most mob hits were throughout the u.s.
There's still Italian neighborhoods like elmwood, melrose, norridge, ect

Melrose Park is 60 percent Hispanic.

thanks for the answer johnny,my apologies if you read my post the wrong way.i wasnt disagreeing with you personally,just the source of information.

definitely not like it used to be but still a quarter italian

also on grand avenue and harlem

Grand Avenue on the near west side around Ogden where all the old mobsters come from is at very best 10 percent Italian.

Sure thing!

I see what you're saying, but my point was more that there are tons of italians in Chicago. For the outfit to just disappear would be strange. The italian hoods in NYC are disappearing, but OC is still strong there.

Well, yes, but is Hoffa still alive? I forget what I read, but IIRC, Zizzo was seen arguing with Sarno the day before he disappeared.

I'll look around, but I believe something was posted on ANP about what happened with Zizzo. IIRC, Zizzo was believed to be moving in on D'Amico's book making and D'Amico had Sarno take him out?

I'll look into, read something about it a few months ago can't remember exactly.

From what I read on ANP this is sort of what happened. That the outfit has turned into 2 separate groups. North/south. That the north-DiFronzo has basically gone legit, to some extent. They have there millions and they haven't made guys in 20 years or so. And that the South side is much more blue collar. Gambling/loan sharking/video poker/etc.

Will probably become more so as the years go on.

Great reading on ANP about the outfit if anyone is interested. Learned more there in a month than reading books for ten years.

I don't think it's strange. Considering the ratio of members who have wound up dead or in jail you'd have to be retarded to join the Outfit in 2012. The worlds changed a lot. I think most young men of Italian heritage these days would find the idea of throwing on a gold chain and walking around in a trench coat trying to shake down pizza parlors nothing so much as comical.

http://www.laborers.org/ChicagoMag_Moblite_12_00.htm

That article is twelve years old, Nicky. Interesting, though.

I know I just thought you guys would want to read it

According to Frank Calabrese Jr. Jarrett got whistled in by Montelone for dealing drugs and other chicanery and ignored the order.

However, if Jarrett was dealing drugs, as strongly rumored, it's also possible people other than the Outfit knocked him down.

Yeah jarret was working with members of the satans disciples street gang in distributing coke in the area and also i think trying to sell a few keys in michigan as well. I think that his shooter was described as a black guy too.

Yep.

I don't see why he thought he would be capo for south side crew. He's not even Italian

I think they got that part wrong. I never heard anyone else ever suggest that Jarrett was in line for anything. I do think he "took over" Calabrese Sr.'s crew while Calabrese Sr. was in prison but from what I remember all that meant was he was supposed to collect on loans etc.

I think he is actually half Italian, but I don't think he was ever in line to take over anything.

Nich calabrese didnt mention his murder so it could be possible his murder was linked directly to the drug trade. Could be rivals of the satans disciples going straight after their supply.

Jarrett was holding back on what he kicked up to Monteleone. Jarrett felt he didn't have to pay Apes the same as when LaPietra was in power. I am not sure but I believe Jarrett also blew off the first several meetings with Monteleone. That along with dealing drugs in Bridgeport area.

Johnny "Apes" Monteleone was running things while Calabrese Sr. was away per the post above.

Sounds about right. They used Jarrett's mother in law's garage in Bridgeport to kill all kinds of people, including several of the thieves who had robbed Accardo. Tied em up and slit their throats. Nasty ish.

This is a real good fucking thread guys with a lot of new shit I was unaware of...would like to start it up again. Anyone have guesses on those who were made by Inendino and Sarno in the early 2000s?

I would assume Frank Caruso Jr. since he had just got out of prison at that point...also Chris Marcotte was made under Toots I believe.

I argued it someplace else in this thread I forgot where, but I think if they made anybody it's Nick Ferriola, he's been around and he has the pedigree

I don't think they would have made a guy like Marcotte, he was with the SD's pumping alot of work here and in michagan, i not saying that thet didn't but if i had to bet i would say no, as far as Caruso Jr IDK he could very well be, the same goes for Ferriola, but i really don't THINK they would've made a guy like Marcotte. Just my 2 cents.

I've always wondered what Frank Caruso Jr. looks like. Anyone have a photo of him?

I believe he is half Italian. I thought I read somewhere that his nickname was "mezza" or something that was Italian for "half".

http://mi-cache.legacy.com/legacy/images...pg_20120212.jpg

I,m not a 100% but from what i,ve seen this appers to be him.

Oh. Well he's a good looking guy if thats him.

Nope that is not him. Here's the guy you posted.......

http://legacy.suntimes.com/obituaries/chicagosuntimes/obituary.aspx?pid=155859737#fbLoggedOut

Oh well my bad i know i seen a photo before when he was going to court on the Lenorad Cleark case

This is the photo of Caruso they used in the Family Secrets case but it's far from recent.




This is a later one. Still fairly old though. Caruso is on the right. Just click the link below.

http://af11.files.wordpress.com/2010/05/20090901_inq_jmob01z-b.jpg?w=510

Could be wrong Ivy, but I think the Frank Caruso Jr. they're talking about might be the son of the guy whose pic you posted.

