School shooter flicks off families in court

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/03/19...kusaolp00000008
What a piece of shit. Wears a shirt wearing killer and says "fuck you" to the families and the flicks them off. If i was one the families I would attack this prick. I don't know how they held back. People like this deserve the death penalty, obviously no remorse.

I saw only the picture on HP but didn't read the story. OMG, that's awful and scary. He sounds like a real psychopath. He belongs in jail.



TIS

I'm puzzled by how the sheriffs allowed him in the court room. Should have been held in contempt and had a jumpsuit on. I'm shocked by his attorney's apparent indifference to the obscene gestures.

No, Tis. He deserves to be put to death.

If he was less than a year older at the time of the shooting he would have been eligible for the death penalty. Why clothe and feed this animal for upwards of the next sixty to seventy years?

Nah, put him down like the animal that he is.

And they should do it sooner than later, and make it as painful as possible!

How did he get into the court room with the words "killer" on his t-shirt. I agree with PB put him down, nobody would miss him..

May he never be placed in protective custody.

Well hopefully he pisses off the wrong person in jail.

I agree he does not deserve to live. I hope he becomes someones bitch.

Maybe he is looking to be put in a mental unit/ward?

Very well said!

Fucking no good piece of shit psychopath. What's gotten into high schoolers? All this damn school violence has gotta stop. I say put him down.

I second what pizza said. Jail? No way.

It's just one more reason every state should have the death penalty. And not 20 years after near endless appeals. Take this guy outside the courthouse, make him kneel down, put a bullet in his head, and make his family pay for the bullet.

The end.

Interesting.

A quick death is too easy, make him suffer i say, nice and slow..

This kid needs to be skinned alive!

How about this..

It's hard to take a different point of view in a case like this. I risk it anyway.

To me it looks like this: Every four months or so there's some news about a cruel killer.
And some people here seem to need a guy like that to vent their own hate and cruelty.
However, there are some long term members from whom I've never heard words like "I want XY to suffer." or "I want XY to be skinned alive" or "XY is an animal".

The terrible message is that the killer is not an animal. He's human which is hard to stand. To say XY is an animal is the first step of the Lucifer Effect .

Unreal! And the children he killed lets forget them! You know what we should send this sick maniac home! Your so smart and philosophical. Good call, he's a person too. He's a just a person who kills innocent kids, he's different, but that's ok! Good call

He's an animal. But aren't you the same guy who scolded us Americans when we celebrated Bin Laden (another animal) getting his eyeball shot out?

What a great day that was!

Fuck Bin Laden, fuck this scumbag kid, and fuck the guy who came up with the Lucifer Effect. He obviously never lost anyone to a scumbag psychopath. If he has, he's a bigger jerk than I thought he was.

The Scripture tells us to render judgement unto God, not thine enemies. An eye for an eye? In some cases (albeit extreme ones), it's the only way to mete out justice.

This guy is more like an animal than a human

Yes this was the same guy, if you recall we were animals for cheering Bin Laden had a sunroof put in his head!

How else can you describe the shooter but as an animal? All these shooters are are pure evil animals.

I have to shake my head at a lot of the comments made in this thread, especially by some of those who consider themselves "Christians." All I've read is "KILL HIM KILL HIM KILL HIM!!!" Clearly, many of you have never taken a class on psychology. You think that good people do good things because they are good, and bad people do bad things because they are evil. I wish it were as simple as that, but it isn't. There is no justification for what this person did, but there are reasons for why people make the decisions they make.

And the "Fuck the guy who came up with the Lucifer Effect" comment is one of the most ridiculous things I've ever heard. I feel terrible for anybody who has lost somebody to a tragedy like this, but those who do suffer these tragedies tend to lose their rationality when it comes to what should be done with the people who commit these atrocities. If they can be studied and understood, one day, things like this may be preventable.

So by taking a phycology class the parents of the victims will feel better knowing why this happened? Also the killers parents obviously should have taken one also. Took phycology and I still say SKIN HIM ALIVE!

I was going to respond to him but, after reading this, I see there would be no point.

What I am saying is that there are psychological and societal forces that influence our actions, whether good or bad. People aren't born evil.

