3 O'CLOCK

Another clue that Tony was whacked...

Remember when Chris is in the hospital after getting shot in the 2nd Season? He warns Tony and Paulie about the message supposedly given to him for them by Mikey Palmice in hell. The message, of course, was "3 O'clock."
Paulie goes nuts, thinking something is going to happen at 3 O'clock.

But what if "3 o'clock" didn't mean a time at all — but a direction?

In pilot's terms, "3 o'clock means straight to the right. Now, if Tony was whacked by the Members Only jacket guy, which direction would his assassin have come from?

From the restroom, straight to his right.

I betcha if we could see what happens afterward, Paulie gets whacked soon too. His killer coming from the right.

I believe Tony got "86'ed" (episode #86) but I wonder who did it. Was it Butch for disrespecting him when curb stomping CoCo?

As loyal as Paulie was to Tony and the fact that he took over the cursed Aprile crew does not bode well for him either.

I've tried to think of a connection between Eugene Pontecorvo wearing a Members Only jacket in the first episode of 6-pt 1, and Tony getting it from the guy in the Members Only jacket at the end, but I've come up short.

But you have to ask: Who would have the balls, and the muscle to deal with the fallout, to whack a boss, even a Jersey boss? It had to be the New York Lupertazzi Family. The assassination was professionally done, that's unquestionable. It wasn't just some emotionally motivated killing.
And Butch was probably getting a lot of pressure from his Capos to revenge Phil's gruesome death, however unintentional it might have been. That could have been enough to make him finish what they started by chopping off the head and doing business with whatever's left.

And there's the money NY would have to pay to Janice...

Not a big enough motive in itself, but taken together with everything else might have pushed Butch over the edge when he started thinking about it.

I totally agree. Plus the emphasis on the wind chimes that wake Paulie up in the episode, is just the same sound as the chimes on the ice cream parlour door as people enter. As Chase has rumored to have said, "Its all there if you look close enough"

I don't think it was Butch.First of all,there wouldn't be any pressure from his captains because Butch turned his back on Phil.Phil's #3 was there,so was Little Carmine and the guy who set up the meet,George Paglieri.
The captains probably agreed with his decision because otherwise Butch himself would have been killed.

And if Butch was to whack Tony,that would restart the war,seeing as how they didn't have their own Jersey guy anymore(Burt Gervasi).
If that was his intetion all along(make himself boss and wipe out Jersey),why not kill Paulie Gualtieri too?They had that meeting(the one Carlo missed)...

But I DO think Paulie probably got whacked. We just didn't see it.

And if it wasn't Butchy, then who? The only higher level guy within the DiMeo Crime Family left alive who ever had a real problem with Tony was Patsy (for killing his twin brother.) Not only had Patsy, apparently, let it go, but at that time, when the DiMeos were so weakened by thier two top guys getting put down (Sil and Bobby), I don't think anybody from within would be looking to weaken the family further. They just wanted to stay alive at that point

They didn't consider Paulie important enough to whack despite his high status in the family.

True. But things change.

This only brings me back to the theory that the message of "3 O'Clock" for Tony AND Paulie only was a warning about which direction their assassin would be coming from. Assuming Tony was indeed killed (and I think only a few hold-outs disagree on that point), from the RIGHT was in fact where the Members Only guy would have come from to shoot Tony. We can only speculate about Paulie's demise.

I WILL say this (and it's been mentioned before elsewhere). The creepy orange cat coming up to Paulie in his very last scene wasn't a good omen. In the Sopranos (as in the Godfather) orange is the color of impending doom. Reportedly, Chase had the picture of the big orange tiger in the resteraunt purposely placed there for Tony's last scene. What does that tell you? The same is true for the orange cat walking up to Paulie in HIS last scene.

I think the Orange gets used as a joke at this point in mob movies more than anything.

Maybe. But I believe Chase was serious about it.

I always noticed that The Sopranos used eggs to mean an impending death moreso than oranges/orange colors. Numerous characters have mentioned eggs in episodes where they get whacked or within a few episodes of being whacked.

Never noticed that...any examples?

Raphie....maybe Richie?

Food in general is associated with anxiety, death or disaster.

