Pat's Thoughts Volume 39: Racism--It's still alive

racism n. - The belief that race accounts for differences in human character or ability and that a particular race is superior to others.

Race is definetly one of the factors that divides the nation right now. I don't think there's anyone on here who can't say they've never said a racial comment or have never racially profiled another race. With the 62 % of America being White, the other 38 % represents Black, Hispanic, and Asian people (in that order). By 2025, Spanish is expected to be very close to the White race and Hispanics are going to be the main language of the country.

I won't lie, a lot of Hispanic people at my school really piss me off. They usually frustrate me so much that I usually do say some hatred about them, some of which I've even talked to people on this board about. I think the problem with this sudden rush of all ethnicities being brought together could be a huge problem. Obviously, some people understand and learn things better then others. I hate to say that minorities don't care about school work, but that seems to be the case. Don't get me wrong, a lot of my White friends don't care either, but my White friends aren't getting this 'extra help.'

A lot of people on here and people all around the political spectrum seem to be complaining about Affirmative Action and minorities getting more benefits in school. I have no problem with a minority getting extra help or maybe a slight extra bump to get into college, but minorities aren't the only people struggling right now. As I said earlier today, my school ranks 4th from last in state testing.

I don't think that giving extra SAT points to minorities will help the sitation. To me, that's like cheating. I think their education would need to be inspected. If someone really tries hard, but just can't get that great score on the SAT, then I think it'd be right for them to get some extra points, but that's not the case. There's an option on the SATs to check off a box for benefits if you're a minority. It doesn't matter if you're failing all of your classes in school and don't care. You can actally get benefits.

To me, this isn't helping anyone. This is telling people that they are going to be given things all through life and can't fail.

The problem is this: When a White speaks out against minorities getting extra help, they're labeled racist. If they agree that minorities need extra help (which I agree), they're pretty much saying that minorities don't have the mind of that of a White person, and then they're labeled racist. I think that all minorities can do whatever a White person can do, but I do think that most times they do need to work a bit more harder.

I think that the difference between Whites and minorities is definetly a problem and will be a huge one if we don't address it in a more well mannered way. It's time for the education system to recheck itself. -Pat

In regards to racism against blacks, the first place to start is with the black community itself. As long as people are going around calling each other the "n word" it will always be around. I don't agree with that "it's alright for us to use it but not you" crap. I know MANY college educated and/or doctorate level black people who will not talk to another black person if they use that word.

I worked with a guy who was black and called EVERYONE the "n word"- one of the guys I worked with called him that one day and the guy punched him.

The black community has to stop using words like that and then you will see how "alive racism is"


one more thing: is it right for a construction company that is building new homes to HAVE TO turn white people away ONLY because they NEED to hire a certain percentage of other races. There was a construction project in my town that took over 2 months to start because they didn't have any black people signing up to work. The guy said it was illegal to start the project because the numbers weren't right and even though no black person signed up, the minute they started working one could come down and potentially file a lawsuit.

Ugh. I was hoping I wouldn't have to address this, but I guess I have to. Black people don't go around and say, "Yo n-gger." They say, "nigga," which means Never Ignorant Getting Goals Accomplished. Please don't turn this into a whole Black thread or start bashing rappers. I am talking about all minorities here and BTW, a lot of Hispanics at my school call each other 'niggas' too. -Pat

Racism will always exist and there really isn't anything that can be done to stop it. This isn't some new revelation that racism is still alive. It has been, still is, and always will be alive.

And please tell me what percentage of CEO's in America know the difference? There is no difference to people just hearing the word.

I have not bashed a single rapper but if you want to talk about racism then you need to address the problem where it starts.

If you want to change the "world" then you need to change yourself. You can't go around calling each other "nigga" or the "nword" and expect people to know the difference. CUT BOTH WORDS out of the vocabulary and how about just saying HEY. It seems a lot more professional than yelling something like "yo nigga" out.

I agree with DMC, its pretty hard to tell the difference between the two versions of the word and even tho you may think it means that acronym, most people arent going to think thats what it means. A lot of white kids or hispanics will use it because they hear in rap songs or on TV. They never say it around a black person tho unless theyre trying to piss them off.

