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Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted

Posted By: IvyLeague

Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/18/11 08:24 PM

LONG ISLAND PRESS RELEASES

For Immediate Release: October 18, 2011

A.G. Schneiderman & NYPD Commissioner Kelly Announce 37 Arrests In Massive Organized Crime Takedown


Long Island Press Releases —
Operation “Flat Rate” Uncovers Sophisticated Multi-Million Dollar Loan Sharking, Gambling & Extortion Rings

Arrests Include Members of Gambino Crime Family

(New York) – Attorney General Eric T. Schneiderman and New York City Police Commissioner Raymond W. Kelly today announced the arrests of 37 individuals on charges stemming from the operation of lucrative loan sharking and gambling activities closely controlled by the Gambino crime family.

A series of early morning raids conducted by Attorney General Schneiderman’s Organized Crime Task Force (OCTF) and the New York City Police Department’s Organized Crime Investigations Division, capped a long-term investigation dubbed “Operation Flat Rate.” Based on the evidence obtained in this investigation, the Attorney General’s office secured five separate indictments from a Kings County grand jury, charging a total of 37 individuals on felony and misdemeanor charges. A full list of all charged individuals is included below.

“These arrests cripple a network of criminal enterprises and the organized crime family they supported,” Attorney General Schneiderman said. “The partnership between OCTF and the NYPD provided the skills and resources needed to bring the 37 individuals charged here to justice, and our offices will continue our work to dismantle these criminal ventures.”

“Illegal gambling rings not only promote addiction and burden families with debt from usurious loans, but the proceeds from gambling and loan sharking are used to fuel organized crime and support harmful criminal enterprises,” New York City Police Commissioner Raymond W. Kelly said. “I want to commend the New York State Attorney General’s Office and the NYPD’s Organized Crime Investigations Division for today’s arrests.”

The investigation used a number of resources including wiretaps, video and audio surveillance, GPS tracking, and bugs inside key locations to gather evidence. Surveillance was also conducted throughout the streets of Brooklyn, Staten Island, Manhattan, and New Jersey, where different aspects of the criminal activity unfolded. Some defendants would conduct business on street corners in an effort to avoid detection by law enforcement.

“Operation Flat Rate” was a long-term investigation into the alleged loan sharking and bookmaking activities of alleged Gambino ‘soldiers,’ or ‘made’ members, Vincent Romano and James Outerie, and alleged Gambino ‘associates,’ or ‘non-made’ members, Louis Lombardo, Louis Peteroy, Frank Esposito, Christopher Sorrentino and Nicolas Fulciniti, among others.

Throughout the investigation, intercepted conversations revealed the hierarchy and alleged criminal activities of the three related Gambino crime family enterprises. According to the charges, two illegal sports gambling operations were run through offshore wire rooms that handled wagers on college and professional sports, as well as horse races. According to the charges, these gambling operations generated millions of dollars worth of wagers.

The charges also assert that one of these three enterprises was a ‘policy operation,’ or an illegal playing the numbers scheme, in which bets were placed on the New York Lottery’s Numbers and Win 4 games. In some instances, victims of the loan sharking enterprise would be required to place wagers on the numbers – all to finance the policy betting operation.

In three of the five indictments unsealed in Kings County today, 35 defendants are charged with Enterprise Corruption based on a pattern of illegal gambling and loan sharking activities. The Enterprise Corruption charge alone carries a maximum penalty of 8 1/3 to 25 years in prison.

Two of the Enterprise Corruption defendants, Mr. Esposito and Mr. Sorrentino, along with two other defendants, were also charged in the fourth indictment, which alleges the extension of a usurious loan and the use of extortion to collect weekly interest payments. The fifth indictment charges Michelle Valente with Conspiracy in the Fourth and Fifth Degree.

“Operation Flat Rate” was conducted by Supervising Investigators Paul Grzegorski and Arthur Schwartz, and Senior Investigator Brian Fleming under the supervision of OCTF’s Eugene Black. The investigation was conducted along with New York City Police Department Detective Biagio Santangelo of the New York City Police Department’s Organized Crime Investigations Division, under the supervision of Sergeant Brian Reicht and Lieutenant Jack Iocouvou, and under the overall supervision of Inspector Brian O’Neill and Organized Crime Control Chief Anthony Izzo.

