Boehner discouraging govt shutdown

The fact that we are here today to debate raising America’s debt limit is a sign of leadership failure. It is a sign that the U.S. Government can’t pay its own bills. It is a sign that we now depend on ongoing financial assistance from foreign countries to finance our Government’s reckless fiscal policies. Over the past 5 years, our federal debt has increased by $3.5 trillion to
$8.6 trillion. That is ‘‘trillion’’ with a ‘‘T.’’ That is money that we have borrowed from the Social Security trust fund, borrowed from China and Japan, borrowed from American taxpayers. And over the next 5 years, between now and 2011, the President’s budget will increase the debt by almost another $3.5 trillion.

Numbers that large are sometimes hard to understand. Some people may wonder why they matter. Here is why: This year, the Federal Government will spend $220 billion on interest. That is more money to pay interest on our national debt than we’ll spend on Medicaid and the State Children’s Health Insurance Program. That is more money to pay interest on our debt this year than we will spend on education, homeland security, transportation, and veterans benefits combined. It is more money in one year than we are likely to spend to rebuild the devastated gulf coast in a way that honors the best of America.

And the cost of our debt is one of the fastest growing expenses in the Federal budget. This rising debt is a hidden domestic enemy, robbing our cities and States of critical investments in infrastructure like bridges, ports, and levees; robbing our families and our children of critical investments in education and health care reform; robbing our seniors of the retirement and
health security they have counted on.

Every dollar we pay in interest is a dollar that is not going to investment in America’s priorities. Instead, interest payments are a significant tax on all Americans—a debt tax that Washington doesn’t want to talk about. If Washington were serious about honest tax relief in this country, we would see an effort to reduce our national debt by returning to responsible fiscal policies.

But we are not doing that. Despite repeated efforts by Senators CONRAD and FEINGOLD, the Senate continues to reject a return to the commonsense Pay-go rules that used to apply. Previously, Pay-go rules applied both to increases in mandatory spending and
to tax cuts. The Senate had to abide by the commonsense budgeting principle of balancing expenses and revenues. Unfortunately, the principle was abandoned, and now the demands of budget discipline apply only to spending.

As a result, tax breaks have not been paid for by reductions in Federal spending, and thus the only way to pay for them has been to increase our deficit to historically high levels and borrow more and more money. Now we have to pay for those tax breaks plus
the cost of borrowing for them. Instead of reducing the deficit, as some people claimed, the fiscal policies of this administration and its allies in Congress will add more than $600 million in debt for each of the next 5 years.

That is why I will once again cosponsor the Pay-go amendment and continue to hope that my colleagues will return to a smart rule that has worked in the past and can work again.

Our debt also matters internationally. My friend, the ranking member of the Senate Budget Committee, likes to remind us that it took 42 Presidents 224 years to run up only $1 trillion of foreign-held debt. This administration did more than that in just 5 years. Now, there is nothing wrong with borrowing from foreign countries. But we must remember that the more we depend on foreign nations to lend us money, the more our economic security is tied to the whims of foreign leaders whose interests might not be aligned with ours.

Increasing America’s debt weakens us domestically and internationally. Leadership means that ‘‘the buck stops here.’’ Instead, Washington is shifting the burden of bad choices today onto the backs of our children and grandchildren. America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership. Americans deserve better.

I therefore intend to oppose the effort to increase America’s debt limit”

Two big examples of problematic self-government are upon us. They are of course the possible partial shutdown of the federal government, following the long-running hamstringing of public functions via "the sequester"; and a possible vote not to raise the federal debt ceiling, which would create the prospect of a default on U.S. Treasury debt.

The details are complicated, but please don't lose sight of these three essential points:

As a matter of substance, constant-shutdown, permanent-emergency governance is so destructive that no other serious country engages in or could tolerate it. The United States can afford it only because we are -- still -- so rich, with so much margin for waste and error. Details on this and other items below.*

As a matter of politics, this is different from anything we learned about in classrooms or expected until the past few years. We're used to thinking that the most important disagreements are between the major parties, not within one party; and that disagreements over policies, goals, tactics can be addressed by negotiation or compromise.

This time, the fight that matters is within the Republican party, and that fight is over whether compromise itself is legitimate.** Outsiders to this struggle -- the president and his administration, Democratic legislators as a group, voters or "opinion leaders" outside the generally safe districts that elected the new House majority -- have essentially no leverage over the outcome..
** The debt-ceiling vote, of course, is not about future spending decisions. It is about whether to cover expenditures the Congress has already authorized. There is no sane reason for subjecting this to a repeated vote. And there is no precedent for serious threats not to honor federal debt -- as opposed to symbolic anti-Administration protest votes, which both parties have cast over the years. Nor for demanding the reversal of major legislation as a condition for routine government operations.

Cruz and his posse of conservatives should listen to their speaker and other moderates. Don't use this as an opportunity to repeal Obamacare, if you feel that strongly about the law, do it when you have the time, not when the clock is ticking on a government shutdown. Obama won't gut the law, especially since it's one of his only domestic achievements he's had. No way in hell is he going to give in, and Cruz and the other dunces need to realize that. I'm glad they passed a measure paying troops, defense contractors and civilian pentagon workers, but it's not enough.

This is not the time to bicker over a law that's not going to be repealed. I don't think it's the best solution to our health care problems, I think it's going to cause problems. But right now the focus needs to be finding a way to avoid a government shutdown. Not this goddamn useless partisan arguing bullshit

How about Dick Cheney as Darth Vader? Where was the bipartisanship then?

Can you give me an example of a Democratic Congressperson in a position of power who reached out to the other side with some sort of real compromise that was also fiscally responsible? Can you name one Democratic plan to bring down the national debt?