The guy above is Frank Caruso Jr. Nicknamed "Toots." His father was Frank "Skids" Caruso. I have no idea if Toots has a son by the same name, but if he did, the kid would be Frank Caruso III.

ferriola is gonna end up one of the bosses

he ate his pinch and didn't rat

plus he's been groomed by heavy hitters his entire life and he's still young

He certainly did have a son. He beat the shit out of Leonard Clark in the mid 90s and went to prison. It was a major deal in Chicago...civil rights issue. Witnesses were murdered or skipped town and the Judge was threatened. Frank Sr. was forced to step out of the shadows and the entire thing put a lot of heat on the Caruso family and Bridgeport. Frank Jr. still went to prison. Main reason why the entire Caruso/Bertucci clan moved to Darien.

He's out now and recently married the daughter of Casey S. who owns video gaming machine companies used by the 26th Street and Cicero Crews.

Nick is usually found with Marco D'Amico now when not with his family and probably running another book. I believe his link to Chinatown died with Calabrese.

True he did have that drug bust some years ago...but he was working for Ronnie Jarrett at the time...so don't think that would keep him off the list. Just more evidence that the Outfit isn't above supplying street gangs with narcotics.

that sounds like a promotion if u ask me

So is ferriola with elmwood or cicero?

He was actually named as an associate of the South Side/26th Street crew in the Family Secrets case.

Ferriola's father was a Cicero guy so I believe that is why he was sucked into 26th Street and Calabrese took him under his wing. But I think when he got out, he went straight to Marco and asked permission to open a book (maybe Cicero guys still have to ask Marco's permission to open a book I don't know). I have some recent pics of Ferriola so if anyone wants them, let me know.

Also many people think that Ferriola was once the top boss...that theory is false according to my sources and he was merely the Capo of Cicero (which was still a big deal). Sam Carlisi took the top spot after Aiuppa went away in 1986 and was replaced by DiFronzo.

Thank you for the info. Very interesting.

I think Inendino is in charge of Cicero and not Matassa

Anybody know anything about "Joe Kong" Cullotta, apparently he's a Captain, also I wonder if he's releated to Frank

Inendino is indeed running Cicero now that Sarno is gone.



His name is always mispelled. His last name is actually "Calato" and he owns a ton of vending machine companies and came up under Joseph "Little Caesar" DiVarco. He's related to a few guys through marriage though I hear he is sick these days.

Joe Kong Cullotta is not even his real name so he's not related to Frank. I've heard he's inactive and has cancer.

Even if Melrose Park is 60% Hispanic, that means 40% are white. about 2/3 of the WHITE people in Melrose Park are Italian. The Mayor is Italian, The chief of Police is Italian. There are still some Italian Neighborhoods in Melrose Park along with Elmwood Park, Grand Ave.(in the city), Taylor St.(in the city), 26th St. (in the city) and a few more I can't think of right this moment.

Matassa is with Elmwood Park.

Cicero.

when I posted Cicero, I meant to say that Ferriola was with Cicero. He was never the Top Boss Of the Outfit.

The Feds don't know everything. Though in this case they are not far off. The Feds thought Joe Ferriola was the Top Boss years ago when it was really Sam Carlisi. The Feds thought Giancana took orders from Accardo years ago. Giancana listened to some of his advice out of respect for Paul Ricca, but never took orders from Acccardo. There are more than 28 made guys in the Outfit today but certainly less than 60 from several years ago when there were 6 Street Crews. Presently there are 4 Street crews. I would say counting the new men who were made in the last 10 years, you're talking about 36 to 40. 40 would be on the high side. You've then got about 100 to 120 soldiers.

40 is accurate with about 120 soldiers. This doesn't count all the associates who do business with the Outfit. Now you're talking several hundred. This would include all the street bookies who are 25% agents, all the bar owners who have poker machines etc.

This topic seems to be going on in 3 or 4 different threads. Bottom line, in 2007, the FBI didn't differentiate between "made members" and "soldiers." And even if you choose to, their estimates were 28 made members and a little over 100 associates. Which is significantly smaller than the numbers you are throwing out.

Incidentally, more recent info suggests the Outfit may be down to two or three crews.

any updates on the outfit guys? Great list by the way

Very little. I think the most accurate number of full time made soldiers and soldier/associates is between 40-50 with another 100 associates. Approx. 10 "made" guys are in prison. So suffice to say, there's about 30 made guys on the street with 100 associates.

Made men/full time soldiers in prison: James Marcello, Michael Marcello, Michael Sarno, Joseph Lombardo, Robert Bellavia, Paul Spano, Anthony Calabrese, Vito Scavo, Louis Marino, Mario Rainone, Paul Schiro.

Made men/full time soldier associates on the street: John DiFronzo, Joseph Andriacchi, Rudy Fratto, Joseph Calato, John Matassa, Peter DiFronzo, Frank Caruso, Leo Caruso, Bruno Caruso, Chris Spina, Michael Spano, Joseph Mangiamele, James Inendino, Salvatore DeLaurentis, Salvatore Cautadella, Joseph Gagliano, Sam Cecola, Tony Dote, Carl Dote, Casey Szaflarski, Dino Marino, Michael Posner, Albert Vena, Gary Gagliano, Robert Abbinanti, Fred Pascente.