The cases are being prosecuted by OCTF Assistant Deputy Attorney General Laura Kirschstein under the supervision of OCTF Deputy Attorney General Peri Alyse Kadanoff, under the overall supervision of Executive Deputy Attorney General for Criminal Justice Nancy Hoppock.

The charges are merely accusations and the defendants are presumed innocent until and unless proven guilty in the court of law.

DEFENDANTS

The defendants charged today as a result of five separate indictments from a Kings County grand jury are:

Vincent Romano, 74, Staten Island, New York
James Outerie, 57, Staten Island, New York
Steven Fusco, 51, Staten Island, New York
Nicola Fulciniti, 41, Staten Island, New York
Michael Epstein, 43, Brooklyn, New York
Jason Sobel, 30, Brooklyn, New York
Arthur Lento 46, Staten Island, New York
Dave Franzese, 32, Staten Island, New York
Louis Peteroy, 64, Staten Island, New York
Frank Esposito, 56, Staten Island, New York
Christopher Sorrentino, 53, Staten Island, New York
Michelle Valente, 35, Staten Island, New York
Bernadette Impliazzo, 50, Staten Island
Patrick Prisco, 49, Nutley, New Jersey
Joseph Casazza, 28, Staten Island, New York
Anthony Crapanzano, 49, Barnegat, New Jersey
John Marinacci, 56, New York, New York
Martin Milone, 53, Marlboro, New Jersey
Ronald Piggot, 42, Watchung, New Jersey
Mark Sini, 35, Staten Island, New York
Michael Bolger, 44, Brick, New Jersey
Wane Fasano, 58, Secaucus, New Jersey
Kenneth Nappi, 42, Brick, New Jersey
Steve Heisman, 41, Toms River, New Jersey
Louis Lombardo, 41, Brooklyn, New York
Joseph Castellano, 48, Brooklyn, New York
Anthony Castellano, 58, Brooklyn, New York
Paul Platania, 67, Queens, New York
Joseph Esposito, 74, Brooklyn, New York
Richard Heck, 61, Queens, New York
Pietro Mastrandrea, 41, Queens, New York
Alex Petrillo, 66, Brooklyn, New York
Joseph Gurrieri, 79, Brooklyn, New York
Anthony Deluca, 73, Brooklyn, New York
Joseph Russo, 29, Brooklyn, New York
Angelo Natoli, 28, Brooklyn, New York
Nicholas Disbrow, 30, Staten Island, New York

http://www.longislandexchange.com/press/...crime-takedown/
Posted By: rg

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/18/11 09:01 PM

wow..
Posted By: JCrusher

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/18/11 09:15 PM

Its funny because one day people will say the mob is dead then the next day there is a big mob arrest for a multi-million dollar operation lol
Posted By: Scorsese

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/18/11 09:35 PM

I know that gambling is their main activity but do you think that their is a considerable number of them involved in drug and sex trafficking?
Posted By: Mukremin

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/18/11 10:07 PM

Drugs is one of the things i think most of them are involved in, its risky but highly lucrative. I am not sure about sex trafficking.
Posted By: Nicholas

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/18/11 10:18 PM

Damn that is a long list of defendants!!
Posted By: Scorsese

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/18/11 10:40 PM

Their probably able to move quite a bit of cocaine and synthetic drugs such as ectacy and kettamine. They probably have the whole jersey shore market because those are customers that they probably have easier access to. I only mentioned the sex trafficking because of that other case when they were caught pimping out underage girls. Id be suprised if they didnt carry it on considering its just as lucratiive as drugs.
Posted By: Rocco1313

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/18/11 10:44 PM

“Illegal gambling rings not only promote addiction and burden families with debt from usurious loans, but the proceeds from gambling and loan sharking are used to fuel organized crime and support harmful criminal enterprises,” New York City Police Commissioner Raymond W. Kelly said.

