European terrorism

Now the radical muslims have stormed a satirical newspaper office killing 12 people- at last count. They were armed with automatic assault rifles and were heard (And recorded)shouting "Alla Aqbar" or however you spell it. The French have let them push them around too long and now they are emboldened and see France as weak, just like they are seeing the USA. It is time for us and our allies to declare war on radical islam before they take over everything, and don't think it can't be done. Remember hitler. It is known that they have sleeper cells in USA. Only a matter of time before they strike.

Fucking bastards. Saw it on the news while eating lunch. Maybe now the French will kick these animals out of their country. Europe's got no balls to deal with these people, and they couldn't even protect this newspaper's right to produce satire.

These assholes bring a shame to the rest of us. They should hang them all. But I think an European all out war against radical Islam wouldn't have the desired results.
And also Im not so sure they are taking over everything. Me as a Muslim and the most of us are also against them( ISIS, al qaeda, etc.)
Radicalism is a problem in Islamic countries too not just in the west.

Sad as it is, horrible days like today will hopefully help open the eyes of Europe before it's too late. What needs to happen is an immigration stop from Muslim countries, deportation for every Arab that even jaywalks (European passport or no, I really don't care at this point) and the realization that Europe still needs a strong defense force. I've sad it before, allowing mass immigration from Muslim countries for the last 60 years is Europe's biggest mistake since Hitler.

In my country, there are areas in the big city's were Jewish people can't walk on the street because of who they are. Our politicians do nothing, cowards that they are. We're talking 70 years after the Holocaust and Jews again have to be afraid in Amsterdam. My family is Catholic, but as far as I'm concerned Europe has a Christian/Jewish culture. The end.

I wish my French brothers well and I hope they will catch these three animals soon, shoot them cripple and lock them up for live in a dark french prison.

Im from Utrecht and I understand what you are talking about, but dont you think deporting these people will make things worse?
Pushing away problems, creating hate against the government involved in this deportation process, giving them a reason to unify. Terrorism unfortunatelly wont be solved by deporting people to their home country.
And I can understand the hate against some of us immigrants, but working together will yield better results imo instead of pusing us away.

I absolutely believe it's the answer, my eyes have been open for quite some time now and I strongly believe the integration of the Muslim people has failed completely. Our cultures do not mix, it's that simple.

The latest news coming out now is that the three terrorists are 'homegrown', meaning they are born in France. So now in the next couple of days the left wing will tell us that therefore they are 'French'. But you see, they are not French. They're Moroccan, Libyan, Algerian or whatever who had every change to make something of themselves in the free West, but have chosen to attack us instead. Fuck them.

Horrible. I'm also from Europe and I know plenty people of a Muslim background. I really mean it when I say that there are a lot of great guys among them. In terms of radical Islamism there are very little problems with the Turkish and Albanian communities. Most of the problems are with people from an Arab background, North Africans, mostly Moroccans over here. And it really is a shame, because some of the greatest guys are Moroccan, but they also have some of the worst.

Radical idiots will only stereotype their own community. That way a lot of indigenous people (especially if they personally know few immigrants) will continuously be confronted with the worst aspects of the immigrant population. And to be honest, if you put yourself in their shoes those feelings of contempt become understandable. And backlash can get horribly extreme when the pot finally boils over, even with the current pacifistic culture of most Western Europeans.

@KJ

There's a large Albanian Muslim population here in the Bronx. I have one as a partner in one of my buildings. And you only have to hear how he curses these assholes for giving them all a bad name. It reminds me of the way my grandfather would bitch about the Mafia giving all Italians a bad name.

And where is the mass outcry from the Muslim community in Europe against terrorism? Where are their mass demonstrations against this violence?

Most of them either remain quiet or they outright support the violence against the West . I fear the worst is yet to come, and maybe we will even see civil war in the future. I don't wish for it, but a lot of the signs are there.

Tragic.May God help the victims famillies,the state of France too,and today of all days.Today the Orthodox cristians celebrate christmas.Serbs,Russians,Georgians etc.Nobody deserves to day like that,may God helps us all of what is yet to come.

True there is no mass outcry against terrorism and I still cant understand why there isn't. But the truth is many people are against it and these terrorists are a couple individuals in Europe. The huge support in the middle east stems from multiple factors, but the support in Europe from normal people for terrorism isn't that much of a concern imo.

And about the Arabs it is sadly true that most radicals come from them. I still firmly believe that the west and middle east can mix if done properly. Most of us have been reluctant to mix with Europeans and vice versa.

And indeed may god help the victims' families.

Yes and I agree with you on that. And in that way they're like a lot of minority communities: they're so quick to point out the faults of the other, yet they never seem to condemn their own. And that's what bothers me the most about their community as a whole. Individually I mostly get along with them.

A civil war? I won't say this isn't possible. I don't think it's near just yet, but in the future I won't leave out the possibility of something like that happening. Following WWII most Western Europeans have been holding rather pacifistic ideals. But a bucket can only hold so much water before it runs over...

I know a couple of Albanians, most of them are from Kosovo (which is widely viewed as the more "backwards" Albanian majority area). But while a certain portion of them is involved in crime -mostly within their own community- they're in general not a problem or a threat for the indigenous community. Most of them aren't really religious anyway, or at least not strict. Nationalistic as hell? That's a different story

Same goes for Turks. Like the Albanians, they mostly keep to their own community. Most of them are in fact hardworking. Over here you often get stereotypical remarks about the "lazy Turk", but in my opinion this is completely untrue. The vast majority of them have steady jobs and I guess a lot of people confuse them with Moroccans. I honestly don't know the reason for that because I can tell the difference between a Turk and a Moroccan in a heartbeat. Radical Islamism with Turks is -over here anyway- almost non-existant. Once in a while you may get the odd one out, but in general I don't mind Albanians and Turks at all.

Religion of peace

The policies of these globalist multicultural libs have consquences. And when you bring in a foreign, hostile, 3rd century population because you no longer feel the need to have children, you get modern europe. I hope people over there wake up to the fact they are going to cease to have a pluaristic, open society if they keep importing lunatics

Fox reports that the French have killed one terrorists and captured 2.

It's unconfirmed though

There will be more and more incidents like this I am afraid because the terror groups have their bases and breeding grounds in the West now. I truly fear for the world my grand kids will inhabit. Luckily I will have done my bit for mankind by then and shuffled off my mortal coil....

This is what 12 people in France died for?

One solution from a man in Texas.

Here in west Texas, I have rattlesnakes on my place, living among us. I have killed a rattlesnake on the front porch. I have killed a rattlesnake on the back porch. I have killed rattlesnakes in the barn, in the shop and on the driveway. In fact, I kill every rattlesnake I encounter. I kill rattlesnakes because I know a rattlesnake will bite me and inject me with poison. I don’t stop to wonder WHY a rattlesnake will bite me; I know it WILL bite me because it's a rattlesnake and that's what rattlesnakes do. I don’t try to reason with a rattlesnake or have a "meaningful dialogue" with it…I just kill it.