Possible made men/full time soldier associates on the street: Paul Carparelli, Vegas Rick Rizzolo, Rocco Lombardo, Frank Caruso, Jr., Nick Ferriola, Vincent Forliano, John Rainone, William Daddono III, Anthony Maggio, Anthony Giannone, Jimmy DiGiulio, Anthony Spavone, Sam Bills, Robert Dominic.

Needless to say, most of these guys are in their 60s and 70s. A few are in their 50s. The only three in their 40s are Paul Carparelli, Michael Spano and Vincent Forliano. Frank Caruso, Jr. and Nick Ferriola are in their 30s.

you know the hierarchy by any chance Mmalioni? boss, underboss, consiglire, capos, soldiers, crews?

I am not 100% sure. Here is what I think. Others please feel free to disagree.

I think there is a dual hierarchy. Think of a little pyramid on top of a bigger pyramid. Or a tiny building sitting atop a big building.

At the very top top is: Boss- Johnny DiFronzo, Underboss- Peter DiFronzo, Consiglieri- Marco D'Amico. I do not think Andriacchi is active anymore on any level. I don't really think Johnny or Marco are really active, other than running very (almost legitimate) lucrative enterprises such as Aruba and high level sports betting. However, like Accardo, I do think they have final say on major things in the post Marcello era.

I think when Marcello got out in the early 2000s, he effectively began running a shadow management operation. I think the taking out of Chiaramonte in 2001 caused DiFronzo & Co. to take a step back and some type of power sharing agreement was reached. The disappearance of Zizzo in 2005 and the attempt on Sal Cautadella probably had to do with the power struggle.

When Marcello went away, that effectively eliminated the "two tier" Outfit. I do think now DiFronzo and D'Amico have final control over major major decisions, but day to day operations are run by Sal Cautadella.

Here is what I think the structure is now below the DiFronzos and D'Amico.

Street Boss- Sal Cautadella
Street Underboss- James Inendino
These two are Cicero Group 1.

Capo- Salvatore DeLaurentis (Cicero Group 2)
Capo- Frank Caruso (Chinatown/26th Street)
Capo- Albert Vena (Grand Ave. somewhat active)
Capo- Peter DiFronzo (Elmwood Park- largely inactive)

The reason I do not think Solly D is a street boss or underboss is because he gave orders directly to Paul Carparelli. Carparelli may or may not be made, but those orders would not come from the top.

Just curious, why do you think Jimmy I takes orders from Solly C? I've seen a lot of people say that I is the new power in Cicero.

What was this? I've never heard about this. Could you please expand? Thanks.

Couple other things:

Was Cautadella taking orders from Sarno?

So Marcello's group took out Zizzo, Hatch and tried to take out Cautadella and DiFronzo just sat there and took it or did DiFronzo OK them?

I am not sure whether Solly C or Jimmy I is the street boss and which one is the street underboss. I would think Solly C because he seems to be a little more white collar.

In 2006, a man in Park Ridge was gunned down with a shotgun. His house number was opposite of Solly C. Park Ridge Police suspected it was a botched hit on Solly C.

Not sure how high Sarno was ranked. I'm not sure anyone really knows. I think he may have been in charge of Cicero Crew 1 (Marcello's old crew). Maybe there was a mini mutiny between Solly C and Sarno.

I think Zizzo was loyal to DiFronzo. Hatch was a threat to Marcello's power when he got out of the penitentiary. The attempt on Solly C was possibly due to a spat between Solly C and Sarno to Sarno's much maligned leadership skills.

Being white collar in Cicero doesn't give you an edge up on being on top. If anything, being blue collar does.
And I never heard anything about that Solly C story after it happened. I feel like it was just a robbery that went wrong and as soon as the reporter found a way to bring up the mob, they did regardless.

The Chicago Mob has influence with Obama,thr president of the united states , through john coli, the son of eco coli and glimco jr the son of James glimco, both are major teamster leaders especially coli the head of joint council 25 of the teamsters

You may be right. But my take on it is that most Outfit rackets now are white collar. There is relatively little evidence of low level street level loansharking, bookmaking, restaurant shakedowns, etc. Even the poker machine racket has lost its luster.

The major Outfit rackets now are high level gaming, major loansharking, control of certain fields (McPier, restaurants, etc.). I take the position (and I could be wrong) that DiFronzo does still have enormous power, even if he doesn't exercise that power and allows other individuals to run the rackets. If that's the case, I would expect that Grand Ave. and Elmwood Park guys (even if somewhat inactive) would identify more with Solly C than with Jimmy I.

The motive for that murder in Park Ridge was not Robbery. Nothing was taken. The media reported that Solly C hadn't lived on the street in 20 years. But that doesn't mean someone didn't own that property related to Solly C and that doesn't mean he really didn't live there. That would be too much of a coincidence.

In any event, the Cicero crew is likely 2 or 3 smaller crews now. Solly C/Jimmy I. lead Crew 1, Solly D leads Crew 2 and perhaps there is some remnant of the Sarno Crew or they are morphed into one of the others.