O fuck off with this nonsense.
Posted By: rg

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/18/11 11:49 PM

Drugs.. No. This was about loans n gambling. Everyone knew this was coming. These guys made alot of money. Does anyone have a link to the full indictment
Posted By: m2w

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/19/11 12:07 AM

are the castellano's arrested related to big paulie?
Posted By: moolou

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/19/11 01:32 AM

Wow, it's pretty interesting that numbers was one of the operations busted. That's a blast from the past.
Posted By: m2w

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/19/11 02:20 AM

several guys are young, it's not true that the mafia today has little manpower that's another fake legend
whole areas like long island, staten island, part of brooklyn, new jersey queens and even bronx are litterally full of mafiosi or people around them
Posted By: LuanKuci

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/19/11 06:10 AM

Originally Posted By: m2w
several guys are young, it's not true that the mafia today has little manpower that's another fake legend
whole areas like long island, staten island, part of brooklyn, new jersey queens and even bronx are litterally full of mafiosi or people around them

Westchester County, South Jersey, Philly, and parts of New England too.

Many things have been exaggerated.
Posted By: IvyLeague

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/19/11 06:39 AM

Originally Posted By: Scorsese
I know that gambling is their main activity but do you think that their is a considerable number of them involved in drug and sex trafficking?


Gambling (in all it's forms) and loansharking are the two most consistent money makers. But other things, like extortion, drug trafficking, labor racketeering, stolen goods, and various types of fraud are also major money makers.

The sex trade is largely passe for the mob. Both prostitution and the porn business. But they're still big into strip clubs.
Posted By: IvyLeague

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/19/11 07:05 AM

News video on the bust -

http://www.wpix.com/videogallery/65500846/News/Major-Mob-Bust-Announced


By the way, with Richard Maldone (Albert Barese) in 2003 and Tony Darrow (Larry Barese) in 2009, that's now 3 Sopranos actors that have been busted in cases involving the Gambinos.
Posted By: IvyLeague

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/19/11 07:06 AM

Some charts....

http://media.silive.com/latest_news/other/Grand%20Jury%20Charts.pdf

Attached picture gambinobookmakingindict.jpg
Attached picture gambinobookmakingindict (1).jpg
Attached picture gambinobookmakingindict (2).jpg
Posted By: LuanKuci

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/19/11 07:50 AM

Originally Posted By: IvyLeague
News video on the bust -

http://www.wpix.com/videogallery/65500846/News/Major-Mob-Bust-Announced
By the way, with Richard Maldone (Albert Barese) in 2003 and Tony Darrow (Larry Barese) in 2009, that's now 3 Sopranos actors that have been busted in cases involving the Gambinos.

NO WAY...Alley Boy was mobbed up? Woo
Who's #3?

Raymond Franza (Donald Cafranza) was arrested for SS fraud in 2009.
Posted By: IvyLeague

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/19/11 07:57 AM

Originally Posted By: LuanKuci


Who's #3?


The guy who was in this latest bust - John Marinacci. Not sure what character he played on the show.
Posted By: Scorsese

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/19/11 10:41 AM

He played like a dealer at a card game or something not sure if his character was named.
Posted By: Scorsese

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/19/11 10:57 AM

Originally Posted By: IvyLeague
Originally Posted By: Scorsese
I know that gambling is their main activity but do you think that their is a considerable number of them involved in drug and sex trafficking?


Gambling (in all it's forms) and loansharking are the two most consistent money makers. But other things, like extortion, drug trafficking, labor racketeering, stolen goods, and various types of fraud are also major money makers.

The sex trade is largely passe for the mob. Both prostitution and the porn business. But they're still big into strip clubs.
Thanks for that ivy league.Do you think that some of the low level guys were perhaps just normal people running their own little gambling rings and then were shaken down by the gambino soldiers and forced to work for them making them apart of the much larger consopiracy?

