What if Silvio & Paulie got into a power struggle?

I always thought that Chase could have made an interesting subplot by having Silvio and Paulie fight for power. There was an interesting scene near the end of Season 4 where Paulie & Sil get into it in the back of Satriale's.

It's where Paulie was trying to get in good with Carmine and was horrified to learn that Carmine had no idea who Paulie was. Paulie was complaining to Silvio about Tony & Ralph. Silvio said that Paulie had been showing a bad attitude of late and, naturually, Paulie took offense. Paulie complained then about having to go to the Russian's house to collect for Silvio (Pine Barrens episode).

If they had started trying to make moves against one another, I think Silvio was better equipped to come out on top. Paulie had no stream of revenue like the Bing and was nowhere as near as creative to make money as Silvio. To top it off, Paulie was weighed down by having Christopher, who was mired in a heroin addiction at the time.

I agree. Sil is much more qualified to come out on top. Paulie would never last as a leader, too neurotic and focused on little pointless things. The only criticism I have of Sil is his incident as "Acting Boss" when Tony was shot. Ended up in the hospital because of the stress given to him from Bobby haha.

There was definitely some tension starting in Season 2, when Tony was elevated, and he moved up Paulie and Silvio equally and had Pussy and Furio reporting to the both of them.

Neither one would have filled Tony's shoes. As BostonGuy17 mentioned, Silvio had panic attacks when he was merely acting boss. And Paulie? New York would have outmaneuvered him and absorbed the Jersey crew in a heartbeat.

In that argument in the back of Satriales, once it gets heated, Paulie tells Silvio, "You never know what the future holds, my friend!" Paulie was thinking to himself that New York would probably whack Tony and install him as boss. So Sil better show him a little respect! But...Paulie was fooled.

You're a wormy cocksucker you know that.

HEY....... im just telling you how your being perceived.

I took Paulie's comment of the future being unknown as an indirect threat to Sil. Kind of like Paulie saying "When I'm with Carmine & Johnny Sac, I'll personally whack you."

To clarify, the point of my original post was about Sil & Paulie battling for the #2 position and not overtaking Tony. I agree with the other comments here that neither was suited to take the big chair.

I think what Paulie was thinking was that Johnny Sac would whack out Tony and then Carmine(NY) would give him the blessing as boss of the NJ mob.

Which never was going to happen except in Paulies deluded mind because of Johnny Sac playing him.

If Sil or anyone else had got hint of his intentions he would have been whacked out quickly. Tony was even considering it due to his unloyalty of repeating the Ginny Sac/Ralph joke.

Sil outclassed Paulie basically everywhere. For all his funny outbursts, Paulie was pretty much a complete scumbag in a gang of scumbags. He claimed loyalty to Tony but was quick to want to hook up with New York when it looked like he could benefit. He played that BS with Ralph over the Ginny Sack joke IIRC just because he didn't like Ralph and to try and get some points with NY.

When Christopher is made he tells him that if there's any problems, with anyone, to go to Tony and later when Chris does so (over Paulie coming over and smelling Adriana's panties) what does Paulie do? He gets pissy and threatens Chris if he ever goes over his head again.

Silvio would prevail as he's a bit more charismatic and witty than Paulie when it is all said and done.

Paulie as Boss wouldn't work out too well as a he is too stubborn and short-sighted to deal with the big picture (Unions, HUD, Credit Card Scams, Webistics, etc.) This is the man who could barely etch out an understanding with the Lawnmower Man lol....

Silvio, well he did say he had "Allergies" lol. More seriously though, he did mention to his wife candidly that was at one point considered for the Big Seat, but self-admittedly couldn't handle the pressure and it showed.

One literally couldn't handle the pressure and the other was essentially going to be a lightening rod for NY's families or a puppet boss.

Paulie was a guy who had his time and place years before the series started. He was a younger, dumber version of Johnny Boy and Junior -- relying on strong-arm heists, gambling, waste management, construction and other old-school scams to make money. And in later years, he couldn't even manage that well.

He's comic relief.

Silvio, he has the brains and more repect with members in the family than Paulie does.

Look at the end of the series. Tony was either going to get whacked or get indicted, as his lawyer said was likely to happen. Silvio was still in the coma, and he might have not came out in time to become boss. If he didn't come out, there would have been a power struggle, possibly between Paulie and Patsy, or other capos. In this power struggle the Jersey Family would be heavily crippled with much of the leadership taken out and crews became thin.

Even though the war was essentially over once Phil got clipped, Tony's crew had been brought down to nothing. He would have only had a few good guys to work with after that. Patsy probably would've ended up number 2 because of Meadow and his son, and if Silvio came out of the coma he'd go right back to what he does best.

Side Note: Does anyone else find it interesting how often Tony puts guys in their positions simply because of family matters? (Chris Bobby and Patsy are the 3 I'm thinking of). Tony respected guys like Vito and Carlo more than these 3 yet he still pampered them because they were family.

That's more Tony's insecurities, narcissism and leadership failures more than anything. He felt more secure to put "family" into top-tier positions, because he viewed that as less of a threat on his position. He would rather sacrifice the long-term stability and power of the DiMeo family to feed his ego. For example, Ralphie would have been a suitable senior leader, given his earning power, business acumen and ruthlessness. Tony would have been better off taking Ralph's success and multiplying it across the family rather than marginalizing and humiliating Ralph at any opportunity.

