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questionable deaths by shooting

Posted By: brickman_75

questionable deaths by shooting - 09/26/07 04:54 PM

i always wondered how vito corleone took 6 or 7 bullets to the back and survived, but they trust barzini died from 2 to the back from a further distance. also, joey zasa( 3 to the back- assumed dead).
i mean... they WERE all dead, but when you get ONE chance to whack a boss, you want a guarantee! anyone have thoughts on this?
Posted By: Turnbull

Re: questionable deaths by shooting - 09/26/07 05:52 PM

Welcome, Brickman.
The short answer is: filmic license. It made for greater drama. We expect that two Mob hitmen on a mission would empty their guns into their victim. But, Vito had to survive the shooting. Logic be damned. Arguably, a combination of Vito's heavy overcoat and layers of clothing, combined with sheer luck, might have allowed him to survive all those shots. Not likely, but the imperative was for FFC to produce a dramatic scene, and for Vito to survive.
And, you're right: there are plenty of illogical shooting techniques for the sake of drama. Why did Rocco and his associate need to use a pair of Madsden submachine guns to kill Tattaglia and the hooker he was in bed with from a distance of about five feet? Why would one guy (Neri), armed with just one six-shot revolver, be entrusted on a mission to kill (as it turned out) Barzini, a bodyguard and the chauffeur? Awfully thin margin. And his .38 Police Special is neither particularly powerful nor accurate at the distance he shot Barzini. Why did Clemenza need a shotgun (big, heavy, conspicuous) to whack Stracci and the other guy in the elevator, when a handgun would have been less conspicuous, lighter and easier on a fat old guy climbing stairs? My favorite anomaly in GF is FFC's homage to Arthur Penn ("Bonnie and Clyde") when he has Sonny riddled with about 100 rounds from Thompson submachine guns--and still able to stand, writhe, scream, etc. Tommyguns fired .45 ACP rounds--the proverbial "big, slow round." They are designed for knockdown power. Even one hit would have knocked Sonny to the ground.
Why? Drama! Visual impact! Fodder for people like you and me to post on. ;\)
Posted By: olivant

Re: questionable deaths by shooting - 09/26/07 06:03 PM

 Originally Posted By: Turnbull
Welcome, Brickman.
The short answer is: filmic license. It made for greater drama. We expect that two Mob hitmen on a mission would empty their guns into their victim. But, Vito had to survive the shooting. Logic be damned. Arguably, a combination of Vito's heavy overcoat and layers of clothing, combined with sheer luck, might have allowed him to survive all those shots. Not likely, but the imperative was for FFC to produce a dramatic scene, and for Vito to survive.
And, you're right: there are plenty of illogical shooting techniques for the sake of drama. Why did Rocco and his associate need to use a pair of Madsden submachine guns to kill Tattaglia and the hooker he was in bed with from a distance of about five feet? Why would one guy (Neri), armed with just one six-shot revolver, be entrusted on a mission to kill (as it turned out) Barzini, a bodyguard and the chauffeur? Awfully thin margin. And his .38 Police Special is neither particularly powerful nor accurate at the distance he shot Barzini. Why did Clemenza need a shotgun (big, heavy, conspicuous) to whack Stracci and the other guy in the elevator, when a handgun would have been less conspicuous, lighter and easier on a fat old guy climbing stairs? My favorite anomaly in GF is FFC's homage to Arthur Penn ("Bonnie and Clyde") when he has Sonny riddled with about 100 rounds from Thompson submachine guns--and still able to stand, writhe, scream, etc. Tommyguns fired .45 ACP rounds--the proverbial "big, slow round." They are designed for knockdown power. Even one hit would have knocked Sonny to the ground.
Why? Drama! Visual impact! Fodder for people like you and me to post on. ;\)


Good points. Authorial license plays a big part in films. Contrast Sonny's murder in the novel with the machine guns in the film. Gratuitous.