I only mentioned sex trafficking because of the arrests last year of gambino family members and also because they seemed to be from several articles heavily involved with both prostitution and pornogaphry during the seventies and perhaps into the eighties.
Posted By: rg

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/19/11 02:02 PM

IS there a pdf on the full indictment IVY?
Posted By: pizzaboy

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/19/11 04:43 PM

Originally Posted By: IvyLeague
The sex trade is largely passe for the mob. Both prostitution and the porn business.

Not to mention that free porn on the internet has done more to curb the pay-for-porn business than the crackdown on Times Square ever did.

The mob is not dead. Not by a longshot. But it's not the same (or as powerful) as it once was. If you thnk it's still like it was in films like "Goodfellas" or "Donnie Brasco," you're being, in the words of my pal Ivy, a fanboy. Those were accurate depictions of the times, but it's just not like that anymore. Times change and all that.

The mob will always be around, to some degree, because of its two lynchpins: gambling and shylocking. People will always want to gamble, and low income/high risk type debtors will always need to borrow money somewhere. It's a supply and demand thing (whether or not the Italians remain the ones to supply those demands is open to debate).

Originally Posted By: LuanKuci
Westchester County, South Jersey, Philly, and parts of New England too.
True, also very telling. The mob had to move to the suburbs to survive wink.

Originally Posted By: LuanKuci
NO WAY...Alley Boy was mobbed up?

Surprised you don't remember that, LK. It got a ton of press at the time because it cost him his job on the show. You can't act from jail lol.
Posted By: Frank

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/19/11 07:51 PM

Originally Posted By: m2w
several guys are young, it's not true that the mafia today has little manpower that's another fake legend
whole areas like long island, staten island, part of brooklyn, new jersey queens and even bronx are litterally full of mafiosi or people around them


this!
Posted By: Frank

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/19/11 08:04 PM

how many made men were involved in the 37 arrested?i read a lot of italian name
Posted By: IvyLeague

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/19/11 08:10 PM

Originally Posted By: Scorsese
Thanks for that ivy league.Do you think that some of the low level guys were perhaps just normal people running their own little gambling rings and then were shaken down by the gambino soldiers and forced to work for them making them apart of the much larger consopiracy?


The mob certainly still does shake down unaffiliated bookies but, in this case, officials allege it was overseen directly by the Gambinos.

Quote:
I only mentioned sex trafficking because of the arrests last year of gambino family members and also because they seemed to be from several articles heavily involved with both prostitution and pornogaphry during the seventies and perhaps into the eighties.


The prostitution charges in the Marino case surprised a lot of people because at least one of the girls was technically underage. The press talked about the mob "sinking to a new low." Given the mob's past, it wasn't really a new low. In the early years, they were very much into the prostitution rackets. But it became more passe as time went on. There's still some mob involvement but not much. In the 2008 Corozzo bust, there was prostitution charges at a Gambino controlled strip club.

The mob was more recently involved in porn - the 1970's and 1980's, as you said. It was when the business was easier to control through the production and distribution companies from the east coast to the west coast. Robert DiBernardo of the Gambinos being the most well known involved in the business. But there were several others. Things started to change when video cassette came around. Porn films that once sold for a lot of money could now be mass produced and sold for $5 or $10 a piece. And, like pizzaboy said, the internet changed things even more. There are still some LA mob guys involved in the business. And several cases over the past decade of the mob shaking down porn shops. And, of course, the Locascio crew using porn sites to run their credit card scams.
Posted By: IvyLeague

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/19/11 08:23 PM

Quote:
The "policy" piece of the conspiracy brought in more than $40,000 a week, with bets placed on the New York Lottery's "Numbers" and "Win 4" games in an illegal playing-the-numbers scheme, according to court papers.

http://www.silive.com/news/index.ssf/2011/10/gambling_bust_nabs_14_islander.html


Wow. Wonder how often they had to pay out.
Posted By: pizzaboy

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/19/11 08:40 PM

I love the way the Feds label the guys on the bottom of that chart as "agents." I guess just calling them the "guys that answer the phones" didn't have enough cachet for them lol.

They love to blow these bullshit pinches out of proportion. I guess it's an election year for someone.