I don’t try to get to know the rattlesnake better so I can find a way to live with the rattlesnakes and convince them not to bite me. I just kill them. I don’t quiz a rattlesnake to see if I can find out where the other snakes are, because (a) it won’t tell me and (b) I already know they live on my place. So, I just kill the rattlesnake and move on to the next one. I don’t look for ways I might be able to change the rattlesnake to a non-poisonous rat snake...I just kill it. Oh, and on occasion, I accidentally kill a rat snake because I thought it was a rattlesnake at the time. Also, I know for every rattlesnake I kill, two more are lurking out there in the brush. In my lifetime I will never be able to rid my place of rattlesnakes.

Do I fear them? Not really. Do I respect what they can do to me and my family? Yes!! And because of that respect, I give them the fair justice they deserve....I kill them... As a country, we should start giving more thought to the fact that these jihadists' are telling the world their goal is to kill Americans and destroy our way of life. They have just posted two graphic videos on the Internet showing them beheading Americans. They are serious. They are exactly like rattlesnakes. It is high time for us to start acting accordingly!

+1,000,000

boy did that turn out to be completely wrong

Ch7 did the same and apologized.

these people that kill like they did in france deserve no mercy. when captured they should face a firing squad, instead of wasting time on a long trial.

swift justice and firing squads might help stop some of the violence. anyone agree?

You taught me a lot about religion,Binnie.

The fact that these fuckers haven't been caught yet is amazing. Call me crazy, but this leads me to believe that these guys have a significant network they can rely on to hide them. France has the largest Muslim population in Europe, it's conceivable, as Yogi stated, there are cells within France sheltering them.

Prayers to France and to the families of these innocent victims, but this should be a lesson to Europe. You let these people in your country, where the culture comparison is literally night and day you're going to face killings like this every day. That's not to say every immigrant from the Muslim world is a terrorist, but from the start it should have been more controlled

The french will probably give him some therapy and call it a day. Least you think this is in jest: Denmark has a government program that accepts ISIS fighters back and gives them some therapy so they arent mean anymore.

the head of britians m-15 security warned the west today that al-Queda operatives in Syria, may be planning major attacks against the west. he said they plan to cause large scale loss of life by attacking transport systems, and Iconic targets, in the U.S. and the U.K.

it was a rare public statement, he last spoke in public in oct 2014, he said " further attacks may be coming"

you and I both know they had better change their policies real quick, or the enemy will win.

The French are going to kill them today or give them live in prison. Those are the only two options as far as the French are concerned. Comparing Denmark to France is like comparing the US to Guatemala.

And believe me, it's better to be killed than to spend live in a French prison.

Now I don't know the laws in France so I can't speak on that, but let's say this was happening in the US they should be executed without trial? Forget civil liberties and the constitution, just take these murderers and shoot them? Where does it end then? Should we just go and shoot anyone who commits a crime without due process?

I'm not condoning violence, my hope is that these murderers are brought to justice. But our country was founded on the rights of citizens and once you take the rights away from people because of crimes they commit, what is stopping the powers that be from taking more rights away (like they are currently doing) under the guise of public safety.

Apparently, the French terrorists have been killed by French police.

Are French prisons that tough? I once read an interview with a Russian gangster who was in prison in Italy and he said Italian prisons aren't that horrible. I assumed prisons in European countries are similar.

French prisons are absolute hellholes. They have the most suicides of the prison system in Europe for a reason.

Now, of course to a Russian it might seem like a vacation .

Just kidding buddy .

Good, we should do it like that here. launch a grenade in and goobye.

DP

I don't understand this. Cannot Europe be competent enough not to let these dangerous radicals back into their country? The biggest threat to their security are homegrown dickheads that grew up in France but hated the culture or became enthralled with the jihadist agenda.

Francois Hollande says this has nothing to do with the Muslim religion. It has everything to do with the fucking Muslim religion!!! When you get people killing others shouting "Allah Akbar" that's smack dab related to this religion and the danger its radical followers present. The time to sit back in our own decadence is past, something needs to be DONE about this

How long will it be before Europe says enough of these heathen scum dogs? I think if Germany gets hit the Euro nations will unite and then there will be a major world wide anti-jihad movement and the fanatical/militant Muslim will feel the wrath of the Western world.

God I hope that happens. The power of the West coming down like a hammer on the radical Muslim organizations who had the nerve to attack us

I have the understanding that one of the terrorist brothers, was in prison for terrorist crimes, why was he let out?

Have they not "felt the wrath" for the last 13 years? Between US and NATO troops on the ground and drones strikes which have killed thousands of enemy combatants and civilians. What do you suggest be done? The "West" can't go invading countries because of a minority of violent people using religion as an excuse to commit heinous acts.

Nobody is talking about invasion. They are talking about a complete end to this disgusting multicultural immigration policy that is set to destroy the west internally. Complete deportations for anyone vaguely related to terror. Busting heads to destroy these organizations in europe. A end to appeasement and self-censoring that goes on constantly in the face of islam.

A minority of violent people (polls from prew put about a 20% approval of bin laden)- is still 200 million people when you have a religion as large as a billion. The statement that protection of religious symbols is more important than free speech- still polls between 60-80% in islam. Thats a massive majority that might not be violent- but at least comes at free speech from the same perspective as the terrorists.

"An appeaser is one who feeds a crocodile, hoping it will eat him last."

Having sympathy for and ideology doesn't necessarily mean they support the killing of innocent people.

I don't think Islam is the problem as much as the countries themselves. If you look at Indonesia, Turkey etc. which are Muslim countries don't have the same type of oppression as you would see in Iran and Saudi Arabia. Blanket statements about religion being the problem in my opinion are incorrect, because I feel you get out of religion what you put in.

Out of curiosity what is "vaguely related to terror?" If you speak out against certain things that could interpret that to being a vague act of terrorism. I support ending the federal government, some people would consider that an extreme view which could be misconstrued as a "vague act of terrorism."

Like not giving a guy like Kouachi, that overtly attempted to go to the middle east to join al queda and kill westerners, a year and half in prison instead of immediate deportation.

Well telling a judge that you want to go join Iraqi or Syrian forces isn't exactly vague related terrorism. Also what country should he have been deported to Iraq? Life in prison seems to be a better route to go.

I think the problem is Islam buddy. These guys didn't start killing people in the name of jihad and camel sex ten years ago for kicks. It's been going on since the crusades, since before America was even a thought.

I had a question for if we abolished the Federal Government: Who would control the Military? Louisiana controls Louisiana troops, New York theirs? Who does the Navy answer to then? North Dakota? Kansas? Same goes for Air Force? Whichever state they are flying over? What if God Forbid a 9/11 situation happens again in New York? California doesn't have to send troops because there is no solid command over the states?

