Genco Land Co.

At the very end of GF I, there's a sign on the stone wall at the compound that says "5.6 acres for future commercial development and SOLD". Clemenza and Pentangeli both lived there, as is stated in GF II. Did the deal fall through or did Clemenza buy it?

Neither. Part II was made instead.

It was intended that the Corleones would sell the mall (and make a huge profit) and that would be the end of the story. The producer discovered that he could make a huge profit himself if he filmed a sequel (and I'm happy he did) but no thought was given the continuity issue of the mall (it really isn't an important issue IMO).

Could Genco land company have been a front company that was set up to make the sale to a Mr. Peter Clemenza?

Given that the Corleones had no problem murdering people, I'd say that setting up a front company to cover their land deal tracks or avoid associated taxes was certainly within the realm of possibility.

Damn, I noticed that also, and was going to make a post concering it, but thought it would be too nit picking

The Genco real estate company existed long before Michael became Don. The novel explains that real estate was one of Vito's sources of income. The novel also says that the company was named after Genco because Vito was "too modest" to attach his own name to it.

Some times the GF threads really do become full of nit picking.This isn't an important issue at all.

I'm sorry but that was a crappy thing to say. I hope you were teasing.

What's a nit? And how does one go about picking one?

Nit picking? Maybe. But (IMO) its an honest question about an observation from the movie (and some plausible explanations - I still like mine best ).

BTW - Thats quite a statement from someone who frequents the Games forum so much.

A nitwit? A knit sweater?

I wonder if its like picking a nose.

Hey i barely go into the Games forum anymore.It's become repetitive and stagnent.
It's just me opinion.We all know part two wasn't written yet and it's the fact that the sign reads that way because of it.
Yes i know it's an observational question,but i found it a little too "nit picking". Fair enough.

"Let he who is without nitpicks among you cast the first stone."

Both SC and DC are right. No sequel was in the works when GF was finished, so the sale of the mall and its property could simply have been a fait accomplias Michael moved the family West. But the "sale" of the property could have been a tax shelter and money-laundering move: Michael could have "sold" it to his New York underboss, Clemenza, for a fraction of its real worth, and taken a big tax credit. Clemenza could then list the deflated price of the mall as his main asset, and escape his own big tax bill. He could also have set up a dummy corporation to buy the mall, then "leased" it from his own company to launder money.

...And for the record i frequent the GF section a lot more than the friggin games.

A nit is lice.

Relax... I was just bustin' your balls.

HAHA yeah i know.

It's sometimes hard to convey sarcasm over the net,i was trying to sound sarcastic,looks like i failed.

Now YOU'RE nitpicking!!!

hahahahahaha

i know.

YEAH? WELL YOU CAN JUST GO PICK A NIT!

If the sale was some kind of elaborate self dealing operation as has been suggested here, then it would make sense that the property was "sold" for commercial development. If for some reason commercial development could not take place (here the Corleones would have to fix a zoning board to rule against them),
then the commercial "buyer" would probably have had an escape clause in the contract. This would make the land much less valuable, which in turn would allow for a huge price reduction for Clemenza. My guess is that some Corleone owned entity continued to own the property because after Clemenza died it passed to Pentangeli, to there was probably some provision that the person running the New York operations could live there for life....which speaking of nit picking.....raises the question, what did they do with Clemenza's wife and kids? Put them on the street?

Organized crime organizations have a plethora of ways to disguise financial transactions. Puzo may have actually intended that the property was sold legitimately to underscore Vito's acumen as he expressed in the novel. But we are allowed to speculate and, in light of the unplanned GFII, we speculate like crazy.

Clemenza's family would not need all that room or upkeep expense. Anything's possible. His wife might have died before him, etc. the timeline is so screwed up in GFII, it's nearly impossible to make any logical sense of it.

Yes but Michael said the house went to Clemenza. And as I recall in GFI Clemenza had kids cause he told Paulie to watch out for them when he was backing out of the driveway.

I've always wondered about those kids.

Clemenza, being roughly Vito's age, would have been in his mid 50's in 1945, a bit old (at that time) to be the father of such young children.

Clemenza was known among his close friends as "the human tripod"

Yeah, him and Anthony Quinn, knocking 'em up from the nursing home.

Maybe they were his grandchildren

Nah, then she would've asked for miniature cannoli.

"Leave the gun, take the miniature..."

It just doesn't work.

I always thought Clemenza divorced his wife for wearing that hairnet.

She wouldn't have blended very well at one of the hostess parties in GOODFELLAS, but if you brushed her with some tacky blue eye shadow, she'd be chewing bubble gum and cursing her husband in no time at all.

They weren't neccesarily Clemnza's children. They could have been kids playing outside his driveway that lived on the block.

That's what I always thought.