Also, it wasn't just the media who speculated it was a botched hit. As I recall, the Feds were involved in the investigation to a degree.

A few things:

There is no "Solly C." Salvatore Cautadella goes by "Sammy C." You are confusing "Solly D" who is Sal DeLaurentis.

Sammy C moved to Westchester in 2004 or so..about 5 years after he got out of prison. So by the time of that shooting in 2006 he was long-gone, hence why no one really thinks it was Outfit.

Sarno and Sammy C are very close and came up together in the Outfit under Robert "Bobby the Boxer" Salerno and Bobby Bellavia. Sarno was the dominant of the two and took over as street boss in Cicero with Sammy C as his number two once the Spano's gave up their rackets before heading to prison. Once Solly D was out of prison in 2006, he took his rightful place at the top of the pyramid in Cicero, with Sarno and Sammy C running things for him (he was still on parole). When Jimmy I came out of prison a few years later, he and Solly D retained leadership of the Cicero Crew. Solly D slowly became more hands-on as his parole restrictions loosened up, however he continued to allow Sarno and Sammy the "acting" positions.

My theory is that when Sarno went away, Sammy C took his spot and Solly D and Jimmy I continue to stay a safe distance away.

The bigger question is who inherited the rackets of this guy--the main money maker for Cicero--Casy Szaflarski--when he went away. Casey is a Bridgeport native and owned by the Carusos. I believe he is a nephew of Shorty LaMantia.

Whatever it was, it wasn't related to Sammy. His adult son lived in the same neighborhood but he is a relatively legit guy.

Here is a recent photo of Sammy.

According to the FBI, he was the Outfit's acting boss prior to his indictment.

You theory is that Solly D and Inendino are #1 and #2 as street boss and street underboss and Cataudella is the Capo?

The reason I do not think Solly D is #1 there is because he wouldn't be giving direct orders to a guy like Carparelli. Solly D is a Capo, but is not a street boss.

Eh the Solly stuff is my fault. I thought he was also referred to by that nickname. Chitown, I know it's probably been brought up before I don't remember, but did you grow up in these neighborhoods?

Mickey Marcello got out of prison back in October. Not sure if he's in a halfway house or back home.

I don't think you can make the conclusion that Solly is giving orders to Carparelli from the media coverage of that indictment. Do you think that Mooney or Joe B never gave specific orders or "pet projects" to street soldiers he was close with in the 50s and 60s?

It came from the Indictment itself, not the media report.

In any case, maybe you are right. Nobody knows unless you are actually part of the Outfit.

Maybe we are all wrong and the top two are two completely different people. Or there is no organized structure and no one in charge.

Who really knows.

^^^^^^

d'amico probably calls it in chicago

Good point and wouldn't doubt if there is a sleeper at the top...few people knew Al Tournabene before Family Secrets, yet he was someone communicating with DiFronzo and being chauffeured by Bruno Caruso. Joe Belli of Elmwood Park for instance is probably a guy who has been made just as long as Gary Gagliano, yet no one knows who he is.

True about Belli and I forgot him and Nick Boscarino on my list. Effectively, I think there are around 50 made men and maybe 100 associates (maybe 20 of whom are full time soldier/associates). As to how many are active, that I don't know.

In any case, all but a half dozen are in their 50s-80s. Even the guys in their 50s are few and far between. This is at least the ones we know about.

Separate question, Culotta likes to tell the story about how the Feds played him a wiretap of someone in Chicago telling Spilotro to "clean his dirty laundry". Anyone know who it was who said that? Lombardo?

I grew up in the heights and Cal City what do you want to know?

Is there any photos of solly c catudella

Nick was a relatively legit guy who simply let his social circle use him a little too much...he is linked up with the Daddono family. Nick's brother Anthony was the real criminal of the two...he may still be locked up, I'm not sure. Anthony was in Vegas for a long time.

Here is a Chicago Outfit Chart from 2010 done by Scott Burnstein. He posted this over on Real Deal and it was something I thought was definitely worth sharing:

http://img823.imageshack.us/img823/7967/outfitt.gif

No offense to Mr. Burnstein and his list concerning the Southside but there are many missing from this list as well as he's listed some twice. Too many missing to be any kind of accurate.

Yes just Google image him.

I don't get why it says 2010. I just looked at the first two rows.

Ferriola and Carlisi were long dead by then.

Lombardo was in jail etc.

I'm sure there are 100 other things wrong as well.

If you look close, it shows that Carlisi and Ferriola were deceased and shows that Lombardo is incarcerated...it says deceased above their names, very faint as you may need to auto enhance the chart. It also shows imprisoned members and members under indictment.

I see.

Well, IMO, the chart seems pretty much like a wild guess, but I guess nearly all of them are.

He seems to have gotten most of the major players right.

Honestly unless the FBI releases a chart, I don't think any of them are really worth that much.

My only point is that informed speculation is one thing, and of interest.

But I think that there is so little known about the current structure and even activity of the Outfit that the speculation in most instances would not qualify as particularly informed.