I agree that racism will never go away. I myself am not racist per se, but I tend to find myself using racist remarks when I'm insanly pissed, i.e "You Jew prick" or Goddamn n-iggers" When i am myself, I would never hold it against anyone if they were black or a Jew, or any other race/whathaveyou. Its only when someone really gets to me that I use terms like that.

Actually, Whites are about 75% of the population, 12.3% Black and 12.5% Hispanic. The hispanics are probably much more though, here illegally. Source: Time Almanac.

The Hispanics better not take over this country and turn the main language into Spanish. America is an English-speaking language, and English is probably going to be made the official language in the near future. We need to totally shut down the Mexican border, and put the National Guard down there to back up Border Patrol. Mexicans trying to illegally enter the US should be sniped. That'll really unencourage terrorists to use that border, too.

But I believe this nation will always remain in majority comprised of people of English, German, Italian, and Irish descent as it always has been.

Affirmative action is flat wrong. That's racism in minorities favor.

And you know, the majority of racism is against Whites today. Truth is, minorities have waaaaaay higher percentage rates of crime, lower scores in education. Many think because they are minoirty they can cheat their way through everything. They should just be happy they're here and get the freedoms that the majorities get and be thankful we aren't like Hitler.

I want to know why us white people don't have any good acronyms. Seriously.

I mean, blacks have "THUGLIFE" and, apparently, "NIGGA" and "NAACP" and all this other good stuff.

What do we get? ACLU? That's gay.

[/politically_incorrect]

---

Anyways, as far as racism goes, we've hit the pinnacle in our country, where the minority is given special priviledge over the majority. It's essentially discrimination against whites.

For instance, my university is ranked #2 in the nation for foreign enrollment. We are funded by the taxpayers of the state of New York. Yet these foreign students, who are now the majority of students, for the most part, don't pay tuition...yet I see my tuition increase every year.

Our Vice President had a quote in the Buffalo News recently because we "don't have enough foreign students." I'm sorry. When it's like a 8-to-1 ratio of Asian to American, and the taxpayers are paying for not only their kids, but foreigners, who get their education and then go home and support their countries economies...that's wrong.

In my opinion, at least.

And I don't care what color you are, we've got people from everywhere...India, Pakistan, Asia, Africa, Scandinavia, Australia, etc. But the sad fact is that our (NYS residents and taxpayers) rates keep going up, while the number of foreign students, who don't pay, increases. And the standards for international students is far lower than it is for American students, which is also interesting. They continue to make it harder for Americans and residents of the United States to get in, yet foreign students are accepted with a stamp of approval that requires little more than the press of a wrist.

Regards,
Double-J

Actually, Whites are about 75% of the population, 12.3% Black and 12.5% Hispanic. The hispanics are probably much more though, here illegally. Source: Time Almanac.

The Hispanics better not take over this country and turn the main language into Spanish. America is an English-speaking language, and English is probably going to be made the official language in the near future. We need to totally shut down the Mexican border, and put the National Guard down there to back up Border Patrol. Mexicans trying to illegally enter the US should be sniped. That'll really unencourage terrorists to use that border, too.

But I believe this nation will always remain in majority comprised of people of English, German, Italian, and Irish descent as it always has been.

Affirmative action is flat wrong. That's racism in minorities favor.

And you know, the majority of racism is against Whites today. Truth is, minorities have waaaaaay higher percentage rates of crime, lower scores in education. Many think because they are minoirty they can cheat their way through everything. They should just be happy they're here and get the freedoms that the majorities get and be thankful we aren't like Hitler. [/quote]The white race is at 62.5 % if we're going to be technical about it. I got news for you. The Hispanics are taking over this country and the main language WILL be Spanish by 2025 (that is a researched fact).

Because their education is too difficult. They need more help, which is what affirmative action and these benefits do for them. I think it's clear that the Black race definetly is cornered by the courts in the US. There's definetly racism in our courts today.