Or, if you wish not to use the armed forces as an example, who controls commerce? Can Florida now openly trade with Cuba, yet Texas choose not to? Or China, can California now trade or borrow money from them without approval of other states? What's stopping or regulating the nation beyond a state level?

Although Saudi Arabia is flooding the market with fuel, when that stops, the majority of fossil fuels is coming from the Gulf Coast and Alaska. Does Louisiana, Texas, and Alabama now have to export oil to the northern states? Who's to tell them they can or cannot if there is no government higher than each respective state?

Well buddy, obviously you are well aware know since you mentioned them, the first crusades was started by the Catholic church. I am not saying that Islam does not have violent extremists they do, violence is in every religion because of violent individuals. Christianity for example crusades, 30 years war, Catholics and protestants in Ireland, the Inquisition. In the US the KKK and bombings at abortion clinics but you don't go about saying the Christianity is evil, certain people are evil and they can use religions as way to justify it. Buddhist monks in Myanmar are killing women in children, but you don't go condemn all of Buddhism.

Also buddy I was using being against a Federal government as an example of how slippery a slope as "vaguely related to terrorism" is. I apologize for not using the correct language or punctuation for you to interpret it that way. But I do indeed believe in a limited Federal government with more power to the states and individuals. I don't believe the power of the military should be in the hands of our elected officials because they don't act in the interest of the people they were elected to represent. Is it not the failed foreign policy of the Federal government that allows terrorism to flourish they way it has?

While not excusing these Islamic radicals in the least (nobody is harder on these terrorists than I am), those at Charlie Hebdo are not innocent, much less "brave" like they've been made out to be. They are typical Western Europe secular leftists who get a kick out of making fun of religion, be it Islam, Christianity, Judaism, etc. In their case, it was evil people killing evil people. Just because somebody has "the right" to say something, it doesn't necessarily mean it is right.

It seems France has gone to both extremes in dealing with the Muslims there. On one hand, too far one way with Charlie Hebdo ilk doing what they do. On the other, being far too accommodating (in the name of tolerance), which has led to things like "no go" Muslim areas where French police and fire won't even go.

Stop with the bullshit. We are not talking about the 12st century crusades (which I doubt you could even coherently explain, let allow understand they were responses to near total islamic conquering of western society), we are talking 21st century. The fact you must reach back to the 12th century or find a unbelievably rare abortion bombing, when we have daily examples of islamic violence is really a tell about how pathetic and weak your argument really is.

An extremist jew wears some funny clothes. A extremist jain meditates more than normal. A extremist mormon might live with a few chicks. A extremist muslim kills people and lots of them. Every day and on every continent. The religion matters. The ideas matter. And these "extremists" have all the justification they need in quran itself. Their prophet was a warlord and they just have a literal interpretation of what the book actually says.

This pathetic attempt to equate religions is a bizarre impulse. It has of course also proved useful to leftists keen to hide the gaping hole in their 'all culture are equal' doctrine - ''Yes, they are committing terrorism in just about every country on the planet, have embarked on massive campaigns of rape right across Europe, are working to undermine fundamental freedoms in their host nations, are far more likely to be welfare dependent than other migrants, commit 'honour' murder when their daughters get friendly with kafir, abuse our system of rights to destroy those very rights, campaign to sabotage our democracy through ballot box fraud and then teach misogyny and supremacy to British born, next generation muslims to continue all of the above ad-infinitum - but we have Islamophobes - remember that guy who threatened to burn a koran and the mo-toons?! And what about the crusades/George Bush!''

I am not debating on if Christianity has had it's dark years, or centuries for that matter, because everyone knows that we have had more than our fair share of blood on our hands due to the Spanish inquisition and crusades hundreds of years ago. Nor do I care to justify it, because I was not alive during that time period. The difference is that Christianity hasn't maintained a constant violence throughout recent history, where as Islamic radicals have used it as an excuse to condone their actions.

You are a bit off base on the "religious war" that has been waged in Ireland for the past century. Predominantly, the Irish are Catholics. The British, that are more protestant mind you, during the height of their empire invaded and took over Ireland. Is it Catholics vs Protestants? If you choose to run along those lines then you may be able to justify that cause. But anyone educated on the struggles of Ireland understands it is nothing more than the People of Ireland trying to rid the Brits from their land, they are fighting the same war America did for independence, except its 200 years later.

As well as for the KKK; you do know that Catholics were not allowed to join and Catholicism was one of the first principle stands the KKK stood for before they completely drifted to pure white trash and accept any warm body as long as it is "white"?

Let's move onto foreign policy. What would you have us do? As the world's predominant superpower, we have no choice but to be involved in every facet of life that neither you nor I care about in the middle east. Why? To maintain our presence on the worlds stage. Simply stopping commerce with countries that produce terrorism will only open the door to Russia, Iran, China, and North Korea to extend their own agendas and political influences to countries we turn our backs to.

Terrorism will flourish as long as we are the superpower. Why? Because we cannot fight them the way they fight us. What this reverts back to are the international laws that we signed in accordance with other nations such as the Geneva conventions and the rules of war. Terrorists can go out and mutilate humans that do not share their views and not face the same backlash as if America went out and mutilated anyone who was considered a terrorist. Terrorists do not fly the flag of a nation, yet hide behind religion out of pure jealousy and cowardice. Any man with leadership abilities can raise a standing army and build a nation or coalition to challenge the US, yet they do not.

Terrorists hide behind the statement that they want all "western influence" out of the middle east for peace. For conversations sake if we were to give these inbred infidels that, do you really think the killings and beheadings would stop? No, they would revert to killing each other going back to what ISIS was doing, eliminating their own that did not comply with their needs. Our government sees that, its why we haven't bowed down to Radical Islam.

These people have fought anyone and anything in accordance to their religion for Millenniums, it has been bred into them. For the world to defeat Radical Islam it would take all nations to stand up against senseless violence, along with the "Good Muslims" (Who for a majority secretly support these guys anyways. It's their religion after all.) So let's face it that's not happening.

Give it another 80-100 years when a child from a generation not yet born has experienced nothing but attacks, hatred and oppression from Muslims. That kid will be the second coming of Hitler, doing away with Muslims like Hitler did to the Jews.

I didn't bring up the Crusades I was simply responding to LALouisiane who was using the Crusades as an example of Islamic violence nor did I bring up Bush and the fact that you seem to assume I am a so called leftist is completely false.

Also again I am not saying Islamic extremist do not exist and that they are not violent. What i am saying and have said is that Islam in itself is not to blame, the worlds highest population of Muslims is not in the Middle East, and we hardly hear of violence in those areas they are in fact more liberal than the Middle East, since they have had multiple women who have served as Heads of State. The violence you are speaking of is occurring in a region and I don't think it should represent and entire religion.

