Tony Soprano didn't know how to speak Italian?

Watching Season 2 last night when they went to Italy and Tony couldn't communicate in Italian with the bosses they were meeting with at the dinner table.

Then Paulie complains about real Italian food they are eating and requests an order of Italian American Spaghetti instead.

What is up with this? I thought it was sort of pathetic but thats just my opinion.

Also in real life would the boss of the New Jersey family even be invited over to Italy for a business meeting with the Don? They must have thought Tony Soprano and his crew were a bunch of idiots.

They were second,third generation Italian-Americans who lived in America, they probably knew the very basic Italian but they would have no need to speak Italian in America..

We could discuss about this for days.
Entire libraries are filled with books, essays and dissertations on the Italian-American assimilation and contemporary culture.

Long story short: Italian-Americans have to be seen as a matrioska doll...there is no single example that defines them all.

There are some that speak Italian fluently despite being of 3rd generation, others were even born there, came here as kids and just speak few dialect words. Go figure.

As an Italian myself with relatives spread all over on the US East Coast as well as Canada...it's really something complicated...

I noticed this in England, too. A girl I knew was Italian and she spoke with a British accent and she didn't know how to speak Italian. She grew up in Britain, so she reproduced what she heard around her.

Likewise Tony was born in the USA. He heard English and the New Jersey accent all his life. He went to schools that didn't have many people who spoke Italian.

mobsters who were born in tality were known as mustache petes because they were old school sicilian/italians who stuck to that culture. Since the 60/70's many mobsters were itlian-american and really didnt speak italian fluently

Exactly. The language is often lost after the second generation, but not all the time. If it's important enough to the family, they'll find a way to keep the language alive in the house. But it's easier said than done.

As far as the episode, Chase did EXACTLY what he wanted to there. He portrayed those guys as cafoni who thought they were culturally Italian because they ate macaroni on Sundays and wore Genelli shirts. Then when they got around real Italian culture, they looked like buffoons.

Unfortunately, you do see a lot of that in Italian American neighborhoods. Guys think that because they memorize the words to a Jerry Vale song and drive in from the suburbs to shop at the Arthur Avenue market twice a year, they're as Italian as their grandparents were. It's actually kinda silly.

Wilson, I have to ask: Have you spent any time at all around Italian Americans?

Importance, as with everything else, is in the eye of the beholder. Over here in Gerona, many of the immigrants stick to Spanish and learn enough Catalan to get by. Fortunately, in English speaking countries, they're a little more adamant about people speaking it properly. Spain has a few lessons it could learn from them.

No doubt about it. To some immigrant Italian American families, becoming Americanized was of the utmost importance. To others, it was holding on to their Italian-ness (that's probably not a word ).

It all depended upon the individual family situation and neither should be judged for their decision. It's hard enough adapting to a new country without people telling you to act more American or more Italian or more whatever.

Exactly right. I completely agree that Chase was accurately portraying the guys in this way. You put any of these guys in Italy and they will quickly learn that the few words they've picked up aren't even the way Italians pronounce them.
Who has it in their signature here...Geoff? Something about not dropping the last syllable or whatever? That's exactly right. I've never heard any Italian speak like Tony Soprano. Gabagoo? What the hell is that? Nobody says that over there. They say, "capicolla".
But they are representing the typical Italian American that thinks they speak italian because at the end of every sentence they say, "capishe?" lol

And Italians in Italy are arrogant like hell. I go there and they want me to speak Italian. They come HERE and they expect everyone to also speak Italian! lol Now, when I go there, they don't like that I only can speak the sicilian dialect. They tell me, they don't speak that anymore, it's not nice. I should only speak proper Italian. How about you all kiss my big fat american ass is the last thing I remember saying.

Whats ironic is that James Gandolfini speaks fluent Italian in real life.

No he doesn't.

As an Italian-Briton I myself can help answer this question in some detail. I was born and raised in the UK, however I am a third generation Italian. My mum was born in the UK however my gran came over when she was young as well. One thing that I always wonder is how did my family manage to keep all it's roots. Well for starters, My gran, mum and myself all live under the same roof. Thanks to that I can speak fluent Italian, even more so than my mum can which you'd think would be odd. However I think the main thing is keeping contacts with family in the old country, also friends of you can.

When Tony went to Italy, he and the guys all looked like tourists and didn't seem really Italian at all. The different between somebody like Tony and myself, is that I go there every year and I have friends over there that I've known since I was a child. To feel like a real Italian you have to integrate with it's society, it's not all about the wine, Pizza and mountains. Once you realize this, you think more like an Italian and trust me, most Italians don't think the way people make it out to be.

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Ya they were dipshits

Actually, he does. His mother was from Naples and his father was from Parma, and Gandolfini was raised fluent in both English and Italian.