Being made

When your made you become a wiseguy/soldier/button/goodfella.
Is that true because sometimes I think when your made they mean you become a caporegime.

Lefty Ruggiero was a made guy, a wiseguy.
Tommy DeSimone (DeVito in the movie GoodFellas) should become made but he get killed. But does he (thought) become a soldier or a caporegime.
So henry Hill and Jimmy Burke were associates and not wiseguys/goodfellas/soldier/button

So i have a few questions:
1-being made: Wiseguy or Caporegime
2-Soldier/Wiseguy/Button/GoodFella are they the same?
3- When DiVito (movie GoodFellas) thought he was going to get made, does he thougt he become a caporegime or a wiseguy?
4- Were Henry Hill and Jimmy Burke associates?

1- Being made means initiation to the Mafia. Henry Hill, James Burke, And Tommy DeSimone (DeVito) were never part of the Mafia, they simply worked for it.
2- It depends who calls them what. Button and Soldier are the same. Wiseguy and Goodfella can be used to describe both initiated men (i.e. soldiers), or uninitiated associates. It isn't an official title as is "soldier" or "capo".
3- Tommy was going to be made a soldier.
4- Henry Hill, James Burke, and Tommy DeSimone were all associates, meaning they worked for the Lucchese family, but were never part of it. Except Tommy, who was told he was being made as a trap.

But they were in the crew of caporegime Paul Vario or not? So, if your in a crew of a capo it doesn't automatticly mean your a made guy(soldier)?

I can see why you're asking that question, Juventus--it seems confusing:
A scandal erupted in the US Mafia in the Fifties, when a high-ranking member of one New York family was found to be collecting bribes from would-be Mafiosi to get "made" in official ceremonies. As a result, the US Mafia "Commission" "closed the books" on new memberships.
But families still had business to attend to, and needed people to do their work. So they began recruiting "associates": people of various backgrounds (not just Italians) who could do Mob work for the Don or a caporegime and be rewarded, but would not be "made members" of the family. This was a good arrangement for both sides. The boss didn't have to give the associate a regular racket (called a "living") as he would for a made man. Nor would he have to support the associate's family if the associate were jailed. But the associate benefited because he didn't have to live by all the rules that applied to a made man. He could do other work or free-lance crimes on his own without having to kick money upstairs to the boss. An associate could make a lot of money and have real clout in a Mafia family--as you saw in "Goodfellas," Jimmy functioned like a crew chief, even though he wasn't made, and never could be made because he was Irish. And since made men attract more attention from law enforcement, associates were less vulnerable to arrest. If they were arrested and convicted, and judges knew that they weren't made men of the Mafia, they'd probably get lighter sentences.
This began to change in the early '70's, when, as you heard in "Goodfellas," the NY Mafia bosses decided to "open up the books" and start "making" more members. That's what Tommy was told.

OK Thanks Turnbull and Researcher.

I know this topic is old (more than a year) but i saw it by research:)

I have a uestion: Were there before the 50's than nearly no associates?

Juventus, it's really hard to know what was going on in the US Mafia before the Fifties because neither the FBI nor most other law enforcement agencies even acknowledged the Mafia.

OK thanks Turnnbull. It's amazing to see how much more I know about the mafia now, than at the time I opened this topic.
I learned a lot, and I learned also a lot on this forum.

So Burke, DeSimone, and Hill were associates...

But they were working for Paulo Vario. What was his role in the Lucchese family? Was he a Caporegime, or was he also just a soldier? That would confuse me, cause what they were doing seemed big business.

vario was a captain

They were doing big business, and it underscores an important point: You don't have to be "made" to function inside the Mafia. Jimmy, Henry and Tommy were full-time gangsters, operating as members of Paulie's crew, but they weren't made. Jimmy, in effect, functioned as a crew chief even though he could never be made. As long as they brought big bucks to Paulie, they were ok with him.

Was Jimmy Burke "promoted" to "lieutenant" of his own crew by Paul Vario? If so, did Gaetano Lucchese approve of his "promotion"?

No, Jimmy Burke didn't become a lieutenant. He never came higher than 'associate'. That was because he was Irish and you must be Italian to become a made-member (soldier, lieutenant, boss). He only ACT like a lieutanent, like TUrnbull said, but he never became one. I personally think, that if he was Italian he would become a highranking mafioso (lieutanent or maybe even higher).

I think you've misunderstood what I meant.

O, I'm sorry. Maybe you could explain your answer a little further...?

O, I'm sorry. Maybe you could explain your question a little further...?

Tommy Desimone in Goodfellas is not played by Danny Devito ahahahah That would have been hilarious, it was Joe Pesci...



Joe Batters

Hahaha! No with 'DeVito in the movie GoodFellas' i meant that his name in GoodFellas was Tommy DeVito, not Tommy DeSimone. His name was changed...
haha, yes I agree if Danny DeVito played Tommy it would be hilarious!

Juventus, what Peter_Clemenza meant was: Was James Burke, being just an associate, unofficial-captain of his own crew, that consisted out of Irishmen, Italians,...?

Als je begrijpt wat ik bedoel...