I used Catholicism in regards to Crusades and Irish (which I very well could be off base with) I tried to use KKK and Christianity in the same sentence for that reason. But my point behind bring the KKK up was the fact that they consider themselves a religious group and hate; Jewish, Muslim and as you pointed out Catholics.

I understand the importance of the Truman Doctrine, Geneva Convention, Marshall Plan and all the international that were created. Our isolationism is part of the reason for WWI and WWII escalated to the extent that they did. Our presence on the world stage is important that being said it doesn't mean I have to agree with that fact that people feel US (as in the USA) should lead the charge, though I know no one else will. We have too many internal problems to lead the charge.

Violence will continue until the Muslim leaders want peace, we can continue to have as many nations in the Middle East but we will be creating enemies quicker than we are killing them. I don't feel you can say that a religion of 1.6 billion people believe in the violence being committed, I don't have a religion so I can't really speak for this but, if you are Catholic do you believe everything to Pope says or should the Westboro Baptist Church (the God hates F*gs people) represent the entire Baptist or Christian community just because they get the most media

Which is to say that there will always be violence.

Best post of 2015. I know it's only January, but this one will hold up for awhile .

Well peace when the Middle Eastern leaders want peace, they happen to be Muslim. Muslims leaders in Asia have peace. So to say there will always be violence in the Middle East is more accurate

Well I know plenty of Muslims who want money. That is their religion not interested in jihad.

There everywhere I get around. I don't think their all fanatic. That is why it is hard for me to hate all of them.

Then we agree that it won't stop until Muslims themselves rise up and do away with the very people that are giving them a bad persona.

"thedudeabides", If your getting that name from the same movie I'm thinking of, your a pretty damn cool dude and you'll understand what I'm about to quote:

"Donnie, shut the Fu-...When do we play?...I don't roll on Shabbos....SHOMER SHOBBUS!!...Shomer effing Shobbus""

Recent news..

Nigeria massacre deadliest in history of Boko Haram, estimated 2000 killed.

http://www.cnn.com/2015/01/09/africa/boko-haram-violence/

There's wall to wall coverage on Paris, but not as much in the media about what's happening in Nigeria.

I hate to admit as a Muslim you fellas are right in most things about radicalism and that terrorism from groups claiming to be islamic. But I would like to stress the importance of culture in the Islam.
I am not trying to blame a whole race but usually these groups are sponsored by the rich sheiks from the Arab peninsula. Also look at any violent fueled sects in the Islam they all come from the Arab desserts. There were times that tribes that had no contact with the Islam where being hired as soldiers and had to change their religion. These tribes formed the backbone of the Wahabbi sect of Islam. These guys are so cruel they have been known in earlier stages of their sect to burn down Islamic settlements and even mosques. This sect came in existence during the time of Napoleon(1800s) I think. Up untill then Islamic empires usually were the same as their western counterparts regarding violence, maybe even more tolerant.

Now we see that Saudi-arabia is from the Wahabbi sect and they are big time into training and funding radicals. For example the Bin-Laden family. Most of their leadership comes from the Arab peninsula.

Now there is the cultural aspect. Just as the west had their different ways of interpreting Christianity we had the same with Islam. Every part of Islam from north Africa to China is different. When was the last time there was a Kurdish IS terrorist, an Uzbek spokesman for Jihad, A Turkish suicide bomber, A terrorist cell operating in Bosnia?
My family is from Turkey and if you tell anyone over there about the 72 virgins and suicide bombing thing they will smack you in the face. Look at IS they target Turks and Kurds in Iraq, one reason is we look at different ways regarding Islam. I now many North-African guys that hate on their own kind, because they have moustaches. They believe that moustaches are signs of the unbelievers, in turkey(99% islam) it is one of the most normal things.
My relatives drink alcohol, even tough it is not allowed, in one way to ,me at least, it shows that a Christian and Muslim don't differ. According to these radical groups we are unbelievers, I think we are just humans who sometimes make ''mistakes'', but like I said we are humans, WE DONT BLOW UP INNOCENT PEOPLE for a bearded guy hiding in a cave who tells you what Islam is.
Just wanted to say that we are not like those assholes and yes radicalism is a problem stemming from Islamic sects not the whole of Islam.
Sorry if I was A bit unclear as English isn't my native language.

And yes i could agree with that.

Great fucking movie. I saw it IN THEATRE, long before it became a "cult classic."

F--- it dude, lets go bowling.

"Life doesn't start and stop at your convenience you miserable piece of shit"

Homerun...my compliments LittleNicky!!

The kid is brilliant. And not just book and history smart, either. He's socially conscious as well (the term "street smart" is used way too much, so I thought I'd shake things up a bit ).

Exactly what i was trying to say

Great post Nicky.

Big Lebowksi is one of my all time favorites.

Yeah, well, you know, that's just, like, your opinion, man

"Hell, I can get you a toe by 3 o'clock this afternoon...with nail polish. These fucking amateurs."

Nicky you are one smart fella.

Like I said before I didn't bring up the Crusades I was simply responding to LALouisiane who was using the Crusades as a historic example of Islamic violence. By bringing up abortion clinic bombing or shootings is to try and show that it is not a religion that causes extreme acts violence, if you are a violent person your religion will be violent.

I wouldn't say a Hasidic Jews clothing is exactly funny, if that is what you are referring to, I also wouldn't call them extremist because they were clothing according to their faith. Mormons live with several women but they also force young girls into marriages and condones what I consider to be the rape of these young girls. To say that Muslims kill people everyday on every continent is just untrue, you will have a a lot of deaths in unstable areas in the world. In the US you have a greater chance of being killed by a cop than a terrorist

Bizarre impulse is nothing that I ever refereed to, I said that you get what you want out of a religion, if you are a violent individual Islam will be violent to serve your needs. I do agree that they try to to undermine fundamental freedoms, as we see in France this happened because of a cartoon, I associate with libertarians and I am 100% for civil liberties, freedom of speech, freedom of press are things I find very important. If you are talking about welfare I am sure you will find just as many Americans working the system. I just believe you are stating things that a minority of these people do, it is not an accurate portrayal of everyone in Islam.

The whole leftist and I blame Bush thing is just kind of a way for you to say I don't agree with you, you must be this. It is just not accurate.



Like the Dude says, it is all just my opinion

The Dude: And, you know, he's got emotional problems, man.
Walter Sobchak: You mean... beyond pacifism?

I can see both sides here.

On one hand we do have to remember not all people who follow the religion of Islam are violent. In fact the great majority are not out to blow up buildings and kill people. I have met people that are Muslim and they seem to follow it properly. Yeah they won't eat bacon but that's about it. Normal people. Of course these were Americanized Muslims.

On the other side of this coin, however, is the indisputable fact, that Islam, is in a dark age in its history. During the Religious Wars of Europe in the 1600s the vast majority of Christians were not killing others, but a there was a significant enough number that it became a continental problem. Germany lost a third of its population in these wars.