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Posted by DJ:
We have to remember everything that Blacks went through in this country. They were traded from country to country like animals. They've only been free from slavey for 134 years in the US. The Civil Rights Act was only passed in 1964. Also, not all Blacks support THUG LIFE or 'nigga.' Pretty much every single Black person who is over 50 is against them. Look at Bill Cosby. He's literally blaming rap music and the use of the word 'nigga' for Black kids not being able to read.

I don't think this should be a money issue though. I think that if someone comes here from another country or if a minority gets some kind've bonus, it's their responsibility to pay for college like every White person, whether it be a loan or whatever. -Pat

Agreed. I wholly disagree for this gladhanded support because someone is of a different ethnic descent.

I don't see any special "white kid" scholarships coming my way.

Agreed. I wholly disagree for this gladhanded support because someone is of a different ethnic descent.

I don't see any special "white kid" scholarships coming my way. [/b][/quote]Well, I think they should be able to get extra help and some bonus points on entrance into college if they have obviously tried, but no monetary prizes. -Pat

And that's where we disagree.

You're telling me an "underprivileged" black kid should get points because he's black, yet an "underprivileged" white kid gets none?

How is that fair?

wouldn't that just promote MORE racism; some kids will say:

why does that black kid get a higher score than me for doing less work? I don't like black kids for that.

THAT IS A STEP IN THE WRONG DIRECTION!

underprivleged black kids that do well may be better because they can overcome hardships such as poverty.

underprivileged white kids that do well may be better becasue they can overcome hardships such as poverty.


nothing to do with race there.

its harder for a black kid, ya gotta admit.

You're mixing up the terms "Spanish" and "Hispanics".

I'm not sure where you get your information from, but its just plain wrong. Black youth have used the term "n*gger" when talking among themselves for many years... long before the term "nigga" became fashionable.

well said SC.

Oh, that's where it is!!

Finally, we find a point of disagreement between you two. All this getting along was giving me a headache.

Well, racism is alive and kicking in Europe. Last night, the England football team played a "friendly" match against Spain, and our black players were targeted by the Spanish fans, who continuously taunted them and made monkey noises whenever they got the ball. And this wasn't just a few of the fans, the noise was deafening. The report by the BBC is here .

This kind of abuse makes me sick. I'm against "political correctness" and giving minorities preference for things, but this is treating blacks as if they aren't even human, and that's disgusting.

Right two points to make. First up:

I totally agree. No matter what, the best person for the job should be chosen, it doesn't matter what colour, gender, sexual orientation is. It doesn't even matter what work it is. But some work has worse implications. Say the fire force. Imagine if a new recruit was hired to fill a quota and wasn't the best at the job. This is a serious position and a dangerous line of work.

The next point I wish to make refers to Pat's opening title: 'Racism -- It's still alive'.

I saw and heard some pretty disgusting things in last nights international football friendly game between Spain and England. Each time a black English player got the ball there were hurls and chants of monkey sounds from the Spanish croud. Absolutely disgusting. I'm sure the majority of Spaniards are ashamed of the fans behaviour, there's no excuse for this.

You beat me to it Bella M. I shouldn't really be posting and cooking at the same time.

Yes Pat, racism is still alive in this very day and age. Just look at the Condoleezza Rice situation that has developed. It makes me sick that a well refined woman of her stature, self made with a top notch education, who overcame racial segragation in the south as a child, has been made fun of in a racial manner over last several days. What makes me even more disgusted is the way that she is being treated by many people of her own race!
Here's a perfect example of a double standard. If a black person struggles and does not overcome the barriers that they may face through thier journey in life, it is said, by many of their own people, that the person has been discriminated against, and held down because of thier color. And on many occasions it may be true. But at the same time, if that same person fights thier way through those barriers, self acheives and rises to a prominant postion within the world, those same people who yelled discrimination the first time now accuse this successful person of "selling out" becoming an "uncle Tom" or a "servant mammy" and of compromising with the powers that be! Such has been the case with Condoleezza Rice! It's really a shame that these kinds of names are used against successful minorities by thier own race of people!

So basically Pat, the problem not only exists between whites and minorities, the problem also exists right within the race itself!