Agents! I can't stop laughing lol.
Posted By: Mukremin

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/19/11 09:33 PM

It seems very easy to start a bookmaking operation in the US, correct me if i am wrong. The moneymaking operations there would not survive one day here in Europe except for drugs operations.

Numbers.. hmm, i always thougth it was gone? Thats what Capeci wrote, interesting to see it still operational, maybe on a much smaller scale.

And like some guys mentioned, it is interesting to see young italian americans on that list.
Posted By: m2w

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/19/11 10:23 PM

in italy the betpoints are usually directly run by the mafia
Posted By: IvyLeague

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/20/11 07:15 AM

Originally Posted By: Frank
how many made men were involved in the 37 arrested?i read a lot of italian name


2 - Vincent Romano and James Outerie. Both soldiers.
Posted By: LuanKuci

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/20/11 07:20 AM

Originally Posted By: pizzaboy
I love the way the Feds label the guys on the bottom of that chart as "agents." I guess just calling them the "guys that answer the phones" didn't have enough cachet for them lol.

They love to blow these bullshit pinches out of proportion. I guess it's an election year for someone.

Agents! I can't stop laughing lol.

lol
You got that right.
Posted By: Nicholas

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/20/11 06:36 PM

Originally Posted By: IvyLeague
Originally Posted By: Frank
how many made men were involved in the 37 arrested?i read a lot of italian name


2 - Vincent Romano and James Outerie. Both soldiers.


Only 2; damn, for such a large operation
Posted By: Mukremin

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/20/11 08:19 PM

Well it isnt the 2 made men that are involved, the most important thing is the long list of associates. All young Italian guys who work for the mob.
Posted By: Nicholas

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/21/11 08:05 PM

I agree Mukremin, but I noticed only two of the guys are in their 20's, 28 and 29. Though a lot of non made guys in a mob ran operation, of which I assume all of the guys knows the proceeds go to the Gambino family. Makes me think the family's bigger than it really is.
Posted By: LuanKuci

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/21/11 09:06 PM

Originally Posted By: Nicholas
I agree Mukremin, but I noticed only two of the guys are in their 20's, 28 and 29. Though a lot of non made guys in a mob ran operation, of which I assume all of the guys knows the proceeds go to the Gambino family. Makes me think the family's bigger than it really is.

Well this was a crew. A pretty big one...so yes, another reminder of how large can they be.
And it is a big hit, even if just two made guys were arrested. The feds hit the money. That's mobsters' worst fear. Cash being taken away from them.

As far as the young guys are concerned: until you are in your late '20s\early '30s it's very unlikley that you can get even a low "position". You can be a driver, bouncer, doors opener a low-low-low level associate if you may.
Or at least if you are not connected by blood (dad, uncles, brothers who are connected).
Posted By: Mukremin

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/21/11 09:43 PM

This also shows the steady maybe a bit slow but steady flow of new recruits willing to make money.
Posted By: NickyScarfo

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/22/11 01:24 AM

No way families today would give a guy in his 20s a high rank or even make him, imagine if a 25 year old gets hit with a life sentence, most likely he would flip today.
Posted By: LuanKuci

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/22/11 01:59 AM

Originally Posted By: NickyScarfo
No way families today would give a guy in his 20s a high rank or even make him, imagine if a 25 year old gets hit with a life sentence, most likely he would flip today.

Not just today...ever.
Posted By: NickyScarfo

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/22/11 08:35 AM

Originally Posted By: LuanKuci
Originally Posted By: NickyScarfo
No way families today would give a guy in his 20s a high rank or even make him, imagine if a 25 year old gets hit with a life sentence, most likely he would flip today.

Not just today...ever.


Back in the day some young guys got made, Salvie Testa, Gotti Jr was pretty young, Joey Pungitore (quite a few Philly guys). Savie must of been about 25 when he got made, Capo when he was 27, 28.
Posted By: carmela

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/22/11 01:16 PM

Originally Posted By: LuanKuci
Originally Posted By: NickyScarfo
No way families today would give a guy in his 20s a high rank or even make him, imagine if a 25 year old gets hit with a life sentence, most likely he would flip today.