Your incredible lack of knowledge of history has shown its face again. Why don't you try to read some facts before you go off on your rants here?

1. The Dems voted overwhemingly for the Iraq war even though it was all based on lies war criminal Bush and war criminal cheney told.

2. The national debt has been dropping since Obama took office.

People like you are not symptoms of the problem, you are the problem. Go live in Paraguay or someplace more suitable to your politics. You are not a real American, yoou are a tereasonous, racist fascist.

Your incredible lack of knowledge of history has shown its face again. Why don't you try to read some facts before you go off on your rants here?

1. The Dems voted overwhemingly for the Iraq war even though it was all based on lies war criminal Bush and war criminal cheney told.

2. The national debt has been dropping since Obama took office.

People like you are not symptoms of the problem, you are the problem. Go live in Paraguay or someplace more suitable to your politics. You are not a real American, yoou are a tereasonous, racist fascist.

http://cognoscenti.wbur.org/2013/10/02/shutdown-john-sivolella

Good article on this. And btw Faithful can we at least agree that infighting among Dems and the GOP is just not good? We elected them to govern not to bitch. Pointing fingers only makes it worse

I'm going to have to disagree with you on this Vinnie. This shutdown needs to be averted ASAP. Right now the people who make our laws are more guilty of incompetence than those who work for them.

How about getting Harry Reid to call a vote to end this? Where is the willingness of the Democratic members? Why don't they move forward to end the government shutdown that they created?

Under what authority can a U.S. Senator call for a vote in the House of Representatives?

This ball is squarely in John Boehner's court.

There's no need to compromise my ACA. The bill passed, became law, was deemed constitutional, and Boehner failed 40 times to repeal it, not to mention that the President won reelection handily where the most differentiating issue of the campaign was Obamacare.

Boehner holding the government hostage to accomplish what he wasn't able to do since 2010 through legislative means is a slap in the face to the democratic process.

Negotiate nothing. That ship has sailed.

Political arguments are so much fun! I want to see Boner cry.

Political arguments are so much fun! I want to see Boner cry.

Slavery was law at one time too, with several Democrat presidents defending it. Justices also came out with decisions like Dred Scott. The ACA was Justice Roberts' Dred Scott decision. He "deemed" it Constitutional although there was clearly nothing Constitutional about it. Justice Kennedy saw through that facade. At any rate, the majority of the House won't vote to support it since they are accountable to their constituents. It doesn't have the votes, so either the White House and Reid compromise or forget it.

BTW, did you complain about Reid/Pelosi holding the government hostage when Bush was president? Didn't think so. Did you criticize Senator Obama when he refused to vote on raising the debt limit?

[quote=klydon1]Slavery was law at one time too, with several Democrat presidents defending it. Justices also came out with decisions like Dred Scott. The ACA was Justice Roberts' Dred Scott decision. He "deemed" it Constitutional although there was clearly nothing Constitutional about it. Justice Kennedy saw through that facade.

Hate leads to rage, and rage makes you stupid. Republicans have convinced themselves both that President Obama is a revolutionary radical hell-bent upon destroying America as we know it and that he's so feckless and weak-willed that he'll always yield to pressure. It's that contradictory, angry assessment that has brought the GOP to a place where it must either abjectly surrender or force a national default. Calmer analysis would have achieved better results.

Anybody comparing ACA to slavery is fucking stupid. The genocide, enslavement, and rape of an entire segment of the population has nothing to do with a free market-based healthcare system. Reminds me of kids online who call each other Hitler because they disagree on who's the better pop star or those idiots who wear T-shirts with Che Guevara's mug.

Besides Lilo has a point. The Republicans had their chance to make Obamacare the referendum for the 2012 national election. They tried and they failed. They lost, and not even fucking close like 2000 or '04, it was a healthy defeat. Democrats had a chance to make Iraq the topic in 2004, and they failed. (Fascinating how both defeated parties nominated men who were for healthcare/Iraq before they were against it.)

Anyway this shutdown was about Obamacare originally, but now its no longer the topic. Its a shutdown for its own sake. What exactly is the point of the shutdown now?

Christie became more interested in being popular and well liked by people than in doing a good job. He seemed to try to be more likeable as election went along, and wanted the approval of those whose politics were more leftist. His televised appearances became embarrassing. Anyone here see him on Jon Stewart? Cringeworthy. Christie made an ass of self trying to show what a regular guy he was.

I join ronnie and lilo in finding that this analogy is baseless, misplaced and silly. In fact, relying on Scott v. Sandford as justification for Boehner's actions contradicts your premise. First, Scott was a judicial decision overturning an Act of Congress whereas the ACA was a legislative enactment signed into law. Scott was overturned through the constitutional process by the enactment of the XIV Amendment. In the present matter Boehner is evading the statutory process to undermine a valid law by withholding funding for the federal government.

There are benefits and problems with ACA as well as voluminous misinformation about it. It will likely need to be revisted, amended and reconfigured in the coming years as it is put into practice. But by stonewalling to create a government shutdown, Boehner is trying to do through illegitimate means what he wasn't able to do through legitimate means.

Sorry. Your analogy misses the mark again. When you say Citizens United is presently law and Obama and I continue to criticize it, that's fine. Every decision should be subject to thoughtful critique. But neither I or Obama did anything to subvert or prevent the application of the law. Respecting (though not agreeing with) the law, Obama proceeded with his campaign with the full effect of Citizens United, and handily won reelection.

And by the way the whining about bulldozing the legislation and ignoring precedent and procedure is baseless and insipid. Even Boehner doesn't resort to that level of ridiculousness.