Also, to answer the original question: to be fatal to a person usually requires that a bullet penetrate an organ. Sometimes bullets don't strike an organ, but sever an artery and the person bleeds to death.
Posted By: JMDII

Re: questionable deaths by shooting - 09/26/07 06:37 PM

In the book it says that not every bullet hit him in the back-some were in the thighs and his a**. Ouch!
Posted By: 45ACP

Re: questionable deaths by shooting - 09/28/07 02:07 AM

Not to mention the book says they got him in the leg and buttocks.
Posted By: Longneck

Re: questionable deaths by shooting - 09/28/07 02:54 PM

 Originally Posted By: 45ACP
Not to mention the book says they got him in the leg and buttocks.


Oh, yes sir. Bit me right in the buttocks. They said it was a million dollar wound, but the army must keep that money 'cause I still haven't seen a nickel of that million dollars.
Posted By: mustachepete

Re: questionable deaths by shooting - 09/29/07 12:28 AM

 Originally Posted By: Turnbull


Why did Rocco and his associate need to use a pair of Madsden submachine guns to kill Tattaglia and the hooker he was in bed with from a distance of about five feet?


Never liked that choice by Coppola because, in contrast to the book, it required the death of an innocent.
Posted By: AppleOnYa

Re: questionable deaths by shooting - 09/29/07 01:02 AM

 Originally Posted By: mustachepete
...Never liked that choice by Coppola because, in contrast to the book, it required the death of an innocent.


Actually, Coppola did that again in GFII, when Geary's prostitute was murdered in order for him to be set up by the Corleones. Tom didn't seem to feel too bad about it, either.

Perhaps a subliminal message in there somewhere... TWO 'innocent' whores losing their lives while simply trying to make a living.

Any hookers killed in GFIII? (You see, Don Cardi...a part of the movie I actually DID NOT see! \:p )

Apple
Posted By: Don Cardi

Re: questionable deaths by shooting - 09/29/07 01:27 AM

 Originally Posted By: AppleOnYa
Any hookers killed in GFIII?


Yeah, Mary.
Posted By: Turnbull

Re: questionable deaths by shooting - 09/29/07 10:21 PM

 Originally Posted By: AppleOnYa
Perhaps a subliminal message in there somewhere... TWO 'innocent' whores losing their lives while simply trying to make a living.


Apple

Not-so-subliminal message: The innocents were dropping like flies after Michael took over.
Posted By: dontomasso

Re: questionable deaths by shooting - 10/01/07 05:00 PM

 Originally Posted By: Turnbull
 Originally Posted By: AppleOnYa
Perhaps a subliminal message in there somewhere... TWO 'innocent' whores losing their lives while simply trying to make a living.


Apple

Not-so-subliminal message: The innocents were dropping like flies after Michael took over.


Come to think of it what ever became of Clemenza's concern for "pain in the ass innocent bystanders?"
Posted By: Turnbull

Re: questionable deaths by shooting - 10/01/07 06:06 PM

 Originally Posted By: dontomasso
 Originally Posted By: Turnbull
 Originally Posted By: AppleOnYa
Perhaps a subliminal message in there somewhere... TWO 'innocent' whores losing their lives while simply trying to make a living.


Apple

Not-so-subliminal message: The innocents were dropping like flies after Michael took over.


Come to think of it what ever became of Clemenza's concern for "pain in the ass innocent bystanders?"

Evidently Michael found them to be a pain in the ass.
Posted By: dontomasso

Re: questionable deaths by shooting - 10/01/07 06:42 PM

 Originally Posted By: Turnbull

Evidently Michael found them to be a pain in the ass.



Everything reallly went to hell after Clemenza died of that non-heart attack.
Posted By: mustachepete

Re: questionable deaths by shooting - 10/02/07 01:16 AM

 Originally Posted By: mustachepete


Never liked that choice by Coppola because, in contrast to the book, it required the death of an innocent.


Come to think about it, following the book would have required full-frontal by Tataglia. Coppola's always right....
Posted By: mercop

Re: questionable deaths by shooting - 01/12/08 05:44 PM

I am re-reading the godfather and I just read the shooting scene so here's how it went in the book. The Don was shot once in the back twise in the a** and one in his arm and leg. as for the baptisim the killing of Barzini I think he used the 38 spesial because that's what the cop's used.
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