If I was guessing I would actually think that HSAC's guess, as a rule of thumb, is most accurate:

Elmwood Park for the most part defunct

Cicero/Bridgeport/perhaps Grand Ave. to a smaller degree, all globbed together more or less, and the only real active Outfit these days

But that too is just a guess

One thing I'm saying though is that I think it makes sense that as the overall activity of the Outfit has declined, the structure perhaps has as well

It's the difference between working at a company with 5K employees and 15. The former necessitates absolutely rigid structure. The latter necessitates virtually none.

But, of course, all guesswork.

That's just what sounds most likely to me.

It's still hard for me to comprehend that the Outfit is down to 30 guys like the FBI said. Chicago has no competing LCN groups and if NY has five families, can't understand why the Outfit hasn't been replenishing the ranks.

I think it's more to do with historical trends.

How many guys do you know who would want to sign up to be in the mob these days, LOL.

Even during the height of it, Chicago didn't have anymore than 75 made guys.

True

I would have assumed that they were as big as the Genovese/Gambino Family at their height. Especially since the Patriarca Family were 100 strong in its heyday. Hard to believe.

Well numerically the height would have been under Capone, when they didn't make guys.

In terms of power probably under Ricca/Giancana/Humphries/Accardo. I have no idea how many made guys there were then, or even if they were making guys at that point.

Seems that its always been a little more difficult to paint a clear picture in Chicago. Not saying Burnstein's chart is accurate, but he does claim to have made it based on FBI and CCC sources. I see no real reason for him to lie, how many more of his books would he actually sell? And in fairness, he has never said all the guys listed as soldiers on that chart are necessarily made. The structure may certainly be off though.

The FBI in my experience hasn't really made claims about knowing the structure, except very vaguely, at least in recent times.

Usually the media reports people like "boss," which is a nice vague term--boss of the whole thing? Boss of a crew? Boss of a neighborhood?

Clearly for instance Sarno was in charge of something... but I don't think the feds generally try to exactly define the position... as they don't know. And, as I said, the structure may be surprisingly loose.

I don't ever remember hearing anyone suggesting that Peter DiFronzo or Matassa were the bosses of anything.

What interests me is what happens with guys who are going to be filtering out of prison. I know speculation already started on here a few months back, wonder if guys like Salerno, Marino, Bellavia, and Spano retire once they get out. All are certainly up there in age. Generally keeping quiet and taking long prison terms enhances your status.

I think the Outfit is around 50 made guys/full time soldier associates and 100 associates. About 30 of those 50 are active.

As for structure, there is definitely a distinction between Cicero, 26th St and Grand Ave/Elmwood. Whether EP is active and Cicero is actually 2 or 3 crews, who knows.

As for who is in charge, it's well known that Frank Caruso runs 26th St. As to the rest, no one really knows for sure.

The only one I would think could reactivate is Marino because his son Dino is likely made. I believe Paul Spano's on Michael is made but not very active.

I personally would go with the feds most recent number of about 28 made guys on the street.

This is from the FBI immediately following Family Secrets:


"We have 28 made members of the Chicago Outfit roaming in the Chicagoland area. We have over 100 associates of the Chicago Outfit," Grant said.

http://abclocal.go.com/wls/story?section=news/local&id=5681103

Therefore, if this is accurate, that number would not include the known made men in prison, including those who went away in FS.

Being from the area and working in the Southside I've got to say that ANYONE thinking they can list anything accurately in Chicago has another thing coming. If you concentrate only on the Italians you'll never get the scope of it. Torrio realized early that the only real factor is money, the only nationality is money and that's how the outfit works.

Gus Alex, Murray Humphreys, Ralph Pierce, Billy Dauber etc. "Can you make money?" that's the only question. Gamblers in Cal City may remember "Gold Man" who most certainly was not Italian. To try and view the Outfit like an East Coast family is not possible in many ways. Overly formalized thinking patterns don't work there.

Chicago is in fact a template for what's happened in general with most of organized crime in the United States in modern times, expansion, retrenchment and invisibility. Chicago was the first to look West and only because they did were gangsters like Bugsy Siegel drawn there in the first place. Anything West of the Mississippi as far as Eastern mobsters went, the first cut went to Chicago. Nowadays, who can say? The businesses are so deeply entrenched at this point, it would be finding needles in stacks of needles. Don Angelini's kid is a lawyer for Christ's sake. Slicker and no longer in the old neighborhood much. Northwest Suburbs and NW Indiana and in chambers of commerce. Baboom.

This came from Goudie via the Chicago Crime Comission in 2007 directly following FS, for what it's worth:

Seventy-eight-year old No Nose John Difronzo is the boss; Difronzo's major domo is his brother Peter, whom mobwatchers say acts as an errand boy, delivering orders to outfit associates.

The current underboss: Joseph "The Builder" Andriacchi, a convicted burglar. Andriacchi is said to control the daily operation of four criminal crews:

his own Elmwood Park crew;
the lucrative 26th Street/Chinatown crew assigned to Frank "Toots" Caruso who has deep political and labor union ties;
south suburbs, overseen by outfit octogenarian al "The Pizza Man" Tornabene.
finally, Cicero, managed by John "Pudge" Matassa.

BWT what is the Chicago Crime Commission?

I've seen them quoted for years.

Do they know what they're talking about?

And what is the laborers site, isdn or whatever it is.

Is that reporting accurate?