Regardless, I'm not here to debate anything leading up to his heinous actions. What he did has no excuse. Then his behavior in court? He's a nut! Again SKIN HIM!

Everybody knows there are pyschological and societal forces that influence people's actions. So what? That doesn't remove the need for people to answer for the decisions they make, especially when it's something like taking an innocent person's life.

And to argue that this goes against being Christian is absurd. Forgiveness is on a personal level. Nevertheless, society has the duty to mete out punishment. And certain criminals deserve nothing but death. Giving them free room and board for the rest of their life is not justice.

You and the other lefties here can take your pseudo-psychological babble, and your moral relativism, and cram it.

Are you aware that the human brain doesn't stop growing until the age of 25, and that the last part of the brain to develop is the part that gives a human being a sense of empathy? Perhaps he has no empathy right now, but will develop it later, and realize the awful thing he did.

Also, I stated that there is no justification for what he did. But there are factors and reasons for EVERYTHING that EVERYBODY does, and to say that you don't care why people do the things they do shows a level of ignorance that unfortunately is very pervasive is today's society. People are afraid to know why bad things happen. They just want to believe that evil exists, and that it should be squashed by any means necessary, no questions asked. It is a very archaic way of thinking.

Yeah I'm ignorant, your defending a maniac who killed innocent children. A nut is a nut. You can play Freud all you want. To justify why this kid acted like a nut is archaic.

So it's okay to cherry-pick the parts of your faith that you want to follow and those you don't? I didn't know that...maybe I should convert back to Christianity.



Classy.

If you actually understood Christianity, instead of misrepresenting it here, you wouldn't be talking about cherrypicking.

To go by your logic, any Christian should be against courts, jails, prisons, parole, etc. altogether. After all, shouldn't all the criminals be immediately forgiven and sent on their way? That's what you seem to be suggesting.

Again, Christians are required by their Savior to forgive their enemies. That's certainly true. But that doesn't remove the responsibility of society to mete out punishment. And it's not contradictory for people, including Christians, to want society to enforce that justice, while at the same time personally forgiving whoever may have offended them.

Thus ends the lesson for Christianity 101 today.



If the shoe fits. Some of you guys make me absolutely sick. You're usually the types who will argue for a murderer to be spared and then turn around and defend abortion. Your moral compass isn't just defective. It's non-existent.

I don't understand how people defend murderer's. The brain may not fully developed until you're 25 but that's no excuse to kill. Little kids know not to kill and he was 17, no excuse. The main reason this story makes me so mad is how he had a shirt saying killer and flicked off the victims families. How can you defend that?

He isn't even showing remorse that may otherwise engender desire by some to spare him. He could be the poster boy of why some people deserve nothing other than to be sent back to their Maker.

Nicky, you've obviously never taken a phycology class! Otherwise you would have this all figured out!

I challenge you to go through my posts and find a single thing I said that suggests I believe this individual should be forgiven and sent on his way. You can't, so if you don't want me to misrepresent Christianity, then don't misrepresent what I am saying.

I am all for law and order. This person committed a heinous crime, and should be punished accordingly. All I suggested was that people should be so quick to jump to conclusions and call this person an "animal" when they have little to no knowledge as to what made him this way. He was sentenced to life in prison. He can't hurt any innocent people anymore.



Why, because I seek to understand why people do the things they do? I don't condone or justify what he did. I believe he should be punished for what he did. But I'd also like to understand the "why." If that makes me morally defective in your eyes, then I am happy to be that. Although it is strange you question my moral compass when I'm the only one here not advocating MORE death.

Why, because I seek to understand why people do the things they do? I don't condone or justify what he did. I believe he should be punished for what he did. But I'd also like to understand the "why." If that makes me morally defective in your eyes, then I am happy to be that. Although it is strange you question my moral compass when I'm the only one here not advocating MORE death. [/quote]


Who are you quoting? There is no name to reference!

Who are you quoting? There is no name to reference! [/quote]

He's quoting Ivyleaue.

Complete POS as others have said i wonder why he wasn't thrown out the courtroom the moment they saw what his shirt said.