Not just today...ever.


What?? Do you even have a clue what you write? There's been countless young guys given high ranks.
Posted By: pizzaboy

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/22/11 03:18 PM

Originally Posted By: carmela
What?? Do you even have a clue what you write? There's been countless young guys given high ranks.

You're right, Carmela. But in all fairness to Luan, I think he was just speaking in general terms. But there have been MANY notable exceptions.

The best example I can think of, in terms of a guy getting made young and living up to high expectations, is Barney. The guy got his button at 20 years old; he was a skipper before he turned 30; and was acting as a street boss by his very early 30's. It doesn't hurt when your father's a made guy (like Barney's was). They can usually get their sons made early if they have enough juice. Someone mentioned Junior Gotti. He was, what, 25 when he got made?

Nepotism is a factor, just like any other job. This was very prevalent in the Gambino family during the Gotti era. Craig DePalma (Greg's son) got made at around 25, and he wasn't an earner or a tough guy. The kid eventually tried to hang himself (after giving testimony to a Grand Jury, then refusing to cooperate any further). He was in a coma for seven years before he finally died. Tore Locasio (Frank's son) was also in his 20's when he got his button. Although Tore went on to make a fortune.

So there are plenty of exceptions, but I'd say that the norm is to wait a little longer (especially in the Genovese family, where the average made guy is like 60).
Posted By: carmela

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/22/11 03:59 PM

That's fine, pizzaboy, and I get all that. But on the other hand, I don't try and guess what people mean and I don't speak on their behalf. I'm also complete shit at giving people the benefit of the doubt, I take them at their word by what they say or what i read.

His words were "not just today...ever". That's pretty cut and dry and to the point, with no room for anything in between, so I took him at his word.

You can add Sal Montagna, as well.
Posted By: pizzaboy

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/22/11 04:01 PM

Originally Posted By: carmela
You can add Sal Montagna, as well.

Of course. I just figured that Sal was a given, as there have been many recent posts about him.
Posted By: Dapper_Don

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/22/11 04:24 PM

According to the FBI, Gotti Jr got made after a six year mob apprenticeship learning the various rackets under the tutelage of his dad's crew.
Posted By: pizzaboy

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/22/11 04:26 PM

Originally Posted By: Dapper_Don
According to the FBI, Gotti Jr got made after a six year mob apprenticeship learning the various rackets under the tutelage of his dad's crew.

All well and good, but he never would have gotten his button based on merit alone.
Posted By: flamingokid123

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/22/11 04:48 PM

Originally Posted By: NickyScarfo
Originally Posted By: LuanKuci
Originally Posted By: NickyScarfo
No way families today would give a guy in his 20s a high rank or even make him, imagine if a 25 year old gets hit with a life sentence, most likely he would flip today.

Not just today...ever.


Back in the day some young guys got made, Salvie Testa, Gotti Jr was pretty young, Joey Pungitore (quite a few Philly guys). Savie must of been about 25 when he got made, Capo when he was 27, 28.
Most of those Philly guys would never been made that young under Bruno. Maybe all.
Posted By: LeroyJones

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/22/11 04:57 PM

Originally Posted By: flamingokid123
Most of those Philly guys would never been made that young under Bruno. Maybe all.

I think Sal Testa would of definitely been made in the next wave of inductee's. He was always a big earner and it doesn't hurt when your father is the Underboss of the family. Plus the guy was a mean son of a bitch and wasn't scared to do his share of the wet work.
Posted By: flamingokid123

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/22/11 06:46 PM

Originally Posted By: LeroyJones
Originally Posted By: flamingokid123
Most of those Philly guys would never been made that young under Bruno. Maybe all.

I think Sal Testa would of definitely been made in the next wave of inductee's. He was always a big earner and it doesn't hurt when your father is the Underboss of the family. Plus the guy was a mean son of a bitch and wasn't scared to do his share of the wet work.
Yes I agree but not at 25. Bruno would have not made anyone at that age. But I do think Salvy should have been made that early. I dont think Testa gets enough credit for who his was, cause he was from Philly.
Posted By: IvyLeague

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/22/11 08:51 PM

Originally Posted By: pizzaboy
Originally Posted By: carmela
What?? Do you even have a clue what you write? There's been countless young guys given high ranks.