I think Goudie got one thing wrong. The Heights and 26th St. are have been one crew since Johnny Apes. Matassa is EP.

The media often confuses Cicero, Melrose Park and Elmwood Park. Cicero and Melrose Park are one crew.

The thing is, from that report, that info either came from the CCC or the FBI, and the way it is phrased, it's the CCC.

That is why I was wondering if they really knew what they were talking about or if they are just amateur "mobologists" like most other writers etc.

The Feds also told you that Family Secrets, which didn't even touch the current boss, and the previous 10 Outfit trials beforehand "crushed" the Chicago cosa nostra family. You gonna take their word there too? The Feds don't know everything...in Chicago they are busier focusing on politicians than following around the few gangsters that remain.

They never said that.

In fact Mitch Mars came out after FS and said the exact opposite. I remember the quote nearly verbatim, "The Outfit isn't going anywhere and neither are we."

Why would the FBI ever diminish the stature of the Outfit?

That would essentially be telling their budget director in Washington to decrease their budget. That ain't how government works.

ChiTown makes good points and as I've stated before if you concentrate strictly on the Italians you'll never get the whole scope. Bernstein is good but Detroit is his wheelhouse. As I've watched for years I've never heard the real boss of the South Side mentioned. Interesting void of information in the Southerly direction.

Matassa is a Cicero guy even though he sometimes drives Marco D'Amico around. He likely reports to Solly D.

Here is an old photo of Pudge:


Cicero and Melrose Park are not one crew...guys like Marco, Dote and Andriacchi are from Melrose Park

Please they use more sensationalist language than anyone in their materials...again, Chicago is different and there are no "active budgets" or agents focused on the mob. They just have bigger fish to fry here...but when something falls right into their lap (like Frank Calabrese Jr.) then they will put on a big dog and pony show and pat themselves on the back.

Your photos are pretty impressive, ChiTown!

Ha... you must have some stories to have stuff like that.

I believe that is incorrect. There are FBI agents actively working on the Outfit. It was posted in an article in these forums some time ago. Yes, it was only a handful.

Well, of course they pat themselves on the back.

They want to appear like they are doing a good job just like nearly everyone.

Matassa has a good union job with the Transit Unit I read.

Maybe this will help. Next to last paragraph.

http://chicago.cbslocal.com/2012/08/12/grant-organized-crime-alive-and-well-in-chicago/

Yes, excellent.

Pudge wears the Chicago mustache very well.

Jim Wagner was head of the CCC until 2009...and he was an OC FBI squad Supervisor. I'm guessing his connections and experience would rate more than mob watcher status.

Btw that article with Grant is pretty crazy when you think about it. Only one full time OC squad in Chicago and only two for NYC. Amazing to see how much of their resources have gone to Terrorism.

Yeah... well, even at their worst probably 99 percent of the mob homicides were against other gangsters.

Far less of a public threat than Islamic terrorists!

I think the biggest threat from the mob these days is corruption. But I suppose that has nearly always been the case.

I wonder if those two squads in NYC are devoted to LCN exclusively or if that includes other OC ethnic groups like Grant says the OC squad in Chicago is set up. The other thread seems to indicate that they are focused on LCN, but who knows.


ChiTown, in your estimation how many made members are there these days?

The two new york squads are devoted to inveistigating lcn. Theres one squad for the
Genovese, Colombo, and Bonanno families and the other squad is for the gambino and luchese families.

Any idea many squads devoted to OC of other ethnic groups like the Russians?

I have no real concept...but I would assume it is a small number and that is a strategic design by them. Most of the ones that are made and major leaders are interrelated to other made members...in fact if someone were to paste a list of made members, I could probably say who was related or married to who. Again a strategic design...though the Calabrese family might make you think otherwise, I think we can all agree it is much harder to testify against your in-laws or uncles.

i believe there is a unit dedicated to what the feds refer to as Eurasian OC groups which includes russians and albanians among others. i know they used to have a squad solely dedicated to Asian OC groups but im not sure if it wasn't combined with another unit with all the downsizing going on, then they have other units to investigate DTOs like the colombians and mexicans.

1. Joseph Andriacchi
2. Dominic Basso
3. Robert Bellavia
4. Frank Calabrese
5. Bruno Caruso
6. Frank Caruso
7. Leo Caruso
8. Marco D'Amico
9. John DiFronzo
10. Joseph DiFronzo
11. Peter M. DiFronzo
12. Salvatore DeLaurentis
13. Rudolph Fratto
14. Michael Gurgone
15. James Inendino
16. Joseph Frank LaMantia
17. Joseph Lombardo
18. Rocco Lombardo
19. Michael Magnifichi
20. James Marcello
21. Louis Marino
22. John Matassa
23. Salvatore Muserino
24. Albert Roverio
25. Michael Spano Sr.
26. John Eugene Spizzirri
27. Richard Allen Spizzirri
28. Michael C. Talarico

If the chronology on the Goudie piece is correct, the guys convicted under FS would not have been included in the 28.