So when Clemenza moved to Vito's house did Pentangeli get Clemenza's house, and then when he moved did Cicci get it?

No. They were taking turns keeping Lucy Mancini satisfied and helping her to raise Vincent.

When Michael said to Frankie, "I was glad you were able to keep the house after Clemenza . . ." (or words to that effect), it appears there was a chance the house could have gone to a "legitimate" owner.

As big as that house was, it would have been easy for Clemenza's wife and children to stay in the house with Frankie and his wife. As a matter of fact, who was the other woman standing next to Pentangeli's wife the day Frankie came home and found out Mike was waiting for him in the study? Clemenza's wife?

"I was glad this house never went to strangers. First, Clemenza took it over, then you." It sounds like its inhabitants had right of first refusal.

Now, let's watch the films a little more closely. Who might you first think the "woman" would be? Maybe Frankie's daughter?

You know, some get so far afield with their speculations. Maybe the Munsters lived in the house also.

Wasn't Lurch one of the guys who greeted Cicci and Frankie when they pulled up in the black Cad?

That's why I ordered the CDs so I can watch them over and over and over . . .

I personally think this is the most important issue surrounding all the Godfathers film, since it involves the changing of the guard in New York.

With all due respect, you obviously don't have a full knowledge of the procreating abilities of the older man.....

Nah the Munsters lived here

Like they say ... "The older the bull, the stiffer the horn."

The ability to procreate wasn't my point. Late life children were just rare back then, that's all.

Just ask Larry King.

Stats? Sources?

Uh, no.

Who taught Michael how to use a GUN?? Clemenza.
Who looks "teriff" out there on the dance floor? Clemenza.
Who makes the meanest pasta this side of Palermo? Clemenza.
Who saysthey should have stopped hitler in Munich? Clemenza.
Who takes a leak near the Statue of Liberty? Clemenza.
Who Garrottes Carlo? Clemenza.
Who stays loyal to the Corleones? Clemenza.
Who is the real stud in the family......???

Sonny

Pizzaboy Corleone, born in October 1959. He can be seen in the foreground of the Tahoe estate, at the end of Part II. He's being fit for a custom made, large in the crotch diaper.

That little farce he played with Vincent's mother? That never fooled a Corleone. Even Vito said it was all "comedy" that was making him soft in the head. Sonny was one of those guys who talked a lot, but at the end of the day even his widow supposedly found more happiness with Tom Hagen.

Nah its never the guys that brag... its the quiet ones...like Clemenza.

Vito

Who taught Michael how to use a GUN?? Marines
Who looks "teriff" out there on the dance floor? Clemenza.
Who makes the meanest pasta this side of Palermo? Clemenza.
Who saysthey should have stopped hitler in Munich? Clemenza.
Who takes a leak near the Statue of Liberty? Clemenza.
Who Garrottes Carlo? Clemenza.
Who stays loyal to the Corleones? Clemenza.
Who is the real stud in the family......???

Technically yes.

But Clemenza taught him how to execute two people up close with a handgun and then what to do after the execution. There's a big difference.

Read my signature below.

Point well taken . . . takes me back to the scene during the "rug heist. . . " young Clemenza was ready to blow out the brains of that cop had he opened the door and stepped inside the house.

There's nothing in the novel or film to preclude Clemenza or anyone else from having instructed Mike in firearms use prior to his Marines experience.

Also, you notice how Tessio is used kind of second hand. He has to get the package at the gate; he drives Mike and picks him up; he's sent to pick up the cake; his regime is assigned hospital duty. There are probably a few more instances. It's surprising considering that he was with Vito right from the beginning just like Clemenza.

You wore your diapers backwards??

I can see an alternate to the scene at the end of GF when Cicci asks Tom if he can get him off the hook for old times' sake:

"It ain't the way I wanted it, Tom. 'Sent Tessio to do this...send Tessio to do that...send Tessio to drive some car, pick up a dead fish, buy a birthday cake...' "

Fredo without question!!!! Two at a time!!!!

Marines??? Maybe not, their rifle is their weapon of choice. Watch Full Metal Jacket, Sands of Iwo Jima or The DI and you see how important a rifle is to a Marine.

For sure. We Army grunts only had marshmellows to throw at the enemy. Madonne!

Referring to Lee Harvey Oswald and mass murderer Charles Whitman]

DRILL SARGENT: Do any of you people know where these individuals learned how to shoot?... Private Joker.

PRIVATE JOKER: Sir. In the Marines, Sir.

DRILL SARGENT: In the Marines. Outstanding. Those individuals showed what one motivated Marine and his rifle can do. And before you ladies leave my Island, you will all be able to do the same thing.

Hold on there, no insult was intended for our fine Army men and women and veterans. The army has many heroes also to be proud of:

Doberman way on the right, and Ridzik behind Bilko.

Well Golly! It's Sgt Bilco!