Islam is the same way right now. There is a fundamental problem with a growing number of Muslims, who take the Quran literally to the point of blowing themselves up. It is a regional problem, with the exceptions of Turkey and the Balkans.

There is also a huge cultural divide between Middle East and West. Right now, I can say, "Joe Biden" is an asshole. And I'm not going to be arrested. But the freedoms that Western civilization, influenced by Rome and Ancient Greece and the philosophers of the Enlightenment, seem incomprehensible to some of these people. Some of them are utter hypocrites. We'll demand special privileges and that you treat us with respect but we don't like the way you're women dress, your cartoons of Muhammad, the fact that there are too many Jews, etc. You can't have it both ways. You either integrate into the culture you immigrate to, or you get the hell out. No exceptions. And these bastards that killed these people at Charlie Hebdo are in that exact same mold. Leeching off the free society that willingly accepted their kind, and they turn around and shoot them in the head with machine guns.

Bottom line, you can have your religion. But it does not become before basic fundamental principles of freedom of the press, speech, and others that we strive for. That goes for all the major faiths. But in this case involving conservative Muslims, we cannot appease a small minority under threat of violence. Europe needs to understand this. No multiculturalism, no open immigration, or allowing the kind of environment that allowed this to happen.

- There are millions of Hindus and Sikhs in the UK: no terrorist attacks, no Hindu/Sikh extremist groups, the Hindus and Sikhs aren't at war with their host country
- There are millions of Chinese in various Western countries: no terrorist attacks, no Chinese extremist groups, the Chinese aren't at war with their host countries
- There are millions of Jews in America: no terrorist attacks, no Jewish extremist groups, the Jews aren't at war with their host countries (even as they were repeatedly attacked/murdered by their hosts)
- There are hundreds of thousands of Filipinos and Thais in Hong Kong: no terrorist attacks, no Catholic/Buddhist extremist groups, the Catholics/Buddhists aren't at war with their host country

- There are millions of Mexicans in the US: no terrorist attacks, no Mexican Catholic extremist groups, the Mexican Catholics aren't at war with their host country

I'm sick of the whinny, twisted moral equivalence. It is just not true.

There is a clear cultural divide among Muslims and Westerners. That much cannot be debated. It's like water and oil, they don't mix. Which is why Europe allowing all this immigration was/is a huge mistake

Update: Best post of 2015. The other is still second, though.

I think its pretty clear that Islamic fundamentalist are public enemy #1 no one is denying that, I don't remember anyone saying anything against that. But the actions of the 4 or however many people murdered all these people in France, have nothing to do with the ideology or views of 60% of the worlds Muslims who live in Southeast Asia. It comes from a regions the Middle East and parts of Africa breed these types of people. But blaming an entire religion just doesn't make sense. People are good or evil, if you are going to do something crazy being a christian Muslim Jew or Hindu, being gay or straight, white or black, is not going to change the fact that you are crazy.

100% agree with that

Ok so you win Islam is to blame every person who has Islamic beliefs is evil and are a threat to National Security regardless of what country they live in, what do we do? Gather everyone up tell them they are wrong and you have to join our team. If they say no we have mass executions just like Cuba? Che Guevara will be proud. That could be kind of messy maybe we should put them in camps? the Japanese really like that alternative during WWII That is just the US though, what do we do for other countries? I mean obviously we should kill every Muslim in the Middle East they are the enemy after all. What about the close to 1 billion living in India, Southeast Asia and China? They didn't have anything to do with the terror attacks, they are actually progressive they wear "normal" clothes have had 7 female Head of State (USA has had 0) But they follow Islam, we should probably kill them to just to be safe, Islam is a dangerous violent religion after all.

Are you claiming all muslims are "at war with their host country" on the basis that there exist within their midst extremist groups who engage in terrorist acts? If so I'm shocked your post has been so praised by everybody without anyone seeing this logical flaw.

(I'm not getting into the holiest of holy religions argument here, just looking to see the basis for your claim)

[quote
Now we see that Saudi-arabia is from the Wahabbi sect and they are big time into training and funding radicals. For example the Bin-Laden family. Most of their leadership comes from the Arab peninsula.

Now there is the cultural aspect. Just as the west had their different ways of interpreting Christianity we had the same with Islam. Every part of Islam from north Africa to China is different. When was the last time there was a Kurdish IS terrorist, an Uzbek spokesman for Jihad, A Turkish suicide bomber, A terrorist cell operating in Bosnia?


[/quote]

I know a lot of Turkish people here and in Germany and in turkey I do business with them and through soccer. I like the ones I know a lot.

I have been to Uzbeckastan a few times. I would not call it safe for American but I been treated very well their. My son has been their with me. They don't give the right of way to pedestrians though .

In fact one of my grand daughters mother is from their.

My Alina always spend Christmas with us. She even goes to Catholic Church with us at Christmas.

Loves to open gifts from Santa with us on Christmas Eve.

Nigeria is a mystery to me I am friends wth 3 Nigerian national team players. I knew them since they were 16 they played with us in the Dallas cup. They were very respectful I liked them all a lot.

I find it impossible to believe that they would do harm to others. They don't have it in them.

I had Afgans and Kuwait players on my youth teams. Very respectful and never let me carry equipment they would take it from me. My Italian players never did that for me.

The only players that gave them trouble were two Israeli players for no reason except the hate put into them by their fathers against Muslems

I talked with their parents who I knew for a very long time. Then even that ended.

You have to be learn how to hate. It is not born into any kid. All kids are cool maybe some of that would be better off with out fucked up parents.

You're getting closer Dude87...keep coming.

You are right sir. But I still think you have to give Islam a chance. As I said before we are not all the same.

This thing they do in France is crazy letting them rule themselves with their own laws. Their in France they have to follow French law. They don't like that they can leave France. The French government is obviously fucked up.

Sometimes you young guys have no rearview mirror...Islam has had 1500 years of chances and has been at war for all of them.

Turkey was one of the first countries in the world to give women the right to vote. During WW2 Turks helped Romanian Jews. Turkey as a Islamic country joined and participated in the Korean war. Turkey as a Islamic country Joined the first world during the cold war.

Look at the amount of immigrants living in Europe and America. Most of the terrorists are brainwashed teens or young adults. We don't support these people we never have and we never will. They usually have rich sponsor enabling them to operate like this.

On Mexicans here in the US they work cheap so I use them. Some deal drugs who doesn't? Their into soccer so am I.

If they learned English their workers can do very well. Instead they work of white bread contractors who make the lions share of the money and pay the Mexicans peanuts a day to work.