Yes, this man is a turd. Yes, he's a complete sociopath. Yes, he deserves whatever punishment he gets. However, I don't understand why the judge allowed him to stay in the courtroom. How was he not found in contempt and hauled out? When Manson and his followers misbehaved in court, the judge immediately had them removed. Why give them the attention they so craved? It's like a reward.

As for X and what he said, I understand his point. We have law and order for a reason. You can't degenerate into a lynch mob because what this man did is inexcusable. That's why we HAVE law and order, to prevent vigilantes and lynch mobs. I didn't read anywhere that X wanted him tucked into bed at night with his blanky and a warm glass of milk.

Through the efforts of psychologists and the efforts of the FBI's BAU and their studies into murderers, we have gained a greater understanding of the minds of killers. Not only can this (hopefully) help us to prevent a young and abused child from becoming a killer, but it also helps us catch those who are at large.

And to call someone like this an animal is insulting to animals. I feel pretty sure that humans are the only animals that kill for pleasure.

You keep bringing up what "caused" him to commit these crimes as if that's relevant to the punishment that should be meted out. He's a murderer who shows no remorse. What else do you need to know? And life of free room and board really isn't justice. He should be sent onto the next world.



I don't have a problem with your desire to know why he did it unless it leads to the usually inevitable desire to not see justice done. You say you believe he should be punished. But your idea of punishment isn't justice. It's not about advocating more death. Society demonstrates how serious a crime is by the punishment it metes out. When we allow a murderer to live, we're are minimizing the importance of the crime.



That's delusional, pie-in-the-sky wishful thinking. To say that we get anything significant from studying most of these murderers is ludicrous. Most of them simply go to prison, some of which eventually get released (a mockery of justice), and the rest simply live off the law abiding public for the rest of their useless lives. There's usually not even some kind of restorative justice program in place. They just spend their remaining years taking up space, watching TV, playing card, lifting weights, etc.

Ivy, I picked up a Phycology book today, I stated that people who attempt to understand the mind of a murderer are troubled themselves. Also states people who have sympathy for people who hurt children are even worse!

See we can learn from Phycology

I would disagree with that Ivy. It's not black and white. There's more gray area when it comes to psychopaths. We have much to gain from studying them. The guys a fucking scumbag and insane, but to the point where he's not even rational. I could care less about whether or not the bastard was given the death penalty, kill him for all I care he'd deserve it. But someone like this, not even the prospect of death scares them. They are just an empty shell of madness. But that's why we need to figure out what causes shit like this, especially in a 17 year old boy.

Only thing to come out of France was the guillotine! They should use it here! Off with his head!

Who said he's insane? He appears perfectly sane to me. One doesn't need to be a lunatic to commit murder. And the excuse that we should forego the death penalty doesn't really hold water when you realize that the vast majority of these guys are not studied at all. They're warehoused in the prison system, sucking away resources from society, and usually doing nothing to recompense the victim's of their crimes. And while you may theoretically be open to the death penalty, I'm pretty convinced others use the argument you did above simply because they're against it.

Really, you're understanding of "Phycology" is fascinating. What subject is that? Is it just one book that covers "phycology", or are there many "phycology" books? Your keen understanding and your insight are something we all should strive for, especially all the decapitating and the skinning.

Ivy, yes, all that wishful thinking created VICAP, which is the largest database of crimes and fingerprints which helps to actually, you know, solve crime. These criminals are studied for a reason. By helping investigators to understand them, they can help us to solve other crimes or to help stop sociopaths before they harm others. You can call it wishful thinking, but I call it results.

And let me add that, from what I understand of this case, this guy was bullied. And nobody is more against bullying than me. I'm draconian in how I would handle bullies. As well as the teachers, school officials, and parents who allow it to go on. But him being bullied isn't enough reason to spare him after he commits murder.

Of all the murderers currently sitting in prison, only a very, very tiny fraction have been "studied." Like I said above, most of them are simply warehoused. And we don't need to study every single one, allowing them free room and board for the rest of their lives, to better understand killers and their psyche. If you were honest, you'd admit you're only making this argument because you're against the death penalty. Not because whatever understanding we have has come from allowing countless killers to be spared capital punishment.

Ivy, please don't try to tell me what I do or don't believe. I actually am NOT against the death penalty. There are certain crimes that cry out for it.