1. Joseph Andriacchi
2. Dominic Basso
3. Robert Bellavia
4. Frank Calabrese
5. Bruno Caruso
6. Frank Caruso
7. Leo Caruso
8. Marco D'Amico
9. John DiFronzo
10. Joseph DiFronzo
11. Peter M. DiFronzo
12. Salvatore DeLaurentis
13. Rudolph Fratto
14. Michael Gurgone
15. James Inendino
16. Joseph Frank LaMantia
17. Joseph Lombardo
18. Rocco Lombardo
19. Michael Magnifichi
20. James Marcello
21. Louis Marino
22. John Matassa
23. Salvatore Muserino
24. Albert Roverio
25. Michael Spano Sr.
26. John Eugene Spizzirri
27. Richard Allen Spizzirri
28. Michael C. Talarico

Not sure who the other three would be.

Pretty sure one would have to be Mike Sarno.
Chris Spina?
Joe Cullotta/Calato?

Can anyone name the made/ connected guys in Vegas? or do I need to start another thread?

Basso is dead

You'd have to also add Vena to that list.

It's come up on here before but I can't remember who or where.

Yeah, I was going to say Vena.

And I forgot Don Scalise, if he is still alive. Fosco claims he is made but was shelved by DiFronzo a few years back.

Fosco also claims Joe DiFronzo isn't made and we all know what he thinks about Marco.

Don Scalise died a few months back

Your missing:

Mike sarno
Salvatore cautadella
Al vena
Dino Marino
Christie spina

I would go ahead an throw these names out there as possibilities, too:

Solly Cautadella
Nicholas Guzzino
Tony Dote
Bobby Abbinanti
Frank Catapano
Joe Saladino

The list wasn't made by me. I think Ivy or someone else posted in a couple of years ago in this same thread.

people don't realize how many shitholes like alsip, midlothian, thornton, etc. exist

so of course they don't understand the southside

Virgil Cimino is supposedly pretty heavy too no?

I don't think it's a coincidence that the fed's number more or less coincides with the number, give or take a handful, that a bunch of people who primarily get their information from the media, with a small degree of word of mouth (us), come up with.

Of those listed you could probably put about 15 who are hard core gangsters who have been arrested multiple times and if they weren't "made" it would be surprising.

Another 10 or so who are again on public record for being, at the least, heavily involved.

And a handful who are more under the radar.

That is one reason why I think the number is probably accurate.

If someone were to come up with 30 more probable "made" guys, it would be a far more nebulous exercise...

The question marks on this list would be ahead of the most suspicious guys on the next list.

So, I don't think it's a coincidence.

40-50 including those in jail seems to make sense. Also, the Outfit seemed to always be much more selective with who was actually made than NY.

The Vegas wise guys are:

Sam Cecola
Vegas Rick Rizzolo
Joseph Cusumano

Unknown if Cusumano is active. Unlikely though. Unknown if Cecola and Rizzolo are made or really active.

Just out of curiousity as a kid growing up, I was told Franklin Park was once a mob town. Is that true, and if so did they just move on eventually?

If you have been a career criminal I would have to assume that by the time you spend 5-10 in the can and waking up everyday ducking the law and fighting with your counterparts that by the time you hit 60 the shit would begin to wear on you. As far as associates go I feel it has to been trying taking orders from a gangster everyday granted we all know the are perks but for the most part it would seem like 60-70 years old would be outs if possible. Then again its an entirely different mindstate for criminal than for a kid you grew up in the burbs and was given a chance life to be what HE wants.

The list is missing more than several names. And Rocco Lombardo is not a made man LOL

Also, Tony Dote & Bob Abbinanti are not made men.

Bobby and Tony D are definitely made.

Under who and when? Abbinanti maybe. Not likely. Dote no way. Heavy guys, but not at made.

Make a list HSA we value your delusions so very much man please Inform us of which one of this guys lost his wallet under you ma's bed.

Not made** Maybe in very recent years? But under whom?

All I know about Bobby Abbinanti is that he figured prominently in Cooley's book, he was Marco's muscle.

He was one of the more prominent goons. But I read it so long ago and I can't really remember much else.

Then he came out on the news a few years ago denying some report that Rod Blogovaich had once been a bookie under him, LOL.

Also to the mods, for some reason I was banned on my home computer/IP. I have to think it was a mistake as I have not said or done anything offensive.

Same here...I was having issues on my mobile devices. I don't think it was intentional as I'm able to get on now.


HSAC...who else would you add?

True, but you see lots of old guys get out of the can and still live the life. Its all they've known for forty years. Sonny Franzese was still active and he's in his 90s.

Cool, thanks. Must have been a technical issue.

I just sent the board administrator an email asking my forum status. I got the same message from my mobile phone saying my IP address was banned from the forum. I've had a few disagreements with a few posters, but didn't think anything was "over the top." Hopefully, it's an error with the site.

Blagojevich & Abbinanti came up together since they were children. Abbinanti hooked Rob up with Marco D.

Ha...I don't doubt it. I wouldn't put anything past Rod.

I have been banned from my home IP. Not quite sure why.

During the Family Secrets trial, a couple different articles cited the FBI as saying there were 4 crews and who the leaders were. More recently, in 2011, one FBI official said the Outfit was down to "two or three crews."

As I said earlier in this thread, the FBI said Sarno was the Outfit's acting boss prior to him being indicted.