Please, Islam was untill the 1900's one of the more peaceful religions. Look up during the crusades how both sides acted. Check out Ottoman tolerance. What happened to the Jews after the Spanish inquisition? Look at the technological advancements of Islam during the middle ages.
Saladin(Ruler who fought Richard the Lionheart during the crusades) was the first ruler since Cyrus the great that lifted the ban for Jews to live in Jerusalem.
The moors ruled over Spain and never exiled them or forced them to convert to Islam.
Islamic nations were most of time the victim of colonialism and imperialism during the 1800s-1900s. Hence the Idea we were at war all the time. The radicalism also developed in the 1800s before that we were equal or maybe even more tolerant.
There were times that the Dutch shouted that they preferred Islamic rule than the pope.

Hope you get the point, we are not a religion of 1500 years of violence.

Save your twisted view of history for some of those who don't know the truth of Islam....from its founder to the present....at NO TIME in their history has Islam been peaceful..in fact the very word islam...means submission.
Anywhere where Muslims exist in this world, there is violence. They want to live under a system where religion and politics are one and the same, where archaic and draconic Sharia law dominates...it is perverted and dangerous.
In short, the end game for Muslims is an Islamic Caliphate in which we all convert and praise Allah and live under the yoke of Sharia.

Im pretty sure most of us muslims don't think that way, but he it's your opinion and I can respect it.
What would be a logical solution to the ''Islam problem'' according to you? Just curious

So you're equating a bunch of cartoonists/journalists with these animals? They deserved to die because they mocked their idiot prophet?

How about those people that were executed in the Jewish supermarket? Should they have reconsidered shopping there? Maybe they went to far buying kosher food? Did they had it coming also Ivy?

Charlie had every fucking right to draw those cartoons, distasteful or not, and no medieval asshole, be it from Yemen or Utah, is going to tell us otherwise.

Fact is, 70% of the Muslim community in Western Europe considers the Quran more important than our laws. At least 50% of them hates the Jews. 73% considers the jihad fighting against Assad heroic, never mind that after the fall of Assad Sharia Law will be implemented.

These are not facts that make me think integration has been a success. The mass immigration from Muslim countries have been a huge mistake, sad as it is.

http://www.wzb.eu/en/press-release/islamic-fundamentalism-is-widely-spread

Fact is, 70% of the Muslim community in Western Europe considers the Quran more important than our laws. At least 50% of them hates the Jews. 73% considers the jihad fighting against Assad heroic, never mind that after the fall of Assad Sharia Law will be implemented.

These are not facts that make me think integration has been a success. The mass immigration from Muslim countries have been a huge mistake, sad as it is.

http://www.wzb.eu/en/press-release/islamic-fundamentalism-is-widely-spread

[/quote] interesting figures but I am wondering how this survey was conducted. Like the one about jihad against assad. Many people are against assad if you would ask them about secular groups fighting assad they would give the same answers.

Regarding jews i have nothing to say as the opinion of the people is influenced by the actions of Israel. This figure about anti semitism is something i can see around me also, not that i am one.

About homosexuals i have to agree many muslims wont associate with them, but i think this is also influenced by culture, for example honor etc.

They say that they choose qurans laws above national laws. I am 100% sure this comes from the fear of Allah, dont expect your local butcher to deal in AKs because Isis would tell them it is for a good cause.

Conclusion, i admit those are worrying figures but saying muslim immigration is a failure isnt going to help. We have to work together to make it a succes again. My grandfather came here because of work, not so that he could undermine the European government. He was a hard worker as are my dad and uncles, whom have worked hard without associating themselves with terrorism or crime.

You are only joking right? It is hard to imagine someone openly endorsing genocide. As a nation we've condemned; Khmer Rouge, Stalin regime, Ratko Mladic; and the Bosnian genocide, Idi Amin for actually doing this. Why even celebrate the 4th of July if you feel that you are entitled to freedom and you can so callously take it away from others you don't agree with.



You feel just because I am younger than you (do you know how old I am?) that you are automatically right. You saying this without any idea of my life experiences our background or automatically assuming I have never read a book or done any research on my own (other than through mainstream media sources CNN, MSNBC, Fox all included) shows how limited you mindset can be. Sometimes you old guys have tunnel vision and when presented with other ways of viewing things even when presented with facts you will laugh it off, go on a rant about leftist this you hate Bush that and bring up extreme cases of injustice committed by a minority.



There is violence everywhere in the world but you can't blame it on Muslims. Close to 1 billion Muslim live in India, Southeast Asia and China, that makes up 60% of the world Muslim population and you do not see the type of extremism as you do in Middle East and Africa. How come we never hear about Muslims going to Indonesia for fundamentalist training? Because it doesn't exist.

Evangelical Christians teach young children to speak in tongues, all they are doing is speaking gibberish pretending it is Gods granting them some sort of power, I've seen women give a "spiritual birth," I've seen people have seizures because the holy spirit, but its all an act. (This is just my opinion, if you believe in this then I'm glad you are happy with your religion) You don't think that all Christians are like this. You don't think all Catholic priest molest children some do, you don't become a priest and all of a sudden you wanted to molest children it is already in you.

The Westboro Baptist Church, the ones who protest military funerals with signs saying God loves dead marines and thank God for 9/11. They aren't representative of the christian community either. These are an extremist group that are a minority of the worldwide population, just like Islamic extremist are a minority of the Islamic community

Exactly

You're being intentionally obtuse. It doesn't matter if they are a minority in the community when there are 1 billion muslims. As the polls illustrate above, the general ideas of mainstream islam give these guys plenty of intellectual and ideological cover. Want some more? 64% of Muslims in Egypt and Pakistan support death penalty for leaving Islam (http://www.pewforum.org/2013/04/30/the-worlds-muslims-religion-politics-society-exec/). And for all your bullshit about how great southeast asia islam is and how moderate it is- 96% believe womens role is to obey their husbands (http://www.pewforum.org/2013/04/30/the-worlds-muslims-religion-politics-society-women-in-society/). 86% in southeast asia believe that sharia should be the law of the land, the goal of "fringe, extremists" seems to a super majority view. (http://www.pewforum.org/2013/04/30/the-w...s-about-sharia/). Bare majorities in many countries support honor killings (http://www.pewforum.org/2013/04/30/the-worlds-muslims-religion-politics-society-morality/)- itself an act of overt, mysgnostic terrorism.

Bad ideas are bad ideas. And they have consequences.

And again, you try moral equivalences. Somehow, I think what evangelical children do with their children is none of your fucking business. You can sit back and judge them- but they will not show up with a Ak-47 and kill your entire editorial staff for writing shit about them. They are a easy target for criticism. If the Westboro Baptist Church (which polled below 1% unlike say Osama Bin Laden in the islamic community) is the best, most violent, terrible extremism you can find, your point speaks for itself. Christianity, unlike Islam, is a much less violent religion in the 21st century.

You claim that four people don't represent islam. Let's go through this weeks news: 12 dead in Paris (Islam), 4 dead jews (Islam), 2000 dead mostly women and children (Boko Haram, Islam), fire bombing german papers that reprinted cartoons (Islam), unknown hundreds or thousands in Syria/Iraq (ISIS, Islam), Tripoli Cafe Bombing (Islam). These are just off the top of my head.