You're right, Carmela. But in all fairness to Luan, I think he was just speaking in general terms. But there have been MANY notable exceptions.

The best example I can think of, in terms of a guy getting made young and living up to high expectations, is Barney. The guy got his button at 20 years old; he was a skipper before he turned 30; and was acting as a street boss by his very early 30's. It doesn't hurt when your father's a made guy (like Barney's was). They can usually get their sons made early if they have enough juice. Someone mentioned Junior Gotti. He was, what, 25 when he got made?

Nepotism is a factor, just like any other job. This was very prevalent in the Gambino family during the Gotti era. Craig DePalma (Greg's son) got made at around 25, and he wasn't an earner or a tough guy. The kid eventually tried to hang himself (after giving testimony to a Grand Jury, then refusing to cooperate any further). He was in a coma for seven years before he finally died. Tore Locasio (Frank's son) was also in his 20's when he got his button. Although Tore went on to make a fortune.

So there are plenty of exceptions, but I'd say that the norm is to wait a little longer (especially in the Genovese family, where the average made guy is like 60).


We can also include Vinny Gorgeous' son, Vinny Jr. Who was made in his 20's. I think he's nearing 30 now.
Posted By: LuanKuci

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/22/11 08:54 PM

Jeez...take it easy.

In a fair comparison it's way harder to get made below-25. That's all. And the Brunos have their own thing going on...
My gosh...take a vacation every once in a while...
Posted By: IvyLeague

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/22/11 09:08 PM

Originally Posted By: LuanKuci
Jeez...take it easy.

In a fair comparison it's way harder to get made below-25. That's all. And the Brunos have their own thing going on...
My gosh...take a vacation every once in a while...


Again, generally speaking, you're absolutely right. A guy getting made in his 20's is very rare. No matter what family we're talking about. The examples given are simply the exceptions that prove the rule.
Posted By: LuanKuci

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/22/11 11:58 PM

Originally Posted By: IvyLeague
Originally Posted By: LuanKuci
Jeez...take it easy.

In a fair comparison it's way harder to get made below-25. That's all. And the Brunos have their own thing going on...
My gosh...take a vacation every once in a while...


Again, generally speaking, you're absolutely right. A guy getting made in his 20's is very rare. No matter what family we're talking about. The examples given are simply the exceptions that prove the rule.


Much appreciated IvyLeague.
Posted By: tt120

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/23/11 07:56 PM

people say assimilation this and that and that the ranks are gonna be thinning but look at this and that prostitution bust Marino was caught up in - lots of relatively young associates. There's always gonna be a ton of young kids with vowel on the end of their name trying to make a fast buck, especially on staten island and little pockets of brooklyn. and because they're young and didn't grow up piss poor people think they're stupid, spoiled, flashy - that might be the case quite often but then again those are only the ones we hear about. there are always gonna be exceptions to the rule. another example about how the mob in NY isnt going anywhere
Posted By: LuanKuci

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/24/11 03:30 AM

Originally Posted By: tt120
people say assimilation this and that and that the ranks are gonna be thinning but look at this and that prostitution bust Marino was caught up in - lots of relatively young associates. There's always gonna be a ton of young kids with vowel on the end of their name trying to make a fast buck, especially on staten island and little pockets of brooklyn. and because they're young and didn't grow up piss poor people think they're stupid, spoiled, flashy - that might be the case quite often but then again those are only the ones we hear about. there are always gonna be exceptions to the rule. another example about how the mob in NY isnt going anywhere


Amen to that...and these things have been siad since the '50s. Still...
Posted By: pizzaboy

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/24/11 02:26 PM

Originally Posted By: LuanKuci
Originally Posted By: tt120
people say assimilation this and that and that the ranks are gonna be thinning but look at this and that prostitution bust Marino was caught up in - lots of relatively young associates. There's always gonna be a ton of young kids with vowel on the end of their name trying to make a fast buck, especially on staten island and little pockets of brooklyn. and because they're young and didn't grow up piss poor people think they're stupid, spoiled, flashy - that might be the case quite often but then again those are only the ones we hear about. there are always gonna be exceptions to the rule. another example about how the mob in NY isnt going anywhere

Amen to that...and these things have been siad since the '50s. Still...