That 28 number they cited appears to be a total figure, as FBI officials also referenced 25 and 30 members elsewhere.



Notice how those non-Italian examples are from the distant past. The Chicago mob is very much an Italian thing now in terms of it's structure and the real power-players left. And the FBI is going to have as accurate an accounting of the Outfit's membership as any other family.



That list was originally posted on another forum years ago by a well known, and very well research poster on the Outfit. It was a list of names who he had specifically seen cited as made members of the Chicago Outfit. There may have been a few that were incorrect but I imagine most of them were right.



No it wasn't a coincidence. The researcher I mentioned above said one time that the FBI actually released a list of 47 names of Outfit members to the local media back in the late 1990's. Since that time, about 20 Outfit members have died, leaving a number very close to what the feds have cited in recent years. If it makes some people feel better to believe the Outfit has 40, 50, 100 or whatever number, so be it, but it's pretty clear what the FBI has said.

kinda like how the non-italian guy that got indicted with sarno was the videopoker guy

a non-italian was the top videopoker guy not very long ago

Yeah, Szaflarski is, obviously, not all Italian, if Italian at all.

But it is entirely possible that he is the video poker guy without being made or really calling any shots.

Szaflarski is Italian. Not full but he is Italian

That list is probably a decent start

Take out Calabrese , Lombardo 's , Difronzo's, Mags , Basso , Marcello

Add in Vena , Sal C, Sarno , Spina plus another 5-7 made guys that we don't

Know about and you are in that 28-30 made range .

I think the FBI estimates are pretty much on point . Outside of the outfit members, kin and high level associates, the bureau probably has more accurate info than anyone else .

With a scaled down org of 30 members focused predominately on loan sharking , gambling, some union . some street tax and the phasing out of extreme violence , you are going to have a pretty secret but profitable organization .

Now it's not the mob we know or like to read about but for those 30 or so guys , they are making solid $ and with the phasing out of extreme violence you have guys not going to jail . Imo it's smart in today's age , just not sexy for followers as it looks like nothing is going on . This trend probably started much earlier than the FS trial as that trial shows how murder was phasing out in the 90s . offers

The one negative is with such a smaller organization , 1 big bust or crackdown could knock them down or even out for a long time ala what we saw in other families like KC , Tampa , Cleveland Lousiana , etc . . However one thing you are always going to have with the outfit is big sharking activities , with or without an umbrella organization, there will always be Italian men in chi town making boatloads of $ sharking ( the few banks are who make the real $, the others do ok )

First, it certainly helps that he's Frank Caruso's son in law. Second, while he was overseeing a substantial video poker operation, that doesn't make him part of the Outfit hierarchy.

False. His daughter Britt is married to Frank Jr. Casey himself is married to Shorty LaMantia's daughter. He is a long-time Bridgeport guy and grew up with the Caruso's and Aldo P...has been running with that crew for decades. He is also Italian...despite the Polish name. He is certainly up there but is under Caruso.

Also Casey essentially took over the distribution companies that Marcello owned when he went to prison. Even as recently as 2007, they were turning over their companies to him. When Jimmy got his sentence and Mickey went away, Sarno and Caruso needed guys without reputations to transfer all the machine businesses. Casey was that guy.

This is the list I posted a week ago that I made with a few new additions.

Made men/full time soldiers in prison:

James Marcello
Michael Sarno
Joseph Lombardo
Robert Bellavia
Paul Spano
Anthony Calabrese
Vito Scavo
Louis Marino
Mario Rainone
Paul Shiro

Made men/full time soldier associates on the street:

John DiFronzo
Joseph Andriacchi
Joseph Calato
John Matassa
Peter DiFronzo
Joseph DiFronzo
Frank Caruso
Leo Caruso
Bruno Caruso
Chris Spina
Michael Spano
Joseph Mangiamele
James Inendino
Salvatore DeLaurentis
Salvatore Cautadella
Joseph Gagliano
Gary Gagliano
Michael Gurgone
Sam Cecola
Tony Dote
Carl Dote
Casey Szaflarski
Dino Marino
Michael Posner
Albert Vena
Robert Abbinanti
Fred Pascente
Michael Marcello
Nicholas Guzzino
Joseph Saladino
Joseph Venezia

Possible made men/full time soldier associates on the street:

Paul Carparelli
Vegas Rick Rizzolo
Rocco Lombardo
Frank Caruso, Jr.
Nick Ferriola
Vincent Forliano
John Rainone
William Daddono Jr.
William Daddono III
Anthony Maggio
Anthony Giannone
Jimmy DiGiulio
Anthony Spavone
Sam Bills
Robert Dominic
Rocco Marcello
Aldo Piscitelli Jr.
Joseph Belli
Richard Spizzirri
Eugene Spizzirri
Joseph Bastone
Carmine Bastone Jr.
Virgil Cimino

Shelved:

Michael Magnifichi
Joseph Cusumano
Murray Ehrenberg

Confidential Informants:

Nick Calabrese
Frank Calabrese Jr.
Kurt Calabrese
Michael Talarico
Joel Glickman
Frank Cullotta
Ronald Jarrett Jr.
Allen Glick
Sal Romano