When there’s this many bad apples, there’s something wrong with the orchard.

I mean I feel that you are



I didn't agree with Bill Maher when he said it first. I've seen that but also 60% of Egyptian Muslims feel that people should be allowed to practice what ever religion they want. Kind of a contradiction maybe the polls aren't as accurate as you want them to be.



Christian women feel the same way, if you say no then you are being obtuse. Also i will quote you " none of your fucking business" what goes on in a marriage that you aren't apart of so that argument holds no ground. Women are also equal, they do not wear head scarves, they can drive, vote and hold political office

You can support the ideology, you can't make an assumption that they condone the killing of innocent people



Id you actually read what I said, I'm not judging them per say I said I don't agree with it but I'm not condemning them, but if it does it for you then live your life that way.

You seem to be missing the point of what saying, probably because you don't like the idea of someone having different ideas or actually questioning you, which I deduce from your overall aggressive tones (unless I am misinterpreting what you are saying) and how you have to curse to try an prove a point, shows you in my opinion simplistic thought process. Where if you don't agree with me, yell yell yell curse curse curse you are a leftist you are this you are that its silly and childish. I don't recall saying you are a right-wing uneducated racist hillbilly, because that is not how I feel. I unlike you it seems respect the opinion and ideas of others and I won't criticize or yell and swear at them for expressing their views, I may question it but I have yet to criticize you.

No you won't find an Evangelical Christian storming buildings with AK-47, I am not disputing that. What I am saying is, that is not the views of all Christians. Like violence is not the views of all of Islam


Other than Paris, where were these attacks located? It is a regional thing its not Islam. In regards to Paris they have links to Syria. It is a regional issue not religious

Well today another nutter firebombed a tabloid in Hamburg.

Ok I'm not certain but I would bet the terrorist are from or have links to the Middle East or Africa, if not I will gladly eat my words. I'm not saying in anyway they are right or have sympathy for them. Just coming to the conclusion that Islam as a whole is to blame doesn't make sense to me

The idea of killing or prohibiting someone from practicing freedom of speech is against everything I stand for. I believe in the constitution of the Unites States, but we can't pick and choose who has rights who doesn't it goes against everything the country stands for

The most numerous victims of Islamic terrorism are Christians. Tens of thousands of Christians have been massacred by Boko Haram and other fanatic groups in Africa alone.

The latest outrage: they used a ten-year-old girl to set off a suicide bomb in Nigeria:

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/world/10...ticle-1.2073696

You need to work on your reading comprehension skills, pal. The first thing I said is that I don't excuse the terrorists in the least. So, no, I don't think the Charlie Hebdo libs - the only ones I was talking about (but you missed that too) deserved to die. What I said was, they weren't innocent and certainly no free-speech heroes. Once again, having "the right" to say something doesn't automatically right to say it.

ivy league, do you or do you not believe in the right of 'FREE SPEECH' if you have the right to say something why can't you say it.

I can read just fine buddy and you know very well what you said and what you are saying is just the same as excusing the acts of terrorists.

'Evil people killing evil people' remember? Fuck that.

And no I didn't miss you were talking about Charlie and not those poor people in the supermarket but my point is that when you start excusing animals for their behavior, like you are doing in the case of those bastards killing the people from Charlie, where does it end? But I guess you missed that.

"I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it." Voltaire

Having the right to say it but it not being right to say doesn't make much sense to me

Anybody who denies that there is a problem with Muslims and thinks it's comparable to other religions is a delusional moron.

There is certainly a problem with Middle Eastern and African extremist. The idea that you can't allow that actions of a few represent an entire religion is not comparing the the extremes of different religions its using rational thinking.

And name calling is for children who don't get what they want. If you want to discuss the first Amendment be my guest, tell me why we should put restrictions on speech and press

no restrictions, if you restrict free speech in any way, then they have won the battle. we cannot give into them, we should attack everything about them, and their religion.

we cannot let these murdering dogs take away free speech in any free nation.

of course you are right, part of their religion, is training radicals to kill, and kill. as of recent events, how can their be any doubt about what they are. murdering dogs. and not only in france. but everywhere on earth.

No restrictions, free speech for all. The idea that we should fight anyone who wants to place a restriction on our rights foreign or domestic I'm all for.

The training radicals is extremist is distorting the word of the prophet and brain washing people to join the cause. Most of the people who join these groups just want power or they see what they would consider injustices committed by foreigners. As I stated in earlier post you have 60% of the Muslims not in the Middle East or Africa, they are not the same as the Muslims committing heinous acts in Pakistan, Iran and Saudi Arabia

Are you actually stating that all followers of Islam are evil?

no, but the ones who are trained to kill, must be brought to justice. they bring shame and dishonor to all muslims.

Cruel words for the Islam.
I think you compare 1billion people with some radicals that bomb and kill. for the 1000000th time they don't represent us and neither do most of us believe in the things they believe in.
Radicalism is driven by Saudi oil money, whom are strong believers of Wahabbism. Wahabbism sees everyone not believing in Wahabbism as infidels, So a sunni like me is just a target as a Jew or Christian.

Absolutely

The main reason the US cares so much

Indeed they do and I agree 100% with what you say about terrorists.
Never forget that Islam, Judaism and Christianity have a lot of similarities and the followers of these religions are sometimes called the people of the book. Instead of flaming and hating on each other on who has the blame we should strive to eradicate the world from terrorism and radicalism.

I agree. I've heard from a few Muslims that part of Islamic teaching is that Christians and Jews are to be treated with respect.

Everyone here is making good points. You can't throw everyone under the bus because they are Muslim, but at the same time, you have to recognize there is a fundamental problem with Islamic radicals and it's roots are religious. Whether anyone wants to admit it or not, these motherless fucks hold beliefs contradictory to Western ideals.

And for the record, I would not be as uncomfortable with all this immigration to Europe if everyone just assimilated. As Little Nicky pointed out, there millions of Mexicans in the U.S. yet you don't see them asking to set aside the law for their religious beliefs. Many of them bust their ass just to make a living for themselves and their children

Yes Ivy it is a right. Morality aside, our society is based upon the principle of saying whatever you want whenever you want, with the exception of incite to riot. Why do you think the Supreme Court ruled in favor of those assholes in the Westboro Baptist Church? Because as sick and twisted as they are, they are protected under the law. I'd smash a brick on their faces, but it wouldn't change the fact they have the ultimate right to say and protest whatever and whenever they want.

Really? Let's see...



Yes, I do know what I said. You apparently don't. Which is why you're creating strawman arguments and attributing them to me.



How can that be when the very first thing I said was I don't excuse their acts?