Don Cardi

Of course, the trouble with "positive discrimination" is that it denigrates the achievments of those minorities who have actually worked hard to get to where they are in life - people assume that they've got their status as a token gesture rather than on merit.

It can also be very patronising. I've been reading in the papers recently how many institutions in the UK are banning the word "Christmas" and banning Santa Claus/Christmas trees etc as it supposedly offends non-Christians....how ridiculous. If I lived in, say, a Muslim country, I wouldn't be offended by them celebrating Ramadan and so on. Its all part of the culture of the country that you've made the decision to go and live in.

I agree with turi that this should never happen, but your press, and your players behaviour in the match promoted it. Because the spanish trainer didnt refer to henry in a racist way like your press said.

Racism is never going a way. I from Newark nj it
most black and my family is the alone Itaians
still here so I have a lot of black friends and
this guys will never stop saying the n word they
never stop saleing drugs but there just a handful
black want to do good in life but not alot. so
frist they have to help them selfs before anybody
else help them.

BMUK, I agree 100%. We are on the way to a society where everyone has to be the same. Blandness and mediocrity are celebrated and the only thing worse than being an under achiever is being an over achiever.

As regards last night's match, in Ireland (and I suspect Spain, though Nicolas will know best) multi-culturalism is a fairly new phenomenon. Go outside Dublin or Belfast and you won't see many faces that aren't white Caucasian. In terms of society dealing with this we are probably where the UK was 20-25 years ago. At this time banana throwing and monkey chants were fairly common in the UK (at football matches). Now it has been virtually eradicated. It will take countries that are not naturally multi-cultural more time to conform with what Brits regard as "normal" behaviour. While I cannot condone the behaviour of some Spanish football fans last night, the amount of media hand-wringing has been a bit over the top. Especially hard to take was that pompous blowhard Alan Green pontificating a few weeks after he was censured by Ofcom for making a racist remark.

I have to disagree with you guys saying that 'nigga' shouldn't be said. Well, until 1865, they were referred to as n-ggers. That's one word that could sum up America and show how far we have come. I also disagree with Turi and DMC about the hiring of Black people and other minorities. I think that they should be looked at first in SOME cases. In most cases, the White race is ALWAYS better for the job. If we don't give Blacks an extra boost, then they will go right on welfare. If you guys think that SOME minorities aren't as smart as the White race (which I agree, don't bombard me), then does that mean you want to segregate everything again? Whites and Whites? Blacks and Blacks? Hispanics and Hispanics? I do believe that Whites hold an advantage, though some of the White race could use some benefits too, but we must remember that Whites were never used as slaves and didn't have to experience the struggle of the 1800's and most of the 1900's. -Pat

Let's also remember that no person alive today WAS a slave.

Let's also remember that no person alive today WAS a slave. [/quote]I'm a slave to the rhythm

I think you should look back further towards the 1600's and indentured servitude, which is essentially white/european slavery...

Posted by DMC:
So what? People still refer to them as what they were called back them and talk about it everyday.

I think you should look back further towards the 1600's and indentured servitude, which is essentially white/european slavery...
[/b][/quote]Well, yeh, slave trade started way back when Europe was colonizing Africa. I'm just referring to what they endured here in America.

and whose fault is it that it is talked about everyday. The black people themselves continuously try to bring it up as a crutch. A good portion of white people DO NOT CARE if blacks were slaves. But its people like you who keep trying to bring it up.

and whose fault is it that it is talked about everyday. The black people themselves continuously try to bring it up as a crutch. A good portion of white people DO NOT CARE if blacks were slaves. But its people like you who keep trying to bring it up. [/quote]Whose fault is it? I'll use a recent example. People here and in the media are talking about how Mrs. Rice was in the segregated south. I have never heard her talk about this. Why is it ok for them to defend her with that, but it's wrong for blacks to bring up the negative side of slavery and segregation, or the ones who didn't succeed like Mrs. Rice? I don't keep 'trying to bring it up.' You asked my opinion and I gave it, willingly. -Pat

No one asked you to start a thread entitled : "Racism- still alive"


one more thing- how would MR. Matrin Luther King Jr. feel about you saying that?