I agree. The mob will always be around, although somewhat weaker, in places like the outer boroughs of New York City and the surrounding suburbs. It's the dwindling Italian populations elsewhere that's eroding the mob as a force on the national scale. The mob will never again be a major force in places like St. Louis, Tampa or Kansas City, to name just a few.

The idea of having ruling panels instead of a boss is probably a good idea on their part. It will help them hang on because the Feds will never allow a Carlo Gambino type of supreme leader to rule ever again.
Posted By: LeroyJones

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/24/11 04:46 PM

Originally Posted By: flamingokid123
Originally Posted By: LeroyJones
Originally Posted By: flamingokid123
Most of those Philly guys would never been made that young under Bruno. Maybe all.

I think Sal Testa would of definitely been made in the next wave of inductee's. He was always a big earner and it doesn't hurt when your father is the Underboss of the family. Plus the guy was a mean son of a bitch and wasn't scared to do his share of the wet work.
Yes I agree but not at 25. Bruno would have not made anyone at that age. But I do think Salvy should have been made that early. I dont think Testa gets enough credit for who his was, cause he was from Philly.

You could very well be right about Bruno. What year did Bruno get the top slot in philly? 1957? So it probably was before he was boss but Scarfo got made in 1954 or 1955 when he was only 25 according to his rat nephew Leonetti. Also Salvatore Sabella made Harry Riccobene when the Hunchback was either 17 or 18. And i think Phil Testa was in his 20's when he got made too. I bet there are a bunch of the old philly guys who got made in their 20's or definitely by their early 30's. But like you said Bruno might of been more cautious about making younger guys. I'm really not sure on the ages of the guys Bruno made, but i'd like to find out just out of curiosity.

I think Bruno himself was made in his 20's. I read he was made sometime in the 1930's and he was born in 1910 i think. So he would of been a hypocrite to look down on making guys in their 20's. But than again Bruno was a hypocrite about a few things so who really knows.
Posted By: flamingokid123

Re: Gambino gambling & loansharking ring busted - 10/25/11 03:03 AM

Originally Posted By: LeroyJones
Originally Posted By: flamingokid123
Originally Posted By: LeroyJones
Originally Posted By: flamingokid123
Most of those Philly guys would never been made that young under Bruno. Maybe all.

I think Sal Testa would of definitely been made in the next wave of inductee's. He was always a big earner and it doesn't hurt when your father is the Underboss of the family. Plus the guy was a mean son of a bitch and wasn't scared to do his share of the wet work.
Yes I agree but not at 25. Bruno would have not made anyone at that age. But I do think Salvy should have been made that early. I dont think Testa gets enough credit for who his was, cause he was from Philly.

You could very well be right about Bruno. What year did Bruno get the top slot in philly? 1957? So it probably was before he was boss but Scarfo got made in 1954 or 1955 when he was only 25 according to his rat nephew Leonetti. Also Salvatore Sabella made Harry Riccobene when the Hunchback was either 17 or 18. And i think Phil Testa was in his 20's when he got made too. I bet there are a bunch of the old philly guys who got made in their 20's or definitely by their early 30's. But like you said Bruno might of been more cautious about making younger guys. I'm really not sure on the ages of the guys Bruno made, but i'd like to find out just out of curiosity.

I think Bruno himself was made in his 20's. I read he was made sometime in the 1930's and he was born in 1910 i think. So he would of been a hypocrite to look down on making guys in their 20's. But than again Bruno was a hypocrite about a few things so who really knows.
Good point, I just thought Bruno made guys wait until there late 30's or early 40's to get made.
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