That's exactly what it was. On one extreme you have medieval (to use your word), bloodthirsty Muslim terrorists. On the other end you have Godless, secular West Europeans. I see evil on both sides. However, that doesn't mean I'm equating the evil or saying they deserved to die. I'm simply saying the Charlie Hebdo victims weren't innocent and certainly not heroes.



Then why did you bring them up? Strawman.



As I've explained above, I'm not excusing anything. Just looking at the whole picture. As I also said, nobody is harder on these terrorists than I am. I'm the guy who wanted every prisoner in Guantanamo Bay executed rather than house, feed, and clothe them indefinitely.



Once again, I'm not arguing about their right to say it. I'm saying having "the right" to say it doesn't automatically mean it's right to say it. The Westboro jerks are a good example. They may have the freedom of speech to say what they do but I think most would agree what they say, and how they say it, is wrong.

Ivy, because someone isn't invested in a religion doesn't make them godless. And between Islam and secularism I'd take secularism. Were they heroes? A stretch in seeing they were going about their every day business, but they were innocent in that they were attacked for exercising the right to the freedom of the press. And anyone who sticks it to those extremists bastards is a friend in my book.

The point is, not everything we say is moral, that's on us. But if we had to limit our speech to morality it wouldn't work, because people have a different idea of what morality is. It's better to have a society where we tolerate everyone's beliefs and opinions, no matter if it's wrong or not. In your view something may be right while someone else sees it as condemnable. It's just too slippery of a slope.

You know what Ivy, I do believe you hate terrorists and you think they deserve to die. On the other hand, I also stand by my point that your comments, to me, sound like you also think the people at Charlie deserved to die. Maybe you do, maybe you don't. We won't come to an agreement about that, and life is way too short to start a ten page discussion.

For me, this shit hits pretty close to home, (I live in 'godless' Amsterdam but I'm in Paris a lot and it's just a 4 hour drive) in a time when I'm already very concerned about the millions of Arab immigrants on our continent who seem to hate us and do not respect our culture and traditions. So maybe I did overreact to your comments.

If you would take one advice from me, we're not all godless liberals around here and if you ever decide to visit I think you'll find that our cultures are not that different.

Hold on a second, lets not go nuts here. You are saying that we don't see violence by radical Islam in India, Southeast Asia and China? What about the 2002 Bali bombing where 202 innocent people died? What about the 1998 riots that targeted Chinese Christians all over Indonesia. Raping, looting and killing people because they are a religious and ethnic minority. What about the 108 people who were killed in Mumbai (Bombay) in 2008 by extremists? How about the Uyghur Muslim terrorists in China with their numerous acts of violence?

Do I believe that all Muslims are terrorists? No, and I do believe that the vast majority are good people. But you cannot claim that China, India and Southeast is a bastion of freedom of religion. That complete BS and that it a fact. There is plenty of terrorist training in places like I don't know, the Maluku Islands. Don't try to pull the wool over peoples eyes just because some are not as informed as others. That list above could go on and on and on. I have been hearing that Islam is a religion of peace for the past 15 years. If that is the case why the f do pundits have to keep saying it??

Sorry that post was a reply to an earlier statement by the Dude Abides where he claimed that Asia is a sea of liberalism in a sea of extremists. Great movie reference Dude, and don't take my post personally, just don't try to ignore facts

To be fair to the Uyghur people, China does treat them like shit. So I do understand their contempt somewhat. The same goes for the Tibetans.

In the Maluku Islands the Christian extremists were at the time as bad as the Muslim ones over there. I don't know anything on the Island's state right now, but it seems things have calmed down. There's a fairly large Moluccan population in the Netherlands. Among them there are quite some nutters who love a good row

http://www.breitbart.com/london/2015/01/...ive-television/

The mayor of an ethnically diverse European city has earned the praise of London mayor Boris Johnson after expressing exasperation with fellow Muslims who failed to appreciate the freedoms enjoyed in the Western world, telling them to “pack your bags”.

Speaking to the NewsHour current affairs programme just hours after the Charlie Hebdo shootings in Paris, Mayor Aboutaleb became angered by the failure of some Muslims to adapt to their new homes, as he himself had done.

Mayor Aboutaleb said: “It is incomprehensible that you can turn against freedom… But if you don’t like freedom, for heaven’s sake pack your bags and leave.

“There may be a place in the world where you can be yourself, be honest with yourself and do not go and kill innocent journalists. And if you do not like it here because humorists you do not like make a newspaper, may I then say you can f*** off.

“This is stupid, this so incomprehensible. Vanish from the Netherlands if you cannot find your place here. All those well-meaning Muslims here will now be stared at”.

Aboutaleb, a Moroccan-born Muslim and former journalist took up the office of Mayor in 2008 now presides over one of a number of European cities where ethnic minorities and non-natives make up over half of the population. Although his appointment as mayor was criticised initially by anti-Islam parties in the Netherlands, who demanded he give up his dual Moroccan citizenship, he has since worked to prove his worth.

Angering his initial power-base among the cities Muslim voters, Aboutaleb has been unafraid to speak his mind on the importance of Dutch values and integration. After supporting the firing of a Muslim member of his cabinet for apparently supporting the Iranian government, fellow Mororcan and Rotterdam citizen Abdel Hafid Bouzidi, 30, said of the mayor in 2009: “He goes too much to the right”.

In 2004, Aboutaleb told Muslims if they didn’t subscribe to Dutch values they should “catch the first plane out”.

You certainly bring up a valid point, I don't know if I said that you will never find extremists in Southeast Asia I probably implied it when trying ti argue that Islam as a whole is not to blame, I was wrong in that regard. I do see a trend with the examples you use, the people who carried out these attacks were born in the Middle East (2008 Mumbai attack, Pakistan) or have a connection with radicals from the Middle East (2002 Bali bombings leader fought in the Afghan-Soviet conflict and had ties to Osama bin Laden). The riots in 1998 Indonesia we more racially and economically motivated, I don't think if a Chinese immigrant told the rioters that they were a Muslim, it would have stopped them from being assaulted or have there business burned to the ground.

You aren't going to find a perfect place in the World. I am not saying that Southeast Asia is 100% free of inequalities, no place on Earth is. But the injustices that for instance women face in the Middle East and Africa like; stoning to death and not being able to drive are problems in places like Pakistan, Iran and certain countries in Africa and a lot of people associate these things with Islam as a whole. Those are not Islamic problems they are problems in the countries that is happening in. Also a place like Indonesia is more liberal that Afghanistan, where 99% of people are Muslim, out of fear retribution. Indonesia's population is over 80% Muslim but you don't have anything to fear if you want to be a Christian or Buddhist, so compared to the Middle East they are extremely liberal.


The problem is when people read the Quran or the Bible they pick and choose what they want to take literally and what are metaphors. Islam, Christianity, Judaism are not religions of peace or violence, what you want out of your religion is what you get. If you want are a violent ignorant hateful person then your Islam, Christianity or Judaism will be violent ignorant hateful.