No one asked you to start a thread entitled : "Racism- still alive" [/quote]..and no one asked you to give your opinion if you were offended (which it seems you are) by the subject. I didn't know I needed to ask permission, since I didn't the past 38 times. And I'd like you to reply to the other part of my post, since I was replying to your comment.

You honestly lost me. I said 'Mrs. Rice,' referring to the new Secretary of State.

No one asked you to start a thread entitled : "Racism- still alive" [/quote]..and no one asked you to give your opinion if you were offended (which it seems you are) by the subject. I didn't know I needed to ask permission, since I didn't the past 38 times. And I'd like you to reply to the other part of my post, since I was replying to your comment.

[/b][/quote]but you said "you weren't bringing it up" but You were by starting the thread in the first place


I didn't respond to that because I've never said it. I can't speak for WHY other people would say things.

There is no need to bring ANY OF IT UP. Slavery has not been around in this country for 200 years, no one alive today has lived through it so IT'S NOT AN EXCUSE FOR THEM. The 50/60 year old black men who lived through segregation can use that, not the 20 year olds.

Pat.

Mrs Rice is a Dr.

And I'm referring to when Europe colonized America.

No need bring any of it up? Why, because it's a problem that no one can solve and you want to ignore it?

I didn't bring up slavery in my first post. It was brought up by other people.

Are you talking about racism or slavery/segregation.


I was talking about slavery/segregation. It is over with there is nothing that can be done to change it.

Racism will always be around, just like sexism. But now we are back to 20 posts ago so there is no point in rewriting everything I've stated before

Ok? Does this mean I can't call her 'Mrs.'? If I ever see my doctor out of the hospital, I call his 'Mr.' Same with professors. I don't say, "Hey, 'professor etc'"-Pat

She's also not a Mrs...she's a Ms. (not married).

Ok? Does this mean I can't call her 'Mrs.'? If I ever see my doctor out of the hospital, I call his 'Mr.' Same with professors. I don't say, "Hey, 'professor etc'"-Pat [/b][/quote]People who spend the time in College/graduate school EARNED the right to be called Dr. It is very offensive to Dr's to be called Mr or Mrs.

Well you are in highschool so I doubt there are any Doctors there but if there are ask them what they would prefer to be called (Obviously not ALL Dr's prefer to be called Dr. but a LARGE majority of them do) But in college I have yet to call a professor mr/mrs. It is always Dr.

She's also not a Mrs...she's a Ms. (not married). [/b][/quote]She's married to her job

Your job does nothing for you and won't take out the trash so its the same as a Husband

Do you have a mouse in your pocket ?

* Mexicans didn't first come to the US, but rather the US came to Mexicans. The Southwest US was part of Mexico until 1848. Therefore the main language was Spanish before it was English.

* Affirmative Action has benefited women way more that any ethnic minorities group. Affirmative Action has benefited more white people (women) than anyone else. It is simply easier to bash ethnic minorities than it is to bash women of any race.

* the vast majority of crime is intra-race, intra-social class.

* If sounds like you wish you were (assuming you are not already) a member of an ethnic minority group. After all, they are now on top of the world from your perspective!

Is the Southwest US the United States of America or Mexico? The geography might have belonged to Mexico once, but the United States is an English-speaking nation. The nation expanded. So, the main language was always English.. it doesn't matter what territories used to belong to where.

So? Affirmative action is wrong with women, too.


Yeah. What's the point?


What??? I'm totally lost. What in the hell are you talking about? Please clarify, I'm very interested in where you pulled that paragraph from.

Racism is alive unfortunately, rap music is to blame, so is inter-racial relationships

How can inter-racial relationships be to blame? That would be one of the things stopping it.

Ok? Does this mean I can't call her 'Mrs.'? If I ever see my doctor out of the hospital, I call his 'Mr.' Same with professors. I don't say, "Hey, 'professor etc'"-Pat [/b][/quote]Pat,

As a sign of sheer respect it is proper to call a Doctor by the title Dr. instead of Mrs., Ms. or Mr. Same with a Judge, you refer to a judge as Your Honor in the court room, and if you meet him or her on the street you would address them as Judge so and so. It is just a proper way of doing things.