He'd rather have yes-men and suck ups around him than have someone call him on his shit (look at the argument Tony and Silvio had at the end of Season 5 about this).

Tony himself admits his failings to Melfi in "Unidentified Black Males" during Season 5. She extracts from him the truth about why Tony S. wasn't there when Tony B. was arrested. In a rare moment of candor, Tony S. admits favoring his cousin and being a weak leader at times.

I would agree in part about Tony elevating Ralph. But Ralph was such a prick that he made it much more difficult to be promoted than necessary. Let's face it - had Gigi not died on the toilet, Ralph may not have ever been raised to the level of captain by Tony. It was only after there was literally no other logical choice that Tony capitulated.

True, and I'm going to diverge from the original topic for a bit. Even at Livia's funeral, Junior was supportive of bumping Ralph up to capo based on how well he was doing with Richie's old crew. Putting Gigi as capo was another Tony ego over business decision -- Tony took offense to Ralphie referring to the crew as "his," then Ralphie compounded it with taking Jackie, Jr. to collect from the Arab. After that, Ralphie was slighted and started acting more outrageously. Since the rest of the crew viewed Gigi as an outsider, the crew treated Ralphie as the de facto capo, which put both Tony and Gigi in a difficult spot.

The same things that Tony hated in Ralphie were the same problems Tony had -- poor impulse control, propensity to violence and subverting the Boss' orders. Tony beating Mahaffey in a very public setting was far stupider than what Ralphie did to the Arab. And Tony had no issue going behind Jackie Aprile's back and lying to his face about it -- look at the Hassidic hotel situation in 46 Long.

You make some interesting points, particularly about Tony not liking the same shortcomings Ralph had that Tony himself also had.

Tony did do some stupid things throughout the series that a boss should never do. As early as the pilot, not only did he punch Mahaffey, he ran him over in front of plenty of witnesses. The Bevalaqua hit was even dumber, as was the killing of the rat in "College."

I'm not disputing your statement, but can you explain how Tony went behind Jackie Aprile's back with the Hassidic hotel? What I recalled was Tony & Silvio meeting the hotel owner/son. This occurred after Silvio brought up the situation when they were all visiting Jackie in the hospital. My memory may be faulty, but I felt as if Tony was honest with Jackie about the whole thing (unless he lied about the percentage for the family, which would be par for the course with Tony).

I'm off an episode - it's actually Denial, Anger, Acceptance. Just before Tony brings in the "nurse," Jackie asks about the motel situation.

Tony lies and said they reached out, Teitelmann wasn't receptive and implied the daughter and son-in-law were going back. Meanwhile, Paulie and Silvio already had spirited Ariel away from the motel for some "persuasion."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q3pCKXRU0Ts

Wow, It's da Jackeeettt. I know exactly what scene you're describing, but I never picked up on Tony's deception to Jackie.

That was a big risk Tony took on by lying to the boss. But knowing Tony, he probably took into account that: a) Jackie was in the hopsital, and b) Tony could probably lie his way out of it to Jackie if ever caught (which was unlikely) by saying that Paulie & Silvio took Ariel away without Tony's knowledge.

I guess setting up Jackie to get laid was probably still a good-will gesture. But it was inadvertantly helpful to Tony since it happened immediately after Tony told his lie.

Paulie tells Silvio to go get his fucking shine box.

Its a silo.

I don't give a fuck what it is, whats the matter with you ? You look like a Puerto Rican whore with that wig on Silvio. You make me sick.

It's as if the ghosts of Billy Batts and Phil Leotardo are speaking through Paulie and Sil.

I smell a new series...Medium meets Sopranos.

Haha Paulie chucking the chairs at the mafia ghosts haunting him....."fucking queers"

Make sure Paulie has the white tennis shoes with the Sansabelt slacks. That outfit alone was almost as funny as the chair toss.

Speaking of Ralph, the reason Tony made a mistake with that, not only was Ralph a power of the family, with his earning power and him taking over the Aprile crew. Later on in The Soprano's, towards the end of his life, he was becoming likable. I think this showed a bit on the show, after his son died, he began to not be such a prick all the time. I think that's what Tony's dream represented and he was in the backseat of the car with his mom, I think, and Johnny Boy was driving and Ralph was in the passenger seat with a catipillar crawling on his bald head.


Considering the way things happened, Jersey would've just been either absorbed, or most likely installed as puppets to the Lupartazzi family. Paulie didn't have the skills needed to run the family. As someone already mentioned, he was a bygone from another era almost, he ran with Tony's dad and uncle, and I think Tony rewarded him for that and for choosing to be loyal to him, being Johnny Boy's son, as opposed to his uncle. I don't think guys like Patsy would really want to be loyal, and I don't think the whatever was left of the family would buy into him as chairman of the company.

Benny Fazio should not be overlooked in this "what if" scenario.

He was very trusted by Tony and others, often charged with not only guarding Tony sometimes but the entire family.

He also had made his bones several times and was point on several big issues.

Just sayin, when things are bad, anything can happen.

DP

Silvio was always more reliable.