I agree. He seems to have lost his mind, and the sentence is fitting. He will never get out. His wearing that t-shirt had to upset families, but he is not in right mind. He killed those 3 boys, and also threw away his own life. Skin him alive? That's sicker than what he did.

You say you are Draconian in how bullies should be handled. TJ Lane was too.

Best punishment for this scum would be a long suffering death. Best way would be the inmates getting up to him and torturing him to death for hours.

Much harsher penalties are needed to stop bullying, as well as other crimes. That's the problem in our society. The punishment meted out by the law is routinely insufficient. And the reason for this insufficient punishment, which only perpetuates more crime, is that people like yourself don't have the stomach for real justice but sit back and smugly try to theorize, psychoanalyze, etc.

Ivy you're going too far. Your personal ideology is your opinion and people will disagree with it, but that doesn't mean that just because they don't believe what you believe in it somehow makes them a "problem"

[quote=Sicilian Babe]Really, you're understanding of "Phycology" is fascinating. What subject is that? Is it just one book that covers "phycology", or are there many "phycology" books? Your keen understanding and your insight are something we all should strive for, especially all the decapitating and the skinning.

Ah, the phycology of a spell checker. Sorry I don't share the same fantasy land approach to child killers as you do. Just different philosophies I guess.

Joe, Google: Wllie Horton

[quote=Sicilian Babe]Yes, this man is a turd. Yes, he's a complete sociopath. Yes, he deserves whatever punishment he gets. However, I don't understand why the judge allowed him to stay in the courtroom. How was he not found in contempt and hauled out? When Manson and his followers misbehaved in court, the judge immediately had them removed. Why give them the attention they so craved? It's like a reward.

And you calling this "turd" shows how deep, philosophical and sophisticated you are!

If it's not the usual suspects who constantly advocate weak laws and insufficient punishment for crime, who, then, holds the responsibility for...well...our weak laws and insufficient punishment when it comes to crime?

With the right kind of laws and penalties, we could really minimize crime. Potential criminals would truly fear prison. But what it would take would cause many, including some of this forum, to start wringing their clammy hands in worry.

The reason that most school administrators turn a blind eye to bullying is their "head in the sand" approach. If they don't recognize, they don't have to deal with it, which means they don't have to report it and deal with all the red tape involved. In NY, these incidents get reported to Albany and those numbers get published. Naturally, the administration doesn't want that - they want the school to seem like ShangriLa, so they bury it or ignore it.

So we're going to blame this phyco on the teachers? Always somebody else's fault.

I was commenting on Ivy's post as to why bullies aren't punished, not handing out blame. I'm going to go out on a limb and say that he's to blame for his own actions. There are thousands of teenagers that are bullied every day, and they don't shoot up their schools.

Ok I agree with that. However I still say we skin him then use the Guillotine

Bring out old sparky!

Another reason they do so is because they know there will be no repercussions for ignoring it.

Unfortunately, that's true. I find that most parents are at one end of the spectrum or the other in their children's lives - they're either hovering and over-involved or they ignore them, very little grey area.

If we want to continue a discussion, let's keep it civilised. There's no use in name calling, like "you don't know anything about psychology" or "Your moral compass is non-existent." If we don't agree that there can be disagreement, why should we discuss at all?

So, here's where I agree:
- The guy who did this is obviously a sociopath, probably a psychopath too.
- He deserves to be punished severely or (if he's mentally disabled) to be put in an institution.
- The crime is outrageous, and what happened in the courtroom is outrageous too. And it's difficult to understand what makes a person to such a thing.
- The judge should have taken him out of the courtroom.


But what do you guys really mean when you say "He's an animal", except that it's some kind of expression of your anger?
I have been being blamed here for being anti-American, anti-Western. Well, I'm not. I believe in law and order which is a cornerstone of the American and all western societies. I don't believe in torture or treating people like animals, which is something you usually find in totalitarian countries. That's North Korean or Nazi Germany style.

I think that the discussion "Who's fault is it" is almost useless. Human behaviour is always a mixture of genetic programming, education and social circumstances. That doesn't mean that we're not responsible for what we're doing.
Still, I believe, it's interesting to know what makes a man do such things. What made him different from the rest of his fellow human beings? To understand doesn't mean to excuse.