Don Cardi

It pisses a lot of white guys off to see white girls with blacks, and they may not have hated blacks before, but they end up hating them, not me obviously, but a friend of mine was happy-go-lucky and hated nobody (like me)but a black stole his girl and now he is derek vinyard the second, catch my drift?

It pisses a lot of white guys off to see white girls with blacks, and they may not have hated blacks before, but they end up hating them, not me obviously, but a friend of mine was happy-go-lucky and hated nobody (like me)but a black stole his girl and now he is derek vinyard the second, catch my drift? [/b][/quote]and if a white guy would have stole his girlfriend would he have hated all white guys?

That makes no sense.


that would make them racist already

I know it makes no sense you are right

As I say, it was not me it happened to.
Most Mediterranean countries are very anti- black unfortunately, italy, greece, cyprus and obviously spain, its a real shame, we are almost in 2005 and this level of racism still exists

Shitting hell, again I saw some disgusting scenes in football here in England. It makes us look like idiots after the fuss we've made about Spain. Even worse it was my team, Blackburn, that's the centre of the allegations. Video evidence clearly shows an ex Blackburn player being verbally abused by fans because of his black skin. I clearly made out numerous "Black bastards" to his face and monkey chanting. It's fucking wrong.

Britan too, is a very racist country racism is part of our society its a shame but there you go, it don't affect my life, being half greek half italian, so i dont really care about the issue

First of all, Britain is not a country.

Of course racism still exists here, find me a place where it doesn't. But here in England we're not half as bad as what we used to be even 20 years ago. We've become a multicultural society and especially with football racism wasn't the issue it was back then.

In general though we're much better now than we've ever been. We're long past the days of the political incorrectness of Love thy Neighbour and even some of the lines Del Boy spurts out in the very old Only Fools and Horses episodes. One particular line springs to mind which would never be used in that context again on TV: On discussing the devastation of a nuclear war and surviving it in a bomb shelter, Rodney explains there'd be no point in living withing nothing to eat. Del Boy's quick quip was something along the lines of: "There'd still be a paki shop on the corner somewhere".

my father was Itaian man and mom is a black
so what you trying to say

You speak a lot of politically correct rubbish Turi,

"There'd still be a paki shop on the corner somewhere"

Is hardly a 'racist' statement, for starters, the word 'paki' is merely an abbrievitaion of pakistani, and racism is as bad as it has ever been over here, but the government would have you believe otherwise, a friend of mine told me he saw the spain vs england game in a pub, and when the spanish were making the immature little monkeys noises, the whole pub was laughing...

You obviously didn't understand the point of the Del Boy quote. Whether or not 'Paki' is acceptable is another matter though it's pretty racist when all Middle Eastern people are referred to as 'Paki's'.

The point of the quote was to outline a racist stereotype that all 'Paki's' own corner shops.

Are you honestly telling me, that as an english person, you have NEVER used the term 'paki' to refer to an asian/middle eastern person, I find this quite absurd, and most english people who say racism 'sickens' them ect.. are merely scared of getting into trouble by saying something 'out of line', are you one of those people turi? i dont know, but anyone who thinks only fools and horses is 'racist' you have to wonder about :rolleyes:

You're completely missing the point so I'm ending this here.

Turi, you seem an intelligent guy, but quoting only fools and horses as racist, is simply stupid, and quite frankly very see-through, but anyway...

this is come form a half greek half Italian person
if one of my sisters come home with a greek
all hell will break

this is come form a half greek half Italian person
if one of my sisters come home with a greek
all hell will break [/b][/quote]greeks and italians are both members of the WHITE race, you cock

you greeks really make me laugh

GSMD has been banned for making a personal attack. He correctly used the "Report Post" feature to inform a moderator of what he felt was an infraction of the Board's Rules, but that was AFTER he, himself, broke the rules. Regardless of who started it, he's gone. He promised to behave, but he lied.

don vencent - You were no better here in this situation. Its easy to take someone else's bait, but thats no excuse. No racial or ethnic slurs will be allowed here, regardless of who started it.

You can use the "Report Post" feature to report any problem on the boards.