- Carlo's chopping onions, I believe, just before he and Sil kill Big Dom.
- Tony steps on eggs before ordering the hit on Tony B.
- Ralphie is making scrambled eggs just before Tony kills him.
- Richie sits down to enjoy his meal just before Janice shoots him.
- Tony's panic attacks are at one point associated with raw meat.
- The brief exchange before Chris kills Emil Kolar: "In the Czech Republic too we love pork. You ever have our sausages?"
- Valentina is cooking eggs when she sets fire to herself.
- Livia's cooking mushrooms when her kitchen sets alight.
- Tony's eating onion rings in the final scene...

But then food also brings people together...

- Tony and his family seek shelter in Artie's new restaurant at the close of season one.
- Funerals loom large in the show; there's always a feast.
- Speaking of which, Junior finds particular comfort by attending the funerals of those to whom he's barely related; he enjoys the food more than anything.
- Vito's love affair in season 6A is with more than johnny cakes.
- Tony and Carmela's decadence, with their sushi restaurant...

There are tons more.

Food is a HUGE part of the Italian culture and David Chase obviously knows this, having lived it. I can NOT emphasize this enough. We talk about food the way normal people gush over their children .

Ralphie, sure. But Richie wasn't eating eggs, or about to eat eggs, when Janice shot him.
And food is indeed a major part of Italian culture. However, I still believe in the old cliche about the color orange being SPECIFICALLY associated with impending death.
One example: Tony and the bottle of orange juice when the black guys try to kill him on contract from Junior.

I don't think Italians have a monopoly on food and its association with emotions or events. Food, at least in America, is everywhere which means that just about wherever we are and whatever we are doing, there's food around to consume whether it's for nutritional purposes, to mitigate an emotional state, to augment conversation, or to ease boredom.

The color orange: I don't know about.

Adrianna also asked Chrissy if he wanted eggs in the same season she was killed.

Wiseguys are 24/7 people. For them, breakfast time is anytime.

By the way: "[appeared to be] killed"

The same SEASON? That's pretty broad.

I think the while crew got wacked, in fact they even got Carm and Janice because i one season carm ate eggs at 3 oclock, and then in one of the other seasons, it was dark at oclock, which chase meant to indicate going black really and I think you guys got to much time on your hands.

We find too much time on our hands because David Chase had too much time on his hands.

I thought Meadow killed Tony?

I think you make a valid point. But all this talk about some secret message is non sense IMO. The producers needed a way to end the series. But they wanted to leave it open for possible future productions. Mean while trying to make a catchy ending. Which has actuallly just pissed everyone off.

I don't think there is a said answer to what happened. I think it was just the ending of the serious.

When Carmine Lupertazzi Sr. has his stroke on the golf course he is eating egg salad

Forgot to mention he was the only one at the table drinking OJ

In my mind, Season 2 was a legendary season. While I fall asleep I'll think this subject over. But, previously it's always felt liked a dropped plotline. Like what happened in Lost, to a lesser extent.

Probably a little late to respond to this, but I just read this now.

As you obviously refer to the "presumed" assassination, I don't think it was actually carried out profesionally.

First of all, why would the "members only" hitman first go to the bathroom and then kill Tony? He could have killed him immediately after he walked beside him and get the hell out of there. Or was it that they desperately wanted to make yet another reference to The Godfather?

Second, Mafia hitmen mostly carry out assassinations as a "hit and run". You don't want people to recognise you. Therefore, I don't think a professional hitman would sit around in a public restaurant showing his face while observing his target before killing him on the spot.

Third, although I'm not totally sure, but isn't it against mafia protocol to kill someone in front of his wife and children?

Fair enough, Phil Leotardo was killed that way, but they had to make the exception as he was in constant hiding and it was probably the only change to get to him.

The point I'm trying to make, if Tony would have been killed by the hitman, it was not professionally done IMO.

True Sonny Black, but Chase had always taken liberties with the show. Watching the whole sixth season from the beginning, there are many references to Tony's fate.

I think the three o'clock dream was something Chase was thinking about but decided to go in a different direction as the show progressed.

I feel like people who try to explain the finale as anything other than Tony being whacked, are reaching. "It's all there if you look close enough" like Chase said.

chase also said "anyone who thinks tony soprano died while eating a plate of onion rings can fuck off" or something to that extent.

lol Are there any published articles that say he died eating onion rings. The way he devoured the goba goo on the show was enough to give anyone a heart-attack.

chase was referring to that tony and his family were eating a plate of onion rings in the final scene when some people think he was killed.